Can you be pro-choice and still be a Christian?

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Truth7t7

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OP title...
Can you be pro-choice and still be a Christian?

It's a bit of a twist.
"Pro-choice", is a secular term, supposedly to 'only' apply to carrying a developing fetus in the womb....

However, Scripturally, "pro-choice"...is precisely a persons God given FREEWILL, to make choices, ABOUT anything.

No one requires any special "lol license", or "permission".... to FREELY CHOOSE "anything".

Anyone, want to choose; God, satan, what to eat, what to wear, what to listen to, what to believe, what to do, what to not do....
* God does not MAKE or PREVENT....a mans freewill to choose.
* You would have to LOOK at Governments of this world to SEE WHO DICTATATES what a PERSON can and can not believe, do, not do...
* the squatting frauds in DC are daily corrupting, "land of the free", into "a land of the enslaved".
In post #250 you openly support a woman right to murder the innocent unborn, and you dont oppose it, your words are plain, and clear

It's my opinion your words are guilty of the same you support

Quote below, Taken Post #250


As the Lord gave mankind FREEWILL,
So also DO I support a mans FREEWILL, to make THEIR own choices
,
and THEY suffer the loss or ENJOY the gain of THEIR own choices.
Nor will I Advocate or Support Oppressing a persons Freewill.


* I have ALREADY MADE my STAND CLEAR.
My STANDING IS "WITH and IN" Christ.
* I have ALREADY MADE my STAND regarding ABORTION CLEAR.
* I DO NOT Advocate or Support Abortions.
* I have ALREADY MADE my STAND CLEAR...
* I Will NOT jump on YOUR Bandwagon and blindly JUDGE people.
* Nor will I Advocate or Support Oppressing a persons Freewill.
 

Taken

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"Wow" you openly support the premeditated, 1st degree murder of the innocent unborn


"WOW"
That is your RESPONSE to this statement.

"* I DO NOT Advocate or Support Abortions."


Thanks for sharing your obvious LACK of comprehension.
Not a wonder having a meaningful discussion with you is impossible.
IGNORE - X
 
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Taken

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In post #250 you openly support a woman right to murder the innocent unborn, and you dont oppose it, your words are plain, and clear

It's my opinion your words are guilty of the same you support

Quote below, Taken Post #250


As the Lord gave mankind FREEWILL,
So also DO I support a mans FREEWILL, to make THEIR own choices,
and THEY suffer the loss or ENJOY the gain of THEIR own choices.
Nor will I Advocate or Support Oppressing a persons Freewill.


* I have ALREADY MADE my STAND CLEAR.
My STANDING IS "WITH and IN" Christ.
* I have ALREADY MADE my STAND regarding ABORTION CLEAR.
* I DO NOT Advocate or Support Abortions.
* I have ALREADY MADE my STAND CLEAR...
* I Will NOT jump on YOUR Bandwagon and blindly JUDGE people.
* Nor will I Advocate or Support Oppressing a persons Freewill.

IGNORE X
 
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Truth7t7

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"WOW"
That is your RESPONSE to this statement.

"* I DO NOT Advocate or Support Abortions."


Thanks for sharing your obvious LACK of comprehension.
Not a wonder having a meaningful discussion with you is impossible.
IGNORE - X
It's my opinion that you do, as your response below clearly shows

1.) You support a woman in her freewill to commit 1st degree murder of the innocent unborn (Abortion)

2.) You will not oppose a woman in her freewill in 1st degree murder of the innocent unborn (Abortion)


Quote below, Taken Post #250

As the Lord gave mankind FREEWILL,
So also DO I support a mans FREEWILL, to make THEIR own choices,
and THEY suffer the loss or ENJOY the gain of THEIR own choices.
Nor will I Advocate or Support Oppressing a persons Freewill.
 
Last edited:

Taken

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It's my opinion that you do, as your response below clearly shows

1.) You support a woman in her freewill to commit 1st degree murder of the innocent unborn

2.) You will not oppose a woman in her freewill in 1st degree murder of the innocent unborn


Quote below, Taken Post #250

As the Lord gave mankind FREEWILL,
So also DO I support a mans FREEWILL, to make THEIR own choices,
and THEY suffer the loss or ENJOY the gain of THEIR own choices.
Nor will I Advocate or Support Oppressing a persons Freewill.

IGNORE X
 
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marks

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That would seem fairly obvious.
It might seem obvious without being obvious. Many people have different reasons.

But in truth, isn't what IS true better than what is not? I mean, If I prefer what God ISN'T doing, doesn't that mean I don't understand it? Since I don't agree?

Much love
 

Stan B

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Can you support pro-choice and abortion and still be a Christian?

I believe abortion is a grave sin, one of the defining moral issues of our time.

Why do you believe that abortion is a grave sin??

Something you got from the Bible, or one of those noisy non-Scriptural anti-abortion/pro-abortion cults? Although abortion is mentioned in the Bible, I haven't been able to find any place in Scripture where it is forbidden. Can you supply the Scripture reference upon which your belief is based?
 

An Apologetic Sheepdog

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I haven't been able to find any place in Scripture where it is forbidden. Can you supply the Scripture reference upon which your belief is based?

You can start with Exodus 20:13

You don't find the modern definition of the medical technique known as abortion then the qualifier of "abortion on demand" in scripture because the technology and technique didn't exist.

What you will find is a preponderance of scripture alluding to life ( as a person) is recognized in the womb.

Then from there, murder (defined as unjust taking of a life) applies to ALL life so that covers the developing infant in the womb.

Use your head and put the relevant scriptures together to find an answer to the question. Its not that difficult.
 
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Grailhunter

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Why do you believe that abortion is a grave sin??

Something you got from the Bible, or one of those noisy non-Scriptural anti-abortion/pro-abortion cults? Although abortion is mentioned in the Bible, I haven't been able to find any place in Scripture where it is forbidden. Can you supply the Scripture reference upon which your belief is based?

Well maybe you over looked...Thou shalt not murder.
The murdering of babies! You have to be kidding! It does not talk about eating them either, or skinning them for clothes. If a person wanted to come up with a religion about what is not in the Bible....WOW...it would be anything but Christian.
 

Stan B

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You can start with Exodus 20:13

You don't find the modern definition of the medical technique known as abortion then the qualifier of "abortion on demand" in scripture because the technology and technique didn't exist.
Not hard for me to find . . .

The practice of abortion goes all the way back to the Books of the Law where an abortion drug was administered to an adulteress:

"But if you have gone astray while married to your husband and you have made yourself impure by having sexual relations with a man other than your husband”— here the priest is to put the woman under this curse—“may the Lord cause you to become a curse among your people when he makes your womb miscarry and your abdomen swell. May this water that brings a curse enter your body so that your abdomen swells or your womb miscarries.” Numbers 5:20-22

And then in the times of the Apostle Paul,
(70–132 CE), Barnabas wrote.

You shall not slay the child by procuring abortion; nor,
again, shall you destroy it after it is born. Barnabas 19:5

You say to start with Exodus 20:13 "Thou shalt not commit murder."
What does that have to do with the subject matter abortion, not murder.
 

An Apologetic Sheepdog

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By the numbers
You shall not slay the child by procuring abortion; nor,
again, shall you destroy it after it is born. Barnabas 19:5

Sorry but the Epistle of Barnabas ( even though lots of good stuff in it) isn't an authority

"But if you have gone astray while married to your husband and you have made yourself impure by having sexual relations with a man other than your husband”— here the priest is to put the woman under this curse—“may the Lord cause you to become a curse among your people when he makes your womb miscarry and your abdomen swell. May this water that brings a curse enter your body so that your abdomen swells or your womb miscarries.” Numbers 5:20-22

First, that's not an "abortion" in proper context. It is a PUNISHMENT for adultery and in proper context is a legal justification for abortion in cases of adultery/rape incest etc.

You say to start with Exodus 20:13 "Thou shalt not commit murder."
What does that have to do with the subject matter abortion, not murder.

"Abort" (to END) is the taking of a life. (specifically an unborn one in this usage)- at that point the only remaining question is a justification under the law. If there is no legal justification then by DEFAULT it becomes MURDER. Then Exodos applies.

If there anything else you have an incorrect understanding or read on that I can straighten out for you?
 

Stan B

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By the numbers

Sorry but the Epistle of Barnabas ( even though lots of good stuff in it) isn't an authority

Exactly! God's last chance to add abortion to the law, but
He didn't.

Sheepdog>First, that's not an "abortion" in proper context. It is a PUNISHMENT for adultery and in proper context is a legal justification for abortion in cases of adultery/rape incest etc.

Abortion is abortion is abortion. Since there is no law against such there can be no legal context, because it is not the law.

Sheepdog>"Abort" (to END) is the taking of a life. (specifically an unborn one in this usage)- at that point the only remaining question is a justification under the law. If there is no legal justification then by DEFAULT it becomes MURDER. Then Exodos applies.

Since God forgot to mention abortion as a sin, you have decided to prop Him up by calling it murder.

First all all, you cannot murder something that is not a living being!

The Bible says “The LORD God formed the man from the dust of the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man became a living being” (Genesis 2:7). Adam did not become a living being until God breathed into him the spirit/breath of life.

"For as the body apart from the spirit is dead, so also faith apart from works is dead. James 2:26

So you can't murder dead things!

If there anything else you have an incorrect understanding or read on that I can straighten out for you?

So far, you haven't provided a scrap of Scriptural evidence to support your personal addition to the Scriptures. God is not stoopid! If He wanted your preferred addition of the Law to be added to the Bible, perhaps He could have figured that out.
 

An Apologetic Sheepdog

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So far, you haven't provided a scrap of Scriptural evidence to support your personal addition to the Scriptures. God is not stoopid! If He wanted your preferred addition of the Law to be added to the Bible, perhaps He could have figured that out.

Can you not read?

Can you just not reason?

Have you ever actually studied and learned anything or do you need to be led by the nose and rubbed in it to get the picture?

God isn't stoopid but the jury is still out on some others so lets see what your learning capacity is.

What is it about what I have explained to you that either you don't understand or fully comprehend?
 

Stan B

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Can you not read?

Can you just not reason?

Have you ever actually studied and learned anything or do you need to be led by the nose and rubbed in it to get the picture?

God isn't stoopid but the jury is still out on some others so lets see what your learning capacity is.

What is it about what I have explained to you that either you don't understand or fully comprehend?

Can I just not reason? That's the same approach the Serpent used to deceive Eve in the Garden! She had God's word on the matter, but decided to go with Satan's reasoning instead.
And this was the last message left with mankind:

I warn everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this scroll: If anyone adds anything to them, God will add to that person the plagues described in this scroll. 19 And if anyone takes words away from this scroll of prophecy, God will take away from that person any share in the tree of life and in the Holy City, which are described in this scroll. Rev 22

Sheepdog>What is it about what I have explained to you that either you don't understand or fully comprehend?

I fully understand what you have said, that you cannot supply a single reference in Scripture that says "Thou shalt not have an abortion", or tells you how you can murder anything that has never been alive.

I do not subscribe to the Gospel of Sheepdog.
 

An Apologetic Sheepdog

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Can I just not reason?

That's the question, yes and so far its in doubt

That's the same approach the Serpent used to deceive Eve in the Garden! She had God's word on the matter, but decided to go with Satan's reasoning instead.
And this was the last message left with mankind:

Satan didn't quote Scripture accurately and in context so your claim is a false dichotomy

fully understand what you have said, that you cannot supply a single reference in Scripture that says "Thou shalt not have an abortion",

I explained that clearly as to why. You are just upset your view imploded so you are hiding behind a legalistic argument now and its taking water like the Titanic too

tells you how you can murder anything that has never been alive.

I explained that clearly too. Go back and read clearly.

I do not subscribe to the Gospel of Sheepdog.

Based on your words, that's not the only Gospel you don't subscribe to as well.
 

Wynona

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Why do you believe that abortion is a grave sin??

Something you got from the Bible, or one of those noisy non-Scriptural anti-abortion/pro-abortion cults? Although abortion is mentioned in the Bible, I haven't been able to find any place in Scripture where it is forbidden. Can you supply the Scripture reference upon which your belief is based?

This one comes to mind first.
Psalm 139:13
New International Version

13 For you created my inmost being;
you knit me together in my mother’s womb.

He was a life before he left the womb.

There's also the verse where we get the idea that murder is wrong.

Exodus 20:13
King James Version

13 Thou shalt not kill.

To me, the outcome of being anti-abortion is simple just from those two verses.

Other verses include Matthew 19:18, Psalm 22:10, and Psalm 71:6

I feel like if those verses are not enough, there simply is no convincing you--- you will think what you want.

However, why do you believe that abortion is okay?
 

Grailhunter

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Not hard for me to find . . .

The practice of abortion goes all the way back to the Books of the Law where an abortion drug was administered to an adulteress:

"But if you have gone astray while married to your husband and you have made yourself impure by having sexual relations with a man other than your husband”— here the priest is to put the woman under this curse—“may the Lord cause you to become a curse among your people when he makes your womb miscarry and your abdomen swell. May this water that brings a curse enter your body so that your abdomen swells or your womb miscarries.” Numbers 5:20-22

And then in the times of the Apostle Paul,
(70–132 CE), Barnabas wrote.

You shall not slay the child by procuring abortion; nor,
again, shall you destroy it after it is born. Barnabas 19:5

You say to start with Exodus 20:13 "Thou shalt not commit murder."
What does that have to do with the subject matter abortion, not murder.

Some call this the test of Jealousy and some call it the test of for Adultery.
Numbers 5:11-30

11 Then the Lord spoke to Moses, saying, 12 “Speak to the sons of Israel and say to them, ‘If any man’s wife goes astray and is unfaithful to him, 13 and a man has intercourse with her and it is hidden from the eyes of her husband and she is undetected, although she has defiled herself, and there is no witness against her and she has not been caught in the act, 14 if a spirit of jealousy comes over him and he is jealous of his wife when she has defiled herself, or if a spirit of jealousy comes over him and he is jealous of his wife when she has not defiled herself, 15 the man shall then bring his wife to the priest, and shall bring as an offering for her one-tenth of an ephah of barley meal; he shall not pour oil on it nor put frankincense on it, for it is a grain offering of jealousy, a grain offering of memorial, a reminder of iniquity.

16 ‘Then the priest shall bring her near and have her stand before the Lord, 17 and the priest shall take holy water in an earthenware vessel; and he shall take some of the dust that is on the floor of the tabernacle and put it into the water. 18 The priest shall then have the woman stand before the Lord and let the hair of the woman’s head go loose, and place the grain offering of memorial in her hands, which is the grain offering of jealousy, and in the hand of the priest is to be the water of bitterness that brings a curse. 19 The priest shall have her take an oath and shall say to the woman, “If no man has lain with you and if you have not gone astray into uncleanness, being under the authority of your husband, be immune to this water of bitterness that brings a curse; 20 if you, however, have gone astray, being under the authority of your husband, and if you have defiled yourself and a man other than your husband has had intercourse with you” 21 (then the priest shall have the woman swear with the oath of the curse, and the priest shall say to the woman), “the Lord make you a curse and an oath among your people by the Lord’s making your thigh waste away and your abdomen swell; 22 and this water that brings a curse shall go into your stomach, and make your abdomen swell and your thigh waste away.” And the woman shall say, “Amen. Amen.”

23 ‘The priest shall then write these curses on a scroll, and he shall wash them off into the water of bitterness. 24 Then he shall make the woman drink the water of bitterness that brings a curse, so that the water which brings a curse will go into her and cause bitterness. 25 The priest shall take the grain offering of jealousy from the woman’s hand, and he shall wave the grain offering before the Lord and bring it to the altar; 26 and the priest shall take a handful of the grain offering as its memorial offering and offer it up in smoke on the altar, and afterward he shall make the woman drink the water. 27 When he has made her drink the water, then it shall come about, if she has defiled herself and has been unfaithful to her husband, that the water which brings a curse will go into her and cause bitterness, and her abdomen will swell and her thigh will waste away, and the woman will become a curse among her people. 28 But if the woman has not defiled herself and is clean, she will then be free and conceive children.

29 ‘This is the law of jealousy: when a wife, being under the authority of her husband, goes astray and defiles herself, 30 or when a spirit of jealousy comes over a man and he is jealous of his wife, he shall then make the woman stand before the Lord, and the priest shall apply all this law to her.

The words miscarriage or abortion does not occur here or anywhere in the Bible.
miscarrying womb...occurs once in Hosea 9:14
 

farouk

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This one comes to mind first.
Psalm 139:13
New International Version

13 For you created my inmost being;
you knit me together in my mother’s womb.

He was a life before he left the womb.

There's also the verse where we get the idea that murder is wrong.

Exodus 20:13

King James Version

13 Thou shalt not kill.

To me, the outcome of being anti-abortion is simple just from those two verses.

Other verses include Matthew 19:18, Psalm 22:10, and Psalm 71:6

I feel like if those verses are not enough, there simply is no convincing you--- you will think what you want.

However, why do you believe that abortion is okay?
@Wynona A searching Psalm....
 
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APAK

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This one comes to mind first.
Psalm 139:13
New International Version

13 For you created my inmost being;
you knit me together in my mother’s womb.

He was a life before he left the womb.

There's also the verse where we get the idea that murder is wrong.

Exodus 20:13

King James Version

13 Thou shalt not kill.

To me, the outcome of being anti-abortion is simple just from those two verses.

Other verses include Matthew 19:18, Psalm 22:10, and Psalm 71:6

I feel like if those verses are not enough, there simply is no convincing you--- you will think what you want.

However, why do you believe that abortion is okay?
Here's some more scripture that God never encouraged or supported abortion even caused by accident.
Here's one translation..

“If men should struggle with each other and they hurt a pregnant woman and she gives birth prematurely but no fatality results, the offender must pay the damages imposed on him by the husband of the woman; and he must pay it through the judges. But if a fatality does occur, then you must give life for life.”—Exodus 21:22, 23

You must die even if you caused the death of baby still in the womb by accident....
 
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