Eschatology - Luke 21:5-38

[Davy]

Hello Davy

But when, at the first century destruction of Jerusalem, did Christians stand before the Son of Man?

Probably when they passed away, and were resurrected. At the destruction of Jerusalem in 70ad, there was a total of 1,100,000 deaths.

They also stood before Jesus after his resurrection in his son of man (fleshly body), before being taken up and received onward to God where he was placed at the right hand of God until all things were placed underneath his feet.

In Christ,
Matthew Gallagher

You still referring to that Luke 21:36 verse? That wasn't meant for 70 A.D., unless you want to say all those that died in Christ at that time stood before Him in Heaven. With that idea I would agree with, but still, that's not the time He meant in Luke 21:36.

The Luke 21:36 verse is about His elect in the future after His return that will reign with Him, as written. It's because He was pointing to the coming destruction of Luke 21:22 at His future return. And that return will involve the burning of man's works off this earth on the "day of the Lord" (2 Peter 3:10). And per Apostle Paul in 1 Thessalonians 5:1-3 it will involve the "sudden destruction" upon the wicked and deceived.

 

[MatthewG]

Thank you for posting, Davy.

You can say what you will, either the text would be correct or one desires for it to mean something thing else other than what it says my friend.

32 “Truly I tell you, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened. 33 Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will never pass away.

Jesus says this (one of the most debated words ever) - Truly - I tell you disciples who are with me standing in front of me listening to the answer to your question you asked: Truly I, Jesus tell you, this

generation - 38 years to 40 years worth of time - though many people may say nope. Day like a 1000, and 1000, like a day.

When Jesus says this I believe that he is talking about a living and breathing generation in that time and day that - This generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened.

Jesus said Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will never pass away. - Heaven and Earth is well known to the Jewish people for they lived in their own World they understood having been the choice nation God had choose to bring out of Egypt.

What Jesus is saying here is that their - heaven and earth (World - Age they understood) would pass away. However the words of Jesus Christ will never go away - for He is the one who bringing forth freedom and reconciliation to all people by paying for Sins of all people.

34 “Be careful, or your hearts will be weighed down with carousing, drunkenness and the anxieties of life, and that day will close on you suddenly like a trap. 35 For it will come on all those who live on the face of the whole earth. 36 Be always on the watch, and pray that you may be able to escape all that is about to happen, and that you may be able to stand before the Son of Man.”

Jesus said to John, Andrew, James, Peter - for them to be careful and to focus on God, For the worries and cares of the world, will come on all those who live on the face of the whole earth. They however are to be on watch and to pray, that they may be able to escape all that is about to happen, that you may be able to stand before the Son of Man. (Previously mentioned that this generation shall not pass away, until).

Overall what a person believes is between them and God and I don’t care if people believe in the futurist viewpoint or not.

If you believe that I don’t mind either way it goes.

I love you the same.

I don’t mind sharing some of my viewpoints though it might not answer any questions anyone may have for me.


In Christ,
Matthew Gallagher

 

[Davy]

Thank you for posting, Davy.

You can say what you will, either the text would be correct or one desires for it to mean something thing else other than what it says my friend.

32 “Truly I tell you, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened. 33 Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will never pass away.

Jesus says this (one of the most debated words ever) - Truly - I tell you disciples who are with me standing in front of me listening to the answer to your question you asked: Truly I, Jesus tell you, this

generation - 38 years to 40 years worth of time - though many people may say nope. Day like a 1000, and 1000, like a day.

When Jesus says this I believe that he is talking about a living and breathing generation in that time and day that - This generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened.

Jesus said Heaven and earth will pass away, but my words will never pass away. - Heaven and Earth is well known to the Jewish people for they lived in their own World they understood having been the choice nation God had choose to bring out of Egypt.

What Jesus is saying here is that their - heaven and earth (World - Age they understood) would pass away. However the words of Jesus Christ will never go away - for He is the one who bringing forth freedom and reconciliation to all people by paying for Sins of all people.

34 “Be careful, or your hearts will be weighed down with carousing, drunkenness and the anxieties of life, and that day will close on you suddenly like a trap. 35 For it will come on all those who live on the face of the whole earth. 36 Be always on the watch, and pray that you may be able to escape all that is about to happen, and that you may be able to stand before the Son of Man.”

Jesus said to John, Andrew, James, Peter - for them to be careful and to focus on God, For the worries and cares of the world, will come on all those who live on the face of the whole earth. They however are to be on watch and to pray, that they may be able to escape all that is about to happen, that you may be able to stand before the Son of Man. (Previously mentioned that this generation shall not pass away, until).

Overall what a person believes is between them and God and I don’t care if people believe in the futurist viewpoint or not.

If you believe that I don’t mind either way it goes.

I love you the same.

I don’t mind sharing some of my viewpoints though it might not answer any questions anyone may have for me.


In Christ,
Matthew Gallagher

I just like to stay with God's Word as written, which I believe is especially important to do in these days and times, regardless of who likes it and who doesn't. I can assure you of one thing, if you stick to God's Word as written, you won't be very popular. His Word straight up isn't very popular and never has been in this world.

 

[MatthewG]

You are absolutely right about that sir.

Continue to suffer for Christ, in having love for God and having love for other people despite their differences of viewpoints, as Christians we are called to be like minded and support one another. The doctrine doesn’t matter so much, as having faith, and love for God and others.

In Christ,
Matthew Gallagher

 

[Daniel L.]

Not one stone atop another, is what Jesus said.

Right, not one stone remained from the temple, but the Roman Fort still stands to this day.

 

[ewq1938]

Right, not one stone remained from the temple, but the Roman Fort still stands to this day.

The wailing wall is part of the original temple walls, and there are more stones under ground that are some of the heaviest and largest stones in the world, placed there long before Rome existed. So, there are still stones upon stones there that were there when Christ was there.
The Roman's merely added to it etc but the majority of it (the largest stone work in the middle and downward and even under ground) was Jewish construction.



http://www.gosleepgo.com/node/183

The Wailing Wall in the Old City of Jerusalem

The Wailing Wall is the most holy place for the Jewish Religion because it is the only part of the 2nd Temple that wasn't destroyed nearly 2,000 years ago by the Romans. Although the Jews collectively rejected and to this day still reject that Jesus was the son of God this wall was standing when Jesus walked the streets of Jerusalem. Also the Islamic faith speaks of the Wailing Wall. Mohammed rode his flying horse from Mecca to Jerusalem, tying his horse to the Wailing Wall and then ascending to Heaven from where the Dome of the Rock stands on the Temple Mount.

http://www.ctsp.co.il/LBS pages/LBS_western_wall.htm

Western Wall

Little remains of the ancient temple of Jerusalem from the time of Jesus but the retaining walls of its porch, like that of the Western Wall.

http://home.houston.rr.com/mypilgrimage/wall.html

Orthodox Jews praying at the Western Wall. The western wall of the Temple area is still in the same location as in Jesus' day. The Western Wall is the only remaining part of the temple built by Herod. The Temple was destroyed in 70AD by Titus. The Western Wall is the holiest place to modern Jews because it is the closest place an Orthodox Jew can get to the Temple site and still be sure he is not intruding on the Holy of Holies. Prayers are written and placed in the wall. They are gathered periodically and burned. One stone in this wall is 16 1/2 feet long and 13 feet wide. The Israelis captured this section of the wall when they conquered the Old City during the Six Days War in 1967.

http://www.frommers.com/destinations/print-narrative.cfm?destID=88&catID=0088030406

The Wall was built by King Herod just before the time of Jesus and is part of a structure that retains the western part of Temple Mount and the vast, artificial ceremonial plaza Herod created on the Temple Mount itself. These retaining (as well as defensive) walls surround the western, southern, and eastern sides of the Temple Mount; the largest of the ashlars is 11 1/2 feet high and 47 1/2 feet long and weighs approximately 400 tons. According to Josephus, the Roman Jewish historian, construction of the walls took 11 years, during which time it rained in Jerusalem only at night, so as not to interfere with the workers? progress.

I saw a History channel documentary on the wall and they measured this stone and estimated it to be 567 tons which is quite a bit more than the estimate given on this website.



Western Wall (BiblePlaces.com) – BiblePlaces.com

Largest Stone

An especially large course of stones is visible on the southern and western walls today. On the west the "Master Course" consists of four stones, the largest of which weighs 570 tons and is 44 feet long, 10 feet high and 12-16 feet deep. The next largest stone in the wall is a mere 40 feet long. The largest stone in the Great Pyramid weighs 11 tons.

 

[Daniel L.]

The wailing wall is part of the original temple walls

Look at it, it's a Roman Fort:
Eschatology - Luke 21:5-38

I saw a History channel documentary

Right, the fact that Jews, who deny Jesus is Messiah, say that, proves my case:

1 John 2:22 Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.

 

[ewq1938]

Look at it, it's a Roman Fort

Maybe they used it but it was built by the Jews long before Christ was born.

 

[Daniel L.]

Maybe they used it but it was built by the Jews long before Christ was born.

You can't have both the temple and the Roman Fort on the same place, so at the time of Christ it can only be one of the two, the Roman Fort. The temple was in the City of David.

 

[ewq1938]

You can't have both the temple and the Roman Fort on the same place, so at the time of Christ it can only be one of the two, the Roman Fort. The temple was in the City of David.

Nope. The wailing wall is part of a Jewish temple complex from before Christ was born. The bottom of that wall is underground, and has a stone that weighs 570 tons and is 44 feet long, 10 feet high and 12-16 feet deep. The Romans did not have the technology to create and move such a stone. The Romans also did not build anything in that type of way.

 

[Daniel L.]

The Romans did not have the technology to create and move such a stone.

Why would you believe them, who deny Messiah?

But tell me, if the greatest super power in the world couldn't build it, how come jews could?

If you are talking about this stones:

They are Herodian Stones, this is his signature:

And they match with the stones at the surfice, Herodian stones.

So the "big stone" you are talking about actually proves my case, because it is a Herodian stone, and it had to be moved by him, at his time. Remember Herod didn't build the temple from foundation up. What he did build was Antonia Fortress, a Roman Fort.

 

[Davy]

The wailing wall is part of the original temple walls, and there are more stones under ground that are some of the heaviest and largest stones in the world, placed there long before Rome existed. So, there are still stones upon stones there that were there when Christ was there.
The Roman's merely added to it etc but the majority of it (the largest stone work in the middle and downward and even under ground) was Jewish construction.
....

Yes, and that is why the 70 A.D. destruction only serves as an incomplete blueprint for the sudden destruction that is to happen on the future "day of the Lord", i.e., the last day of this world when Jesus returns per Zechariah 14.

 

[Daniel L.]

70 A.D.

You are confusing the two, the temple in the City of David was utterly removed and you cannot find one stone, and prophecy is fulfilled, this Herodian Stones are the Roman Fort, the only thing that wasn't destroyed in Jerusalem, was their own fort.

 

[Behold]

20 “When you see Jerusalem being surrounded by armies, you will know that its desolation is near.

Something interesting is about to happen.
Its the "Rapture".

And after that, the Devil has to come to solve the "Global Crisis".

Before all that, you needed Covid, so that people could learn (be trained) to do what their Government forced them to do.
(Train them, as the Anti-Christ needs them to take orders from a one-world Government)
And by the way.>Globalism is Satanic.
See, a One world Government is going to be controlled by a one world leader.... The AntiChrist.

Next..

You see something interesting happening in the UKRAINE, recently.
Here is what is most interesting..
Zelensky is a fascist pretending to be the poor president who needs the world to stop Putin for him ....

Yet, while all this is keeping the world focused on this silly "occupation" in a far away country that is meaningless, ...the real issue is that Putin is loading up Syria and Lebanon with Missiles that are all aimed at destroying the State Israel, while you read this.....

See that? That is "end times" in front of your eyes.

Watch and see more soon.

 

[MatthewG]

Thank you for sharing your viewpoint,

There are many different particular beliefs about it, you know I use to believe that the world was gonna end. However the Bible doesn’t seem to suggest this world will ever end. However our life will eventually end.

It’s good to know that with the use of the Bible a persona is able to get to learn and grow in their knowledge about God and Jesus and the things from above and even here on earth.

Having Faith in trusting God,
Having love for God first,
And having love for others are the most important things in this life we are given to do.

Faith, Love and Hope; that one day after his life one will get to be able to go and spend time with God and family and old friends, and be able to help those up there in heaven who may be outside the kingdom in darkness.

God bless you all,
In Christ,
Matthew Gallagher

 

[Davy]

You are confusing the two, the temple in the City of David was utterly removed and you cannot find one stone, and prophecy is fulfilled, this Herodian Stones are the Roman Fort, the only thing that wasn't destroyed in Jerusalem, was their own fort.

You cannot just wish... something into existence. The huge stones of the still standing Wailing Wall are proof that what Jesus said about not one stone atop another is still yet to be fulfilled there.

What You Need to Know About the Wailing Wall or Western Wall

And what prophecy were we given to show when literally not even those stones atop another there today will be demolished? It is here, on the day of Jesus' future return, and good grief, how many times must this be shown to hardheads?...

Zech 14:1-4
14 Behold, the day of the LORD cometh, and thy spoil shall be divided in the midst of thee.

2 For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city.

3 Then shall the LORD go forth, and fight against those nations, as when He fought in the day of battle.

4 And His feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.
KJV

 

[Behold]

Thank you for sharing your viewpoint,

There are many different particular beliefs about it, you know I use to believe that the world was gonna end.

Pay attention.
Noone, is saying the "world is going to end".
So, where you get this idea......who knows....

But the "time of the Gentiles" is going to end soon, then the Rapture occurs, , and then the great Tribulation is soon to follow.
If you are not born again ,you will find yourself in the Grt Trib.
During those yrs , you will have to both Trust Christ and "endure to the end".
This means you will have to be a martyr to go to Heaven,, or you can take the mark of the beast and end up in Hell.

My Advice?
become a born again Christian and watch all that from up above with the Body of Christ.

So...None of this is the "end of the world"., Its all just times and seasons, or you can say dispensations, or you can label it "progressive revelation"...
See, the entire bible is REVELATION IN PROGRESS......

 

[MatthewG]

Those who believe in the future coming event of the second advent of Christ.

Thank you for sharing your views.

(I have been convinced though to suggest for people to pay attention to the words, and who, what, when, where, why and how questions when reading and studying the Bible)

I’ll tell you this for sure do not believe me but seek out the answer in the Bible yourself along with secular history. Question and challenge anything anyone presents to you, for yourself and test it by the spirit!

In Christ,
Matthew Gallagher

 

[Behold]

----

 

[Davy]

Real Order of Events, as written in God's Word:

1. time of 1260 days prior to the "great tribulation" also of 1260 days.
2. time of Paul's "Peace and safety" by the wicked deceived; lasts to the end of the GT.
3. time when false-Messiah shows up to help build the Jew's temple and start sacrifices again.
4. middle of the 7 years; time when false-Messiah will end sacrifices, and instead setup an IDOL abomination in the Jerusalem temple, and demand all worship it or be killed.
5. false-Messiah and his to reign for 42 months at the end, and have power over all peoples, the time of the "great tribulation".
6. ONLY those who's names were written in the book of life from the foundation of the world will NOT be deceived. This applies to those of Christ's Church that are 'sealed' with God's Seal prior to the great tribulation, both believing Israelite and believing Gentile.
7. Satan goes after Christ's elect to make war with them. Some of us get delivered up to give a Testimony for Christ against the beast.
8. God's two witnesses show up in Jerusalem for the latter 1260 days, to prophesy against the beast, and work plagues against the beast.
9. after the 1260 days, Satan, the beast that ascends out of the bottomless pit, kills God's two witnesses in Jerusalem, leaving their dead bodies laying in the plaza, all nations see their dead bodies.
10. after 3.5 days, God's two witnesses are raised from the dead.
11. the 7th Trumpet sounds with Christ's coming, and the time of His WRATH upon the wicked, and His rewards to His servants, and all kingdoms on earth become those of The Father and of His Christ.
12. Christ's Church is then gathered on that 7th Trumpet, which is also the 7th Vial, and 6th Seal timing.