If not saved in the end, then never saved, because the work of Christ at the Cross for sinners is perfect: "It is finished" (John 19.30).
Once Saved, Always Saved?
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Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
The question is, do you live in it in unbelief everyday? That is the sin that will condemn you on the day Jesus returns.
The original words came from BloodBought1953. See quote #1768. I was referring to this quote.
Then hold him accountable, NOT everyone else who already KNOWS...
*Salvation GIVEN and RECEIVED IS a ONE TIME GIFT, FROM GOD, to a man WHOSE BODY was NATURALLY BORN...FORGIVEN for having had Disbelief...AND Whose Body has DIED BELIEVING....AND thus RECEIVES it’s Salvation!
OSAS.....There is no dead saved men, making himself come back to life and say....uh...God....changed my mind!
Interesting verbiage. I like this saying. The problem is OSAS is trying so hard to leave it all up to Jesus to get us over the finish line, they are willing to even give up baptism (because it is possibly something to boast about), even though Jesus and the apostles tell us to be baptized. Not sure how they reconcile the NT.
Bible Highlighter
Well-Known Member
Grace, peace, and love be unto you and your family in the name of Jesus Christ.
Bible Highlighter
Well-Known Member
This sounds like Universalism (Whether you intended that to be so or not). The difference between Universalism and biblical salvation is that you need biblical faith in order to access the finished work of the cross (i.e. the atonement) which would also include the application of the resurrection to our lives, as well (Which you did not mention).
For example: Read 1 John 1:7. It basically says if you walk in the light as he is in the light, the blood of Jesus Christ cleanses us from all sin.
Walking in the light = Loving your brother according to the indirect wording in 1 John 2:9-11. So you have to love the brethren in order for the blood of Jesus to continue to cleanse you. This is a part of the faith. 1 John 3:15 says if you hate your brother, no eternal life abides in you. So yeah. It’s more than a belief alone in Jesus to be saved or God electing you to salvation and it’s over. You have to work out your salvation with fear and trembling (Philippians 2:12). You have to fight the good fight of faith, and lay hold on eternal life (1 Timothy 6:12). Yes, God does the good work through us and so all boasting is in Him, but God does not force us to be saved against our own free will. Otherwise, why would God get angry at the wicked every day? (Psalms 7:11). Think, my friend.
Newsflash...No I do not.
Newsflash...You are qualified to speak for yourself.
Newsflash...You are not qualified to speak for All others one on one relationship with the Lord God.
Is it true that in Calvinism, you believe that God is the one that chooses a person to be saved?
Lifelong_sinner
Well-Known Member
yes, you do. You sin EVERY day!!!! We all do. And we cant stop from sinning daily.
Lifelong_sinner
Well-Known Member
ScottA
Well-Known Member
If nothing else...that is a good definition and the crux of the problem.
It is true that if one spiritually identifies with and continues to walk in that carcass that actually died on the cross 2,000 years ago--yeah, that's a problem--and yes, in that case it is most definitely YOU sinning daily. Because you remain a prisoner--meaning you have not at all been set free yet--which is the definition of salvation...and YOU ain't there yet, you are in chains. So, for those of YOU who want to take up that cross and carry it to Golgatha...and then keep on going on and on for 2,000 more years, not allowing Christ to full come in, until you pass away from natural causes--good luck with that. It's only natural.
On the other hand, those who dropped off that carcass at the cross (2,000 years ago) and now walk in newness of life by the Spirit of God because it is no longer YOU but Christ who lives in that carcass until He is through with it--YOU are free according to the scriptures and the promises of God and Christ, no longer captive, a part of the first resurrection, to rule and reign with Christ as Priests and Kings for a thousand years...that is, until the fulness of time.
Hallelujah!
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I am in full agreement that the English translations are sufficient for English speaking folks to understand the revelation of God.
However, it is not the advise of Thayer ALONE.
Look up the word nature and you will learn that it means exactly what I taught you.
It does in fact mean by a long term habit.
Deny Thayers definition on this Greek word,
You unfortunately will be denying the true meaning of the word.
Go to other Greek scholars so as to learn the meaning.
Furthermore,
I do not need the Greek to define the meaning of nature used in Ephesians 2:3.
I have already taught you the context proves it is speaking of developing a sinful lifestyle out of habit.
Not by being born sinful or innately sinful.
As Romans 2:14 proves those gentiles did not have an innate nature to be utterly wicked without ability to live godly lives.
Compare the two verses and we can see there is no evidence for the calvinist doctrine of a innate nature of sin that we are supposedly born with,
Ephesians 2:3,
-among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature(long habit) the children of wrath, even as others.
Now listen to these gentiles nature being godly upright law keeping folks.
Romans 2:14,
-For when the gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature(chose to be upright)) the things contained in the law, these having not the law, are a law unto themselves.
Even without the law by their nature they obey the law of God.
No way we have a depraved innate sinful wicked reprobated, inherited sin nature.
Those who are wicked by nature do so as by the definition of this Greek word, by habit.
All mankind are created upright.
Not depraved wicked sinners.
If sin nature is true. Babies are going to hell.
It cannot be as gentiles nature in Romans were a godly nature that obeyed God.
Thanks be to God babies are born without sin... have never been separated from God,
Therefore they all die in the Lord.
Stop with your FANTASY. Your forum name says it all about you...
However, I am NOT YOU, and YOU, a mere human, HAVE ZERO authority over MY relationship spiritual with God.
OSAS not found in the Bible.
1John is speaking to Christians not the lost.
1John 3 addresses christians,
1John 3:1-2,
-behold what manner of love God has bestowed on us, that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew Him not.
-Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be : but we know that, when He shall appear, we shall see Him as He is.
These are saved Christians!
Now listen to John tell these christians what will happen to their eternal life if they HATE their brother.
1John 3:15,
-whosoever hateth His brother is a murderer: and ye know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him.
No Christian who hates His brother has eternal life.
Now that is so simple to understand.
The only way one can say this is false is to deny that these folks were not saved Christians.
If one does, they are denying the word of God.
1John is speaking to Christians not the lost.
1John 3 addresses christians,
1John 3:1-2,
-behold what manner of love God has bestowed on us, that we should be called the sons of God: therefore the world knoweth us not, because it knew Him not.
-Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be : but we know that, when He shall appear, we shall see Him as He is.
These are saved Christians!
Now listen to John tell these christians what will happen to their eternal life if they HATE their brother.
1John 3:15,
-whosoever hateth His brother is a murderer: and ye know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him.
No Christian who hates His brother has eternal life.
Now that is so simple to understand.
The only way one can say this is false is to deny that these folks were not saved Christians.
If one does, they are denying the word of God.
If I cannot stop myself from sinning as Lifelong sinner proclaims.
Then I am not accountable for my actions.
Lifelong_sinner
Well-Known Member
None of you get it. This is not rocket science.
1 john 1:8 says “If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.”
1. keyword is “have” not had.
2. If at ANY point in your life, ANY means ANY, you say you dont have sin in your life, then you arent saved. If you have no sin, then you’re saying you either have no need of a Saviour, or you are the Saviour. Wow this forum has such terrible theology. Theres NO way most of you go to church. This is theology 101 we’re talking about and yet 95% + cant get this one thing right.
Let me say this as clearly as i know how;
if you say, you dont sin, or that you no longer sin, then you are deceived and not saved.
1 john 1:8 says “If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.”
1. keyword is “have” not had.
2. If at ANY point in your life, ANY means ANY, you say you dont have sin in your life, then you arent saved. If you have no sin, then you’re saying you either have no need of a Saviour, or you are the Saviour. Wow this forum has such terrible theology. Theres NO way most of you go to church. This is theology 101 we’re talking about and yet 95% + cant get this one thing right.
Let me say this as clearly as i know how;
if you say, you dont sin, or that you no longer sin, then you are deceived and not saved.
I obey Hebrews 10:25.
I attend worship every first day of the week, Acts 20:7
If we are NEVER without sin, then everyone is going to hell.
1John 1:9,
-If we confess our sins, God is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
I am holy, righteous, justified, sanctified, purified by the blood of Jesus Christ.
You can also Lifelong sinner,
All you have to do is believe and obey the gospel of Jesus Christ.
Isaiah 1:18-19, 20
-Come now and let us reason together saith the Lord: though your sins be as scarlet they shall be white as snow; though they be red like crimson, they shall be white as wool.
-If ye be willing and obedient, ye shall eat the good of the land
-but if ye refuse and rebel, ye shall be devoured with the sword; for the mouth of the Lord hath spoken it.
Lifelong_sinner
Well-Known Member
we are always with sin. The difference between the saved and unsaved is the saved have been forgiven. And yes, the majority of mankind are going to hell. Jesus tells us this.
heres a great example; a billionaire one day walks into town, and randomly starts giving people a million dollars, just because he wants to. Completely random. Now what was the difference between those who received that money and those that didnt? Nothing. That is how grace works. It had nothing to do with what we do or dont do (unconditional).
this is also how God determined who would be saved. This is the doctrine of election in a nutshell. Even if we are saved, we still sin. We may not like it, but we still do. And for so many to sit there and type how they dont sin anymore, its preposterous to even think that.
Hello friend,
I agree Christians sin.
I dont agree Christians are continuing in sin.
There are sins of omission and commission
You like that you have no responsibility to stop sin.
No condition placed upon you to be saved.
No responsibility to not sin.
You better start believing that Gods grace is conditional Lifelong sinner.
Otherwise you will stay lost.
You must repent of sins to be saved.
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