Please explain this.

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Lady Crosstalk

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Hi LC,

It's an interesting thing, learning about child sexual abuse, not to mention other childhood abuses, neglect, physical, all that. Horrifying, really, but when it's me, well, it takes on an new depth.

Your words above are dead on target.

I've learned that the corruption of the flesh is exactly that, our bodies and our brains have been ruined.

In childhood sexual abuse, the brain forms differently, generally becoming underdeveloped in numerous regions, these changes having a devastating impact on one's understanding of self, God, others, the world in general, everything.

These changes likewise have a devastating impact on perceptions, feelings, thoughts, and behavior. Brain maladaptations often result in the victim reproducing the developemental conditions they grew up in, whether perpetuating lives of fear and violation, or even become an abuser themself. God spared me from that. But there was much He did not spare me from.

At the end of the day, I've learned that the brain changes resultant from childhood abuse act just like addictions.

When someone is drug addicted, it is because the drug they are ingesting has overstimulated certain parts of the brain, resulting in the increased desire of that overstimulation, but also resulting in dimishined natural production of whatever body/brain chemistry that drug is supplementing.

Drugs work on us because they mimic a natural process. That process becauses hijacked by the drug, which then builds more brain circuits that respond to the drug. Neurons grow more dendrites to accomodate the drug, or whatever the specific change is. Now, take away the drug, and the cravings are stronger, because of those extra circuits. Take more drug, build stronger addiction. The brain has been modified to accomodate that drug. The drug has become part of the fabric of the person's consciousness.

Kaiser Permanente defines drug addiction as "abnormal drug seeking behavior". Addicts call it "jonesing", I don't know why. But the idea is that if you don't have the drug, you have this overwhelm sense of need, of urgency, to get the drug.

Only when you abstain from the drug for sufficient time will those cravings subside, as the brain structure returns to normal, those extra dendrites and what have you reverting back.

Childhood abuse does the same thing to the brain, but not just with neurons and dendtrites and all that, but with the very parts of the brain itself.

One example is Vetral Medial Pre Frontal Cortex, which can become undersized, resulting in diminished capacity. The vm/PFC is responsible for assigning values to perceptions, in sorting out where to store memories, dampening overly loud noises, overly bright lights, strong emotions, ringing in the ears, pain sensations, much more.

Each part that is damages results in lessened ability to process perceptions to stimuli, to weigh competing thoughts, to control impulses.

Poor impulse control is a sign of an underdeveloped brain, in that the brain has it's own agenda hardwired into it, whether to take a drug, or to "prove" through my bad behavior that is really was my fault.

The brain records a child's world in letter of iron. As we grow up, that's how we are.

A crazy life of fear and pain and acting out can supply that overstimulation needed to keep the brain function and chemistry up to par for a "normal" life, though this is anything but normal. A life within which one can function, in the only kind of funtioning one has ever known.

But that kind of life is not good.

Take away the fear and pain and acting out, and all that goes with all of that, and this "brain support" ends. And what happens when the brain lacks sufficient serotonin? dopamine? norepinephrine? all that? Major depression is typically the result. It was the result with me, about 90% debilitating.

Yes, the corruption of the flesh can be described in cold clinical terms. But just the same, sin was committed against me, but then I committed sins against myself.

At the end of the day, nothing anyone in this world can do will restore what's been lost to me, but in Jesus, this was for my good, for my salvation, and is being redeemed.

I have to agree, this was Pure Evil.

The man that did that to me told me his story, it had been done to him, now he's doing it to me, I think to try to prove to himself that he wasn't evil, rather, anyone would become like that! Not!

Man, why am I saying all this???

To say this:

The body and the brain are a mess, not just me, I think all of us, just some more than others. Even the minor issues of childhood leave their imprint. No one grows up perfectly. We all have baggage. And I think if we were to be able to see well enough, we'd find baggage that goes all the way back to Adam.

We can do things for the body, for the brain, that can help. We can study and learn, as I've done. For me, information is a very powerful tool. I could be taking antidepressants, but I don't want to, so I'm not. I don't mind if someone does, but I know that whatever I do at the material level is either simply good healthy habits, or is paliative care, as the real answer is to walk in the Spirit.

Walking in the Spirit does not depend on the condition of the flesh, the brain, the mind of the flesh. Walking in the Spirit is a completely separate life. In the Spirit, all is good. Extremely good!

I may experience the physical and mental symtoms, and I may not, but all I can say is, he who serves, in the strength God gives.

@Lady Crosstalk , @JohnPaul

Fair warning . . . these are the kinds of posts I tend to delete after a bit. I'll have to see how I feel about all this self revelation.

Much love!


I'm so sorry that happened to you, Marks. But I am sincerely glad that the Lord is taking it all on Himself and healing you. As you have noted a spiritual AND physical healing must take place when one has suffered childhood abuse.
 

Lady Crosstalk

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While I know these things happen, I prefer to not let details into my mind.

I've learned that I need to keep strict control of what enters my mind.

Much love!


It is wise advice for all. Children today are often victimized by what they see on television.
 

marks

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It is wise advice for all. Children today are often victimized by what they see on television.
I don't watch much in the way of TV, only recorded media.

Scientists say that the brain stores memories all the same way, whether real or contrived. Violence, terror, monsters, whatever, the brain takes it all in as real life. That's what they say anyway.

Much love!
 

marks

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I'm so sorry that happened to you, Marks. But I am sincerely glad that the Lord is taking it all on Himself and healing you. As you have noted a spiritual AND physical healing must take place when one has suffered childhood abuse.
To be honest, the physical healing progresses with agonizing slowness. But the Spiritual, well, what can I say, this is what overcomes, even our faith. Trusting Jesus in this moment causes my life to be a beautiful and wondrous thing.

And while this life experience has been very difficult to say the least, what I've learned, I believe I have an understanding of the flesh and how it functions, what the corruption of the flesh is, how it is so deceitful, and how we can - nuts and bolts stuff - control it. How the new creation has nothing to do with the old, only that we live in that old body - for now.

How we have the tools from God to live in triumph at all times, regardless of who or what or when.

Much love!
 
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GodsGrace

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What did you want to know? I think a lot of people have the rebirth at the time that they first believe--especially if they come to Christ early in their lives--before they have a chance to pile much sin upon sin and before much hardening of their hearts occurs.
It's OK.
My point was that we're born again one time and have the experience once.
If we fall away, we could come back to God..we do hear about these stories also.
 
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marks

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Yeah.
I was kinda wishing I had never read it.
It'll take some time to get the pix out of my head.

Best to keep those things out.

I find many people want to share with me details of terrible things, as if we need to know them, and maybe some do, but the way my mind works? I tend to remember every evil and terrible things that gets put in there.

I think we need to conserve whatever innocence we have remaining.

Much love!
 

GodsGrace

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Best to keep those things out.

I find many people want to share with me details of terrible things, as if we need to know them, and maybe some do, but the way my mind works? I tend to remember every evil and terrible things that gets put in there.

I think we need to conserve whatever innocence we have remaining.

Much love!
AMEN!!
 
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JohnPaul

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Greetings JohnPaul, Let me ask a question, do you know of someone that has these problems and you are wondering how to minister to them?
Thank you for the greetings Grailhunter.
No I don’t know of anyone with these problems, if I knew of a child that was getting molested I’d report it to the authorities and have the molester arrested.
 
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Lady Crosstalk

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It's OK.
My point was that we're born again one time and have the experience once.
If we fall away, we could come back to God..we do hear about these stories also.


If it was a complete and genuine conversion, they will come back (with much grief over their sin and with the knowledge that they have grieved the Holy Spirit).
 

Lady Crosstalk

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Yeah.
I was kinda wishing I had never read it.
It'll take some time to get the pix out of my head.

In my work with women who were abused as children, I "saw" enough of that nightmare through their eyes, that I never want to volunteer to hear of any more. Surely the Lord is coming to put an end to the outrage of child abuse. I pray that it will be soon.
 
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marks

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One other thing I'll add to what I was saying . . . I remain absolutely convinced that God has limited my life to what is needful for me to know God, and to have the most abundant and fruitful life possible.

Much love!
 

justbyfaith

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We are told that we will know a false teacher by his fruit.

That would be the general fruit of the teacher...not a mess-up here or there. You who are contending for the idea that we all sin from time to time are certainly quick to judge when someone makes a one-time blunder. I said to you that I was referring to a general attitude among people of a certain opinion, that they tend to go to other translations because of itching ears. Now I did not, say, "you, Lady Crosstalk", though I did say you. That was a slip-up in communication on my part. I was not referring to you in particular, pointing the finger at you. But it was more of a general statement that carried over into my estimation of you; because I know that there are those who go to other translations because of itching ears: and in the heat of the moment I applied that to you. So, if it is not true of you, then I apologize. But I truly did mean it only as a general statement.

Now there is a certain type of person, who thinks it is their job to identify false teachers, and who will jump at the first sign of any kind of sinful behaviour in a teacher's life. Usually these are the same people who excuse sin in their own lives and in the lives of anyone who is not a teacher of God's word, via the false doctrine of the inevitability of sin. So the hypocrisy is readily apparent, in that they immediately point the finger at the first fault of a teacher, while excusing their own sins and the sins of those who are not teachers through their doctrine.

You addressed it to me in your post, and this is what you said: "I'm certain that now you will go to another translation, heaping up for yourself a teacher in the translator of it, to tell you what your itching ears want to hear..." I repeat, maligning those you don't even know (you don't know ANYTHING about me) is NOT very Christlike.

And yet, in the same breath that you say that I am not Christ-like over the "maligning of you", you exhibit the same un-Christ-like behaviour in maligning me (by saying that my behaviour is un-Christ-like; and that therefore I must be a false teacher because I am bearing bad fruit).

Good to hear that it didn't pass. Wonder what happened?

People prayed. I was one of them. Also, it was very likely determined to be unconsitutional.

Now, if you believe the bible teaches this...then I surely hope that YOU never are sinning since IF you ARE, by your theology, it would mean that you are NOT a Christian.

Okay, now, I may be off-base to expect that people would take all of my posts into account when estimating what I believe in.

I consider that I have laid a foundation in other posts within the past 5 months wherein I have taught on what I believe 1 John 3:9 really teaches. But since some of you may have missed what I said on the subject, I will repeat it here, just so you can get a more accurate account of what I believe in; and what I mean when I say certain things.

Of course, when I say such things as what John said in 1 John 3:9, I am taken literally and am called to the carpet for my statements. When he says it, it is interpreted by the hearer as saying something other than what he actually said.

I even do this; and have interpreted 1 John 3:9 as being a statement of hyperbole (exaggeration to make a point).

So, when I say that we, as believers, do not sin; or that we cannot sin, I am also using hyperbole.

The point that I (and John) would make by this statement is that when we repent and turn to Christ in faith, there is a 180-degree turn that is made from walking towards sin, death, and hell, towards righteousness, life, and heaven.

We are not walking in the same direction any more; our lives have changed. I hold that 1 John 3:9 is saying exactly the same thing as 2 Corinthians 5:17.

We are headed towards a new country, RIGHTEOUSNESS, and away from the old country, SIN.

Now when we cross the boundary into the new country, we have left the old country.

And I consider that the immediate result does not necessarily have to be physical death.

Even once we have crossed the boundary into the new country, I consider that our righteousness will continue to increase.

Pro 4:18, But the path of the just is as the shining light, that shineth more and more unto the perfect day.

I consider that the moment we begin to head towards the new country, we are justified before the Lord; for we have made that 180-degree turn. We may still mess up from time to time; because we have not yet left the old country: nevertheless our direction has changed and this is what the Lord sees.

There is a second benefit (2 Corinthians 1:15) awaiting those who are headed toward the new country, the moment they cross the boundary from the old country into the new. I do not believe that this second benefit = physical death.

Some people give me the impression that in our quest for sanctification, the goal is to physically die.

Because if you were to ever reach the goal of entire sanctification, in their estimation that means the Lord will immediately take you home.
 
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Lady Crosstalk

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That would be the general fruit of the teacher...not a mess-up here or there. You who are contending for the idea that we all sin from time to time are certainly quick to judge when someone makes a one-time blunder. I said to you that I was referring to a general attitude among people of a certain opinion, that they tend to go to other translations because of itching ears. Now I did not, say, "you, Lady Crosstalk", though I did say you. That was a slip-up in communication on my part. I was not referring to you in particular, pointing the finger at you. But it was more of a general statement that carried over into my estimation of you; because I know that there are those who go to other translations because of itching ears: and in the heat of the moment I applied that to you. So, if it is not true of you, then I apologize. But I truly did mean it only as a general statement.
That's good to know. I accept your apology. I made the false teacher statement about John Calvin. He was a murderer--I don't care how much his followers deny it.

Now there is a certain type of person, who thinks it is their job to identify false teachers, and who will jump at the first sign of any kind of sinful behaviour in a teacher's life.
That wouldn't be me as I am always dismayed when I see the fall of mega church pastors because it gives fuel to the unbelievers to say, "See, see, all Christians are a bunch of hypocrites."

Usually these are the same people who excuse sin in their own lives and in the lives of anyone who is not a teacher of God's word, via the false doctrine of the inevitability of sin. So the hypocrisy is readily apparent, in that they immediately point the finger at the first fault of a teacher, while excusing their own sins and the sins of those who are not teachers through their doctrine.
That wouldn't be me either. If the sin in a church leader wasn't grossly obvious, how would any of us know about it? In the case of a certain mega church pastor, who I won't name, almost ANY MAN IN HIS CHURCH was likely much more obedient than he apparently was, while in the pulpit. Gambling trips to Las Vegas, fleecing the church out of millions upon millions, financial irregularities because he absolutely controlled the church's money and record of expenditures, making sexual advances on female staff members--the list goes on and on. There are definite New Testament criteria (see Titus and 1 Timothy) for the moral fiber of those who would lead a church--and he didn't meet any of them. But, he was good at making people laugh.



And yet, in the same breath that you say that I am not Christ-like over the "maligning of you", you exhibit the same un-Christ-like behaviour in maligning me (by saying that my behaviour is un-Christ-like; and that therefore I must be a false teacher because I am bearing bad fruit).
I SAID ABSOLUTELY NOTHING connecting your un-Christ-like behavior with being a false teacher. You are mistaken. I was merely pointing out that you are not as sinless as you pretend to be. It was not "maligning" you at all--I was referring to an obvious moral fault of yours. Insinuating something about my character that you obviously could not know, is called slander. A moral failing to which I was pointing.



People prayed. I was one of them. Also, it was very likely determined to be unconsitutional.
Even though I am a Canadian, I pray regularly for the U.S. I pray for a great revival in N. America.
 
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justbyfaith

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I SAID ABSOLUTELY NOTHING connecting your un-Christ-like behavior with being a false teacher. You are mistaken.

Sorry, I got your words mixed up. You may have indeed been talking about John Calvin; but it appeared that you were talking about me.

You wrote:

You malign people you don't even know--not very Christlike of you. By the way, it is said even more plainly in the NLT--"So you cannot become my disciples without giving up everything you own." That verse was the basis of the early Church holding everything in common. Didn't last long because, people being people, some took advantage. That is why Paul said, "Those who wont work, won't eat." How do you know that I haven't given up everything? Have you?

And in the very next post, you wrote:

We are told that we will know a false teacher by his fruit.

In your second post, I simply failed to see the quote of what you were responding to; and assumed that there was a continuity in what you were posting.

In any case, your comment about John Calvin spilled over to include me because of how close these things were in context to each other.
 
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justbyfaith

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I was merely pointing out that you are not as sinless as you pretend to be.
Also, I do not pretend to be sinless. I will be the first one to call myself the chief of sinners to you.

This may be a paradox in the word of the Lord; that it is a trustworthy saying to call ourselves the chief of sinners (1 Timothy 1:15): while at the same time the Lord promises that He will sanctify you wholly (1 Thess. 5:23-24 (kjv)).

It can be hard to wrap your mind around.

But I consider that the closer you get to Jesus in your walk with Him, the more aware you become of what is sinful within you.

So it is a kind of paradox that the more holy I become, the less holy I will think myself to be.

And if I think myself more holy, does that not mean that I am in all reality the less holy?

So then, if I realize this, I will think myself less holy for that I am aware (as was Job) of the righteousness that the Lord has placed within me.
 

marks

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I even do this; and have interpreted 1 John 3:9 as being a statement of hyperbole (exaggeration to make a point).
Hi JBF,

Curious, how do you substantiate this interpretation, that this is hyperbole? And not a literal statement of fact?

We are not walking in the same direction any more; our lives have changed. I hold that 1 John 3:9 is saying exactly the same thing as 2 Corinthians 5:17.

But then, 2 Cor 5:17 tells us we are new creations, that nothing of the old remains, everything is new, everything is now of God. Curious . . . where in that is the sinfulness?

Much love!