How can the Rapture be a New Age thing when Christ spoke of it even before He was crucified? And since Jesus is the Truth, we need to listen to what He had to say about it.
Is The Rapture A Literal Event?
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Hi brakelite,
His way seems to be by keeping all His promises to Israel according to the flesh, saving them out of the end of the age, then delivering to them the promised kingdom ruled by the Holy One of Israel.
And without "spiritualizing", or interpretting other than literally, there will be no protection except for Jews.
Much love!
The thing is that it's been changed, it's been played with by Satan as to the truth, so it's been bastardised by Satan so as to lead people astray.
No one talked the silly rubbish that people have been ranting on about nowadays with it all, because that's just a modern day simplistic dribble.
It's like people have been watching the Simpsons where the Principal came out of he dunny and had not done up his zip and the kids pointed it out to him, he was totally embarrassed and he lifted up his arms and said leave your body ? and that was the start of it with the show. they have it nailed.
Taken
Well-Known Member
Is The Rapture A Literal Event? <--- OP
Literal? Yes.
Spiritual? Yes.
For Who? Everyone? No.
For Who? Christ's Church? Yes.
What? Resurrection of the Body, in Glory. (United with the SAVED soul and QUICKENED spirit).
When?
When the Lord Jesus descends from Heaven, to the Clouds.
Before the Great Tribulation.
Why?
1) The spirit, soul, body has been Prepared.
2) The Church is called to come meet face to face with their Lord.
3) The Marriage of the Bride to her Groom.
Where?
Heaven? No.
Earth? No.
Clouds Above the Face of the Earth? Yes
How?
Trump is sounded to Alert Christ's Church.
Sound is heard by Christ's Church.
"Power of God" Raises up His Church to meet the Lord in the Air.
What about ISRAEL?
What about UNBELIEVERS?
What about those COMING INTO BELIEF?
What about them or ANY OTHER group WHO IS NOT Christ's Church?
The Resurrection of Christ's Church IS SPECIFIC to Christ's Church, and TO THEM, who are Prepared to BE resurrected; It is on a day of the Lords Choosing; and QUICK.
(IN short, called the RAPTURE, pursuant to the meaning of the WORDS "Caught Up".)
Every Bible student is notified...
The Time is at hand.
Every Bible student is notified...
Death comes to us ALL, and They know not the day of their physical Death...
So, yes, THEIR / "everyone's" TIME is at hand.
The Lord IS QUICK to Act...
However MEN are SLOW to learn, They; ponder, put it off, have "Other" supposed important things to DO, work, ballgames, partying, events, etc...
Which is to say IN SHORT..."THEY" are "NOT" PREPARING or PREPARED to MEET God face to face.
(Warning to us: A Humans TIME IS SHORT...Be Informed, Be diligent, Know your Choices, Be Prepared).
"THEY" Dallied...Therefore "a QUICK" snatching, catching up, DOES NOT APPLY to THEM.
Are THEY...therefore without Hope or Expectation? No. They also MUST "BECOME" prepared.. "TO"
Be WITH the Lord Forever...
Or
Maintain and or Choose to Be WITHOUT the Lord Forever...
Who, What, When, Why, Where, How..
"WAS" a mystery.
The Book of Daniel Revealed there WAS a mystery.
John in the Book of Revelations, REVEALED the mystery.
Glory to God, that When He LOOKS DOWN "up you", and the Lord Descends from Heaven to the Clouds;
that He may FIND YOU prepared, YOU having Chosen/ Elected God to be Your God, and YOU having Chosen / Elected to participate IN His Reasonable Service.
1 Thes 1
[4] Knowing, brethren beloved, your election of God.
Rom 12
[1] I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.
Glory to God,
Taken
Literal? Yes.
Spiritual? Yes.
For Who? Everyone? No.
For Who? Christ's Church? Yes.
What? Resurrection of the Body, in Glory. (United with the SAVED soul and QUICKENED spirit).
When?
When the Lord Jesus descends from Heaven, to the Clouds.
Before the Great Tribulation.
Why?
1) The spirit, soul, body has been Prepared.
2) The Church is called to come meet face to face with their Lord.
3) The Marriage of the Bride to her Groom.
Where?
Heaven? No.
Earth? No.
Clouds Above the Face of the Earth? Yes
How?
Trump is sounded to Alert Christ's Church.
Sound is heard by Christ's Church.
"Power of God" Raises up His Church to meet the Lord in the Air.
What about ISRAEL?
What about UNBELIEVERS?
What about those COMING INTO BELIEF?
What about them or ANY OTHER group WHO IS NOT Christ's Church?
The Resurrection of Christ's Church IS SPECIFIC to Christ's Church, and TO THEM, who are Prepared to BE resurrected; It is on a day of the Lords Choosing; and QUICK.
(IN short, called the RAPTURE, pursuant to the meaning of the WORDS "Caught Up".)
Every Bible student is notified...
The Time is at hand.
Every Bible student is notified...
Death comes to us ALL, and They know not the day of their physical Death...
So, yes, THEIR / "everyone's" TIME is at hand.
The Lord IS QUICK to Act...
However MEN are SLOW to learn, They; ponder, put it off, have "Other" supposed important things to DO, work, ballgames, partying, events, etc...
Which is to say IN SHORT..."THEY" are "NOT" PREPARING or PREPARED to MEET God face to face.
(Warning to us: A Humans TIME IS SHORT...Be Informed, Be diligent, Know your Choices, Be Prepared).
"THEY" Dallied...Therefore "a QUICK" snatching, catching up, DOES NOT APPLY to THEM.
Are THEY...therefore without Hope or Expectation? No. They also MUST "BECOME" prepared.. "TO"
Be WITH the Lord Forever...
Or
Maintain and or Choose to Be WITHOUT the Lord Forever...
Who, What, When, Why, Where, How..
"WAS" a mystery.
The Book of Daniel Revealed there WAS a mystery.
John in the Book of Revelations, REVEALED the mystery.
Glory to God, that When He LOOKS DOWN "up you", and the Lord Descends from Heaven to the Clouds;
that He may FIND YOU prepared, YOU having Chosen/ Elected God to be Your God, and YOU having Chosen / Elected to participate IN His Reasonable Service.
1 Thes 1
[4] Knowing, brethren beloved, your election of God.
Rom 12
[1] I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.
Glory to God,
Taken
Go study the RCC teaching on all this going back for years and you will find that the word rapture is stupid for a start. it's dumbed down dribble.
Meet the Lord in the Air ? what is your take on that ? mine is that the Air, is the Holy Spirit and the Clouds, is about his Majesty. no one is going up into the Clouds literally at all. it's all Spiritual relationship.
Taken
Well-Known Member
Why? I own several Bibles and can Read.
I find no such thing, IN Scripture or IN the meaning of Words from One Language to Another.
Latin ~ rapio
Meaning ~ seized or snatched from one place to another.
Latin ~ rapturo
Meaning ~ Caught up
Greek ~ harpazo
Meaning ~ snatch or take away, caught up
English ~ rapture
Meaning ~ Caught up
Acts 8:39
[39] And when they were come up out of the water, the Spirit of the Lord caught away Philip and the eunuch saw him no more...
2 Cor 12:
[2] I knew a man in Christ above fourteen years ago, (whether in the body, I cannot tell; or whether out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth;) such an one caught up to the third heaven.
Rev 12
[5] And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne.
1 Thes 4:17
[17] Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
Yes.
That:
Dead Bodies of (saved souls) & (quickened spirits), shall be "risen up/ caught up/ taken up" (IN Glory),
TO the Air/Clouds/Lower Heavens...
And Meet their Lord, And SEE Him, As He IS.
And
Living Bodies, and that bodies saved soul & quickened spirit, shall be "risen up/ caught up/ taken up" (IN Glory),
TO the Air/Clouds/Lower Heavens...
And Meet their Lord, And SEE Him, As He IS.
Disagree.
Air is the gaseous substance we breath that aids a human in sustaining his life.
Clouds are a masses of condensed water visible in the sky.
The Holy Spirit IS Gods POWER, and called by the title CHRIST.
Acts 1:
[8] But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me ...
1 Cor 1:
[24] But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God.
[/QUOTE] no one is going up into the Clouds literally at all. it's all Spiritual relationship.[/QUOTE]
Disagree.
You have presented no evidence to the contrary.
The Spiritual Relationship is Formed AND "BONDED" when a man Gives his WHOLE LIFE (body soul, spirit) TO the Lord...
...AND
"SEALED".
When the Lord God;
"Restores" (saves) the mans soul.
"Quickens" (births again with Gods SEED) the mans spirit.
Promises to "RAISE UP" in Glory, the mans body.
WHEN the WHOLE, saved soul, quickened spirit, and IS Raised UP bodily in Glory...that man IS Caught UP TO the Lord God, IN the Clouds.
1 Cor 15:
[43] It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:
On that day, such a man SHALL BE "ABLE" to SEE, the Lord God, "as He is"...
(Currently, we can only SEE His works).
Matt 5
[8] Blessed are the pure in heart: for they shall see God.
Glory to God,
Taken
no one is going up into the Clouds literally at all. it's all Spiritual relationship.[/QUOTE]
Disagree.
You have presented no evidence to the contrary.
The Spiritual Relationship is Formed AND "BONDED" when a man Gives his WHOLE LIFE (body soul, spirit) TO the Lord...
...AND
"SEALED".
When the Lord God;
"Restores" (saves) the mans soul.
"Quickens" (births again with Gods SEED) the mans spirit.
Promises to "RAISE UP" in Glory, the mans body.
WHEN the WHOLE, saved soul, quickened spirit, and IS Raised UP bodily in Glory...that man IS Caught UP TO the Lord God, IN the Clouds.
1 Cor 15:
[43] It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:
On that day, such a man SHALL BE "ABLE" to SEE, the Lord God, "as He is"...
(Currently, we can only SEE His works).
Matt 5
[8] Blessed are the pure in heart: for they shall see God.
Glory to God,
Taken[/QUOTE]
You have to get a handle on Hebrew in the relation as to how the words are use and then look at how English has tried it's best to relate to it.
Meet the Lord in the Holy Spirit. Air here is such.
Caught up, means Spiritually caught up, not your flesh at all.
Do you believe that people are going to rise from the graves in the flesh ? no that is a spiritual thing.
Jesus Christ is not coming back in the flesh, he comes back by the power of the Holy Spirit.
Well if you are reluctant about going to Heaven, don't put everyone else in the same boat. The Church will go RIGHT THROUGH THE CLOUDS into Heaven itself. And later the saints and angels coming with Christ from Heaven will appears as clouds (white and radiating light).
Behold, He cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see Him, and they also which pierced Him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of Him. Even so, Amen. (Rev 1:7)
So if they did not go to Heaven in the first place, how could they come from Heaven at His Second Coming?
Taken
Well-Known Member
Already have. TY.
The Point is:
Body's of men, Do not go UP to the High Heavens.
Body's of "saved and born again" men, Are Lifted UP Off the Face of the Earth.
It signifies, what comes Nexr...
Destruction upon the Earth.
The Saved and Born Again are NOT Subject to; and SAVED FROM Gods Wrath, or (otherwise the effects of Gods Wrath).
Destruction upon the Earth, (also known as the GREAT TRIBULATION) IS Effected By Gods POWER, and Because of Gods WRATH toward the unGodly.
It is Precisely, a mans "Glorified FLESH", (saved soul & Quickened spirit).
Our bodies do not remain Flesh and Blood, they become "Changed", to a Glorified Body.
And that occurs WHEN a saved and born again BODY is "RAISED UP"...IN Glory.
Only Bodies are in the graves, and Yes, ALL Bodies in the Graves SHALL be raised up.
Some will be "RAISED UP" IN Glory.
Some will be "RAISED UP" IN Damnination.
How can ALL stand before their Judge on Judgement day, IF their Body is IN A GRAVE?
Of course it is a "spiritual thing". It is an occurance that shall come to pass, BY the POWER of God.
Jesus FIRST came to earth, as a BABY, without His Reputation (Christ, the Power of God), as a Son of Man, (as ALL men with the SEED of God), are the Son of Abraham, (Gods Faithful Servant).
When Jesus "RETURNS", He comes as "the Son of Man"...
WITH His "Reputation"...(The POWER of God).
Mark 14:
[62] And Jesus said, I am: and ye shall see the Son of man sitting on the right hand of power, and coming in the clouds of heaven.
Every EYE on Earth shall SEE Him coming
down from the Clouds. Earthly men, (still in their corrupt bodies, would NOT BE ABLE to SEE HIM, unless He Returned in the FLESH.)
Rev 1
[7] Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.
Additionally;
So as it was in the Days of Noah, so shall it be in the end days.
The Earth was Destroyed....EXCEPT for those who were LIFTED UP ABOVE "the face of the Earth" (that they were REMOVED out of the harm while the earth was being destroyed).
Matt 24:
[37] But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
Gen 7
[17] And the flood was forty days upon the earth; and the waters increased, and bare up the ark, and it was lift up above the earth.
[18] And the waters prevailed, and were increased greatly upon the earth; and the ark went upon the face of the waters.
Noah was Saved.
When the Earth is Destroyed during the Great Tribulation....the saved shall be Lited UP, above the earth...and SAVED from destruction.
Glory to God,
Taken
Why not? The New Jerusalem is indeed in the Highest Heaven, and that is exactly where all the saints will be. That is also where Christ is presently.
Taken
Well-Known Member
Point.
Bodies of men do not go up to the high heaven.
Enoch question;
Why not?
DO not, is a reference to a humans body presently.
YOU reiterated the same concept...
Ie "will be".
Much has NOT YET been fulfilled.
(Continued Division, Great Tribulation, Millennium reign, Chaos, Raising up in Glory and Damnation, Judgement, Separation of the Divided, New Heaven, New Earth, All in Agreement gathered together, Some with, some without God.)
What is present...is not what "will be".
Glory to God,
Taken
Did the glorified body of Christ go up to Heaven? If that is true (which it is is) the the bodies of glorified saints also go up to Heaven. And Enoch and Elijah went to Heaven a long time ago.
Taken
Well-Known Member
Agree.
I find Scripture silent on the Body's of Saints who rose up out of their graves.
Do you have a Scripture relating to that?
Body, soul & spirit?
BEFORE Christ Jesus? Who is First/Before ALL things?
Col 1
[17] And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.
Glory to God,
Taken
Taken
Well-Known Member
Hi Stan ~
Can't quote a number.
To otherwise answer your question...
1) Warning.
Gen 2:
[17] But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.
2) Failure to heed warning...Appointment with Death required By God.
Gen 9:
[5] And surely your blood of your lives will I require; ...
...I require the life of man.
3) Verified in the Book of Hebrews.
Heb 9:
[27] And as it is appointed unto men once to die, ...
4) New Covenant. Good News.
Jesus' Offering. His Flesh...For the Life of the world.
John 6:
[51] I am the living bread which came down from heaven: if any man eat of this bread, he shall live for ever: and the bread that I will give is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.
IF and WHEN a man Hears, Reads, Learns what Jesus has Offered...
AND chooses to "RECEIVE" what Jesus has Offered...
The man doesn't "WAIT" for God To "TAKE" his Life...but Rather the man "GIVES" his Life To the Lord God, and is Crucified With Christ, and thereafter his Life is Sealed unto God, and his Life IN the FOREVER Living Lord Gods Life.
John 11:
[25] Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:
[26] And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?
The Great Tribulation is an appointed time For
Those not yet believers and Those who have been sealed by the Mark of the Beast, to experience The Lambs Wrath and God Wrath.
OT men had 4,000 years to listen to Believing men Witnessing of God.
NT Believing men have been Witnessing of the Lord God to Unbelieving men for 2,000 + years.
The only Believers mentioned Witnessing During The Great Tribulation IS:
Two men in Jerusalem.
144,000, being 12,000 from each Tribe of Israel.
An Angel.
No mention of Christ's Church (those IN Christ), or Any Gentile's, or Any others, Witnessing for the Lord God.
Christ's Church (those IN Christ), (not subject to wrath) have been raised in Glory, to meet their Lord in the Air, PREPARED as the Bride of Christ, To participate in the Marriage supper...and the Guests (witnesses) of that event are the OT Saints.
Glory to God,
Taken
How is that relevant to the FACT -- the Bible FACT -- that Enoch and Elijah were taken to Heaven (and in those bodies)?
And it came to pass, when the LORD would take up Elijah into Heaven by a whirlwind, that Elijah went with Elisha from Gilgal...And it came to pass, as they still went on, and talked, that, behold,there appeared a chariot of fire, and horses of fire, and parted them both asunder; and Elijah went up by a whirlwind into Heaven. (2 Kings 2:1,11)
By faith Enoch was translated that he should not see death; and was not found, because God had translated him: for before his translation he had this testimony, that he pleased God. (Heb 11:5)
It is never a good idea to take Scripture out of context.
Taken
Well-Known Member
Perhaps you can put things IN CONTEXT, and help out with the following.
John 1
[13] And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.
Who are the parents of the Elijah and Enoch you mentioned?
And do you believe Jesus (John 1:13) ?
Do you believe Elijah and Enoch CAME DOWN from heaven, and then went BACK to heaven?
Glory to God,
Taken
When one is born again, you are at Jesus right hand, no one can pluck you out.
When you are born again you are Saved in Christ Jesus and abide in him.
When you are water baptised you are welcome in the body of Christ people, much like a Tribe united under such, but you are not saved, one must be born again to be saved.
No one's body goes up to Heaven at all, that is the Soul that goes their. we do not have a body like we do here, when in heaven and there is no male or female in Heaven because such a body is not so. we become spiritual body's.
The days that are coming is when Satan will dominate over all totally and the Devil will control the whole world but this will fail as great suffering will come like never before and when all such works are represented as burnet up, then comes the awakening that all Satan's works are seen for what they truly were and the whole world will see who Jesus Christ truly is and then become truly born again.
When one becomes truly born again, then such a one knows who Jesus truly is, look when one is water baptised you do not know Jesus, you as a Christian believer only knows "of" Jesus, they do not "Know" Jesus, they only have a percentage of faith in Jesus but not 100% faith that can move mountains ! for if they did they would not be lead astray, now would they.
I do not take my Q from any denomination Church as I see them all as Corrupted, as the Bible says they will be in the last days. I take my Q from Jesus Christ as I do not need such because I am born again, you need to be guided in the Church before you become born again as that is the duty of such a system and this is all about that the hope is that one becomes truly born again.
So one enters the Church in the hope that they will become truly born again, now that is what all the people should hope and pray for such ones to come forth, now not every Christian will become truly born again, but that's fine because not all are called, now all are called but not all will answer the call. or can not hear the call, for they do not have ears to hear and that's OK, that does not condemn one, because as long as you have faith in Jesus and are willing to follow one may be ok, but if one rejects Jesus as the Christ that one is condemned.
Look I went the Church and all I had faith in Jesus and stood up for him always I knew of him but that day that I got Saved it was then that I knew him 100% to be Jesus Christ, the lights came on ! there were no shadows of doubt it blew me away, no one was their with me but Jesus giving me the message, much like he did to Saul when he became Paul. now you don't forget such an in counter like that. it was just out of the blue, bam ! OK I got the message just like Moses did and went forward in God and Saul got the message and went forward in Jesus Christ, that's not an easy task but they did it. it was God working in them.
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