The Antichrist in the book of Daniel

BlackManINC said:

Exactly, because they are not one entity, nor is "the beast" necessarily representative of a government. Apollyon was called "the beast ascending out of the pit" well before Revelation 13 even occurred. The reason is because the prophet Daniel says that Apollyon the "little horn", rises from out of the region of the ten horned beast in chapter seven, and there is no other reason for it. Taking all of Daniels prophecies together, he strongly implies that Europe will eventually end up being the ten horned beast. In Revelation 13, Apollyon is referred to as the seven headed ten horned beast that rises out of the sea because at that time all of the nations of the earth will be under his authority, after the workings of Satan. So when it says that the beast is cast alive in the lake of fire, its not referring to a government, its symbolically referring to Apollyon. You would think that most Christians with their head screwed on straight would come to this obvious conclusion after 2,000 years of countless Bible studies. If I were God, I would be VERY disappointed in the fact that my flock can't understand something that's explained so clearly in kings English that even a ten year old can understand it.

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I agree in general with what you're saying. I'm not so sure about the Apollyon part whether or not he is "the beast" or "Satan". But I'm not too concerned about that. I do agree that Europe is most likely symbolized in the ten horns/toes. I have to clarify one point I made. I'm not saying the beast does not represent governments or kingdoms. I do believe the 7 heads of the beast represent 7 world empires. However, in Rev. 13 it is also talking about the particular ruler of the last kingdom referring to him as the "beast". In other words the "beast" is being used in both ways. But the way I see it, there is a definite reference to the beast in Rev. 13 as a person, who is ruling the final world empire. This is also brought out in Daniel and other places as well.

toknowthetruth said:

I agree in general with what you're saying. I'm not so sure about the Apollyon part whether or not he is "the beast" or "Satan". But I'm not too concerned about that. I do agree that Europe is most likely symbolized in the ten horns/toes. I have to clarify one point I made. I'm not saying the beast does not represent governments or kingdoms. I do believe the 7 heads of the beast represent 7 world empires. However, in Rev. 13 it is also talking about the particular ruler of the last kingdom referring to him as the "beast". In other words the "beast" is being used in both ways. But the way I see it, there is a definite reference to the beast in Rev. 13 as a person, who is ruling the final world empire. This is also brought out in Daniel and other places as well.

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Apollyon,the beast and satan are all one and the same...

Revelation 9:11 "And they had a king over them, which is the angel of the bottomless pit, whose name in the He'-brew tongue is A-bad'-don, but in the Greek tongue hath his [the] name A-pol'-ly-on."

There can be no doubt who the Antichrist is. Jesus is telling us here, through the pen of John. Satan is that King; and "Abaddon" in the Hebrew language means "destroyer" and that is Satan's name. This is verified in the Greek the name, "Apollyon" [Strongs # 623, "the destroyer "Satan"].

n2thelight said:

Apollyon,the beast and satan are all one and the same...

Revelation 9:11 "And they had a king over them, which is the angel of the bottomless pit, whose name in the He'-brew tongue is A-bad'-don, but in the Greek tongue hath his [the] name A-pol'-ly-on."

There can be no doubt who the Antichrist is. Jesus is telling us here, through the pen of John. Satan is that King; and "Abaddon" in the Hebrew language means "destroyer" and that is Satan's name. This is verified in the Greek the name, "Apollyon" [Strongs # 623, "the destroyer "Satan"].

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Can't say for sure about Apollyon, but the beast is cast alive into the lake of fire (Rev 19), and Satan is bound and cast into the bottomless pit (Rev 20). You've also got Rev 13:2 which basically says that Satan give the beast his power and seat and great authority. Sounds to me like two different entities.

BlackManINC

Lets do a simple assessment of your claim and let pure reason prevail. Sine Apollyon is another name in reference to Satan himself according to you, you are henceforth claiming that Satan has already been chained up and locked away in the bottomless pit, where he can no longer go to and fro the earth to deceive the nations for a period of time, with the establishment of Gods kingdom on earth, long after the battle of Armageddon. According to you, the war in heaven between Satan and Michael has already occurred, even though it is clearly stated in kings English that none of this occurs until long after Apollyon's arrival. At no point in scripture is Satan ever referred to as the "beast that rises out of the pit" or "the seven headed ten horned beast", yet for some unknown reason, you believe that Satan, the seven headed ten horned dragon is the seven headed ten horned beast of Revelation when the two are clearly distinguished. If you don't see the logical inconsistencies in your argument, then there is nothing more I can do for you.

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Not according to me, rather scripture....Do you know all the different names satan goes by?satan gets bound on the Day of the Lord,ie,the start of the millennium...

The war in Heaven takes place round about the 5th trump satan get's cast to earth at the 6th trump 6th seal 6th vial

The first beast is the nwo,the one world political system.... That system shall fall apart(deadly wound)satan,gets kicks out of Heaven,he comes at that time pretending to be Christ,at which time he heals the wound thus the world becomes ruled by satan pretending to be Christ.....

Revelation 13:11 "And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon."

Looks like the lamb(Christ)spoke like the dragon,because he is(satan)...

Revelation 13:13 "And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men."

This is satan,and verse 11 shows him coming up out of the earth,so unless you believe the dragon is not satan,there's your proof....

Nowhere did I say the first beast(7 head 10 horn)beast was satan as that is a system,as explained above....

Again apollyon is satan,so know,I don't see the inconsistencies of my argument

Now let's look at who goes into perdition ,and this should leave no doubt...

There is only one soul that is condemned by name to eternal perishment, and that is satan, the son of perdition by one name, and the antichrist by another. Satan has many names but he's the same entity.

Revelation 17:8 "The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is [shall come]."

All of verse 8 is satan,the was the is not and acends......

satan is the son of perdition......

II Th 2:3
3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition (KJV)

The word "perdition" means "one that perishes". Satan and only Satan has already been condemned to die [to perish] by God.

BlackManINC

He claims that Satan is already cast alive into the bottomless pit, since Satan and Apollyon are the same thing according to him. This is a blatantly logical inconsistency.

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Not according to me

The original name of the devil was Lucifer, who was originally a 'good' spirit being and one of a class of angels known as Cherubim (Ezekiel 28:14). At one time, according to the Bible, he was one of only two angelic beings whose task was to cover God's glory as he sat on the throne of the universe. Lucifer eventually rebelled against the Eternal and tried to force him off his throne. Needless to save, this attempt was abysmally unsuccessful. Lucifer had perverted his own mind and became the enemy of righteousness. He was thrown out of heaven like lightening and the rest, they say, is history.

Below are only some of the many names and titles the Bible uses to reference the evil spirit we now commonly call Satan. Next to each one, where possible, is its original language (Hebrew or Greek) meaning. Please note that the Biblical reference for each term may not be the only place in scripture where it can be found.

* Abaddon (destroying angel), as found in Revelation 9:11
* Angel of the bottomless pit, in Revelation 9:11
* Apollyon (destroyer), in Revelation 9:11
* Accuser of our brethren (complainer against those who believe in God), Revelation 12:10
* Adversary (opponent), 1Peter 5:8
* Angel of light (messenger of light), 2Corinthians 11:14
* Antichrist (opponent of the Messiah), 1John 4:3
* Beelzebub (the dung god, ruler of the demons), Luke 11:15
* Belial (worthlessness), 2Corinthians 6:15
* Dragon, Great dragon, Serpent of old, Revelation 12:7 - 9
* Enemy (the hateful, hostile one), Wicked One (evil one), Matthew 13:38 - 39
* god of this world (god of this age), 2Corinthians 4:3 - 4
* Great fiery red dragon (serpent), Revelation 12:3
* Lucifer (morning star), Isaiah 14:12
* Man of sin (man of offence), son of perdition (son of destruction), 2Thessalonians 2:3 - 4
* Murderer, Liar (a falsifier), Father of lies, John 8:44
* Power of darkness (power of obscurity), Colossians 1:13
* Prince of the power of the air (ruler who has authority over air), Ephesians 2:1 - 2
* Rulers of the darkness of this world (world ruler of obscurity in this age), Ephesians 6:12
* Ruler of this world (prince of this world), John 12:31
* Serpent (snake), Genesis 3:1, 2Corinthians 11:3
* Tempter (the tester, one who entices), Matthew 4:3
* Thief (stealer), John 10:9 - 10

BlackManINC said:

Ok, thanks for the list, for this yet again allows me to show you the error in your interpretation by simply checking off the titles that are not referring to Satan at all, which I show in bold.



Antichrist is a vague term referring to anybody that is against everything Jesus stands for, so I'll cut you some slack there. Now as far as the man of sin/son of perdition title is concerned, I would have cut you some slack with that one, had Paul not have clearly distinguished the "man of sin/son of perdition" as a particular individual who comes on the scene after the workings of Satan himself. Yet again, they are clearly described as two different people. So my conclusion to your interpretation is simple, either you have serious problems with basic reading comprehension, or you are being willfully ignorant of the cold hard facts relayed to you in kings English, in which case I'm sure God wouldn't be too pleased, because you are playing games with his word.

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II Thessalonians 2:3 "Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come [it will not be], except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;"

Jesus Christ is not gathering anyone to Him, nor is He coming here to earth, except there be a falling away first. The word for "falling away", in the Greek is "apostasy". Jesus told us in His revelation to John, in Revelation 9:11, that "Apollyon" is one of Satan's names, and this name is derived from the word apostasy.

The word "perdition" means "one that perishes". Satan and only Satan has already been condemned to die [to perish] by God. Satan's judgment day has come already back in the first earth age, and he will have no part in the Great White Throne judgment, or any other judgment yet to come. He has already been judged, and sentence by God to death "perdition" [Ezekiel 28 covers this judgment].
What did Paul say again?

Jesus Christ is coming back to this earth, but the saints of Christ will not be gathered to Him until the "son of perdition" [Satan] be revealed first. How will we know who he is when he arrives?

Revelation 17:8 "The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is [shall come]."

This beast "thou [John] sawest", was in the first earth age; and is not on this earth now, as it is written in Revelation 12:7. Satan is in heaven being our accuser, and will be cast out to this earth very shortly by Michael.

"And shall ascend out of the bottomless pit; and go into perdition;" Who is he again? He is Satan the Antichrist. Satan is not a man born of woman, but a "supernatural arch angel". In Ezekiel 28 it is written that Satan [Lucifer] is the most beautiful of all God's created beings.
In Isaiah 14:12; "How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lu'-ci-fer [day star], son of the morning! How art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!" Lucifer then is another name for Satan; he is also called the Dragon, the serpent, and many other names accounting for the roles he plays, and in our generation he will also be called the "Antichrist".

Isaiah 14:13; "For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:"

Satan is saying, I'm going to be God, and be above the sons [stars] of God. The "mount of the congregation" is on mount Zion; and that is "the side of the north" where Jesus Christ's temple will be.

Isaiah 14:14; "I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High." Satan is saying again, he is going to be God.
Isaiah 14:15; "Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell [sheol], to the sides of the pit."

Who is this that is going into the pit? Who is this son of perdition? It is Lucifer, who is Satan, the "son of perdition". The "son of perdition" of II Thessalonians 2:3 is none other than Satan himself, coming to earth to play the role of Jesus Christ. Paul then is saying that the true Christ,

Jesus Christ, will not return to earth until this "apostasy" takes place first.

Isaiah 14:16; "They that see thee shall narrowly look upon thee, and consider thee, saying, is this the man that made the earth to tremble, that did shake kingdoms;"

Following Jesus Christ's return to earth, and when the Antichrist [Satan] is safely in the pit; the world will wonder; how could Satan have shook all the kingdoms? They simply can't believe that they were deceived into believing this man to be God. Are you going to be one of those deceived into believing Satan is the Christ, or do you know the difference?

Paul is saying to the Thessalonians that Jesus Christ will not come, or will their be a gathering of the saints until you see the Antichrist [son of perdition] first. It takes a lot of guts to take the word of a false preacher, over Paul, Jesus, John, Isaiah, and a whole host of other prophets and disciples. This "apostasy" [falling away] is caused by the "son of perdition", and you will see him live and in person, very shortly.

II Thessalonians 2:4 "Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God."

The "Son of perdition" is Satan and Isaiah just told us this very same thing. Remember, the temple of God is on mount Zion, and "on the side of the North". This person sitting there is sitting in God's seat, pretending to be God: "Showing himself that he is God."

Do you know what Jesus said about this very thing. Jesus called it in Matthew 24:15, the very same thing that Daniel called it in Daniel 9:27; "the Abomination of desolation". A more correct translation in the "James Moffatt translation Bible" is called "The abomination by the desolator".

"Satan claiming to be God" is the abomination, and "he" [Satan] is the desolator, for the entire world will believe him; except for God's elect, and all those who have the seal of God in their minds [foreheads]. The sealed of God have their gospel armor on, and they are ready to face Satan and his system in the spiritual warfare.

Do you see the correlation of the two persons mentioned in the Isaiah Scripture and the 2nd Thessalonians Scripture? It is one and the same entity, it is satan as the antichrist, his most formidable move ever upon God’s children.

I am unclear why you seem it to be so unrealistic that satan shall come and impersonate Jesus Christ as the antichrist prior to the return of the true Messiah Jesus Christ’ Second Advent. And I am equally unclear as to why it is so important for you to hang on to the assertion that the antichrist shall be a flesh man, born of woman, reared and taught on this earth in the normal fashion of men. It seems, to me, far more difficult to believe that the locust army, which are supernatural fallen angels (to be cast out of Heaven with satan in (Rev 12:9) would be subject to a mere mortal man on earth for their five month reign:


And just so you know,I have no problems whatsoever and I don't play games....Judgement starts at the pulpit,and I'll have no problems when I stand before God!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Revelation 9:1 "And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit [pit of the abyss]."

Revelation 9:11 "And they had a king over them, which is the angel of the bottomless pit, whose name in the He'-brew tongue is A-bad'-don, but in the Greek tongue hath his [the] name A-pol'-ly-on."


Now let's see who the star is that falls from Heaven and then you tell me if you still believe Abaddon and Apollyon is not satan

Luke 10:18 "And He said unto them, "I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven."

Now I guess you're going to tell me that the star is not satan,for if you admit it,your argument goes up in smoke!!!!

It's no way in the world that this king is not satan,as he(satan)is the king over all demonic forces.........

Maybe it's you who needs reading comprehension skills!!!!!

BlackManINC said:

Or maybe you should stop grasping at straws, because it only makes you look more foolish the more I debunk every single one of your claims. The verdict is in for me, you are being disingenuous about things plainly stated in the Bible, a trait I find far too often on from many Christians. For the sake of my sanity and precious time, I won't be wasting anymore of my time with you.

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It's all good,people tend to do that when scripture in it's right context is presented....Do have a good life,and the one thing that we all will find out,is the truth!!!!!!!!!!!!But just out of curiosity who was the star and the lightning that fell....If you don't answer I really could care less,my purpose is to plant seeds..

Comment


Here is Satan [Revelation 9:1]

Here is Abaddon [Revelation 9:11; 11:7; 17:8-18]

Here is the relationship [Revelation 13:1-4]

Two fallen angels .... not the same

n2thelight said:

In the book of Daniel he is known as the “little horn” and the “vile one” to name a few.

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That is where you are wrong due to the translation you are using.

The description of "vile" belongs to the king of Daniel 11:20, not to the king of Daniel 11:21.

The two versions that do have those two verses correct as regards the use of the word "vile" are John Wycliffe's and the Douay-Rheims.

the_sign said:

That is where you are wrong due to the translation you are using.

The description of "vile" belongs to the king of Daniel 11:20, not to the king of Daniel 11:21.

The two versions that do have those two verses correct as regards the use of the word "vile" are John Wycliffe's and the Douay-Rheims.

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Not understanding what you are saying,the vile person is satan

Daniel 11:21 "And in his estate shall stand up a vile person, to whom they shall not give the honour of the kingdom: but he shall come in peaceable, and obtain the kingdom by flatteries."

The vile person is satan himself....


When the Antichrist (Satan) comes, there will be no war. He will come as a man of peace and prosperity. The battle Satan will fight is one of deception. This is why we are warned in the sixth chapter of Ephesians to "be strong in the Lord and int he power of His might". (See verse 10.) Verses 11-16 then tell us what armor we must put on to face the battle Satan has for us. This armor is to protect our minds from the deceptions of the Antichrist. It is with this "vile person" that we will be in a spiritual battle with; and it will be fought with words, ideas, and concepts.

This battle is with spiritual principalities, Satan's angelic hosts, Satan's kids (the Kenites), and all sorts of wickedness in high places. This "vile person" (Satan) will attack every fragment of your life, home, school, and work. He will even rule your church. He will seem so right, yet be so wrong.

When Michael will cast Satan to earth (Revelations 12:7), and then this spiritual battle will be in full force. Satan will be eye to eye with the Christians, and most will be so ignorant of God's word that they will think he is Jesus Christ, and go whoring after him. Satan will claim to be Christ!

Same person as below

Daniel 8:25 "And through his policy also he shall cause craft to prosper in his hand; and he shall magnify himself in his heart, and by peace shall destroy many: he shall also stand up against the Prince of princes; but he shall be broken without hand."

n2thelight said:

The vile person . . .

Same person as below

Daniel 8:25

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Now include the previous two verses.

Speaking in that kingship, I am strengthened by all manner of crime, deception, hostility, etc. that can be seen better in Daniel 11:4.

An actual discussion with that king you are having now.

But as regards 2 Thess. 2:6, such a conversation would be impossible outside of the "time of the end" (Daniel 12:9) due to the closing and sealing.

My life since ca. September 25, 1955 A.D. is the life of that kingship of Daniel 8:23, also the same as the kingship of Daniel 11:3-4, and Daniel 11:21.

I witnessed the attack, rape, and incest of the king of Daniel 11:20 upon his own mother (the wife of the king of Daniel 11:19) from the vantage point of being a legitimate son of her's as a growing fetus in her womb.

If what that king of Daniel 11:20 did isn't vile to you, me thinks you'll never understand the meaning of the word.

It is also an abomination.

What God did though, was He conjoined my oldest brother's seed to the already developing embryo and raised Judas Iscariot from the dead in the process.

We were conjoined for several years until I received Holy Communion from the Byzantine Rite chalice administered by the personage of "Gloria Olivae" of the St. Malachy prophecy at which time we were miraculously separated without harm.

Getting back to the translation error, it was intentional, as 16th century prophecy carries a conviction against it in the words "reading the false promise", fulfilled in my brother's companion that evening who also witnessed the abomination.

BlackManINC said:

Where do people get this idea that the Antichrist will be a human possessed by Satan or "the beast"?

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The kingship of the king of the north from Daniel 11:21 to the end of that 11th chapter describes such personage. (see also Daniel 7:24-25, Daniel 8:23-25, Daniel 9:26, and Daniel 11:3-4)

2 Thessalonians 2:1-11 provides an optimum description from the New Testament.

None of these strong references use "possessed", per se, at least from the only two translations which do not err on the proper use of "vile" as regards Daniel 11:20 & 21.

Trump (Donald) means - (World rule) - The name of blasphemy as in Revelation 13..Only Christ will be the World ruler... Trump speaks great things (Make America great again) Did not receive the (HONOR) of the kingdom - The republican establishment and the media dissed him---as in it tells in (Daniel 11) -- But obtained it by flatteries (False promises or flattery of the peoples) Will do something his (Fathers_ past presidents) have never done - Take spoils of war and spread it into the country - Oil from Iraq - After ISIS is defeated by him is what he says he (WILL DO) .. take the oil. and put it into the US economy.. He is more stout (Bigger) than his companions.. Trump is 6 foot 2 and 270 pounds.. (Huuuuge) no one near but Christie - but he is all (Fat) and not stout... Trump is (STOUT) .. He is from (New York) - the only city on earth now that fits the Mystery babylon bill.. He will be seen as (Despicable) or in his own words (Deplorable -- all in Daniel chapter 11) tells of this man to come.. He will be the (Host) for the first beast (That was wounded but lived- Ronald Reagan) They will together form a coalition of World armies to fight the invaders from outer space.. Christ 2nd return..

BlackManINC said:

In this video, I make a blow by blow comparison of the little horn in Daniel with the Antichrist in the book of revelation. And I'd like to thank all of you jokers out there who accuse me of being a false prophet, for you inspired me to make this video as my response, my surgical strike against those who accuse the saints, doing Satan's job for him, amen.

The Antichrist in the book of Daniel:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Jg-fpPFaZec

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That's a good start. It's where I was about 35 years ago. But there is so much wrong. For one, the "locusts" out of the pit are demons who possessed men ("left their first estate," Jude 1:6) and took their souls to the pit when they died. So the demon that possesses A/C is the demon of the soul of Judas Escariot.

Now recall when Satan desired the body of Moses .. to revive it and indwell/possess it? Well, that is what Judas demon spirit does to A/C of the mortal head wound about midtrib.

And we know from Rev 17:18 that A/C arises first out of Rome and out of the last and revived Roman Empire. By midtrib the one world religion will be Chrislam — the false "12th Prophet" making an image to the false "Christ." By that time, A/C will become AntiGod. In fact, the rest of history can be mapped out as church age/AntiHoly Spirit, tribulation/AntiChrist, and great tribulation/AntiGod where in the Pope succeeds to all of these roles. And it all started, according to Two Babylons (Google it. You can read the book online), with Simon Magus (Acts 8). Remember, he's the one who Peter denied the Spirit to and who wouldn't repent unto salvation. Paul, before he died, was aware of his church in Rome (Phil 1:15-17)

skypair