Rest up and talk some more tomorrow....
We read the Bible as though certain parts do not apply to us—that we have certain things covered or under control.
Every part applies to us, otherwise what is the point of it? If we are not comparing ourselves to the first century model in all things, (both good and bad) we are certainly not near Christ at all. Why was it written if not to keep comparing to test whether we are following Christ to the letter or not?
2 Corinthians 13:5, 11...
"Keep testing whether you are in the faith; keep proving what you yourselves are. Or do you not recognize that Jesus Christ is in union with you? Unless you are disapproved. . . . .Finally, brothers, continue to rejoice, to be readjusted, to be comforted, to think in agreement, to live peaceably; and the God of love and of peace will be with you."
These are words from the elect, to the elect, who have to keep testing themselves, and proving themselves, because their heavenly reward depends on it.
Christian conduct is clearly set out in the scriptures.....we are either living up to Christ's teachings, or we aren't...elect, or not. It is a daily battle as Paul said....so who do we blame, if we aren't? No one is perfect and no one can do all things perfectly....but God knows if what we offer him is our best. He gave us his best, so we are under obligation to give him our best as well.
Any appearance of purity in a denomination is an illusion. Men cannot keep other men clean. Religious liberty precludes it. Church discipline is and should be administered in the Adventist church. But we are all like the Pharisees. Were they not of the opinion that they were keeping themselves clean? To say we are not like them is to prove that we are.
What is "religious liberty"? Can you define that...?
Imperfection and sin cannot produce 'purity'....at best, all we can offer is what God requires of us. Are we in some doubt about what that should be? I do not believe that God sees our "denomination" as such, because claiming to be a "Christians" doesn't make you one. (Matthew 7:21-23)
God sees our obedience to his commands and compliance with the teachings of the son he sent to redeem and instruct us. He doesn't want mere performance.....all he wants is our compliance without complaint....and that from the heart....
It is not the elders' job to be the spiritual police, but discipline was necessary in the first century for clear breaches of Christian teachings, and it is just as necessary in this time of the end. (1 Corinthians 5:9-13) Religious liberty cannot mean "believe and do whatever you wish".
Hebrews 12:5-7, 11...
"And you have entirely forgotten the exhortation that addresses you as sons: “My son, do not belittle the discipline from Jehovah, nor give up when you are corrected by him; 6 for those whom Jehovah loves he disciplines, in fact, he scourges everyone whom he receives as a son. . . . .True, no discipline seems for the present to be joyous, but it is painful; yet afterward, it yields the peaceable fruit of righteousness to those who have been trained by it.”
1 John 5:2-4....
"By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God and carry out his commandments. 3 For this is what the love of God means, that we observe his commandments; and yet his commandments are not burdensome, 4 because everyone who has been born from God conquers the world. And this is the conquest that has conquered the world, our faith."
"The Witness/Adventist stood and prayed thus with himself, ‘God, I thank You that I am not like other men—Pharisees,..."
It just doesn't work, Aunty.
None are fully consecrated. We do not hunger and thirst after righteousness, that we might be filled.
Speak for yourself
....God's elect have standards to follow and it is God who "fills" them with his spirit. He doesn't expect perfection because sin will not allow for that, but it doesn't mean that they, or we, stop trying.
It's just another biblical paradox that we must wrap our heads around if we would be like Jesus.
I see no paradox.....conforming to the standards set out in the scriptures is all that is asked of us, whether we are heaven bound or part of the "new earth". We are the drivers of our own life. We hand the reigns only to God, not sin. Yet, if we do fall, we can get back up again, confident that if we are truly repentant, Christ's blood provides forgiveness.
It's not a matter of whether or not we are lukewarm, wretched, miserable, poor, blind, and naked, but in what manner, to what extent, and what is being done to promote revival and reformation.
Men will not have Jesus to rule over them in every particular. The sooner we realize it, the sooner we can get down to the business of pleading as the woman to the unjust judge, who prevailed by her persistence:
Sorry but you lost me on this one....I don't think I got out of that parable what you did....
the Adventist church was never meant to be governed by 'directive from the leadership down.' The church was never meant to be governed at all. It is organized for work and administered with due consideration given to discipline. Every effort is made to encourage and help people to make the right decisions, but individual religious liberty is a line we won't cross.
As above, you will have to define what that means....."individual religious liberty". Where will I find Jesus advocating that?
Non-combatancy, I believe, has never been a test of fellowship.
I don't remember saying it was.... but if you join the military or support politically motivated bloodshed, its a test of one's "Christianity" IMO.
How can you be "no part of the world" if you are up to your neck in its political agendas?
