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Featured Abortion ?

Discussion in 'Bible Study Forum' started by twinc, Aug 8, 2018.

  1. Harvest 1874

    Harvest 1874 Well-Known Member

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    You asserted all these same points once before under the thread, The thief on the cross!?, which we in turn responded so we will not waste the time here going over them all over again, however for any who are interested they are post #'s 123, 124, 158, 161-163
     
  2. Marymog

    Marymog Well-Known Member

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    Thank you. However, in this case, we do know.

    Do you believe when you die your soul will be sent into a different body? (reincarnation)

    Mary
     
  3. aspen

    aspen “"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few

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    The God i know does not damn aborted fetuses or any other child under the age of accountability
     
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  4. Willie T

    Willie T Well-Known Member

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    No, we really don't know a thing about that. We THINK we do, and we certainly like to SAY we do. But we do not know a thing about whether or not God gives opportunities to ALL souls to be born. After all, if we are going to play "Scripture says" games.... and you believe that an aborted fetus never lived in the first place... then how could the Scripture, "It is appointed unto ALL men, once to die, and then the judgement." possibly be true?
     
  5. Harvest 1874

    Harvest 1874 Well-Known Member

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    It depends on what you mean by “born again”.

    Are you’re speaking in regards to those believers who during the Gospel age have fully consecrated themselves to the Lord and have been begotten again to a new nature, a spirit nature, who in the first resurrection will be born spirit beings.

    Or are you speaking of mankind in general who will experience a resurrection by judgement in which they will be given opportunity to be fully recovered to all that was lost in father Adam, i.e. Human perfection, dominion of the earth and etc.

    This is important as relating to Mary’s original question: Where does scripture suggest that when a human dies (or is murdered in this case) their soul is ‘born again’?

    Obviously an aborted fetus could not fully consecrate itself to the Lord, therefore could not be born again to a spirit nature, however it nevertheless still falls under the ransom sacrifice and as such this yet to be individual begotten through father Adam’s linage has been purchased with the precious blood of Christ, and therefore will experience a resurrection by judgement.

    So yes we do know, having the assurance of the scriptures.

    As to the reference to Heb 9:27And as it is appointed for men to die once, but after this the judgment.”

    The context shows that this was in reference to the High Priest who once a year on the Day of Atonement would enter into the presence of God to sprinkle the blood before and upon the Mercy Seat. If he felled to perform any aspect of the sacrifice correctly he was in danger of death.

    However if you would like to apply the common view (howbeit the incorrect view) we can look at it thus,

    And as it is appointed for men to die once (due to the sentence of death which came upon all due to the first judgement), but after this the judgment (the second judgement, which takes place in the millennial age, the resurrection by judgement).

    “Therefore, as through one man’s offense judgment (the sentence) came to all men (extensively) resulting in condemnation… (All fall short of the glory of God, there is none righteous, no not one) even so through one man’s righteous act (the Man Christ Jesus who gave his life a ransom for all) the free gift (salvation) came to all men (co-extensively) resulting in (the sentence of) justification of life.” (Rom 5:18)
     
    Last edited: Aug 17, 2018
  6. Kristen Davis

    Kristen Davis New Member

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    Yes aborted souls shall go to heaven!
     
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  7. Harvest 1874

    Harvest 1874 Well-Known Member

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    And what is your scriptural proof of this? Not your opinion, but your scriptural evidence.

    Some prefer to ignore the truth even when it is set before them. "And for this reason God will send (permit to come upon) them strong delusion (deceiving errors), that they should believe the lie (the falsehood)... because they did not believe the truth (on the issue), but had pleasure (preference) in unrighteousness (in errors, in falsehoods, because it satisfied their own personal feelings and longings). 2 Thess 2:11, 12

    We must not allow our own heartfelt sentiments in regards to this issue no matter how much we wish, to override the clear statements of scripture as to how entrance into the heavenly phase of the kingdom is to be achieved.
    Do not be dishearten, all of these little souls will be well taken care of in the earthly phase of the kingdom, we have the Lord's assurance on the matter.

    "To the law and to the testimony if they speak not according to this word there is no truth in them." Isa 8:20
     
  8. aspen

    aspen “"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few

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    After all, how can you be damned if you are incapable of understanding the state of damnation?
     
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  9. Triumph1300

    Triumph1300 Well-Known Member

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    I thought it was already posted.
     
  10. Harvest 1874

    Harvest 1874 Well-Known Member

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    Therefore, just as through one man sin entered the world, and death through sin, and thus death spread to all men, because all sinned—(For until the law sin was in the world, but sin is not imputed when there is no law. Nevertheless death (the sentence, damnation) reigned from Adam to Moses, even over those who had not sinned according to the likeness of the transgression of Adam...” Rom 5:12-14

    Here the Apostle makes clear that even before the law was given death reign over everyone including those incapable of personal sin, such as infants and small children, the mentally challenged and etc. all of whom are incapable of personal sin. Nevertheless the death penalty was inflicted upon everyone regardless, even upon those who were merely born in sin, shapen in iniquity, brought forth sinners, by heredity.

    Behold, I was brought forth in iniquity, and in sin my mother conceived me.” Psa 51:5

    No one escapes the penalty, all fall short of the Glory of God, which is Holiness, perfection. All were lost in Adam, but even so all are redeemed in Christ.

    For as by one man’s disobedience many (all) were made sinners (for there is none righteous, no not one), so also by one Man’s obedience many (all) will be made righteous.” Rom 5:19

    For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior (the Author of the Plan of Salvation), who will have all men to be saved (from the Adamic condemnation) and to come to the knowledge of the truth.” (1 Tim 2:3, 4)

    For “we trust in the living God, who is the Savior of all men, AND especially of those who believe (who exercise faith, now during the Gospel age).” 1 Tim 4:10

    All men having been saved from the Adamic curse does not however in any way guarantee that all men will receive everlasting life, this will be contingent upon the faithful completion of their judgement (Greek: krisis, period, testing or trial time), and their passing the final judgement (Greek: krima) at its conclusion in which the final decision as to their worthiness of life everlasting will be determined.
     
  11. aspen

    aspen “"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few

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    What is sin?
     
  12. Harvest 1874

    Harvest 1874 Well-Known Member

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    Thus far I have seen no direct scriptural statement that aborted souls go to heaven, in every instance in which a scripture has been given thus far it has only been the opinion of the individual as to whether it supports this idea.

    That's not a direct statement of scripture, that's self-interpretation.
     
  13. aspen

    aspen “"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few

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    Every word we utter is opinion. You might benefit from recognizing this fact. We cannot generate truth only opinion. Even quoting scripture is opinion. It is the reason we cannot agree. Yes, it is my opinion that the God i know intimately is not in the business of damning little children - jesus loved children.
    Wondering if God would do this is fine, but deciding on the idea that God damns litte kids because someone didn’t mention it in scripture is totally reductionistic - it discounts God’s character, which is love
     
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  14. Harvest 1874

    Harvest 1874 Well-Known Member

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    This is a question often asked sincerely, and sometimes asked arrogantly in a tone that defiantly questions also: “Who feels himself qualified to answer?” Most assuredly there is none among us without sin and qualified of him-self to answer or, as it were, to “first cast a stone.” (John 8:7). The Bible tells us “There is none righteous; no, not one,” (Rom. 3:10).

    However there is an authoritative source for our answer: the Bible defines sin very simply; it tells us, “Sin is the transgression of the law.” (I John 3:4).

    The law is that which condemns all imperfection. "In my flesh dwells no good thing" (Rom. 7:18) --no perfection, and all imperfection is un-right, and all unrighteousness is sin.

    What is the origin of sin? Where did it come from?

    Rom 5:12 -- "Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned."

    Sin originated when father Adam, disobeyed God. Since that time all humanity has been under the condemnation of death.

    Aren't there any exceptions to this rule that all people sin?

    Gal 3:22 -- "But the Scripture has confined all under sin, that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe."
     
  15. Triumph1300

    Triumph1300 Well-Known Member

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    The Bible says God is a just God.
    So, what do you think a Just God would do?
     
  16. aspen

    aspen “"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few

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    Why do I feel like i am talking to a machine?

    Yes. Sin is a transgression of the law. In essence and practice, it is loving imperfectly. Unless you love perfectly as we were created (in the image of God) to do, you are a sinner. Only Jesus fulfilled the law by loving perfectly. We are guilty of not acting as we were created to act. Hell is being in this broken state forever.

    Kids do not know what this state of brokeness is.
     
  17. Harvest 1874

    Harvest 1874 Well-Known Member

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    I think a just God is not about to change His plans for the salvation of the world just to suit you or I, just because we feel like these aborted souls should not be judged on the same terms as we are, as sinners.

    Are we now more just than God?

    God has chosen the most efficient and economical way to insure that everyone benefits from the ransom sacrifice of Christ.

    By condemning all mankind in the one man (Adam), it thereby allows for just one man (the man Christ Jesus) to redeem them all. This economical feature of His plan is an something which no mortal man could have ever contrived.
     
  18. Triumph1300

    Triumph1300 Well-Known Member

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    That's not an answer to my question.
    I asked: What do you think a Just God would do in regards to aborted babies.
     
  19. aspen

    aspen “"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few

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    Well, considering the fact that i treat my dog with more compassion then your view if God treats humanity, i wonder if you may have a somewhat impovished view of His character.....
     
    Last edited: Aug 17, 2018
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  20. Truth

    Truth Well-Known Member

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    We are speaking about Abortion Right!

    How could a Loving, Righteous, Merciful God condemn a soul that has never seen the light of Day, Never taken a breath a Air, and has never had the Ability to consider one true thought, good or evil!
    According to Hebrew Culture one needs to reach an Age of Understanding, How can a soul sin without the understanding of what sin is!
     
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