@Behold, would you expound the following:

[justbyfaith]

Jo 1:7, But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.


1Jo 1:8, If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.


1Jo 1:9, If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

 

[justbyfaith]

Here is my take on it:

We walk in the light by being transparent before the Lord. And this entails confessing our sins to Him. When we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us of our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. When we walk in the light the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.

But if we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. So, if we have been cleansed from our sins, we are blind to the fact that our sins are gone; and do not know our own soul. Therefore we would never proclaim that we don't have sin; because we are blind to the fact of the matter. We would consider that it is still true that we ourselves have sin.

There are a few verses that teach me on this:

Job 9:20, If I justify myself, mine own mouth shall condemn me: if I say, I am perfect, it shall also prove me perverse.
Job 9:21, Though I were perfect, yet would I not know my soul: I would despise my life.
Job 9:22, This is one thing, therefore I said it, He destroyeth the perfect and the wicked.

Isa 42:19, Who is blind, but my servant? or deaf, as my messenger that I sent? who is blind as he that is perfect, and blind as the LORD'S servant?

Jhn 9:41, Jesus said unto them, If ye were blind, ye should have no sin: but now ye say, We see; therefore your sin remaineth.

So then, the one who is cleansed from all sin would never proclaim that he is thus; because he is blind to the fact that he is.

But when he begins to see, it is because he has sin; and when the Holy Ghost pinpoints a sin, it is so that it can be confessed and placed underneath the blood of Jesus.

If a man is in the light, he sees; and therefore the Holy Ghost will pinpoint the sin in his life by shedding light on his situation.

It is also the attitude of the perfect that he considers that he has not yet apprehended what the Lord has apprehended him for (Philippians 3:13-15).

So then, the one who is blind and perfect will have the attitude that even though he does not see anything in particular that is besetting him as a sin, that this does not mean that he necessarily doesn't have sin to be dealt with; but these doctrines will lead him to say to the Lord:

Psa 19:12, Who can understand his errors? cleanse thou me from secret faults.
Psa 19:13, Keep back thy servant also from presumptuous sins; let them not have dominion over me: then shall I be upright, and I shall be innocent from the great transgression.
Psa 19:14, Let the words of my mouth, and the meditation of my heart, be acceptable in thy sight, O LORD, my strength, and my redeemer.

Psa 139:23, Search me, O God, and know my heart: try me, and know my thoughts:
Psa 139:24, And see if there be any wicked way in me, and lead me in the way everlasting.

In this, he is asking the Lord to shed light on his situation and to remove his blindness to anything that is truly sinful in his life.

Knowing that the Lord reserves the right to not reveal sin to him; and recognizing that if the Lord doesn't reveal sin to him, that again, this does not necessarily mean that he does not have sin: but that there is the possibility of this and yet there is the possibility of the opposite conclusion and that the Lord is keeping him blind for whatever reason.

Here is where it breaks down. Because why would the Lord keep a man blind who is seeking for Him to shed light on his situation? Therefore if light is there and the man has also been cleansed from all of his sins, would he not know that he has been cleansed?

Nevertheless he would be forbidden by holy scripture (1 John 1:8) to say that he has no sin; because the deception might be in the fact that he is boasting. For it is written that a man is saved by grace through faith and not saved by works in order that no one might be able to boast. So if a man boasts of the fact that after he has sought the Lord to shed light on his situation, the light revealed no sin, he is deceiving himself and the truth (that prevents a man from boasting) is not in him.

But I would say also that if anyone asks the Lord to shed light on his situation that he is very likely to find the Lord showing him yet again that he is a sinner in some way, shape, or form.

For when the light is being shed on the situation, it will reveal sin. It is only when all sins have been confessed, therefore, that a man will find that he is without sin when standing under the light.

And the blood of Jesus (continually) cleanseth him from all sin. That is what the Greek verb tense bears out. It implies that sin is constantly coming in from the outside and that the blood is doing a constant work of cleaning the man out who walks in the light as He is in the light.

Thus, when new sin comes in from the outside, it must needs be confessed as a matter of transparency before the Lord.

Jesus said,

Jhn 13:10, Jesus saith to him, He that is washed needeth not save to wash his feet, but is clean every whit: and ye are clean, but not all.

We still get our feet dirty from walking around in the dirt.

So we need Jesus to wash our feet on a regular basis.

"Lord, here's the spot that needs cleansing. Thanks for showing me by shedding forth your light."

'nuff said!

 

[justbyfaith]

Also, there is this scripture:

Mat 8:1, When he was come down from the mountain, great multitudes followed him.
Mat 8:2, And, behold, there came a leper and worshipped him, saying, Lord, if thou wilt, thou canst make me clean.
Mat 8:3, And Jesus put forth his hand, and touched him, saying, I will; be thou clean. And immediately his leprosy was cleansed.
Mat 8:4, And Jesus saith unto him, See thou tell no man; but go thy way, shew thyself to the priest, and offer the gift that Moses commanded, for a testimony unto them.

Jesus cleansed the leper; and the leper was completely cleansed. In the Bible, leprosy is a type of sin.

Jesus told the leper not to tell anyone that he was cleansed; but to show forth that he was cleansed.

So often when someone says, "I am redeemed by the blood of the Lamb; I am a changed man." it turns out on closer inspection that there is still very much sin in the life of that person.

But when he is silent and simply lives the life out that the Lord has called him to live; and shows forth by his life that he has been cleansed: when he speaks of the realities of how to be cleansed (he will tell everyone to go to Jesus for cleansing); his words have power.

It is written,

Phm 1:6, That the communication of thy faith may become effectual by the acknowledging of every good thing which is in you in Christ Jesus.

In the Old Testament the high priest's garment had a belt that had attached to it bells and pomegranates (Exodus 28:33-34).

Application: when the priest walked around, the bells made a noise that attracted attention. And when you looked over, you would see fruit.

 

[Enoch111]

Behold does not need another thread to present his false gospel. He has already decided that he needs to learn nothing, and he has figured it out perfectly.

 

[justbyfaith]

Behold does not need another thread to present his false gospel. He has already decided that he needs to learn nothing, and he has figured it out perfectly.

I'm interested in what he has to say about these verses; since most of what he teaches appears to be in contradiction to them.

 

[Enoch111]

I'm interested in what he has to say about these verses; since most of what he teaches appears to be in contradiction to them.

Correct. But he is so THOROUGHLY MUDDLED in his thinking that he actually believes that he is teaching everyone here something that everyone has missed. Check my assessment of his false theology on the Spotting the Heretic thread.

 

[justbyfaith]

He should have seen this thread by now. I am supposing that he has no answer.

 

[justbyfaith]

Now, I have even given links to this thread where @Behold has been frequenting; still no response.

I think maybe I've hit a nerve.

 

[marks]

Those Scriptures don't conflict with this understanding of what God has done for His children. But there is a lot to unpack for those who hold a different view. But that's just my thinking.

I can address these if you wish, but it all comes down to the old man and the new man.

Much love!

 

[justbyfaith]

Those Scriptures don't conflict with this understanding of what God has done for His children. But there is a lot to unpack for those who hold a different view. But that's just my thinking.

I can address these if you wish, but it all comes down to the old man and the new man.

Much love!

By all means, have at it. But I'm not certain that, if you agree with @Behold's premises, that you really understand what he is saying; especially if you think that what he is saying is not in contradiction to the verses in the OP.

I really want @Behold to be the one to expound on them since his pov appears to be in contradiction to them.

But so far, he has not stepped up to the plate; which to me speaks volumes.

 

[marks]

But so far, he has not stepped up to the plate; which to me speaks volumes.

Try to avoid these assumptions. You may think it because he has no answer, but I doubt that myself.

I think I understand his POV very well, and I certainly know the power over sin he's pointing to. It's what the Bible teaches . . . the motions of sin in our members which is by the law . . .

There is no contradiction.

 

[marks]

Correct. But he is so THOROUGHLY MUDDLED in his thinking that he actually believes that he is teaching everyone here something that everyone has missed. Check my assessment of his false theology on the Spotting the Heretic thread.

Enoch, did you see my three replies to your post? I don't recall seeing an answer. I'll try to find them . . .

 

[marks]

Can anyone correctly restate @Behold 's POV?

 

[Behold]

----

 

[Episkopos]

Can anyone correctly restate @Behold 's POV?

I can play devil's advocate.

Behold states...There is no sin in Christ so then by claiming to be in Christ I can also claim to have no sin. In Him is no sin. (simple lawyer strategy)

And on weekends I can dress up as superman and claim to leap over tall buildings in a single bound. (The imagination is a terrible thing to waste. )

 

[Behold]

Jo 1:7, But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.
1Jo 1:8, If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
1Jo 1:9, If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

Ive responded to this same question, these verses, in posts to you, at least 20 times.

So, just read this..
-
We as humans are "feel" and "sight" and" "reason" controlled.
We believe what we see . We go by our feelings, and we try to understand things so that by our belief that we understand.... is why we react or commit a response or behavior.
Well, throw all that out forever when you are dealing with your Christianity, as you can't function in the "Kingdom of God", with your normal mind of reason, as its not going to work in that Spiritual place, that is within you, where God exists.

God is A Spirit.
We are a born again spirit, and this puts us in a Spiritual KINGDOM that we can't see, but is actually more real then the natural realm.
If you died today, its only your heart that stopped beating, as the real You was never the body... The real You lives IN that body, and that real You is now a NEW CREATION, if you are born again.... You are now joined Spiritually, ... in union with...GOD ALMIGHTY HIMSELF.

So, this Kingdom of God, were we eternally exist. having become translated from darkness (the world and the flesh and unbelief) into Light, where God exits, Truth exists as God, and Holiness is the LIGHT...... we are in THAT Spiritual Kingdom for eternity, right now, and we can't even SEE IT, Saint.
WE are seated in Heaven right now , in Jesus, and we can't even see it, yet it more real then then our earthly experience that we can see.

Saint, in the natural realm, seeing is Believing.
But in the Spiritual realm, in God's Kingdom, BELIEVING IS HOW YOU SEE.

So, what we wrongly try to do, is use our mind and our reasoning and logic, to try to function in a Kingdom that is Spiritual and alien to our flesh, or logic, or normal mind.
Thats fails.
And that is what most Christians are doing, and they fail for life.
Most Christians dont even realize that the Bible is not a book.. Its a LIVING SPIRITUAL Power, that is written on pages, as living words.
So, even in this, most Believers have no idea what is going on, and they read the Spirit of God, that has inspirited these words, ...and they read them like they are reading a cereal box or a newspaper. And so, they get lost in the bible, in heresy, in a cult, or worse,.... totally.

So, the Key, is to understand that God's Kingdom is not what we can understand by rational mind or reason, or logic.
FAITH, that God requires, exists OUTSIDE of our logic and our reasoning, and our point of view.
We cant understand how to live IN God's Kingdom with our mind, so we have to find out how to get the "mind of Christ", as our "renewed mind", as that mind is the mind that has to be in us for us to exist correctly in the Kingdom of God.
This is why Paul tells you to "renew your mind", in Romans 12.
This means to get out of your carnal mind and into the mind of the Spiritual "in Christ".
This means you have to realize first of all that you can't try to serve God or please God in this "FLESH" mind, as all you'll do is end up confused and even in many cases bitter, because nothing is what you expected it to be, in your Christianity. As what you expected was to understand how to exist in this New Creation existence, in your normal mind, and that mind is carnal, sinful, sin conscious, and is naturally against God's Spiritually.
So, if you dont learn how to get out of your normal way of thinking, which is all flesh based and self righteous, and you're not renewed in your mind, you will never be able to even understand what "spirituality" is all about, regarding being born again.

It can be that you will learn a lot of Theology, and you'll end up sounding like Wikipedia teaching the bible on a Forum, as you try to sound spiritual, and are in reality just completely spiritually backwards and carnal, while you quote dozens of verses and pretend that you have it all figured out.

Listen, all of our Spiritually is just a reaction to God's love for us.
That is what is going on.
And our reaction has to be faith based according to what works in God's realm as the RULES, according to divine knowledge and revelation that is how God progresses us into spiritual discernment and theological purity.
So, to have this, you have to understand one main thing.. Which is, its not how you see it that is truth, its How God's see it, that makes it Truth.
This means to see as God sees, is to be in the Light, is to be walking in the Spirit.

Saint..
>You must believe 2 things, or you will always be trying to get to what you will never find., which is a holy walk and a mind that is free from sin consciousness and real spiritual power and true influence.

1.) BELIEVE : You are always at peace with God. Always... Romans 5:1

So, No matter what you just did wrong, again, next month, you are always at Peace with GOD. And the reason is, its not by what you do that causes God to always be at Peace with you.. But rather its because of Christ's accomplishment....His "finished work on the Cross' that is the "once and for all eternal redemption that Christ Gained" = the REASON God will always be at peace with all His Born Again Children.
So, on your best spiritual day, or on your most carnal backslidden day, or week, or decade,..that SAME BLOOD of God that was shed on The Cross, is what God accepted to accept you as His OWN, and this will always keep you in perfect Peace with God.
God's shed blood keeps you in perfect peace with God.= Believe this... remember this......Learn this. !
Now your mind will rebel at this idea.
Your natural inclination will resist this fact, regarding God's peace.
Thats the mind of the Flesh, the self righteous mind.
And that is the part of you that you that you have to RENEW, so that it does not keep you from right believing.

2.) BELIEVE : All you Sin is forgiven.. ALL. Colossians 2:13

See, if it wasn't, then you could not have Peace with God, you could not be born again, and you could NOT be a Son-Daughter - Child of God.
All your sin had to be resolved by GOD as Christ, so THAT you can exist in GOD, "In Christ" and in Eternity with God.
Now once again, your flesh , your carnal mind, will rebel at this idea. It will not want to believe that... and THAT part of you, you have to renew as that is the WRONG MIND, and that MIND will keep you in bondage to wrong believing and wrong living, and striving to be good, repenting, and yet failing.

 

[justbyfaith]

Try to avoid these assumptions. You may think it because he has no answer, but I doubt that myself.

I think I understand his POV very well, and I certainly know the power over sin he's pointing to. It's what the Bible teaches . . . the motions of sin in our members which is by the law . . .

There is no contradiction.

I also know that some of what @Behold is preaching does indeed contain keys to obtaining victory over sin (and I also laid hold of the truths in question before I ever came across @Behold); however, in certain instances he contradicts the clear teaching of holy scripture; and this is where the red flag goes up in my mind.

The verses in the OP are indeed contradicted by much of what is preached by him...so I would desire to see what he has to say about them so I can see how they are integrated into his theology...unless he truly is attempting to deny them and therefore, in such a case, his judgment would be coming from Revelation 22:19 (kjv).

Rev 22:19, And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.

 

[justbyfaith]

Ive responded to this same question, these verses, in posts to you, at least 20 times.

So, just read this..
-
We as humans are "feel" and "sight" and" "reason" controlled.
We believe what we see . We go by our feelings, and we try to understand things so that by our belief that we understand.... is why we react or commit a response or behavior.
Well, throw all that out forever when you are dealing with your Christianity, as you can't function in the "Kingdom of God", with your normal mind of reason, as its not going to work in that Spiritual place, that is within you, where God exists.

God is A Spirit.
We are a born again spirit, and this puts us in a Spiritual KINGDOM that we can't see, but is actually more real then the natural realm.
If you died today, its only your heart that stopped beating, as the real You was never the body... The real You lives IN that body, and that real You is now a NEW CREATION, if you are born again.... You are now joined Spiritually, ... in union with...GOD ALMIGHTY HIMSELF.

So, this Kingdom of God, were we eternally exist. having become translated from darkness (the world and the flesh and unbelief) into Light, where God exits, Truth exists as God, and Holiness is the LIGHT...... we are in THAT Spiritual Kingdom for eternity, right now, and we can't even SEE IT, Saint.
WE are seated in Heaven right now , in Jesus, and we can't even see it, yet it more real then then our earthly experience that we can see.

Saint, in the natural realm, seeing is Believing.
But in the Spiritual realm, in God's Kingdom, BELIEVING IS HOW YOU SEE.

So, what we wrongly try to do, is use our mind and our reasoning and logic, to try to function in a Kingdom that is Spiritual and alien to our flesh, or logic, or normal mind.
Thats fails.
And that is what most Christians are doing, and they fail for life.
Most Christians dont even realize that the Bible is not a book.. Its a LIVING SPIRITUAL Power, that is written on pages, as living words.
So, even in this, most Believers have no idea what is going on, and they read the Spirit of God, that has inspirited these words, ...and they read them like they are reading a cereal box or a newspaper. And so, they get lost in the bible, in heresy, in a cult, or worse,.... totally.

So, the Key, is to understand that God's Kingdom is not what we can understand by rational mind or reason, or logic.
FAITH, that God requires, exists OUTSIDE of our logic and our reasoning, and our point of view.
We cant understand how to live IN God's Kingdom with our mind, so we have to find out how to get the "mind of Christ", as our "renewed mind", as that mind is the mind that has to be in us for us to exist correctly in the Kingdom of God.
This is why Paul tells you to "renew your mind", in Romans 12.
This means to get out of your carnal mind and into the mind of the Spiritual "in Christ".
This means you have to realize first of all that you can't try to serve God or please God in this "FLESH" mind, as all you'll do is end up confused and even in many cases bitter, because nothing is what you expected it to be, in your Christianity. As what you expected was to understand how to exist in this New Creation existence, in your normal mind, and that mind is carnal, sinful, sin conscious, and is naturally against God's Spiritually.
So, if you dont learn how to get out of your normal way of thinking, which is all flesh based and self righteous, and you're not renewed in your mind, you will never be able to even understand what "spirituality" is all about, regarding being born again.

It can be that you will learn a lot of Theology, and you'll end up sounding like Wikipedia teaching the bible on a Forum, as you try to sound spiritual, and are in reality just completely spiritually backwards and carnal, while you quote dozens of verses and pretend that you have it all figured out.

Listen, all of our Spiritually is just a reaction to God's love for us.
That is what is going on.
And our reaction has to be faith based according to what works in God's realm as the RULES, according to divine knowledge and revelation that is how God progresses us into spiritual discernment and theological purity.
So, to have this, you have to understand one main thing.. Which is, its not how you see it that is truth, its How God's see it, that makes it Truth.
This means to see as God sees, is to be in the Light, is to be walking in the Spirit.

Saint..
>You must believe 2 things, or you will always be trying to get to what you will never find., which is a holy walk and a mind that is free from sin consciousness and real spiritual power and true influence.

1.) BELIEVE : You are always at peace with God. Always... Romans 5:1

So, No matter what you just did wrong, again, next month, you are always at Peace with GOD. And the reason is, its not by what you do that causes God to always be at Peace with you.. But rather its because of Christ's accomplishment....His "finished work on the Cross' that is the "once and for all eternal redemption that Christ Gained" = the REASON God will always be at peace with all His Born Again Children.
So, on your best spiritual day, or on your most carnal backslidden day, or week, or decade,..that SAME BLOOD of God that was shed on The Cross, is what God accepted to accept you as His OWN, and this will always keep you in perfect Peace with God.
God's shed blood keeps you in perfect peace with God.= Believe this... remember this......Learn this. !
Now your mind will rebel at this idea.
Your natural inclination will resist this fact, regarding God's peace.
Thats the mind of the Flesh, the self righteous mind.
And that is the part of you that you that you have to RENEW, so that it does not keep you from right believing.

2.) BELIEVE : All you Sin is forgiven.. ALL. Colossians 2:13

See, if it wasn't, then you could not have Peace with God, you could not be born again, and you could NOT be a Son-Daughter - Child of God.
All your sin had to be resolved by GOD as Christ, so THAT you can exist in GOD, "In Christ" and in Eternity with God.
Now once again, your flesh , your carnal mind, will rebel at this idea. It will not want to believe that... and THAT part of you, you have to renew as that is the WRONG MIND, and that MIND will keep you in bondage to wrong believing and wrong living, and striving to be good, repenting, and yet failing.

What I want you to do, @Behold, is to quote verse 7 and then give an exegesis on that verse. Then quote verse 8 and give exegesis on that. And then, quote verse 9 and give exegesis on that.

You have not done this in the post that I am now responding to.

I want to see how you interpret each word of the scriptures at hand.

 

[justbyfaith]

It is also heresy to claim that we must bypass the mind when seeking the Lord.

Isa 1:18, Come now, and let us reason together, saith the LORD: though your sins be as scarlet, they shall be as white as snow; though they be red like crimson, they shall be as wool.

 

[marks]

I can play devil's advocate.

Behold states...There is no sin in Christ so then by claiming to be in Christ I can also claim to have no sin. In Him is no sin. (simple lawyer strategy)

And on weekends I can dress up as superman and claim to leap over tall buildings in a single bound. (The imagination is a terrible thing to waste. )

Seriously? This is your answer? I'd say that proves my point.