Believers need to understand the Truth

[bbyrd009]

Mess with the bull, and you get the horns.

who told you that you were naked?

ya, what a vicious bastard God is, huh

Yup, and God did it once and permanently.

but if we try to examine that, see, you are gonna go run behind a tree bro, and you wont be anywhere to be found ok. You so profoundly have no clue about what you are even saying here, ok?

 

[justbyfaith]

@GodsGrace,

I think that while there are verses that say that obedience is something God wants,

You would be hard-pressed to find a verse that says that obedience or works are required for (continued) salvation.

We do not obtain salvation by works in the beginning; and neither do we maintain our salvation by works.

The righteousness/salvation of the Lord is by faith from beginning to end and all the way through...Romans 1:17, Colossians 2:6, Galatians 3:1-3.

Rom 1:17, For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.

Col 2:6, As ye have therefore received Christ Jesus the Lord, so walk ye in him:

Gal 3:1, O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you?
Gal 3:2, This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?
Gal 3:3, Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?

 

[justbyfaith]

1 John 2:2 Lexicon: and He Himself is the propitiation for our sins; and not for ours only, but also for those of the whole world.

so nice try, but bs ok. You were not forgiven of your sins when you believed, and i know thats what you were taught and so thats why you are parrotting it, but it is pure crap bro, ok

and then you woke up

@bbyrd009,

Everyone here already knows from your statements that you don't believe the gospel.

I feel sorry for you that you keep digging for yourself a bigger hole that you will not be able to crawl out of on your day of judgment.

 

[Helen]

Have we not all done evil? (1 John 1:10, Romans 3:23). Therefore, according to your verse (especially in the kjv), all will be raised unto the resurrection of condemnation.

Those who are forgiven, their sins have been washed away and they have been made into new creatures in Christ.

And this is by faith alone in Jesus Christ alone.




Of course, the Lord will not deal with any sin in your life apart from you giving Him permission to do so...He requires surrender.



I think that it is indeed a sign of gratitude...see Luke 7:36-50.



If God requires obedience, then there is condemnation over disobedience.

How then are we forgiven?

God does not require obedience of the believer, He merely desires it of us; and He also works within us to make it happen.

The obedience that He "requires" of me is a practical love (1 John 3:17-18); and He also provides that love through faith in Jesus Christ (Galatians 3:14, Romans 5:5).

Thus faith in Jesus is all that He requires of us; because a saving faith is something that will produce love in our hearts, which is the obedience that He "requires"...no, for the believer, he only desires it; because if we are in Christ and are disobedient, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous. We are forgiven of past, present, and future sin(s)...Romans 4:8, Romans 8:37-39, Hebrews 9:12...and therefore if we are disobedient, the penalty has already been paid by Christ's death on the Cross. And therefore, for the believer, obedience is not required (as of a penalty being required for disobedience); it is only desired.

And in this, I find that there is more obedience than when I felt that it was required of me.

Obedience is required only of those who are still under the law.

For those of us who are under grace, obedience is not required; and also sin shall not have dominion over us (Romans 6:14).

Amen , good word bro.

 

[atpollard]

Well, for someone that requires verses..
YOU have posted NONE. (1)

So all of the above is YOUR opinion.
Your opinion is worth zero. (2)

Obedience is NOT a sign of gratitude.
God requires obedience...as He always has.(3)

(1) Verses did me no good in communicating with you the first two times, why would more verses change things?

(2) It is your opinion as well if you quoted the Westminster Shorter Catechism definition of Sanctification because you believe that it is biblically correct:

"Sanctification is the work of God's free grace, whereby we are renewed in the whole man after the image of God, and are enabled more and more to die unto sin, and live unto righteousness." - Westminster Shorter Catechism

• “The Westminster Catechism states that we are ENABLED more and more, by God's Holy Spirit, to live unto righteousness.” - GodsGrace
• “Obedience is not Sanctification. Sanctification is being made progressively more Christ-like from the moment of our initial justification until our final Perfection/Glorification. Sanctification is a work of God through His Holy Spirit. Obedience is an act of gratitude, love and service undertaken by man in response to God’s work of Justification and his ongoing work of progressive Sanctification.” - atpollard

(3) What is the ultimate destiny of a person that is disobedient? What is the ultimate destiny of a person (like the Pharisees) that obeys the letter of the law and rejects Jesus? What difference does obedience for obedience sake make?

 

[atpollard]

who told you that you were naked?

ya, what a vicious bastard God is, huh

but if we try to examine that, see, you are gonna go run behind a tree bro, and you wont be anywhere to be found ok. You so profoundly have no clue about what you are even saying here, ok?

You talk a lot of tough smack for someone that never actually puts up anything to discuss.

How would we know what I would do when you always seem to be bluffing and refuse to lay any cards on the table!

If you have something you want to debate with me, then start a topic and call me out on it. I’ll be there.

 

[bbyrd009]

@bbyrd009,

Everyone here already knows from your statements that you don't believe the gospel.

I feel sorry for you that you keep digging for yourself a bigger hole that you will not be able to crawl out of on your day of judgment.

and as long as you dont address the subject and deflect away from it and onto me, youre fine right
just assume "everybody" and youre good to go huh

that i have already plainly confessed that Christ died for my sins, piss on that right

 

[bbyrd009]

You talk a lot of tough smack for someone that never actually puts up anything to discuss.

How would we know what I would do when you always seem to be bluffing and refuse to lay any cards on the table!

If you have something you want to debate with me, then start a topic and call me out on it. I’ll be there.

who told you that you were naked?

 

[atpollard]

who told you that you were naked?

Just as I suspect. Run along little boy, the GROWNUPS are talking.

 

[GodsGrace]

You talk a lot of tough smack for someone that never actually puts up anything to discuss.

How would we know what I would do when you always seem to be bluffing and refuse to lay any cards on the table!

If you have something you want to debate with me, then start a topic and call me out on it. I’ll be there.

Why would anyone want to start a topic with you?
I'm here and wrote you TWO pages to which you
have NO REPLY.

 

[GodsGrace]

Just as I suspect. Run along little boy, the GROWNUPS are talking.

So you're not a grown up because YOU are not talking.

 

[Zachary]

Obedience is not required for salvation.
Faith is the only requirement.
Faith and real salvation will produce obedience.
Therefore, if someone is disobedient to the Lord,
we can safely say that they are not saved.
But it is not obedience that saves;
it is the faith that produces obedience that truly saves.

Several things are required by BACs to STAY saved.

You have things confused.
I guess this why you refuse to respond to
the thread which you requested be posted,
which contains many anti-OSAS VT verses!

We see this a lot ... Those who are confused refuse.

Become unconfused ... and reconcile ALL of the NT verses.
.

 

[GodsGrace]

(1) Verses did me no good in communicating with you the first two times, why would more verses change things?

(2) It is your opinion as well if you quoted the Westminster Shorter Catechism definition of Sanctification because you believe that it is biblically correct:

"Sanctification is the work of God's free grace, whereby we are renewed in the whole man after the image of God, and are enabled more and more to die unto sin, and live unto righteousness." - Westminster Shorter Catechism

• “The Westminster Catechism states that we are ENABLED more and more, by God's Holy Spirit, to live unto righteousness.” - GodsGrace
• “Obedience is not Sanctification. Sanctification is being made progressively more Christ-like from the moment of our initial justification until our final Perfection/Glorification. Sanctification is a work of God through His Holy Spirit. Obedience is an act of gratitude, love and service undertaken by man in response to God’s work of Justification and his ongoing work of progressive Sanctification.” - atpollard

(3) What is the ultimate destiny of a person that is disobedient? What is the ultimate destiny of a person (like the Pharisees) that obeys the letter of the law and rejects Jesus? What difference does obedience for obedience sake make?

You answer a two page post with questions?
You can t support Calvinism, can you?
Deep down you know it's WRONG.

 

[Zachary]

Can we safely say 'someone is disobedient to the Lord'
if we don't know their heart?

Sure we can.
If a BAC is involved in habitual sin, they obviously are being disobedient.
.

 

[GodsGrace]

(1) Verses did me no good in communicating with you the first two times, why would more verses change things?

(2) It is your opinion as well if you quoted the Westminster Shorter Catechism definition of Sanctification because you believe that it is biblically correct:

"Sanctification is the work of God's free grace, whereby we are renewed in the whole man after the image of God, and are enabled more and more to die unto sin, and live unto righteousness." - Westminster Shorter Catechism

• “The Westminster Catechism states that we are ENABLED more and more, by God's Holy Spirit, to live unto righteousness.” - GodsGrace
• “Obedience is not Sanctification. Sanctification is being made progressively more Christ-like from the moment of our initial justification until our final Perfection/Glorification. Sanctification is a work of God through His Holy Spirit. Obedience is an act of gratitude, love and service undertaken by man in response to God’s work of Justification and his ongoing work of progressive Sanctification.” - atpollard

(3) What is the ultimate destiny of a person that is disobedient? What is the ultimate destiny of a person (like the Pharisees) that obeys the letter of the law and rejects Jesus? What difference does obedience for obedience sake make?

See how this works A.
You wrote to me.
I replied to you.
Now YOU write to me.

After that, I'll be happy to answer any question.

You don't just change the topic because you have no answers because your
Theology is mixed up and wrong,,,,so.... there are no answers that make sense.

 

[aspen]

well, i wouldnt be writing that in stone ok, hedonists love love too right

Actually, I think commitment to love without Christ turns to hedonism

 

[aspen]

Please elaborate; because this doctrine sounds strange to my ears.

Every part of God’s creation is good
We were created to love - to be in an intimate relationship with God
We misused ourselves by betraying/disobeying God, we also misused the Tree

Every sinful action we engage in from self love to destroying the Earth is our attempt to love apart from God. Every sinful action is a twisted, incomplete version of love, which ends up being a bid for power at the expense of our brothers and sisters.

Even eating the fruit was a bid for power, which ended up locking us into a state of dualism. The result being us running around labeling God’s good creation, ‘good’ and ‘bad’ based on how it affects self. It is a terrible habit and it distracts from loving God and neighbor.

The double edge sword that cuts through this dualism is the love of God and Christ’s ministry and sacrifice on the cross (justification) and the Holy Spirit’s sanctification, which teaches us how to love as we were created to love, once again.

 

[GodsGrace]

Actually, I think commitment to love without Christ turns to hedonism

That's not true Aspen.
There are different types of love even in the secular world.
Not all love in the secular world is eros.

 

[aspen]

That's not true Aspen.
There are different types of love even in the secular world.
Not all love in the secular world is eros.

Hedonism is self love through the senses

 

[GodsGrace]

Hedonism is self love through the senses

Right.
I did say that even in the secular world there are different types of love.
A mother's love.
A teacher's love for her students.
A wife's love for her husband.
An uncle's love for his nephews and nieces
etc.