Body of Christ never mentioned in Revelation, but The Bride is.

[Base12]

What does IMG mean?

A quick summary...

1) Mystery Babylon is Earthly Jerusalem
2) Mystery Babylon plays the Harlot
3) Mystery Babylon is killed
4) Mystery Babylon is Resurrected
5) Mystery Babylon is Judged worthy to be Saved via GRACE
6) Mystery Babylon is clothed with Righteousness
7) Mystery Babylon is now New Jerusalem, the Bride made ready

Thus Mystery Babylon serves as an example of all who have sinned and are saved by the Grace of God.

Those that understand this have passed the ultimate Love I.Q. Test.

That's what Love is for.

 

[marks]

I find there is no reference to "The Bride Of Christ" anywhere in the bible.
Fourteen times, is the word, "bride," mentioned in the New Testament, only oonce in the Gospel of John, and then 4 more times in Rev. In John, the "bridegroom" is said to be Jesus Christ.
Revelation 21: "And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, made ready as a bride adorned for her husband." <---Is this to mean that the Jews are the "bride"? And, Christians will be the "guests" at the wedding supper of the Lamb? After all, the Jew's ARE the chosen of God...and I believe it is a Hebrew custom for the Father to choose the wife of their sons...not sure but, it's what I have heard said.
Any thoughts?

Here are my thoughts.

You are correct that while the church is compared to a bride, it is not identified as the bride. There is a bride however identified, and that is Israel.

Non-dispensationalists will not agree with this I think.

And yet, you cannot find a place where the the gentile church is so identified.

What we do find is that God was wed to Israel, divorced her, but will re-marry, not the gentile church, but Israel.

If we want to stick with Scriptural definitions, then that's it, the church is the body, and Israel is the bride. That's what is written. And other views only introduce confusion requiring convoluted explanations, and a certain amount of conjecture.

In Revelation 19, while the Lamb is in heaven, the bride is making herself ready in the wilderness, nourished by God for 1260 days, as Elijah prepares her to say, Blessed is He who comes in the Name of the Lord.

When the bride is ready, Jesus returns, Israel is gathered, the nations are gathered and judged, and as Israel shares the wedding feast with God, many will be there from the east and west, although many from Israel itself won't be there.

Several places in Revelation tell us the church won't be on earth during those times, one of which is chapter 7, the 144,000 servants of God are sealed on their foreheads, and they are all Israelites. We are also servants of God, though we be not Jews, and we be more than 144,000. But at this time on earth there are only 144,000 servants of God, and they are all Jews.

So where are we? Where did the gentile church go? John saw an innumerable multitude before the throne . . . Hey! I found the church!

Much love!

 

[VictoryinJesus]

who follow our own ways

Our ways and our thoughts are beneath.
His ways and His thoughts are higher. He said “walk in the Spirit” as His thoughts and His ways lead to Life. Our thoughts and our ways lead to death. He said “I am the way”. Do we want to continue to follow our own ways?

 

[Nancy]

Here are my thoughts.

You are correct that while the church is compared to a bride, it is not identified as the bride. There is a bride however identified, and that is Israel.

Non-dispensationalists will not agree with this I think.

And yet, you cannot find a place where the the gentile church is so identified.

What we do find is that God was wed to Israel, divorced her, but will re-marry, not the gentile church, but Israel.

If we want to stick with Scriptural definitions, then that's it, the church is the body, and Israel is the bride. That's what is written. And other views only introduce confusion requiring convoluted explanations, and a certain amount of conjecture.

In Revelation 19, while the Lamb is in heaven, the bride is making herself ready in the wilderness, nourished by God for 1260 days, as Elijah prepares her to say, Blessed is He who comes in the Name of the Lord.

When the bride is ready, Jesus returns, Israel is gathered, the nations are gathered and judged, and as Israel shares the wedding feast with God, many will be there from the east and west, although many from Israel itself won't be there.

Several places in Revelation tell us the church won't be on earth during those times, one of which is chapter 7, the 144,000 servants of God are sealed on their foreheads, and they are all Israelites. We are also servants of God, though we be not Jews, and we be more than 144,000. But at this time on earth there are only 144,000 servants of God, and they are all Jews.

So where are we? Where did the gentile church go? John saw an innumerable multitude before the throne . . . Hey! I found the church!

Much love!

Hi Marks,
I know many will argue this and that is their right, just as it is our right. I do agree with you and this is what I got out of my searching different scriptures in Rev. It just makes sense to me.

 

[Nancy]

2 Corinthians 3:5 Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think any thing as of ourselves; but our sufficiency is of God;

You said you can never get there...how is that since “our sufficiency is of God”?

Yes, true. Yet, we are growing as we seek Him. Yes, we have no sufficiency of ourselves, and know that we can do nothing outside of Him. I just do not see us walking exactly as Jesus did...that would mean, to me that we are perfect in every way. How can this be if we are still in these fleshly bodies and in the world?

 

[Nancy]

It is that very thing that qualifies you--you shall indeed come to know all!

One day, one day yes...we all will ♥

 

[Helen]

the present is better than any conceivable past, by any measure we can objectively identify, and you should not trust tomorrow people imo
Death, More Abundantly is not Life, more abundantly

So you don't joyfully sing in the mornings -

"This world is not my home,
I'm just a passing through,
If heaven not my home,
Then Lord what do I do,
The angels beckon me, from heavens open door,
And I don't feel at home in this world anymore!"

 

[Helen]

The bride of Christ is a small subset of the body of Christ. Just like when Eve was taken from one rib of Adam's chest....that which was next to his heart.

And The Bride fits back perfectly into the Bride shaped hole, in Christ.

 

[Helen]

...so, do you mean the rest of the Body as opposed to the Bride are not as close to God?

Yes, God offers all of Himself in a relationship with His people.
And you know Nancy, not all the say they follow God , do so with all their hearts, souls and minds , ( as He asked us to do) Many do not wish to pay the price , they want to live with one foot in God's kingdom and the other foot in this world.

God does not designate who will be where in His Kingdom...He has left it to each of us personally to choose .

Victory mentioned " a pecking order" ...it is not God who decides that..but WE DO!!

(This is a much hated truth. )

 

[Helen]

We all follow the Lord from different distances. So few walk in the Spirit...and not too many are led by the Spirit. Many turn to God when He is needed...but are just fine on heir own most of the time.

And even those who were there following heard differently, some could hear in the Spirit and some couldn't. ( "He that hath an ear to hear, hear what the Spirit says.." )

John 12
28 "Father, glorify Thy name. Then came there a voice from heaven, saying, I have both glorified it, and will glorify it again......

So the crowd of people who stood by and heard it were saying that "it had thundered"; others were saying,- "An angel has spoken to Him."

Right there we see 3 levels or hearing...

Staying tuned means staying focused, ..as you say...some what to follow, but - " a far off.."

 

[Base12]

But at this time on earth there are only 144,000 servants of God, and they are all Jews.

Does anyone here connect the 144,000 to Ezekiel?

Ezekiel 9:4
"And the LORD said unto him, Go through the midst of the city, through the midst of Jerusalem, and set a mark upon the foreheads of the men that sigh and that cry for all the abominations that be done in the midst thereof"

 

[Philip James]

Is this to mean that the Jews are the "bride"? And, Christians will be the "guests" at the wedding supper of the Lamb?

Hello Nancy,

Who is the bride?

Hosea 2:18-22

I will espouse you to me forever: I will espouse you in right and in justice, in love and in mercy;


I will espouse you in fidelity, and you shall know the LORD.


On that day I will respond, says the LORD; I will respond to the heavens, and they shall respond to the earth;


The earth shall respond to the grain, and wine, and oil, and these shall respond to Jezreel.


I will sow him for myself in the land, and I will have pity on Lo-ruhama. I will say to Lo-ammi, "You are my people," and he shall say, "My God!"

Jer 31: 31-33
The days are coming, says the LORD, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and the house of Judah.


It will not be like the covenant I made with their fathers the day I took them by the hand to lead them forth from the land of Egypt; for they broke my covenant and I had to show myself their master, says the LORD.

But this is the covenant which I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the LORD. I will place my law within them, and write it upon their hearts; I will be their God, and they shall be my people.


We see here that the Lord promises a new covenant to the people of Israel, that it is an everlasting marital covenant between God and His people.

It is this promised new covenant which Jesus is referencing when He says: "This cup is the new covenant in my blood, which will be shed for you"

Who does He enter into this new covenant with? The twelve apostles who are representative of the whole house of Israel (exodus 12:6).

All who hear the call and enter into this covenant are united with Christ and with one another, and truly become 'the people of God'

1cor 10: 16-17

The cup of blessing that we bless, is it not a participation in the blood of Christ? The bread that we break, is it not a participation in the body of Christ?


Because the loaf of bread is one, we, though many, are one body, for we all partake of the one loaf.

So then, as a people, we are the bride, united with our Husband, one body...

Eph 5:29-32

For no one hates his own flesh but rather nourishes and cherishes it, even as Christ does the church,


because we are members of his body.


"For this reason a man shall leave (his) father and (his) mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh."


This is a great mystery, but I speak in reference to Christ and the church.


But who are the guests?

Mark 2:18-19

The disciples of John and of the Pharisees were accustomed to fast. People came to him and objected, "Why do the disciples of John and the disciples of the Pharisees fast, but your disciples do not fast?"


Jesus answered them, "Can the wedding guests fast while the bridegroom is with them? As long as they have the bridegroom with them they cannot fast.

Identifies Christ's disciples as the guests... but how can we be both guests and bride?

As individuals we are guests at the feast, but as a people, united in Him and through Him we are (together) His bride..

Consider another metaphor... as individuals we are bricks (living stones) being built up as a glorious temple in which our Lord, God dwells... Together we are the temple, individually the stones... in the same way we individually are guests at the feast and corporately the Bride...


I noticed someone mentioned Eve taken from Adams side... this is a 'type' of the Church taken from Jesus' side on the cross. The water and blood that poured forth are the 2 great sacraments of the Church, Baptism and the Eucharist.

This is the one who came through water and blood, Jesus Christ, not by water alone, but by water and blood. The Spirit is the one that testifies, and the Spirit is truth.


So there are three that testify,


the Spirit, the water, and the blood, and the three are of one accord.

Peace be with you!

Christ is risen!
Alleluia!

 

[Helen]

We can still bear an eternal kind of fruit by being LED by the Spirit...which is far less than walking IN the Spirit (as Jesus did). There is a difference between someone who is abiding in Christ and one who goes to Christ for direction...or is listening to God's voice.

True word!!

 

[Helen]

Notice that the eternal fruit is at different levels of honour...gold, silver and precious stones. Gold would be walking in the light as Jesus did. And precious stones are those times where we are led to do the things that were prepared in advance. (Unsure where silver fits in...but it is somewhere in between)

Likewise the works of the flesh are at different levels of futility....wood, hay and stubble.

Amen again!

You are leaving me nothing to post here...but you say it all so much better than I can.

 

[marks]

Ahh, yer gettin all deep again :O hahaha...so, do you mean the rest of the Body as opposed to the Bride are not as close to God?

Hi Nancy,

My understanding of the view is that of those who are the body of Christ, all the saved, a certain few who have given themselves more to the faith are the bride, those who are especially close to God's heart, who live IN the Holy City, not around it, those outside reaching all the way out into outer darkness, gnashing their teeth. Those of the body.

The bride the rulers of the body. The body those who didn't try as hard, or desire as hard.

I'm trusting someone will correct me if I'm misrepresenting anthing here, I try to understand these things!

Personally I don't see it in Scripture. I think I understand how people reach that view, maybe primarily based on one's ideas of Justification of the believer.

There clearly will be differences between us in the ages to come. Daniel 11, those who are wise will shine like the brightness of the sky, and those who turn many to righteousness like the stars of heaven forever.

1 Corinthians 3, Gold, Silver, Gemstones, or ashes, those still saved. Is this to be Gold is the bride, silver the body, precious stones I don't know?

The works that are gold and silver and precious stones are building on the foundation, these are what we build with, and they remain through the fire.

Anyway hopefully someone will clarify better if I'm off base here.

Much love!

 

[marks]

We can walk in the Spirit at any and all times simply by knowing the truth of Scripture that it is by faith we enter the grace in which we stand, as so trusting God to make it so, He does. He is so Good!!!

So much love!

 

[marks]

And precious stones are those times where we are led to do the things that were prepared in advance. (Unsure where silver fits in...but it is somewhere in between)

As I've thought about this I associate gold with the holiness of God, silver with the righteousness of Christ, and precious stones with the the adornment of our works.

Knowing that I do of you, I think I'd phrase . . . Gold comes from being holy as God is holy, silver comes from the righteousness of Christ lived through me, and precious stones are the works I do by the Holy Spirit. Something like that perhaps?

Myself I liken them to the building materials we use as we edify others, towards holiness, towards righteousness, and towards fruitfulness.

Much love!

 

[marks]

Agreed, of course but...to be totally and fully sinless as Jesus? I dunno. Maybe I think I am sinning when I'm really not? I always come back to 'now there is no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus' yet, it is a struggle to even like myself when unkind thoughts and criticisms flit through my mind. We cannot always blame Satan so...where do these thoughts come from? Repentance is immediate when they do come yet, it is really "repentance" if it happens again?
Oh the humanity!

Understanding the Greek word Metanoia, this is translated repentance. Meta the preposition After, noia means the mind. In conjunction, the after-mind refers to the result of an exchange, you had one mind, you've repented, now you have the after-mind.

The new mind. The Bible calls these the mind of the flesh and the mind of Christ. At one time, we were flesh, with the flesh mind. We've repudiated that in confession with God, agreeing with His assessment of the flesh, that it is corrupt, and God has regenerated us with a new mind.

The humanity is that we don't always remain active in the new mind, and sometimes hear the old mind leaking through. And that can cause all sorts of problems!

Much love!

 

[Helen]

Hi Marks,
I know many will argue this and that is their right, just as it is our right. I do agree with you and this is what I got out of my searching different scriptures in Rev. It just makes sense to me.

♥︎ ♥︎ And I am one who does not agree that it is Israel ( alone) ...for reasons I have expressed earlier in this thread

Rom - There is now no division, Jew or Gentile , male or female, bond or free.

Hugs...

 

[Helen]

As I've thought about this I associate gold with the holiness of God, silver with the righteousness of Christ, and precious stones with the the adornment of our works.

Knowing that I do of you, I think I'd phrase . . . Gold comes from being holy as God is holy, silver comes from the righteousness of Christ lived through me, and precious stones are the works I do by the Holy Spirit. Something like that perhaps?

Myself I liken them to the building materials we use as we edify others, towards holiness, towards righteousness, and towards fruitfulness.

Much love!