Born again = Righteous

[Johann]

ITS better experienced that explained

BORN AGAIN (from 1 Peter 1)

This is the same root (anagennaō, cf. 1 Pet. 1:23) is used in Jesus' discussion with Nicodemus in John 3:3,7,8 (gennaō). It is an aorist active participle, which speaks of a decisive act. The NT also uses other metaphors to describe our salvation:

1. "quickened" (cf. Col. 2:13; Eph. 2:4-5)

2. "new creation" (cf. 2 Cor. 5:17; Gal. 6:15)

3. "partaker of Divine Nature," (cf. 2 Pet. 1:4)

4. Paul is fond of the familial metaphor "adoption" (cf. Rom. 8:23; Gal. 4:5; Eph. 1:5), while John and Peter are fond of the familial metaphor "new birth"

Being "born again" or "born from above" is a biblical emphasis on the need for a totally new start (cf. Ezek. 36:26-27), a totally new family (cf. John 1:12-13; Rom. 5:12-21). Christianity is not a reformation or a new morality; it is a new relationship with God. This new relationship is made possible because of

1. the Father's mercy and grace (cf. Exod. 34:6; Neh. 9:17)

2. the Son's sacrificial death (cf. 2 Cor. 5:21) and resurrection from the dead (cf. 1 Corinthians 15)

3. the work of the Spirit (cf. John 3:6; 6:44,65; 1 Pet. 1:2)

Hope this would be helpful

 

[Johann]

We will continue this line when you define what you understand born again means Ezra.

BORN AGAIN (from 1 Peter 1)

This is the same root (anagennaō, cf. 1 Pet. 1:23) is used in Jesus' discussion with Nicodemus in John 3:3,7,8 (gennaō). It is an aorist active participle, which speaks of a decisive act. The NT also uses other metaphors to describe our salvation:

1. "quickened" (cf. Col. 2:13; Eph. 2:4-5)

2. "new creation" (cf. 2 Cor. 5:17; Gal. 6:15)

3. "partaker of Divine Nature," (cf. 2 Pet. 1:4)

4. Paul is fond of the familial metaphor "adoption" (cf. Rom. 8:23; Gal. 4:5; Eph. 1:5), while John and Peter are fond of the familial metaphor "new birth"

Being "born again" or "born from above" is a biblical emphasis on the need for a totally new start (cf. Ezek. 36:26-27), a totally new family (cf. John 1:12-13; Rom. 5:12-21). Christianity is not a reformation or a new morality; it is a new relationship with God. This new relationship is made possible because of

1. the Father's mercy and grace (cf. Exod. 34:6; Neh. 9:17)

2. the Son's sacrificial death (cf. 2 Cor. 5:21) and resurrection from the dead (cf. 1 Corinthians 15)

3. the work of the Spirit (cf. John 3:6; 6:44,65; 1 Pet. 1:2)

 

[Ezra]

BORN AGAIN (from 1 Peter 1)

This is the same root (anagennaō, cf. 1 Pet. 1:23) is used in Jesus' discussion with Nicodemus in John 3:3,7,8 (gennaō). It is an aorist active participle, which speaks of a decisive act. The NT also uses other metaphors to describe our salvation:

1. "quickened" (cf. Col. 2:13; Eph. 2:4-5)

2. "new creation" (cf. 2 Cor. 5:17; Gal. 6:15)

3. "partaker of Divine Nature," (cf. 2 Pet. 1:4)

4. Paul is fond of the familial metaphor "adoption" (cf. Rom. 8:23; Gal. 4:5; Eph. 1:5), while John and Peter are fond of the familial metaphor "new birth"

Being "born again" or "born from above" is a biblical emphasis on the need for a totally new start (cf. Ezek. 36:26-27), a totally new family (cf. John 1:12-13; Rom. 5:12-21). Christianity is not a reformation or a new morality; it is a new relationship with God. This new relationship is made possible because of

1. the Father's mercy and grace (cf. Exod. 34:6; Neh. 9:17)

2. the Son's sacrificial death (cf. 2 Cor. 5:21) and resurrection from the dead (cf. 1 Corinthians 15)

3. the work of the Spirit (cf. John 3:6; 6:44,65; 1 Pet. 1:2)

this is good not sure he will accept it. but i like how you laid it out

 

[Ezra]

No, he will not accept it, you are dealing with a JW.

thats ok even j.w needs to be saved

 

[Robert Gwin]

you got give a person time. your like a snail in reply. born again is the new birth born of the spirit
.
born-again can be born a new or born from above . God Holy spirit enters and makes us a new creation in Christ.
another way of saying it is regenerated transformed. so i can tell you beyond a shadow of doubt.

if your not Born again/ saved you will NOT make heaven your home, none of this happens unless the spirit draws us. is that simple enough or do you need it broke down better

Yes sir, that is exactly correct, I would say you have a great grasp on it as all you said it true.

Since you definitely know what it means, why are some chosen to be born again and reside in heaven?

 

[Robert Gwin]

ITS better experienced that explained

I think you defined it rather well Ezra.

 

[Robert Gwin]

BORN AGAIN (from 1 Peter 1)

This is the same root (anagennaō, cf. 1 Pet. 1:23) is used in Jesus' discussion with Nicodemus in John 3:3,7,8 (gennaō). It is an aorist active participle, which speaks of a decisive act. The NT also uses other metaphors to describe our salvation:

1. "quickened" (cf. Col. 2:13; Eph. 2:4-5)

2. "new creation" (cf. 2 Cor. 5:17; Gal. 6:15)

3. "partaker of Divine Nature," (cf. 2 Pet. 1:4)

4. Paul is fond of the familial metaphor "adoption" (cf. Rom. 8:23; Gal. 4:5; Eph. 1:5), while John and Peter are fond of the familial metaphor "new birth"

Being "born again" or "born from above" is a biblical emphasis on the need for a totally new start (cf. Ezek. 36:26-27), a totally new family (cf. John 1:12-13; Rom. 5:12-21). Christianity is not a reformation or a new morality; it is a new relationship with God. This new relationship is made possible because of

1. the Father's mercy and grace (cf. Exod. 34:6; Neh. 9:17)

2. the Son's sacrificial death (cf. 2 Cor. 5:21) and resurrection from the dead (cf. 1 Corinthians 15)

3. the work of the Spirit (cf. John 3:6; 6:44,65; 1 Pet. 1:2)

Great definition Joe.

 

[Ezra]

Yes sir, that is exactly correct, I would say you have a great grasp on it as all you said it true.

Since you definitely know what it means, why are some chosen to be born again and reside in heaven?

you tell me

1 Timothy 2:4-6

King James Version

​

4 Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
6 Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.


2 peter 3:9 9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance. if a person does not get saved then that is there own fault.. dont blame God

 

[Behold]

Since you definitely know what it means, why are some chosen to be born again and reside in heaven?

God "chooses" all who will believe.

So, its "by faith in Christ", that God takes you as His own.

He does not force you to believe.
He does not choose you to believe.

He only "accepts your faith" once you believe, as "faith is counted as righteousness".

Jesus said, "all that believe in me, i give unto them eternal life"

A Heretic, a CULT will change this verse into John Calvinism, as "All that i forced to believe, i give unto them eternal life"

Calvin is a devil.
His doctrine is a mind trap, its a Hebrews 13:9

 

[Behold]

4 Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

God wants everyone to believe in Jesus and become born again.

Will all believe?

Ask those who went to Hell, today, yesterday, and tomorrow.

Ask Jesus who said..>"if you DONT believe in Me, you will die in your Sins".
See that?
So, that is a CHOICE, He's describing., ... free will, To BELIEVE or NOT:...... and if you choose to die in your sins and go to Hell, then you chose to NOT Believe, even tho God would have you to believe.

 

[Johann]

Great definition Joe.

No problem brother.

 

[Johann]

you tell me

1 Timothy 2:4-6​

​

King James Version​

​

​

4 Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
6 Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.


2 peter 3:9 9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance. if a person does not get saved then that is there own fault.. dont blame God

Excellent Scripture reference.

 

[Johann]

God wants everyone to believe in Jesus and become born again.

Will all believe?

Ask those who went to Hell, today, yesterday, and tomorrow.

Ask Jesus who said..>"if you DONT believe in Me, you will die in your Sins".
See that?
So, that is a CHOICE, He's describing., ... free will, To BELIEVE or NOT:...... and if you choose to die in your sins and go to Hell, then you chose to NOT Believe, even tho God would have you to believe.

If you’re not familiar with the question, it comes up as people read passages like Ephesians 1:4-5, where it says: “he chose us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and blameless before him. In love he predestined us for adoption as sons through Jesus Christ, according to the purpose of his will.” It seems to say that God chose certain people before He even created the world and purposed to adopt them and make them holy. Just as we’re hoping for a reason, he adds that he does this for His own purposes. The New Living Translation puts it like this: This is what he wanted to do, and it gave him great pleasure.

Of course, this sounds generous on one hand, but it doesn’t strike us as fair. There must be some other explanation. Surely, it means that God chooses everyone equally. Surely, He adopts everyone, but some people just refuse His adoption. Surely, if He does choose certain people, it must be because of some quality of faith or merit that He sees in them. Christians argue back and forth about these questions. Maybe, there’s help in looking at other choices that God has made in Scripture.

Why did God choose Abraham?

Abraham is perhaps the first person that God is described as choosing. It comes at a crisis point in human history. Since the garden, sin had only seemed to increase from generation to generation. Not even the flood seemed to change things. Then at Babel, humanity united in rebellion against Him. We wonder if God is going to destroy His creation altogether this time. Instead, he calls a man from one of the towns surrounding Babel, the centre of the rebellion. Through Abraham, God will bring salvation to the world (Genesis 12:3). The question is, Why him? It wasn’t because of his moral or spiritual superiority because he was an idol worshipper before God called him (Joshua 24:2), and his moral lapses are famous (Genesis 12:13; 16:2; 20:2). In Genesis 18:19, God does describe His choice in this way: “I have chosen him, that he may command his children and his household after him to keep the way of the Lord by doing righteousness and justice, so that the Lord may bring to Abraham what he has promised him.” God chose Abraham simply because He had a purpose for Him, and He wanted to fulfill His promise to Him. God didn’t choose everyone equally. There wasn’t a democratic vote. And there’s no indication that Abraham was chosen because of his worthiness. God simply decided to have mercy on him and through him, show mercy to the world.

Why did God choose Israel?

What about Israel, though? Why did God choose Israel? In the Fiddler on the Roof, Tevye famously says: “I know, I know. We are Your chosen people. But, once in a while, can't You choose someone else?” But the fact is that God didn’t choose someone else. He didn’t choose Philistia or Moab or Tyre. He chose Israel. Was it because God knew what an incredibly faithful nation they’d become? In Deuteronomy 7:6-8, God explains His choice in this way: “The LORD your God has chosen you to be a people for his treasured possession, out of all the peoples who are on the face of the earth. It was not because you were more in number than any other people that the LORD set his love on you and chose you, for you were the fewest of all peoples, but it is because the LORD loves you and is keeping the oath that he swore to your fathers” It wasn’t because Israel was especially worthy that God chose them, but because He set His love on them and wanted to keep the promises He had made to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.

Why did God choose Paul?

Finally, consider Paul. He was on his way to Damascus with letters to arrest the Christians there (Acts 9:1-2). Believers were terrified of him. He later called himself the worst of sinners (1 Timothy 1:15). Why did God call him and not someone else? Why did Jesus miraculously appear to Him (Acts 9:3-6)? It’s not like Jesus physically appears to everyone with blinding light and an audible voice from heaven. Surely it was to show that no one is beyond God’s grace. No one is too far gone to be beyond hope. It wasn’t so much that God knew what an amazing apostle Paul could become. It was more the fact that God set His love on the worst of sinners to show how much His grace can change a person.

God chose to save Abraham, Israel, and Paul in order to display His own glory. And as we circle back to Ephesians 1:4-5, we see that that’s why God chooses any of us. We’re not especially savable or lovable. The reality is that, left to ourselves, none of us would have turned from our sins and believed. But God worked in our hearts that we would. He chose us and drew us to faith, and so everything about our salvation is a gift from God. That gives me hope in sharing my faith with others because God might save anyone. And it gives me hope for myself because I can trust that whatever God has started, I can be assured He’ll finish. Give thanks to God for the hope of His grace!
Eph 1:3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:
Eph 1:4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
Eph 1:5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,--


2Th_2:13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:

2Ti_2:4 No man that warreth entangleth himself with the affairs of this life; that he may please him who hath chosen him to be a soldier.

Jas_2:5 Hearken, my beloved brethren, Hath not God chosen the poor of this world rich in faith, and heirs of the kingdom which he hath promised to them that love him?

1Pe_2:4 To whom coming, as unto a living stone, disallowed indeed of men, but chosen of God, and precious,

1Pe_2:9 But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:

Calvinism aside, who is doing the "choosing/chosen" @Behold?

 

[Johann]

4 Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
6 Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.

One question-how do you understand this passage?

Do you see/witness that "all" are presently saved? Or that the "all' will eventually be saved at the Parousia of Christ Jesus?

 

[Ezra]

Calvinism aside, who is doing the "choosing/chosen

so when it comes to salvation why does it need be Calvinism/ Baptist / any other denomination ? Facts are if the God Holy spirit has drawn you and you called upon the name of the Lord Jesus Christ to be saved. from a true sincere heart . SAVED is SAVED it seems almost every denom has a different way to salvation. .. a rock group by the name ac/dc had a album named who made who. my question is WHO SAVED WHO ? if were saved by grace through faith not of WORKS lest any man should boast. it is the Gift of God.

the apostolic thinks its baptized in Jesus name . speak in tongues your saved. no wonder there is so much division in the Body of Christ . then we have the group i know God and i will go to heaven. or join the Church shake the preachers hand and saved. NO one must be born again a change from inward to outward justified sanctified and Glorified

 

[Ezra]

One question-how do you understand this passage?

Do you see/witness that "all" are presently saved? Or that the "all' will eventually be saved at the Parousia of Christ Jesus?

i see it as God will some how and some point time give everybody the Chance to be saved. his mercy endures forever

Give thanks to the Lord, for he is good.
For his mercy endures forever.
2 Give thanks to the God of Gods.
For his mercy endures forever.
3 Give thanks to the Lord of Lords.
For his mercy endures forever.

His Creating Love​

4 To him who alone does great wonders—[a]
For his mercy endures forever.
5 To him who by his understanding made the heavens—
For his mercy endures forever.
6 To him who spread out the earth on the waters—
For his mercy endures forever.
7 To him who made the great lights,
For his mercy endures forever.
8 the sun to rule by day,
For his mercy endures forever.
9 the moon and stars to rule by night—
For his mercy endures forever.


HE is longsuffering with us not willing any should perish. ITS not his will man be lost.. however not all will call upon the name of the Lord to be saved. in heaven our father has many mansions being prepared for us.. HELL has enlarged its self.. there is no such thing as universalism salvation . you either are saved or your not chose you this day whom you will serve

 

[Johann]

the apostolic thinks its baptized in Jesus name . speak in tongues your saved. no wonder there is so much division in the Body of Christ . then we have the group i know God and i will go to heaven. or join the Church shake the preachers hand and saved. NO one must be born again a change from inward to outward justified sanctified and Glorified

Just one day after the feeding of the 5000, the crowds became offended at Jesus’ teaching and largely walked away, never to return. They grumbled about Him, argued with Him, and ultimately decided that they knew better than Jesus did. Their final recorded words, “This is a hard saying; who can listen to it” (John 6:60), stand as a warning to all who would reject Jesus because they’re offended at what He says. While few Christians today are offended by Jesus’ claims to be the “bread of life” (v. 35) or the “bread that came down from heaven” (v. 41), many are offended by another teaching of Jesus in this same passage. The teaching that people find so offensive, today, is the idea that no one trusts in Jesus unless God enables them to do so. Let’s look at the text again and see if that’s what it really says.


Jesus states the same truth four times in this passage, twice positively and twice negatively. Consider the positive sense in John 6:37. Jesus says, “All that the Father gives me will come to me, and whoever comes to me I will never cast out.”

It seems to be saying that those who come to trust in Jesus do so because the Father has given them to Him. Believers are, in a sense, the Father’s gift to a worthy Saviour.

It’s also clear that “all that the Father gives” to Jesus “will come.”

So it’s not just that God works in all people’s lives equally and some come to believe in Jesus. Every single person that the Father gives to Jesus, comes to trust in Him. It’s important to notice the context. This verse is given by Jesus in response to the fact that many in the crowd fail to believe. Jesus says as much in the previous verse, “you have seen me and yet do not believe” (v. 36).

This is important because it shows that the coming to Him in v. 37 can’t just mean getting near to Jesus, as if all that the Father gives to Jesus come close to get an opportunity to hear and they have to do the rest on their own. Coming to Jesus in v. 37 must mean believing in Jesus because He is explaining why many in the crowd refuse to believe. Simply put, the Father has not given them to Jesus – and the human heart is so stubborn that it refuses to come on its own.

Let’s consider, the second positive statement of this same teaching. In v. 39, Jesus says, “And this is the will of him who sent me, that I should lose nothing of all that he has given me, but raise it up on the last day.”

Notice the similar phrase, “all that he has given me.” The following verse makes it clear that “all that he has given me” refers to everyone who “believes in him” and so receives eternal life.

The promise of this verse is that those who have been given by the Father to Jesus will not turn away as the crowd did, because Jesus has vowed not to lose any of them.

Notice again the impact of Jesus’ words in their context. A small group of disciples has remained faithful to Jesus in the face of a mass exodus of the crowd who have been put off by Jesus’ words.

Jesus first explains the defection of the crowd by saying that they have, in essence, not been given to Him by the Father. But then He assures the faithful disciples, that He won’t lose any of them. A true disciples’ coming to faith is secured by the Father and his or her remaining in the faith is secured by the Son.

Now let’s consider the two negative statements. The first is in v. 44, “No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him. And I will raise him up on the last day.”

This is the same truth from the opposite perspective, here using the word “draw” instead of “give.” Again, coming to Jesus must mean coming to saving faith. That can’t happen, Jesus says, unless the Father draws the person. The word for “draw” here can either mean to drag someone against their will or to inwardly compel them.

Obviously, the latter meaning is intended here. Anyone who has ever trusted Jesus has been first inwardly compelled to faith by the Father. The human heart is so stubborn that without God’s help we’d never turn to Him.

The final statement, and the second negative one, comes in v. 65, “And he said, “This is why I told you that no one can come to me unless it is granted him by the Father.””

Here Jesus’ words from v. 44 are repeated except that “unless the Father who sent me draws him” is replaced by “unless it is granted him by the Father.” The Father giving or granting people to Jesus is interchangeable with Him drawing people to Jesus. So no one comes to Jesus unless the Father draws them, and everyone whom the Father draws, inevitably comes to Jesus.

This is a “hard saying.” It seems to go against our instincts and our natural sense of fairness. It creates problems for us. Why doesn’t the Father draw everyone to Jesus?

How do we know whom the Father has given to the Son? lf everyone whom the Father draws, comes to faith in Jesus, what does that mean for our understanding of human free will? Jesus doesn’t answer all of these questions, at least not in this passage. But He has shown us how true disciples respond to hard sayings – instead of walking away like the crowd or assuming that they know better, they trust Jesus not their own instincts because He has “the words of eternal life” (v. 68).

May we have the humility to take Jesus at His word and in so doing recognize that our coming to faith and our remaining in the faith are both secured by God and are part of His gift to us. His grace is greater than our minds can grasp!

Calvinism aside-would you agree on these passages?

 

[Johann]

HELL has enlarged its self.. there is no such thing as universalism salvation . you either are saved or your not chose you this day whom you will serve

Simply love this-there is no such thing as "Universalism Salvation"--and you are correct.
Shalom
J.

 

[Ezra]

Calvinism aside-would you agree on these passages?

first part i agree Calvinism aside. the next step i agree with scripturas n salvation. the next part is interpretation how does one interpretant ? this is how doctrines are formed. do i agree %100 in Calvinism ? no however no man/woman is saved of themselves .

i hold to free will the whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved . The Holy spirit has to be drawing us. i have had the argument dead men cant hear. lets let God do the saving we simply testify of his marvelous grace. 1 plant 1 waters God gives the increase.

my testimony the night i got saved when the altar call was given .i heard the Holy spirit say to me its NOW or never i chose the NOW. not of my won doing. i have also been told i was wrong saying i heard a voice . BTW this is a good discussion but if it turns to a Calvinist doctrine i will drop this like a hot coal

enjoy the song

 

[Johann]

first part i agree Calvinism aside. the next step i agree with scripturas n salvation. the next part is interpretation how does one interpretant ? this is how doctrines are formed. do i agree %100 in Calvinism ? no however no man/woman is saved of themselves .

i hold to free will the whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved . The Holy spirit has to be drawing us. i have had the argument dead men cant hear. lets let God do the saving we simply testify of his marvelous grace. 1 plant 1 waters God gives the increase.

my testimony the night i got saved when the altar call was given .i heard the Holy spirit say to me its NOW or never i chose the NOW. not of my won doing. i have also been told i was wrong saying i heard a voice . BTW this is a good discussion but if it turns to a Calvinist doctrine i will drop this like a hot coal

enjoy the song

Don't fear-I don't hold to Calvinistic doctrines-and thanks for the song-