Those born again were never actually born in the first place.
I would say that should be accompanied by an explanation.
Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.
You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!
Those born again were never actually born in the first place.
It seems like there is birth & you were born, until you start questioning the direct experience of ‘your own’ birth. Not of perception, or, seeing a baby born, and not of pictures or videos, but the actual direct experience of being born, of beginning. Same with “death”.What do you mean by that Phil?
So Christians were never born? If you are born again, how did you get here? I was born again in 1977; I was born the first time in 1943.Those born again were never actually born in the first place.
Are you okay? I don't actually remember my actual birth experience, but that obviously doesn't mean that I wasn't born. And I haven't experienced physical death yet.It seems like there is birth & you were born, until you start questioning the direct experience of ‘your own’ birth. Not of perception, or, seeing a baby born, and not of pictures or videos, but the actual direct experience of being born, of beginning. Same with “death”.
No one has ever really been born. It sounds paradoxical initially, but to be born again is synonymous with realizing you were never born in the first place.So Christians were never born?
I’ve never been there. No one has.If you are born again, how did you get here?
What was 1977 and 1943 before ‘birth’, or when you were an infant, before you were taught that there is time?I was born again in 1977; I was born the first time in 1943.
I am well, thank you. Never been better.Are you okay?
These are assumptions. What’s being suggested is examining direct experience, not meaning or knowledge.I don't actually remember my actual birth experience, but that obviously doesn't mean that I wasn't born. And I haven't experienced physical death yet.
Who remembers?I do vividly remember being "born again" and the death of the "old man" atheist that I once was..
Okay, I'm done. IMHO you are making zero sense. Bye.No one has ever really been born. It sounds paradoxical initially, but to be born again is synonymous with realizing you were never born in the first place.
I’ve never been there. No one has.
What was 1977 and 1943 before ‘birth’, or when you were an infant, before you were taught that there is time?
We believe the term means anointed. Those with the title have been selected from among mankind to be baptized with holy spirit, bought from the earth to reside in heaven to serve as Kings and Priests and bride to the King Jesus in the Kingdom of God. Rev 14:3; 5:9,10It's being baptized into the death of Christ through faith, entering the New Covenant.
I agree we just have a down payment on our salvation until the resurrection where the purchase in made complete.
But we are told that we can have assurance of our salvation here and now.
John makes it clear that we are saved now, Paul places salvation in the past tense in this life.
A salvation of works brings fear, but a salvation of faith brings assurance.
We believe the term means anointed. Those with the title have been selected from among mankind to be baptized with holy spirit, bought from the earth to reside in heaven to serve as Kings and Priests and bride to the King Jesus in the Kingdom of God. Rev 14:3; 5:9,10
Does this make sense to you Charlie?
Why do you suppose God chose to have the 144k recorded in the Bible sir?Which brings us to the 144,000 which is just another contention with the principles of Christianity.
It's just an ongoing argument with JW's that never ends, virtually everything discussed with them ends in argument!
Why do you suppose God chose to have the 144k recorded in the Bible sir?
In honesty, question, contemplate…Okay, I'm done. IMHO you are making zero sense. Bye.
Yes sir I fully agree. So in line with our discussion, what is their role in God's service?They are the first fruits of His chosen people. They are the true witnesses, not the pretenders.
Yes sir I fully agree. So in line with our discussion, what is their role in God's service?
I agree fully Charlie, but now may I ask you to define what "Jew" means sir? I want to make sure we have the same understanding of what a Jew is.They are Jews, Robert! The Scripture doesn't tell us how they come to Christ, but we know they do and bring many with them into the Kingdom. Paul told us that all of Israel will be saved, these 144,000 are considered to be the first fruits of that prophecy.
I agree fully Charlie, but now may I ask you to define what "Jew" means sir? I want to make sure we have the same understanding of what a Jew is.
I thought you felt that way Charlie, and that was true of the pre-Christian Jews, even though only those from the tribe of Judah was actually Jews, kind of early profiling. Christian Jews are anointed Christians from all nations, peoples, tribes, and tongues Rev 5:9,10. Since they are not necessarily descendants of Judah, Paul described them for us this way: (Romans 2:28, 29) . . .he is not a Jew who is one on the outside, nor is circumcision something on the outside, on the flesh. 29 But he is a Jew who is one on the inside, and his circumcision is that of the heart by spirit and not by a written code. That person’s praise comes from God, not from people.They are Abraham's natural seed! To what extent that natural seed is considered a Jew is only known to God.