Faith: True and False

[GracePeace]

Many assert James 2 (wherein James calls his Christian audience (he knows they're believers, or else he wouldn't call them "adulteresses against God"--unbelievers who sin are not being "adulterous" to God, since they're not "married" to God) to repent of sin, and to not only have faith, but to also walk in faith (as Paul also says, "if we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit"), and discusses faith that is complete (with works) and incomplete (without works), as Paul warns "the widow who lives in wanton pleasure is dead even while she lives", so we can know the opposite of Christians walking in faith, walking after the Spirit, is Christians living for pleasure, walking after the flesh, leading to death and not life, and sin, which Christians can commit, is pleasure-based) refers to "true" and "false" faith.

I find it distasteful when, in my opinion, people ignore the context, play games, do mental gymnastics, to try to make it fit in to a "faith alone" framework (it obviously doesn't) by claiming James is referring to "true" and "false" faith, and not to complete and incomplete faith.

Having said that, I find it interesting that we do seem to find, in John's Gospel, this concept of "true" and "false" faith.

John 6
14Therefore when the people saw the sign which He had performed, they said, “This is truly the Prophet who is to come into the world."
15So Jesus, perceiving that they were intending to come and take Him by force to make Him king, withdrew again to the mountain by Himself alone.
...
22The next day the crowd that stood on the other side of the sea saw that there was no other small boat there, except one, and that Jesus had not entered with His disciples into the boat, but that His disciples had gone away alone. 23There came other small boats from Tiberias near to the place where they ate the bread after the Lord had given thanks. 24So when the crowd saw that Jesus was not there, nor His disciples, they themselves got into the small boats, and came to Capernaum seeking Jesus. 25When they found Him on the other side of the sea, they said to Him, “Rabbi, when did You get here?”
26Jesus answered them and said, “Truly, truly, I say to you, you seek Me, not because you saw signs, but because you ate of the loaves and were filled.

So, clearly, though the text says they "believed", this appears to be a categorically invalid "belief", because they "believed", but they "believed" in a "Jesus" that didn't really exist--what they "believed" in was a "Jesus" of their own, and thought that the real Jesus would be the fulfillment of their own "Prophet Who is to come into the world" concepts.

John 8
30As He spoke these things, many came to believe in Him.
31So Jesus was saying to those Jews who had believed Him, “If you continue in My word, then you are truly disciples of Mine;
32and you will know the truth, and the truth will make you free.”
33They answered Him, “We are Abraham’s descendants and have never yet been enslaved to anyone; how is it that You say, ‘You will become free’?”
34Jesus answered them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, everyone who commits sin is the slave of sin.

We know how this conversation ends--Jesus says their father is the devil--so, though the text says they "believed", their "belief" was not a valid "belief", because their "belief" was not truly in Christ, but it was in a figment of their own imagination that excluded, was antithetical to, the teachings of the true Christ.

I wouldn't want to hide the truth that I see in Scripture, so I thought it was interesting that, though James 2 obviously isn't talking about this, the concept does seem to exist in Scripture. I like to challenge myself, so, though I know it could be used as "ammunition" against my views, I thought it would be interesting to see what happened if I shared it. "He who waters others will himself be watered"--maybe by helping others, I, myself, will be helped, will be given more understanding.

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

For by grace you have been saved through faith; and this is not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; not a result of works, so that no one may boast." Eph. 2:8, 9

Justification by faith separates Christianity from all other religions. however some branches of what is called “Christianity,” man works his way to God.
In true Christianity, man is saved as a result of grace through faith.

justified = “pronounced righteous.”
It is an Act of God, instantaneous.
God imputed Christ's righteousness to us.
Romans 5:1;
Galatians 3:2, 11

Titus 3:5
We are declared righteous and freed from the guilt of sin.

Sanctification, is an ongoing process of growth by which we become more Christlike
1 Thes.5:23.
Thus justification motivates good works and begins sanctification, spiritual growth.
Since justification is a finished work of God, we can feel secure in our salvation, it is a done deal.
God sees us as righteous, purely cleansed.
Nothing else is needed to enter into heaven.
Rom. 3:28 states our own works are disqualified as a means to salvation

Now what Jame's stated, "faith without works is dead" is true. But it is not faith plus works that get you saved.
Good works is a result of salvation.
As the Christian matures, he begins to produce fruit. The truth is God is producing the fruit through us. " the fruitbif the Spirit is ..." So James is a saying, where is this fruit that is evidence of God in you?
Of course this is true, we cooperate with God. But He is the Vine, we are the branches. He gets the credit. James is just reiterating a very similar doctrine, "by their fruit, you will know them".

 

[GracePeace]

Salvation by grace through faith alone is real, it's just not the entire story--that salvation is, in 1 Cor 10, compared to the salvation of the Jews from Egypt, yet, after salvation, they sinned, so they died under God's wrath, and did not inherit what was promised.

Paul says the same is true of us.

So, yes, what you said is true, but, no, it's not the whole story, and it confuses readers of Scripture.

Nevertheless, "true" and "false" faith are concepts that, to my chagrin, are taught in Scripture.

 

[Behold]

Salvation by grace through faith alone is real, it's just not the entire story--that salvation is, in 1 Cor 10, compared to the salvation of the Jews from Egypt, yet, after salvation, they sinned, so they died under God's wrath, and did not inherit what was promised.

Take note that the "jews in Egypt" had no Cross of Christ.

Neither did Adam and Eve.

We do.
"They" didnt have access to the Blood of Jesus, or the NEW Covenant.
We do.
So, this is a completely different situation, because God has given Salvation as a GIFT, that requires no works.. only Faith that is "counted by God as (Christ's) Righteousness".
The born again, never have to purse righteousness to try to be accepted by God, because the born again have been "made righteous" and are become "THE... righteousness of GOD... in Christ".

 

[GracePeace]

Take note that the "jews in Egypt" had no Cross of Christ.

Neither did Adam and Eve.

We do.
"They" didnt have access to the Blood of Jesus, or the NEW Covenant.
We do.
So, this is a completely different situation, because God has given Salvation as a GIFT, that requires no works.. only Faith that is "counted by God as (Christ's) Righteousness".
The born again, never have to purse righteousness to try to be accepted by God, because the born again have been "made righteous" and are become "THE... righteousness of GOD... in Christ".

You're trying to correct Paul--Paul was the one who said that the salvation which the Jews experienced (by the blood of lambs) by the hand of God, but still fell under His wrath for sinning after having already been saved, was meant to teach us Christians about what can happen to us after we are saved if we walk in sin.

 

[Behold]

You're trying to correct Paul--Paul was the one who said that the salvation which the Jews experienced (by the blood of lambs) by the hand of God,

You are making up your own bible now?
Not a good idea.

Listen...There is no salvation, other than "faith is counted as righteousness, BY GOD. = "The GIFT of Salvation".

Salvation is found on The Cross of Christ = as the Blood Atonement.

The "Jews" didnt experience this Salvation, unless they became Messianic Believing Jews.
My home is in Israel, and ive seen a lot of unbelieving Jews, and they are still under God's wrath.

John 3:36

but still fell under His wrath for sinning after having already been saved,

So, you are making up your own bible., as i have pointed out.
You must have just posted @GracePeace Chapter 6:66
Not a good idea.

God's "WRATH" was poured out on Jesus on the Cross, ... and never is it found as poured out on a Born Again Child of God.
Not now and not in eternity.
Believe it.

 

[GracePeace]

You are making up your own bible now?
Not a good idea.

Listen...There is no salvation, other than "faith is counted as righteousness, BY GOD. = "The GIFT of Salvation".

Salvation is found on The Cross of Christ = as the Blood Atonement.

The "Jews" didnt experience this Salvation, unless they became Messianic Believing Jews.
My home is in Israel, and ive seen a lot of unbelieving Jews, and they are still under God's wrath.

John 3:36



So, you are making up your own bible., as i have pointed out.
You must have just posted @GracePeace Chapter 6:66
Not a good idea.

God's "WRATH" was poured out on Jesus on the Cross, ... and never is it found as poured out on a Born Again Child of God.
Not now and not in eternity.
Believe it.

No, actually, and when I cite Scripture, you try to tear it in pieces so it can fit your tradition. I'll post the passage here, and you'll do the same.

1 Corinthians 10
1For I do not want you to be unaware, brethren, that our fathers were all under the cloud and all passed through the sea; 2and all were baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea; 3and all ate the same spiritual food; 4and all drank the same spiritual drink, for they were drinking from a spiritual rock which followed them; and the rock was Christ. 5Nevertheless, with most of them God was not well-pleased; for they were laid low in the wilderness. 6Now these things happened as examples for us, so that we would not crave evil things as they also craved. 7Do not be idolaters, as some of them were; as it is written, “THE PEOPLE SAT DOWN TO EAT AND DRINK, AND STOOD UP TO PLAY.” 8Nor let us act immorally, as some of them did, and twenty-three thousand fell in one day. 9Nor let us try the Lord, as some of them did, and were destroyed by the serpents. 10Nor grumble, as some of them did, and were destroyed by the destroyer. 11Now these things happened to them as an example, and they were written for our instruction, upon whom the ends of the ages have come.

Again, you are unacquainted with Scripture.

 

[Traveler]

To Define Faith.

It would seem strange that the time has come where there now needs to be an explanation of what faith is. Supposed to be such a simple definition, but in our generation it has become so twisted that this is one of the greatest hindrances to the development of the saints and the breaking of their power found in the gifts of the Spirit.

What faith is not ;

Faith is not some mystical spiritual power that you need to develop more of so as to get rich quicker or walk on water. In fact the gifts of the spirit are not even meant to be used to gain wealth as in mammon for power in this world this side of the rapture. So even the motivation for the building up of the saints faith has been compromised. Yes you need faith to gain access to God but it is Gods power that does the miracles, not your faith. It is your faith in God that makes you a conduit for the power of God to flow through you.

In the kingdom of God everything revolves around God and God is the source of the saints power. In the kingdom of Satan everything revolves around self and power is to be found in the development of self. Hence the twisting of the definition of faith into a force that is supposed to be developed in self. We were warned about this in the book of Daniel and his description of the Son of Perdition.

Dan 11:37 Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women, nor regard any god: for he shall magnify himself above all.
Dan 11:38 But in his estate shall he honour the God of forces: and a god whom his fathers knew not shall he honour with gold, and silver, and with precious stones, and pleasant things.

As you can see, a gay atheist that believes in a god of forces, Sounds like something out of the movie Star wars. ( May the force be with you !) If you are trying to develop and build up your force of faith then you are not worshiping God, you are idolizing Self and as such serving the kingdom of Satan.

What faith is;

A dictionary definition is this ;

G4100
πιστεύω
pisteuō
pist-yoo'-o
From G4102; to have faith (in, upon, or with respect to, a person or thing), that is, credit; by implication to entrust (especially one’s spiritual well being to Christ): - believe (-r), commit (to trust), put in trust with.

Faith has to rest in something or someone. Do you have trust in your spouse to come to your aid if you are in trouble. That is faith in your spouse. Do you believe that if you get in your car to drive to work in the morning that it will get you there, you are displaying faith in your car.

Likewise you have faith in God. You trust God and believe in God that he will be looking out for your better well-being as viewed from the perspective of his kingdom. You are the servant of the Lord, the Lord is not your servant ! The relationship is God centre, not self centre.

In prayer the actual power that makes the miracle happen comes from God, not the saint. The prayer of the saint is that of an intercessor that is asking God to intervene in natural events on their behalf. The saint is asking God for help because the saint has faith in God to answer their requests. Faith in God is much the same as trust in God.

Think of a relationship between a child and a parent. The Child has faith in the parent to look out for them and if the child asks the parent for something then the child will have the expectation of an answer. The parent can still hold back if the request will be a problem down the line but the trust relationship between the parent and child remains. The relationship between the Saint and God is much the same with the exception that the saint is a bit more mature and God does expect respect and obedience from the saint and the saint is often given small tasks to do in service of the kingdom.

This faith in God is a requirement for everything from the basic salvation to the operation of the gifts of the spirit to an active prayer life. Without this faith there just is no real relationship with God.

Heb 11:5 By faith Enoch was translated that he should not see death; and was not found, because God had translated him: for before his translation he had this testimony, that he pleased God.
Heb 11:6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.
Heb 11:7 By faith Noah, being warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear, prepared an ark to the saving of his house; by the which he condemned the world, and became heir of the righteousness which is by faith.

It is the trust faith and belief in God that gives you the confidence to believe the scriptures and grow spiritually to the point where you come into the fullness of the promises. A lack of or misdirected faith in God will result in a dry academic religion with no power.

This can be demonstrated in the verses below.

Act 3:12 And when Peter saw it, he answered unto the people, Ye men of Israel, why marvel ye at this? or why look ye so earnestly on us, as though by our own power or holiness we had made this man to walk?
Act 3:13 The God of Abraham, and of Isaac, and of Jacob, the God of our fathers, hath glorified his Son Jesus; whom ye delivered up, and denied him in the presence of Pilate, when he was determined to let him go.
Act 3:14 But ye denied the Holy One and the Just, and desired a murderer to be granted unto you;
Act 3:15 And killed the Prince of life, whom God hath raised from the dead; whereof we are witnesses.
Act 3:16 And his name through faith in his name hath made this man strong, whom ye see and know: yea, the faith which is by him hath given him this perfect soundness in the presence of you all.

A notable miracle occurred under the ministry of the original apostles and the people started to look on them as if they were special holy people. Correction they were uneducated fishermen. They were the peasantry of the day. But they had been redeemed by Jesus and they had the authority to use his name and they had faith in God the Father of Jesus to work the miracle in answer to their prayers. And in that passage they stated as such. It still works exactly the same way to day. I have seen miracles under my own small ministry even though I am very ordinary in every way.

Get your theology and motives right and anyone reading this will be able to start walking in the power of the spirit as well. That is how the real body of Christ self perpetuates and grows from generation to generation down through time. Or do you really think all those who gave their lives for Christ did so because of religious delusions ?

The cost to you;

Do not think that if you grow to the point where you start to walk in the fullness of the spirit that Satan will leave you to go your merry way. Persecution is sure to follow. If you are not being persecuted then you need to see if you are doing something wrong from the perspective of the kingdom of God. The events explained in the passage below is typical and often repeated right to this day. Note that it came from the religious establishment.

Act 6:7 And the word of God increased; and the number of the disciples multiplied in Jerusalem greatly; and a great company of the priests were obedient to the faith.
Act 6:8 And Stephen, full of faith and power, did great wonders and miracles among the people.
Act 6:9 Then there arose certain of the synagogue, which is called the synagogue of the Libertines, and Cyrenians, and Alexandrians, and of them of Cilicia and of Asia, disputing with Stephen.
Act 6:10 And they were not able to resist the wisdom and the spirit by which he spake.
Act 6:11 Then they suborned men, which said, We have heard him speak blasphemous words against Moses, and against God.
Act 6:12 And they stirred up the people, and the elders, and the scribes, and came upon him, and caught him, and brought him to the council,
Act 6:13 And set up false witnesses, which said, This man ceaseth not to speak blasphemous words against this holy place, and the law:

Now Stephen had a nice little ministry going there. The gifts of the spirit was operating through him and people where coming to the Lord etc. It was members of other synagogues that first came to debate with him and try to lead him astray or comply with their way. This did not go well for them so they gathered false witnesses to slander him and then used that to bring him before the law courts to destroy him publicly.

This is demonically induced and Satan has a whole lot of demons dedicated to isolating the saints that get in the way. This can be combated and driven back in prayer but that is another subject. Just know that this type of persecution will hit any saint that moves in the will of the Lord. It’s a lot less devastating if you have a heads up and are expect it. It will always come from your area of greatest weakness.

 

[marks]

You're trying to correct Paul--Paul was the one who said that the salvation which the Jews experienced (by the blood of lambs) by the hand of God, but still fell under His wrath for sinning after having already been saved, was meant to teach us Christians about what can happen to us after we are saved if we walk in sin.

Ergo, the Blood of Jesus has no greater efficacy than the blood of animals?

They were not regenerated, which is a significant difference, wouldn't you say? And in fact Jesus' blood is transcendant in all respects from animal blood.

Hebrews is really clear on that.

Paul was not saying that those Israelites were regenerate, baptized into Christ. You are making a false equivalency.

Much love!

 

[GracePeace]

To Define Faith.

It would seem strange that the time has come where there now needs to be an explanation of what faith is. Supposed to be such a simple definition, but in our generation it has become so twisted that this is one of the greatest hindrances to the development of the saints and the breaking of their power found in the gifts of the Spirit.

What faith is not ;

Faith is not some mystical spiritual power that you need to develop more of so as to get rich quicker or walk on water. In fact the gifts of the spirit are not even meant to be used to gain wealth as in mammon for power in this world this side of the rapture. So even the motivation for the building up of the saints faith has been compromised. Yes you need faith to gain access to God but it is Gods power that does the miracles, not your faith. It is your faith in God that makes you a conduit for the power of God to flow through you.

In the kingdom of God everything revolves around God and God is the source of the saints power. In the kingdom of Satan everything revolves around self and power is to be found in the development of self. Hence the twisting of the definition of faith into a force that is supposed to be developed in self. We were warned about this in the book of Daniel and his description of the Son of Perdition.

Dan 11:37 Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women, nor regard any god: for he shall magnify himself above all.
Dan 11:38 But in his estate shall he honour the God of forces: and a god whom his fathers knew not shall he honour with gold, and silver, and with precious stones, and pleasant things.

As you can see, a gay atheist that believes in a god of forces, Sounds like something out of the movie Star wars. ( May the force be with you !) If you are trying to develop and build up your force of faith then you are not worshiping God, you are idolizing Self and as such serving the kingdom of Satan.

What faith is;

A dictionary definition is this ;

G4100
πιστεύω
pisteuō
pist-yoo'-o
From G4102; to have faith (in, upon, or with respect to, a person or thing), that is, credit; by implication to entrust (especially one’s spiritual well being to Christ): - believe (-r), commit (to trust), put in trust with.

Faith has to rest in something or someone. Do you have trust in your spouse to come to your aid if you are in trouble. That is faith in your spouse. Do you believe that if you get in your car to drive to work in the morning that it will get you there, you are displaying faith in your car.

Likewise you have faith in God. You trust God and believe in God that he will be looking out for your better well-being as viewed from the perspective of his kingdom. You are the servant of the Lord, the Lord is not your servant ! The relationship is God centre, not self centre.

In prayer the actual power that makes the miracle happen comes from God, not the saint. The prayer of the saint is that of an intercessor that is asking God to intervene in natural events on their behalf. The saint is asking God for help because the saint has faith in God to answer their requests. Faith in God is much the same as trust in God.

Think of a relationship between a child and a parent. The Child has faith in the parent to look out for them and if the child asks the parent for something then the child will have the expectation of an answer. The parent can still hold back if the request will be a problem down the line but the trust relationship between the parent and child remains. The relationship between the Saint and God is much the same with the exception that the saint is a bit more mature and God does expect respect and obedience from the saint and the saint is often given small tasks to do in service of the kingdom.

This faith in God is a requirement for everything from the basic salvation to the operation of the gifts of the spirit to an active prayer life. Without this faith there just is no real relationship with God.

Heb 11:5 By faith Enoch was translated that he should not see death; and was not found, because God had translated him: for before his translation he had this testimony, that he pleased God.
Heb 11:6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.
Heb 11:7 By faith Noah, being warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear, prepared an ark to the saving of his house; by the which he condemned the world, and became heir of the righteousness which is by faith.

It is the trust faith and belief in God that gives you the confidence to believe the scriptures and grow spiritually to the point where you come into the fullness of the promises. A lack of or misdirected faith in God will result in a dry academic religion with no power.

This can be demonstrated in the verses below.

Act 3:12 And when Peter saw it, he answered unto the people, Ye men of Israel, why marvel ye at this? or why look ye so earnestly on us, as though by our own power or holiness we had made this man to walk?
Act 3:13 The God of Abraham, and of Isaac, and of Jacob, the God of our fathers, hath glorified his Son Jesus; whom ye delivered up, and denied him in the presence of Pilate, when he was determined to let him go.
Act 3:14 But ye denied the Holy One and the Just, and desired a murderer to be granted unto you;
Act 3:15 And killed the Prince of life, whom God hath raised from the dead; whereof we are witnesses.
Act 3:16 And his name through faith in his name hath made this man strong, whom ye see and know: yea, the faith which is by him hath given him this perfect soundness in the presence of you all.

A notable miracle occurred under the ministry of the original apostles and the people started to look on them as if they were special holy people. Correction they were uneducated fishermen. They were the peasantry of the day. But they had been redeemed by Jesus and they had the authority to use his name and they had faith in God the Father of Jesus to work the miracle in answer to their prayers. And in that passage they stated as such. It still works exactly the same way to day. I have seen miracles under my own small ministry even though I am very ordinary in every way.

Get your theology and motives right and anyone reading this will be able to start walking in the power of the spirit as well. That is how the real body of Christ self perpetuates and grows from generation to generation down through time. Or do you really think all those who gave their lives for Christ did so because of religious delusions ?

The cost to you;

Do not think that if you grow to the point where you start to walk in the fullness of the spirit that Satan will leave you to go your merry way. Persecution is sure to follow. If you are not being persecuted then you need to see if you are doing something wrong from the perspective of the kingdom of God. The events explained in the passage below is typical and often repeated right to this day. Note that it came from the religious establishment.

Act 6:7 And the word of God increased; and the number of the disciples multiplied in Jerusalem greatly; and a great company of the priests were obedient to the faith.
Act 6:8 And Stephen, full of faith and power, did great wonders and miracles among the people.
Act 6:9 Then there arose certain of the synagogue, which is called the synagogue of the Libertines, and Cyrenians, and Alexandrians, and of them of Cilicia and of Asia, disputing with Stephen.
Act 6:10 And they were not able to resist the wisdom and the spirit by which he spake.
Act 6:11 Then they suborned men, which said, We have heard him speak blasphemous words against Moses, and against God.
Act 6:12 And they stirred up the people, and the elders, and the scribes, and came upon him, and caught him, and brought him to the council,
Act 6:13 And set up false witnesses, which said, This man ceaseth not to speak blasphemous words against this holy place, and the law:

Now Stephen had a nice little ministry going there. The gifts of the spirit was operating through him and people where coming to the Lord etc. It was members of other synagogues that first came to debate with him and try to lead him astray or comply with their way. This did not go well for them so they gathered false witnesses to slander him and then used that to bring him before the law courts to destroy him publicly.

This is demonically induced and Satan has a whole lot of demons dedicated to isolating the saints that get in the way. This can be combated and driven back in prayer but that is another subject. Just know that this type of persecution will hit any saint that moves in the will of the Lord. It’s a lot less devastating if you have a heads up and are expect it. It will always come from your area of greatest weakness.

Proverbs 18
13If one gives an answer before he hears, it is his folly and shame.

You must not have read before answering, because your "answer" is not about what I wrote.

 

[GracePeace]

Ergo, the Blood of Jesus has no greater efficacy than the blood of animals?

They were not regenerated, which is a significant difference, wouldn't you say? And in fact Jesus' blood is transcendant in all respects from animal blood.

Hebrews is really clear on that.

Paul was not saying that those Israelites were regenerate, baptized into Christ. You are making a false equivalency.

Much love!

Paul drew the comparison, not me. Sorry, I'm simple. I just believe what he writes.

 

[marks]

Paul drew the comparison, not me. Sorry, I'm simple. I justification believe what he writes.

He drew a comparison, but not that comparison. In fact the Scripture makes a really big deal over the difference, and I don't think Paul is contradicting that.

Much love!

 

[GracePeace]

He drew a comparison, but not that comparison. In fact the Scripture makes a really big deal over the difference, and I don't think Paul is contradicting that.

Much love!

What comparison was Paul not making that I am making--and what is the "correct" "takeaway" from this passage?

 

[marks]

What comparison was Paul not making that I am making?

That our "salvation" is the same as the ancient Israelites. As if the animal sacrifices left them in the same state that Jesus' sacrifice makes for us.

We are regenerated, united in spirit to God. This was not true for them.

Much love!

 

[GracePeace]

That our "salvation" is the same as the ancient Israelites. As if the animal sacrifices left them in the same state that Jesus' sacrifice makes for us.

We are regenerated, united in spirit to God. This was not true for them.

Much love!

So... all those times the Bible teaches the OT was intentionally a type and shadow of things to come, the Bible is wrong, because what came before were only types and shadows, not the fulfillment of those types and shadows? Lol

 

[GracePeace]

That our "salvation" is the same as the ancient Israelites. As if the animal sacrifices left them in the same state that Jesus' sacrifice makes for us.

We are regenerated, united in spirit to God. This was not true for them.

Much love!

Also, what is the "correct" understanding of the passage we should be walking away with?

 

[marks]

Also, what is the "correct" understanding of the passage we should be walking away with?

1 Corinthians 10:6 KJV
Now these things were our examples, to the intent we should not lust after evil things, as they also lusted.

1 Corinthians 10:11-12 KJV
11) Now all these things happened unto them for ensamples: and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world are come.
12) Wherefore let him that thinketh he standeth take heed lest he fall.

Much love!

 

[GracePeace]

That our "salvation" is the same as the ancient Israelites.

Who said that? I sure didn't.
But why were they saved from slavery (sin is slavery Jn 8) specifically by the blood of lambs, if it weren't prefiguring our salvation by the blood of the Lamb of God? Why does Paul say they were "baptized", and "ate communion" if he wasn't drawing the comparison?

And are you saying we can commit idolatry, immorality, etc--sins he is warning us not in commit--and still inherit Gods Kingdom?

Isn't it true that Paul said that if we do those things we will NOT inherit God's Kingdom (1 Co 6)--isn't that the warning he's trying to get across to the Church?

 

[marks]

the Bible is wrong,

Is that what I said? No it is not.

If you merely want a conversation with yourself, there is no need to tag me on it.

Much love!

 

[GracePeace]

1 Corinthians 10:6 KJV
Now these things were our examples, to the intent we should not lust after evil things, as they also lusted.

1 Corinthians 10:11-12 KJV
11) Now all these things happened unto them for ensamples: and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world are come.
12) Wherefore let him that thinketh he standeth take heed lest he fall.

Much love!

Right... so, what happens if the already-saved people go ahead and do hose things?