And that's EXACTLY what you do! You remove the Flood, the burning of Sodom, everlasting fire ...
And no doubt MANY other Bible verses!
Hellfire and brimstone has given way to eternal separation from God. - Why?
- Thread starter St. SteVen
- Start date
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And no doubt MANY other Bible verses!
Aunty Jane
Well-Known Member
No Jack, I think that your crusade here is ‘funny’ because it is based on ignorance…..and in what you write, your errors are more glaring and unchristian than you believe mine are.
Same script….you know, the sad thing is, you don’t know what “hellfire” meant to a Jew. Jesus preached only to the Jews because he was sent only to “the lost sheep of the house of Israel”.
The Jews were never taught about such a place, and since Jesus was Jewish, using only Jewish scripture, he never taught about “hellfire”…he taught about “Gehenna”.
In referring to “the Gehenna of fire” (which is erroneously translated “hellfire” in many Bibles) Jesus was speaking of a place well known to Jerusalem’s inhabitants……”Gehenna” was the rubbish dump outside the walls of the city where fires were kept burning day and night (with the addition of brimstone or sulfur) to consume the rubbish that was thrown in there. Things went into Gehenna for disposal because nothing alive was ever cast there. The carcasses of dead animals, and even the bodies of executed criminals, deemed not worthy of a decent burial were thrown into Gehenna……it was a place that Jews believed for humans, meant eternal death. It was assumed that without a burial place with names and lineage inscribed, God would not remember these ones in the resurrection….”hades” is the place from which Jesus calls all the dead, both good and bad. (John 5:28-29) No one is ever called from “Gehenna”.
To prop up belief in immortal souls, the RCC adopted the pagan notion of “hellfire” so as to create control…..a doctrine, not based on love, but based on fear…..this is what your doctrine supports….where is the God of love? Christendom has turned him into a fiendish and sadistic god who delights in eternally punishing a soul for committing a short life of sins, that they inherited from Adam in the first place. (Rom 5:12) That is not justice! The punishment does not fit the crime.
Your understanding is so stunted that it produces a stubborn spirit that cannot be corrected. You have been told the truth so many times, but in your crusade against anyone who dares to question the validity of what you have probably believed all your life, you act like the first century Jews who believed their religious leaders, and put their own Messiah to death…..that is your choice…..we are all free to believe whatever we wish…..but the majority of us will end up being dead wrong. (Matt 7:13-14; 21-23)
You don’t want to learn anything that might force you to change, not just your mind, but your heart, poisoned with errors that you want to hang on to…..will God correct you? No Jack, he will not. (2 Thess 2:9-12) We have to correct ourselves and accept the Bible’s truth, or we will have no place in his Kingdom.
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Really? Bible-believing Christians “become kind to one another, tenderly compassionate, freely forgiving one another just as God also by Christ freely forgave.” — Ephesians 4:32
They try to follow Paul’s counsel @ vs.31, to “Put away from yourselves every kind of malicious bitterness, anger, wrath, screaming, and abusive speech, as well as everything injurious.”
As Christ did.
Is that you?
I haven’t seen it.
From the OP.
Over the years I have noticed a shift away from the embarrassment of the hell doctrine.
It had always seemed like the "fly in the ointment" of Christianity to me.
But we had biblical evidence that it was sad, but true.
The solution was evangelism. We are in the business of "saving souls from hell." Err...
I mean "eternal separation from God." (whatever that means to you) ???
This task of world evangelism was completely overwhelming.
We had annual world missions conferences for fund raising.
We were sending and supporting missionaries at home and abroad.
Some were wanting to be good stewards of their giving by
demanding results, or channeling the funds toward "fruitful" ministries.
Which meant withdrawing support from any who seemed to not
measure up to their expectations. Made me wonder.
Here at home we were still expected to spread the good news.
But, an over-evangelized America was less than welcoming.
They hadn't forgotten the "hellfire and brimstone".
What's your take on all of this?
/
Over the years I have noticed a shift away from the embarrassment of the hell doctrine.
It had always seemed like the "fly in the ointment" of Christianity to me.
But we had biblical evidence that it was sad, but true.
The solution was evangelism. We are in the business of "saving souls from hell." Err...
I mean "eternal separation from God." (whatever that means to you) ???
This task of world evangelism was completely overwhelming.
We had annual world missions conferences for fund raising.
We were sending and supporting missionaries at home and abroad.
Some were wanting to be good stewards of their giving by
demanding results, or channeling the funds toward "fruitful" ministries.
Which meant withdrawing support from any who seemed to not
measure up to their expectations. Made me wonder.
Here at home we were still expected to spread the good news.
But, an over-evangelized America was less than welcoming.
They hadn't forgotten the "hellfire and brimstone".
What's your take on all of this?
/
GISMYS_7
Well-Known Member
Dan Clarkston
Active Member
Being eternally separated from the Lord means spending eternity in hell with the devil and all his fallen angels.
They are without excuse and since they refuse to accept the Lord, they are turned over to a reprobate mind so just move on when they indicate they don't want to hear about the Lord.
Evangelizing is a lot like fishing (according to Jesus) so it involves throwing a little God's Word out there as bait (or seed) and see if someone bites. If they do, then reel them in.
If they don't, then ignore them and work on some other person (fish in another part of the pond.)
This is true. It's notable to realize in resent years we've seen such an increase in the false teaching of annihilationism
This tells unbelievers out there that there's no need to get saved because the annihilationism people tell them they won't suffer in hell for all eternity, they'll just cease to exist instead.
Not many can do that when there is no love in their heart to begin with.
As with many that get saved, I came to the Lord after hearing a hell fire and brimstone message and after getting saved I learned about God's love. Without the hell fire and brimstone message I never would have gotten saved and learned the Lord loves people.
And you have included yourself in this group right?
Others are not doing anything you're not also doing.
It's part of the learning process to study God's Word, develop opinions about it, and then grow from their receiving the Lord correction and leading as we continue to study and grow spiritually
That's not true. The Lord would have just gotten another person to replace Paul.
The Lord always has other people He can call on to get things done that He needs a person to be involved in.
Paul was an apostle of the church bride back in the day. He was trained personally by the Lord Jesus Christ, everyone else who was sent out to the nation of Israel first, also who were trained personally by the Lord Jesus Christ, were Apostles of Jesus Christ, because of that merit having trained under him, as their Master.
No one has that qualification today. While so, no doubt, does God use people, to fulfill his good purposes and will who willingly share and pray with others, when the spirit is lead, by the Lord Jesus Christ within you, blessings!
Dan Clarkston
Active Member
God did not force any of them to be apostles.
They had opportunity to walk away from Him and if they had, the Lord would have gotten someone else to take their place.
They had opportunity to walk away from Him and if they had, the Lord would have gotten someone else to take their place.
Behold
Well-Known Member
11 And He gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
A.) 12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:Notice @MatthewG that there were no Pastors, Evangelists, or Teachers, until after Jesus was back in Heaven.
Please throw away all your commentaries.
ASAP.
Dan Clarkston
Active Member
Well, there are many out there that got their start with the Lord because they did not want to go to hell.
This is a big part of the gospel message and people must be told that is they reject Jesus then they will be birning in hell because that is the Truth.
There's a reason why Jesus taught a lot on hell.
Dan Clarkston
Active Member
Jesus calls it the Truth.
Withholding the Truth from people is a sin before the Lord as teaching about hell is part of the gospel.
Unless of course one wants to claim Jesus was mistaken about hell? Maybe He was not in the loop that God was just joking around and He's not really sending anybody to hell?
This is a subject where we get to see who believes what the Lord says and who does not.
Talking to people about hell is not pleasant, but it's part of the gospel because they are going there is they do not get born again and walk with the Lord being faithful to Him their entire lives.
Did Jesus die to save you from God?
--- PARODY ---
Person #1: Receive the free gift of eternal life.
Person #2: No thanks.
Person #1: I said it was free.
Person #2: There must be some strings attached.
Person #1: Well, of course.
Person #2: It's not a free gift then, right?
Person #1: You had better take it... or else!
Person #2: Say what?
Person #1: Otherwise you will be incinerated!
Person #2: What sort of free gift is that?
Indeed.
/
St. SteVen said:
I call it spiritual extortion.
Where did you hear that?
Like the bad news part of the good news?
Mark 9:49 NRSVue
“For everyone will be salted with fire.
And where did you get this business about "being faithful to Him their entire lives"?
Do you live in constant fear of losing your salvation? What if you develop mental issues late in life?
Kiss your salvation goodbye? Will you be toast?
/
I call it spiritual extortion.
Does he now?
Where did you hear that?
Hell is part of the gospel?
Like the bad news part of the good news?
I believe in hell. EVERYONE is going there. Jesus said:
Mark 9:49 NRSVue
“For everyone will be salted with fire.
Are you prepared to accept what that says about you?
Rubbish.
And where did you get this business about "being faithful to Him their entire lives"?
Do you live in constant fear of losing your salvation? What if you develop mental issues late in life?
Kiss your salvation goodbye? Will you be toast?
/
Behold
Well-Known Member
This world, this world system is the only Hell that a born again believer, will ever know and experience.
And for the unbeliever, this world is as close to Heaven, as they will ever get.
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