Is the story of Noah literal?

[Cassandra]

Yes!!!!! You are right!!! NASA - Astronomers Find Largest, Most Distant Reservoir of Water

.
● Gen 7:11a . . In the six hundredth year of Noah's life, in the second
month, on the seventeenth day of the month,

The Flood isn't dated according to a calendar; but rather, relative to Noah's
life. In other words: let's say that Noah was born in the month of July. Had
that been the case; then the second month of his life would have been
August.

● Gen 7:11b . . the same day were all the fountains of the great deep
broken up, and the windows of heaven were opened.

The Hebrew word translated "deep" is tehowm (teh-home') which indicates
an abyss (as a surging mass of water) especially the deep (the main sea or
the subterranean water-supply). Tehowm occurred very early on in the
Bible's texts at Gen 1:1-2.

The difference is that this deep is the great deep. The word for "great" is
from rab (rab) which means abundant (in quantity, size, age, number, rank,
quality), so that this particular deep could be thought of as bottomless; viz:
an abysmal source of water beyond human imagination whereas the Earth's
indigenous sources are limited. The precise location of the great deep is
currently unknown.

The "windows" of heaven are translated from 'arubbah (ar-oob-baw') which
refers to a sluice; viz: a trough and/or a channel for moving water from one
place to another; in this case for transferring water from the great deep to
the Earth.

Seeing as how Gen 7:11 speaks of heaven and sluices, then I think it's safe
to assume that the water used to inundate the Earth came from somewhere
out in the void; which is actually a reasonable assumption.

In an article I found on the internet dated July 22, 2011; astronomers have
discovered the largest and oldest mass of water ever detected in the
universe-- a gigantic cloud harboring 140 trillion times more water than all
of Earth's oceans combined. Well; I'm pretty sure that's a sufficient quantity
of water to inundate the Earth to a depth required by the Flood.
_

 

[Cassandra]

I wonder if this explains divide the waters from the waters.

Gen 1:6-7
6 And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters.


7 And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so.

 

[Webers_Home]

.
FAQ: Were the waters of the Flood fresh or salt?

REPLY: The sea's saltiness isn't static; it's increasing all the time, and always
has. Which means that if you were to go waaaay back in time, the sea was a
lot less salty than it is today; ergo: sea life's adjustment to dilution back
in Noah's day wouldn't have been nearly as extreme as sea life's
adjustment would be in our day.

● Gen 7:21-23a . . And all flesh that stirred on earth perished— birds, cattle,
beasts, and all the things that swarmed upon the earth, and all mankind. All
in whose nostrils was the merest breath of life, all that was on dry land,
died.

All "existence on earth" was limited to fauna life on land. Apparently flora life
and aqua life were spared.

FAQ: What is the breath of life?

REPLY: The Hebrew word translated "breath" is somewhat ambiguous but I
think we can be reasonably sure it isn't speaking of atmospheric gases like
oxygen, nitrogen, and/or carbon dioxide. For example:

"And the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into
his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul". (Gen 2:7)

In that case, the breath of life served to make Adam a sentient being. Here's
another along that same line.

"The Spirit of God has made me; the breath of the Almighty gives me life".
(Job 33:4)

The breath of life sustained all the critters aboard Noah's ark (Gen 7:15) but
I have yet to discover a anything in the Bible suggesting vegetation is
sustained by the breath of life; which indicates to me that vegetation is a
non-sentient form of life (hence the medical term: vegetative).
_

 

[TinMan]

.
FAQ: Were the waters of the Flood fresh or salt?

REPLY: The sea's saltiness isn't static; it's increasing all the time, and always
has. Which means that if you were to go waaaay back in time, the sea was a
lot less salty than it is today; ergo: sea life's adjustment to dilution back
in Noah's day wouldn't have been nearly as extreme as sea life's
adjustment would be in our day.

● Gen 7:21-23a . . And all flesh that stirred on earth perished— birds, cattle,
beasts, and all the things that swarmed upon the earth, and all mankind. All
in whose nostrils was the merest breath of life, all that was on dry land,
died.

All "existence on earth" was limited to fauna life on land. Apparently flora life
and aqua life were spared.

FAQ: What is the breath of life?

REPLY: The Hebrew word translated "breath" is somewhat ambiguous but I
think we can be reasonably sure it isn't speaking of atmospheric gases like
oxygen, nitrogen, and/or carbon dioxide. For example:

"And the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into
his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul". (Gen 2:7)

In that case, the breath of life served to make Adam a sentient being. Here's
another along that same line.

"The Spirit of God has made me; the breath of the Almighty gives me life".
(Job 33:4)

The breath of life sustained all the critters aboard Noah's ark (Gen 7:15) but
I have yet to discover a anything in the Bible suggesting vegetation is
sustained by the breath of life; which indicates to me that vegetation is a
non-sentient form of life (hence the medical term: vegetative).
_

Actually the salinity of the oceans is falling and has been doing so for the last 500 million years. REf 1, Ref 2.

 

[Webers_Home]

.
● Gen 9:1-4 . . Then God blessed Noah and his sons, saying to them:
Everything that lives and moves will be food for you. Just as I gave you the
green plants, I now give you everything.

Blessings should never be construed as commandments and/or laws and
edicts. In other words: God gave Noah and his sons the green light to eat
meat, but He didn't say they had to.

● Rom 14:2-3 . . One man's faith allows him to eat everything, but another3
man, whose faith is weak, eats only vegetables. The man who eats
everything must not look down on him who does not, and the man who does
not eat everything must not condemn the man who does, for God has
accepted him.

People are often curious why God revised humanity's diet after the Flood.
Well; the Bible gives no specific reason for it that I'm aware of, but
according to an article in the Dec 10, 2013 Science section of the New York
Times, scientists believe that the early human body was able to manufacture
all of its own essential vitamins; but over time gradually lost the ability to
manufacture all but K and D.

That seems plausible to me seeing as how Noah lived to be 950 years old,
but by the time of Abraham, the human life span had decreased
considerably to 175; which the Bible describes as a ripe old age (Gen 25:7
8). Well, Noah at 175 was about equivalent to Abraham at 32; so the human
body was obviously a whole lot stronger back in Noah's day than it was in
Abraham's.

Apparently the inclusion of meat in Man's diet after the Flood was intended
primarily as a source of natural supplements to make up for the human
body's gradually lessening ability to manufacture all it's own essential
nutrients; much the same reason that modern vegans resort to synthetic
supplements in order to avoid contracting deficiency diseases.

People subsisting on vegan diets, such as many of the people of India, often
eat lots of minute insect eggs along with their fruits and vegetables without
knowing it, thus providing themselves with a number of essential nutrients
that most everyone else obtains by deliberately eating animal products. It's
kind of humorous that in their care to avoid meat. vegans sometimes end up
dining on bugs.
_

 

[Webers_Home]

.
● Gen 7:1 . . The Lord then said to Noah: Go into the ark, you and your
whole family, because I have found you righteous in this generation.

Righteousness varies; for example there's the righteous of God (Rom 3:23)
which of course Noah couldn't possibly match because the bar is set just too
high.

Then there's a righteousness that comes from following instructions to the
letter; for example Luke 1:6 & Phil 3:6.

And there's a righteousness relative to one's fellow men (Ezek 14:12-20)

An imputed righteousness (Gen 15:6)

And innate righteousness (1John 3:9)

Noah preached on righteousness (2Pet 2:5) so I think we may safely assume
that he practiced what he preached in order to receive such a high mark
from God.
_

 

[Ronald Nolette]

When talking about things like moving contenants and thousands of sedimentary layers being laid down almost over night it is unreasonable.

Is it? We have empirical evidence that hundreds of sedimentary layers can be laid down in days. All wee have to do is go to Mt. St. Helens to see them. And as for continental drift- we do not know the original movement and now the natural slowing down.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

High temperatures cause water molecules to split to create hydroxyl radicals (-OH). Pores in the ringwoodite absorb the hydroxyl radicals. This traps the broken-down water inside the mineral’s molecular structure.

Not as high as you are intimating. As water boils, the bonding between o and H are broken.

 

[TinMan]

Is it? We have empirical evidence that hundreds of sedimentary layers can be laid down in days. All wee have to do is go to Mt. St. Helens to see them. And as for continental drift- we do not know the original movement and now the natural slowing down.

No, if one were to go the slopes of Mt St Hellens you might be able to find some of the volcanic ash from its 1982 eruption, most of it has washed away btutnot multiple layers. Unlike the grand canyon where you can see multiple layers of granite many different forms of limestone, Mutiple layers of shale, and 5 different kinds of sandstone.

The problem with moving tectonic plates around as you want to pretend happened is friction. spreading apart the African and the South American plates over a year would produce temperatures exceeding the surface of the sun.

 

[TinMan]

Not as high as you are intimating. As water boils, the bonding between o and H are broken.

no, boiling water just produces a change in its state from liquid to gas. the water is water whether it is ice, liquid or vapor.

 

[Taken]

When talking about things like moving contenants and thousands of sedimentary layers being laid down almost over night it is unreasonable.

Ringwoodite is a high-pressure phase of Mg2SiO4 (magnesium silicate) formed at high temperatures and pressures of the Earth's mantle between 525 and 660 km (326 and 410 mi) depth. Ringwoodite can absorb water. But it can’t absorb water in liquid, solid or gas form. High temperatures cause water molecules to split to create hydroxyl radicals (-OH). Pores in the ringwoodite absorb the hydroxyl radicals. This traps the broken-down water inside the mineral’s molecular structure.

If the hydroxyl radicals were somehow be able to be removed from the molecular structure of RIngwoodite and go immediately to the surface it would emerge at just over 5,400 degrees

Science claims discovery of an under earth Ocean, size estimate same as all Oceans we are familiar with. The ringwoodite was described in layman’s terms as a visual of rock but water saturated.
Science not particularly my forte’.
Thanks for the info.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

No, if one were to go the slopes of Mt St Hellens you might be able to find some of the volcanic ash from its 1982 eruption, most of it has washed away btutnot multiple layers. Unlike the grand canyon where you can see multiple layers of granite many different forms of limestone, Mutiple layers of shale, and 5 different kinds of sandstone.

The problem with moving tectonic plates around as you want to pretend happened is friction. spreading apart the African and the South American plates over a year would produce temperatures exceeding the surface of the sun.

You need to watch some recent videos of the effects MT. St. Helens left after it erupted and learn real facts for a change that can be tested and observed with the naked eye.

And the tectonic plates are still in motion and continental drift is still taking place! and it is not hotter than the temp of the sun despite your protest. YOu cxannot even test your statement here to even validate it! and if the plates and land masses are moving apart, floating on a bed of molten lava as they are, there would be little to no friction.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Actually the salinity of the oceans is falling and has been doing so for the last 500 million years. REf 1, Ref 2.

And that is his supposition and he is entitled to his guesses.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

no, boiling water just produces a change in its state from liquid to gas. the water is water whether it is ice, liquid or vapor.

You need to read up on hydroxyls then. Also hydroxyls are found in the troposphere which is far far cooler than the temps you hypothesized are needed to create them. Hydroxyls are formed when the bond between O and H are broken, and that can happen when yo uboil water at 212 degrees. MOst turns to vapor, but hydroxyls as well. Stop telling untruths.

 

[TinMan]

You need to watch some recent videos of the effects MT. St. Helens left after it erupted and learn real facts for a change that can be tested and observed with the naked eye.

and multiple sedimentary layers is not one of them

And the tectonic plates are still in motion and continental drift is still taking place! and it is not hotter than the temp of the sun despite your protest.

At the rate of about 1/8th an inch per year.

If we pretend that the plates were moving for the whole 40 days of the deluge that means the north American plat would have had to have moved at a rate of 170 miles per day

YOu cxannot even test your statement here to even validate it! and if the plates and land masses are moving apart, floating on a bed of molten lava as they are, there would be little to no friction.

Molten doesn't mean frictionless.
the entire surface of the earth is composed of tectonic plates, some are being moved apart like the European and North American plates some move together, some move sideways.

And yes we can observe and validate. In places where the tectonic plate are moving faster the higher the crust temperatures are.

You need to watch some recent videos of the effects MT. St. Helens left after it erupted and learn real facts for a change that can be tested and observed with the naked eye.

none of which is multiple sedimentary strata

And the tectonic plates are still in motion and continental drift is still taking place! and it is not hotter than the temp of the sun despite your protest. YOu cxannot even test your statement here to even validate it! and if the plates and land masses are moving apart, floating on a bed of molten lava as they are, there would be little to no friction.

1: the tectonic plates are moving at an average rate of about an 1/8 of an inch a year. To move tectonic plates around the planet in the time period of the flood would mean moving at over 170 miles a day. This is of course for the plates that would be moving, other plates like the Atlantic ocean plates would have to form in this amount of time.
2 molten doesn't mean frictionless. The friction coefficient of magma is 0.45–0.79 meaning when moved against the metamorphic rock of the curst they would have about the same friction as your shoes on a wood floor.
3 It can all be observed and validated. In areas where the plate are moving faster the crust temperatures are higher.


I can put out the equations used to calculate how much of a temperature increase a fast moving plate produces if you are really interested.

 

[TinMan]

And that is his supposition and he is entitled to his guesses.

no it's actually observable, no guessing

 

[TinMan]

You need to read up on hydroxyls then. Also hydroxyls are found in the troposphere which is far far cooler than the temps you hypothesized are needed to create them. Hydroxyls are formed when the bond between O and H are broken, and that can happen when yo uboil water at 212 degrees. MOst turns to vapor, but hydroxyls as well. Stop telling untruths.

if this were the case your kitchen would explode every time you made tea.

 

[Deborah_]

I don't read the Symbol Man's Bible, nor give it any regard.

Nether do I.

People who do away with the factual record of the Bible, only do so by unbelief.

I wouldn't dismiss anything from the Bible that's factual (the gospels, the historical records). But not everything in the Bible was intended to be factual, and it would be a crude distortion to interpret it that way.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

and multiple sedimentary layers is not one of them

yes it is! hundreds laid down in days,

if this were the case your kitchen would explode every time you made tea.

wrong again. Basic hydroxyls are very safe! Matter of fact they make odor removal generators using hydroxyls.

At the rate of about 1/8th an inch per year.

If we pretend that the plates were moving for the whole 40 days of the deluge that means the north American plat would have had to have moved at a rate of 170 miles per day

Well the super continent broke up after the flood so that part is moot. And how fast they moved is anybody's hypothesis. and 1/8th inch /day is about right for how inertia works.

Molten doesn't mean frictionless.
the entire surface of the earth is composed of tectonic plates, some are being moved apart like the European and North American plates some move together, some move sideways.

And yes we can observe and validate. In places where the tectonic plate are moving faster the higher the crust temperatures are.

Well then we all shall await you rpoviding the evidence to support this claim.

none of which is multiple sedimentary strata

wrong again. the carving out of the landscape by the eruption and subsequent flows left hundreds of sedimentary strata. all recorded for all to see!

1: the tectonic plates are moving at an average rate of about an 1/8 of an inch a year. To move tectonic plates around the planet in the time period of the flood would mean moving at over 170 miles a day. This is of course for the plates that would be moving, other plates like the Atlantic ocean plates would have to form in this amount of time.
2 molten doesn't mean frictionless. The friction coefficient of magma is 0.45–0.79 meaning when moved against the metamorphic rock of the curst they would have about the same friction as your shoes on a wood floor.
3 It can all be observed and validated. In areas where the plate are moving faster the crust temperatures are higher.

#2 shoes on a wood floor do not create loads of friction! Relatively speaking. I do not think one could start a fire by rubbing a shoe real hard and fast against a floor.

I can put out the equations used to calculate how much of a temperature increase a fast moving plate produces if you are really interested.

Have these equations been verified by actual real world data?

no it's actually observable, no guessing

Well then, tell me who was observing the salinity for teh first 499,000,000 years?????

 

[MatthewG]

Could be the whole world could be basin of the allotted land.

I believe something happened.