Judaizers! They Live!!!! They walk among us!!!

[Grailhunter]

Do you know what you are actually supporting and condemning?
Some pharisees came to faith and followed Christ, some blasphemed against the Holy Spirit and were lost.

Not being able to tell the two apart is a major problem.
God bless you.

I wonder if a person throws themselves in hell after picking up a sword and chopping off their own feet and hands, is there any less judgement than for those who truly rebel and hate God.

You choose to be rude. I do not deny that we are to love God and love one another is Mosaic. But if they took it seriously there would not be a need for 613 laws and they certainly did not pay much attention to love of anything. Most of the Mosaic Laws are examples of how not to be a Christian.

 

[Grailhunter]

It is slightly unclear what you are getting at.
We are called to listen and follow Jesus. Do you listen to Jesus and follow Him?

I am going to ignore this because it is silly. We all love Jesus and follow him.

 

[justbyfaith]

It is a matter of scripture that Christ kept the Mosaic Laws perfectly.

Actually, Jesus broke the sabbath (John 5:17-18). And I am also not certain that He wore tzitzit and tallit and tefilin from the moment He was born to the moment of His death. He couldn't have: He was practically naked while being crucified.

Which only goes to show that the change in law (Hebrews 7:12) had already taken place by the time John 5:17-18 rolled around.

Jesus was High Priest according to the order of Melchizedec: and as such, His priesthood was not based on a carnal commandment but after the power of an endless life. Being the Son of God, Jesus is the Lord of the sabbath. And therefore He did not sin in breaking it.

We can take it further and state that Jesus Himself was not bound to the letter but was obedient to the spirit of the law. We follow His example therefore when we take to heart such verses as Romans 7:6 and 2 Corinthians 3:6.

Jesus is love. So everything He does is in fulfillment of the law; whether He violates the letter or not. It is the spirit that matters and gives life: the flesh profits nothing: and the letter kills.

 

[Waiting on him]

Yes. Agree. Hebrews 10:24 And let us consider one another to provoke unto love and to good works:

How often do we taste fruit and call good what is not good? In fact it is poison and one needs to supernaturally be able to drink poison and not be harmed (nor hurt) by drinking it in, or the result is death.

I think I understand what you are saying...correct me if I am wrong...speaking of the two great commandments of Christ....Love God and love thy neighbor. These two cover the whole of Mosaic Law and in all ways are superior. One of the differences and again only one the differences is that the Jews always found ways around the Laws and came up with teaching that they applied to others, not them. But there is no way around the Laws of Christ. Not written laws, but rather beliefs, concepts and application of love. Love God, love one another, do all things in love. The Mosaic Laws cannot hold a candle to the Teachings of Christ.

His love was spilt out in deed not word.

 

[Grailhunter]

Actually, Jesus broke the sabbath (John 5:18). And I am also not certain that He wore tzitzit and tallit and tefilin from the moment He was born to the moment of His death. He couldn't have: He was practically naked while being crucified.

Which only goes to show that the change in law (Hebrews 7:12) had already taken place when John 5:18 rolled around.

Jesus was High Priest according to the order of Melchizedec: and as such, His priesthood was not based on a carnal commandment but after the power of an endless life. Being the Son of God, Jesus is the Lord of the sabbath. And therefore He did not sin in breaking it.

We can take it further and state that Jesus Himself was not bound to the letter but was obedient to the spirit of the law. We follow His example therefore when we take to heart such verses as Romans 7:6 and 1 Corinthians 3:6.

Jesus is love. So everything He does is in fulfillment of the law; whether He violates the letter or not. It is the spirit that matters and gives life: the flesh profits nothing: and the letter kills.

That being true, still debate there is on Christ's perfect adherence. We can both go through and sight different things that the Jews called Him on different things He did. He was in fact a High Priest of the order of Melchizedek. And I know you know all that. lol

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Reminds me of:

1Co 13:1, Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not charity, I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal.
1Co 13:2, And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing.
1Co 13:3, And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing.

Love that passage. Yes, it reminds me of it too! Give that love justbyfaith. The Mercy which you Hope to receive.

 

[Waiting on him]

Jesus could have been citing them on every law Moses ever pinned, all the way up the hill, but He didn’t???

 

[Waiting on him]

Too all the Judaizers , have a good look this is love in deed. ^^^^

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Sorry, I am not calling them what I will, they are from the law of Moses, which you definitively said was from Jesus and was superior to the law of Moses, which is clearly not true. Do you know the difference between saying something that is not true, finding it not to be true and then side stepping it? This is lying, which is not something associated with Gods people or His ways.

I remember pointing out a mistake a sister in Christ had made, and she got very upset and apologised for their oversight. These oversights really matter because our whole salvation relies on these points and their foundation. It is no minor point. The foundation of the law and the prophets is the foundation of the gospel and Jesus's message, our whole salvation and the Kingdom of Heaven. So you cannot get more foundational than this, over which the elect have no compromise. God bless you

Question still being if we can’t keep the first two...what authority is there to even mention or debate the rest. Take here...heard it said so many times this is a board and not a place for nonbelievers. If they came here ...what would they read? Would they run from those speaking of love with empty vain words ... with no power. The only power being a turn off on anything Christ. It is said this is different from church. Different from “church” where we dress up, clean up, and watch our mouth and actions as we are “in” church and it is to be expected. Are we not ALWAYS to be before God. Is it to our core ...a turning from malice; or is it only when we attend certain places where it is to be expected. What about in a bar? Scary thing is ...here on this site might be the only time the facade comes down and the truth comes loudly out. Again, the First two...or what authority do we have to speak of anything else.

 

[FollowHim]

Question still being if we can’t keep the first two...what authority is there to even mention or debate the rest. Take here...heard it said so many times this is a board and not a place for nonbelievers. If they came here ...what would they read? Would they run from those speaking of love with empty vain words ... with no power. The only power being a turn off on anything Christ. It is said this is different from church. Different from “church” where we dress up, clean up, and watch our mouth and actions as we are “in” church and it is to be expected. Are we not ALWAYS to be before God. Is it to our core ...a turning from malice; or is it only when we attend certain places where it is to be expected. What about in a bar? Scary thing is ...here on this site might be the only time the facade comes down and the truth comes loudly out. Again, the First two...or what authority do we have to speak of anything else.

We can keep the first two. That is why Jesus came. But the question is when we fail, do we wish to know why and work it through or just accept failure as our definition?

 

[VictoryinJesus]

We can keep the first two. That is why Jesus came. But the question is when we fail, do we wish to know why and work it through or just accept failure as our definition?

The flesh is weak, but the Spirit is willing. Not failure: Greater is He that is in you, than he that is in the world. How else are the Sons of God made manifest?

 

[Waiting on him]

Expounding the law is not keeping the law

 

[justbyfaith]

Love that passage. Yes, it reminds me of it too! Give that love justbyfaith. The Mercy which you Hope to receive.

Amen, I am learning to do that, even in most recent days, in which I have noticed myself falling short of what I would like to be.

 

[FollowHim]

The flesh is weak, but the Spirit is willing. Not failure: Greater is He that is in you, than he that is in the world. How else are the Sons of God made manifest?

So do you believe we grow into perfection, maturity, or stay as we are struggling and not achieving or knowing how Christ walked?

 

[Enoch111]

Jesus could have been citing them on every law Moses ever pinned, all the way up the hill, but He didn’t???

Jesus was under the Law until the day that He died. Christ fully upheld the Law of Moses as given by Himself to Moses. What He also did was to show the Jews that their rabbis had made the traditions of men supercede the Word of God.

 

[Enoch111]

So do you believe we grow into perfection, maturity, or stay as we are struggling and not achieving or knowing how Christ walked?

We hear a lot about *struggling* today. But Christians were never meant to be struggling in order to live out the Christian life. That is why the Holy Spirit was given to each one as a GIFT.

 

[Truth]

I am not surprised nor ignorant of what is happening with Israel. God spoke to me a year ago and told me to keep my eyes on Israel.....and there is much to see! Prophesy being fulfilled rapidly ....Jerusalem being restored to this nation was huge!
Gentiles are not required to convert to Judaism because the have been converted to Christ.
And as far as what I said about God will provoke them to jealousy by the salvation of the Gentiles...it is written in His Word.
At the time the Apostles were preaching the Gospel of Jesus the Jewish people were provoked to jealousy because the Gentiles were uncircumcised and under Jewish law uncircumcised carried the meaning of unclean.
But Paul corrects them and assures them neither circumcision nor uncircumcision mattered....it was believing on Jesus is what must be the main point.
We also can read through various scriptures and see that there are more than one kind of circumcision....the heart, the mind and the spiritm

Circumcision was one of the first Covenants made with Abraham, it only had to do with the Land. as far as what Paul did concerning these Jews that were pushing circumcision, they were Pharisees that had come to the Faith, they just couldn't shake their Oral Laws, so they were trying to circumvent the Truth and enforce their flaming hoops!
Consider this, when reading the Gospels when you come to the word Jew or Jews, replace it with Pharisees. most of the time when Jew or Jews is used it is relating to the Pharisees, or the Religious Leader of that time.
Remember during Our Savior's Ministry It was Jews that followed Him, it was Jews that He healed, it was a Majority of Jews when He feed the 5000, and after that 4000, So we can not Lump all Jews together. The Conflict was always with the Religious Leaders-Pharisees not the common people!

 

[justbyfaith]

Jesus was under the Law until the day that He died. Christ fully upheld the Law of Moses as given by Himself to Moses. What He also did was to show the Jews that their rabbis had made the traditions of men supercede the Word of God.

Actually, Jesus broke the sabbath (John 5:17-18). And I am also not certain that He wore tzitzit and tallit and tefilin from the moment He was born to the moment of His death. He couldn't have: He was practically naked while being crucified.

Which only goes to show that the change in law (Hebrews 7:12) had already taken place by the time John 5:17-18 rolled around.

Jesus was High Priest according to the order of Melchizedec: and as such, His priesthood was not based on a carnal commandment but after the power of an endless life. Being the Son of God, Jesus is the Lord of the sabbath. And therefore He did not sin in breaking it.

We can take it further and state that Jesus Himself was not bound to the letter but was obedient to the spirit of the law. We follow His example therefore when we take to heart such verses as Romans 7:6 and 2 Corinthians 3:6.

Jesus is love. So everything He does is in fulfillment of the law; whether He violates the letter or not. It is the spirit that matters and gives life: the flesh profits nothing: and the letter kills.

 

[VictoryinJesus]

So do you believe we grow into perfection, maturity, or stay as we are struggling and not achieving or knowing how Christ walked?

Doesn’t matter what I think. But(IMO) you could not even ask about perfection without the New and Better. Colossians 3:14 And above all these things put on charity, which is the bond of perfectness.

What was the fruit of the Pharisees...was it charity or the bond of perfectness? Did they distract from: worship God? Revelation 19:10 And I fell at his feet to worship him. And he said unto me, See thou do it not: I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.

Revelation 22:9
[9] Then saith he unto me, See thou do it not: for I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren the prophets, and of them which keep the sayings of this book: worship God.

The second command is like unto the First; in the keeping of the second depends upon the First. Love God and love neighbour as you love yourself. Is this: Worship God. Is this keeping His sayings? Again, if those are neglected is there any authority to even consider the rest?

Acts 10:25-26
[25] And as Peter was coming in, Cornelius met him, and fell down at his feet, and worshipped him. [26] But Peter took him up, saying, Stand up; I myself also am a man.

 

[brakelite]

Concerning the first two commands in arguing all the other commandments....question being are the first two kept? How much time is spent on insisting and keeping them all, even the ten ...in asserting them of a certainty, when yet the first two go neglected and not kept. Would that not be insane in focusing always all the attention on all the other commandments ...while not even keeping the first two? He said the second commandment is like unto the First, in keeping the second is BECAUSE of keeping the first in Love God. Love your neighbour as you love yourself. The one wanting to justify himself asked Him...well...who is my neighbour? It is not a loop-hole to weasel through. surely God didn’t mean a geographical location only in the neighboring home next to yours...but enveloped All created in His image. He said you will know by the fruit manifested, yet that fruit is ignored even here. Totally ignore the first two commands as the Pharisees ignored them...going for the arguing of the whole ten ...yet failing the first two that fulfill the rest. Wasted effort when the first two have already spoken ...there is no fruit.

If you are loving God and your neighbour as you ought, you are already keeping the ten. So love fulfills the law.
If you are not keeping God's commandments, then you are not loving.
KJV 1 John 2
To Know God Is to Obey
3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
5 But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him.