Once Saved Always Saved Garbage Teaching!!

[Nondenom40]

OSAS is a false teaching embraced by many who seek to obtain by dead faith that which can only be obtained by living faith: eternal life.

Not to beat a dead horse but again, i don't know anyone who currently believes in eternal security of the believer (as i do) and at the same time think they can sit on the couch binging on netflix until they die because in their minds their ticket to heaven has been punched.

On the contrary. Those that i see regularly are not only fruit producing but very conscious of the lack of fruit in our lives. Its the ' i know i could have done more ' scenario. And one more thing. Eternal life isn't obtained by a 'living faith'. As though you are working your tail off for the kingdom and when you die then and only then do you know if you did enough. A living faith is simply proof of that life of God inside us. They will know us by our fruit. Fruit is the evidence of the saved, its not the cause.

 

[CharismaticLady]

I guess you didn't read everything I posted. I made it clear (as do the scriptures) that "Whoever abides in Him does not sin." 1 John 3:6.

That means no sins "present and future" by those "whoever abide in Him."

Is that not clear?

That is the same thing I was saying to Dove, and you said I wasn't scriptural. I think you are confused. You came in to where I'm asking Dove questions to help him reason out why adding "present and future" is wrong. I don't say that, he does.

Now if you continue to argue with me on this, then I'll know there is a spirit of Leviathan at work - the twisting serpent. Rebuke it Scott! We are actually on the same page.

 

[CharismaticLady]

dats ur problem, self teaching!! and u wont humble urself, u think u know it all

Did I write that Scripture? Do you think I'm Peter?

 

[justbyfaith]

OK.
So then how do we reconcile that JESUS said belief could be lost....
belief could be temporary.

Paul also confirmed this.
I'll post scripture ONLY if you respond directly to it.
I'm getting tired of posting scripture which goes unnoticed....

For example, how do YOU interpret Luke 8:13?
JESUS SAID the person BELIEVES TEMPORARILY
and then FALLS AWAY.

The answer (as I have mentioned before) is that there are two types of faith: 1) mental assent to the tenets of the gospel, which is a nominal, lukewarm, or shallow faith. Even living and saving faith requires mental assent. 2) A heart faith that is unto righteousness (Romans 10:10) and the enduring to the end (Hebrews 3:6, Hebrews 3:14, Matthew 10:22, Matthew 24:13).

We can have faith only in our mind, or we can allow it to trickle down into our hearts. It is only faith that reaches the heart that results in assured everlasting life.

If it is only in the mind, then a man can certainly fall away. Thus Luke 8:13 is true, in that it speaks of a faith that has not yet reached the heart; but is only in the mind.

 

[justbyfaith]

dats ur problem, self teaching!! and u wont humble urself, u think u know it all

Everyone who studies the word gets some of their teaching from Bible teachers.

And of course there is absolutely nothing wrong with being a Berean about what you are being taught (Acts 17:10-11).

 

[Zachary]

We're human,,,I'll bet we've all doubted at one time or another.

If you mean to doubt the existence of God, and that He loves me ...
I vote a great big "NO!" ...
For me, NO doubting whatsoever, whatever might come my way!
However, I have known a BAC who was very upset with God for some time!
.

 

[Zachary]

self teaching!!

Yes, by believing the Scriptures ...

At the moment you were born-again …
you were only forgiven of the sins you had committed up to that point in time!
“For he who lacks these things is shortsighted, even to blindness,
and has forgotten that he was cleansed from his OLD sins.
Therefore, brethren, be even more diligent to make your call
and election sure, for IF you do these things you will never stumble;
for so an entrance will be supplied to you abundantly into the everlasting
kingdom of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.” (2 Peter 1:9-11, NKJV)
“OLD sins” is also in the KJV, RSV, NLT, AMP

“having forgotten his purification from his FORMER sins.” (2 Peter 1:9, NASB)
“FORMER sins” is also in the ESV

“forgetting that they have been cleansed from their PAST sins.” (2 Pet 1:9, NIV)
“PAST sins” is also in the HCSB

And one of my favorite "hidden" ones …

“… the pain (from his rebuke) caused you to repent and change your ways.
It was the kind of sorrow God wants His people to have, so you were not
harmed by us in any way. For the kind of sorrow God wants us to experience
leads us away from sin and results in salvation. … worldly sorrow, which lacks
repentance, results in spiritual (eternal) death.” (2 Corinthians 7:8-10, NLT)
Paul wrote this to the Corinthian church concerning his words of rebuke
in 1 Corinthians that he had sent to them concerning some particular sin(s).
They really needed to be sorrowful and repent.
.

 

[Zachary]

All this just goes to show that you simply do not understand salvation.

All this just goes to show that you simply do not understand
any of the MANY dire warnings in the NT (and the Gospels)!
Wake Up!
.

 

[Zachary]

There are persons on these forums that will right out tell you that they can live as they want to and still be saved. THIS IS WRONG....and this is one
of the curses that OSAS has brought about...the curse of a false sense of security....which to you means nothing...but to some may cause their
loss of salvation since God does require obedience to salvation.
Obedience of faith...Romans 1:5

AMEN, brother!
.

 

[ScottA]

Then why say our future sins are forgiven, if you don't believe that yourself. Do you know that only our past sins are cleansed? Adding to scripture "present and future sin" are already forgiven such as future murder, is error. And even you know that.

That is the same thing I was saying to Dove, and you said I wasn't scriptural. I think you are confused. You came in to where I'm asking Dove questions to help him reason out why adding "present and future" is wrong. I don't say that, he does.

Now if you continue to argue with me on this, then I'll know there is a spirit of Leviathan at work - the twisting serpent. Rebuke it Scott! We are actually on the same page.

I didn't do anything of the sort. I just quoted you (above) and told you it was not biblical.

 

[CharismaticLady]

I didn't do anything of the sort. I just quoted you (above) and told you it was not biblical.

You are still arguing. I quoted Peter who said our OLD SINS are cleansed. Do you disagree with Peter, or just me quoting him?

2 Peter 1:9 For he who lacks these things is shortsighted, even to blindness, and has forgotten that he was cleansed from his old sins? What other sins are there, except what we would commit in the present or future, that 1 John 3:9 says we don't commit. There is either a Leviathan spirit at work, or a Chauvinist spirit at work here - or both.

From that point we shouldn't be committing any present and future sins, so what problem do you have with that? Do you believe as some do that as we continue committing sins they are forgiven? If so, then, no, we are not on the same page.

(I REBUKE YOU, SPIRITS OF LEVIATHAN AND MALE DOMINATION IN THE NAME OF JESUS!)

 

[ScottA]

You are still arguing. I quoted Peter who said our OLD SINS are cleansed. Do you disagree with Peter, or just me quoting him?

2 Peter 1:9 For he who lacks these things is shortsighted, even to blindness, and has forgotten that he was cleansed from his old sins? What other sins are there, except what we would commit in the present or future, that 1 John 3:9 says we don't commit. There is either a Leviathan spirit at work, or a Chauvinist spirit at work here - or both.

From that point we shouldn't be committing any present and future sins, so what problem do you have with that? Do you believe as some do that as we continue committing sins they are forgiven? If so, then, no, we are not on the same page.

(I REBUKE YOU, SPIRITS OF LEVIATHAN AND MALE DOMINATION IN THE NAME OF JESUS!)

You have a real problem.

I quoted you in biblical untruth (post 230 and 310), (not 2 Peter 1:9), and now you want to call me names and accursed.

You're acting wacko!

It's all here, anyone can read it an know the truth.

 

[ScottA]

@Nancy ... You should pay more attention to what you are "Like"ing (post 311).

 

[Nancy]

@Nancy ... You should pay more attention to what you are "Like"ing (post 311).

You are correct It has been "un-liked".
"If we say we have no sin..." We are NOT Jesus Christ the ONLY "perfect in all His ways" human.

 

[Zachary]

You (CL) have a real problem.
You're acting wacko!

Look, she's in her 70's ... please give her a break!
You think you have problems ...
on another forum, she got confused and called me a liar.
.

 

[GodsGrace]

The answer (as I have mentioned before) is that there are two types of faith: 1) mental assent to the tenets of the gospel, which is a nominal, lukewarm, or shallow faith. Even living and saving faith requires mental assent. 2) A heart faith that is unto righteousness (Romans 10:10) and the enduring to the end (Hebrews 3:6, Hebrews 3:14, Matthew 10:22, Matthew 24:13).

We can have faith only in our mind, or we can allow it to trickle down into our hearts. It is only faith that reaches the heart that results in assured everlasting life.

If it is only in the mind, then a man can certainly fall away. Thus Luke 8:13 is true, in that it speaks of a faith that has not yet reached the heart; but is only in the mind.

You also have said this before....
But Jesus did not speak of the mind or the heart...
HE said
1. They receive the word with joy.
2. They have no firm root.
3. They believe for a while.
4. They fall away.

One that believes only with the mind does not experience joy.
Mark 4:17 says the same....they remain only for a season.
They have no root --- this could mean that their belief was not deep enough, or they did not learn their faith, or who knows what else.

But Jesus says that they were believers for a while...and one must be a believer in Him in order to be saved. THEN, for whatever trial or tribulation, they fell away.

Doesn't this mean that one CAN fall away?

Let's assume you are even right about this...there's so much scripture that points to
conditional eternal security.

See Mathew 5:13

1. We are the salt of the earth.
2. The salt has become tasteless.
3. How can it become salty AGAIN.
4. It is good for nothing ANYMORE..except to be trampled underfoot.

The above also points to the possibility that we can lose our saltiness.

 

[GodsGrace]

If you mean to doubt the existence of God, and that He loves me ...
I vote a great big "NO!" ...
For me, NO doubting whatsoever, whatever might come my way!
However, I have known a BAC who was very upset with God for some time!
.

I don't think a BELIEVER doubts that God exists!
That would be an atheist, right?

If anyone here has had a doubt, they'll know what I'm talking about.
And if a person has never had a doubt, then I'm happy for them.

I like to remember Romans 8:28
God works all things for our good...one way or another.

 

[FollowHim]

Not to beat a dead horse but again, i don't know anyone who currently believes in eternal security of the believer (as i do) and at the same time think they can sit on the couch binging on netflix until they die because in their minds their ticket to heaven has been punched.

On the contrary. Those that i see regularly are not only fruit producing but very conscious of the lack of fruit in our lives. Its the ' i know i could have done more ' scenario. And one more thing. Eternal life isn't obtained by a 'living faith'. As though you are working your tail off for the kingdom and when you die then and only then do you know if you did enough. A living faith is simply proof of that life of God inside us. They will know us by our fruit. Fruit is the evidence of the saved, its not the cause.

I have spent years, literally talking to a group who very much believe they can have no fruit and still be saved.
They do so far as to say if you believe anything you do is part of being accepted by God, then that is adding to
Christs work, so devaluing its worth and beauty.

To suggest Jesus said fruitless trees are doomed is for them heresy and self righteous justification and the opposite
of the gospel. They will get so angry if they were allowed it would be a torrent of expletives.

And this is why I understand the fruit of such a belief and also the blindness involved. One simple reason why I oppose
such things is doing evil and harming others is the opposite of love and truly grievous, yet to these folk evil is not relevant,
but rather daring to suggest man could be called worthy in Christ and walk in His ways. They regard this as anti-Christ, and
treat brothers and sisters in Christ as the enemy for testifying to the work of the Lord in their hearts.

I had a conversation on the principle a believer went and murdered someone and left the faith, in their eyes they are still
saved and secure. I exposed one believer who was abusive and swearing, a real gun toting right winger, and there view
was this was fine, acceptable to the Lord because their sin was forgiven past present and future. For exposing this believer
I was banned from the site. So truth, honesty, integrity and justice are simply no longer relevant to these folk.

 

[Zachary]

For exposing this believer I was banned from the site.

You should try the Pentecostal Oneness site.
No Trinity ... they reject the John 1 verses ... and all the others also!
.

 

[CharismaticLady]

You have a real problem.

I quoted you in biblical untruth (post 230 and 310), (not 2 Peter 1:9), and now you want to call me names and accursed.

You're acting wacko!

It's all here, anyone can read it an know the truth.

I rebuked the spirits controlling you, not you. You and I believe the same thing, and yet the twisting spirit is making everything I'm saying seem twisted in your thinking. I'm not the one who is wacko. You need to go back further than your first post to me and see for yourself my conversation with Dove. But first you are going to have to rebuke those spirits yourself.