Rapture - I would be afraid not to believe in one

[rockytopva]

If I had to pick an end time date I would go, word by word, with the scientist, Isaac Newton...

"And I heard the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand unto heaven, and sware by him that liveth for ever that it shall be for a time, times, and an half. " - Daniel 12:7

From a folio cataloged as Yahuda MS 7.3g, f. 13v:

"So then the time times & half a time are 42 months or 1260 days or three years & an half, reckoning twelve months to a year & 30 days to a month as was done in the Calendar of the primitive year. And the days of short lived Beasts being put for the years of lived kingdoms, the period of 1260 days, if dated from the complete conquest of the three kings A.C. 800, will end A.C. 2060." - Isaac Newton

As Charlemagne was crowned king on December 25, 800 by Pope Leo the III so the day of Christ's coming will be on Christmas Day, 2060. If the rapture of the saints (1 Thessalonians 4:16-17) occurs seven years before the time of Christ’s coming the date of the rapture 12.25 2053. However Isaac Newton notes

"It may end later, but I see no reason for its ending sooner. This I mention not to assert when the time of the end shall be, but to put a stop to the rash conjectures of fancifull men who are frequently predicting the time of the end, & by doing so bring the sacred prophesies into discredit as often as their predictions fail. Christ comes as a thief in the night, & it is not for us to know the times & seasons which God hath put into his own breast." - Isaac Newton

And this know, that if the goodman of the house had known what hour the thief would come, he would have watched, and not have suffered his house to be broken through. Be ye therefore ready also: for the Son of man cometh at an hour when ye think not. - Luke 12:39-40

I have fought a good fight, I have finished my course, I have kept the faith: Henceforth there is laid up for me a crown of righteousness, which the Lord, the righteous judge, shall give me at that day: and not to me only, but unto all them also that love his appearing. - 2 Timothy 4:7-8

If I were not looking for Christ to come at any time… And he did just that… I would be afraid as punishment I would be left behind.

 

[Randy Kluth]

If I had to pick an end time date I would go, word by word, with the scientist, Isaac Newton...

"And I heard the man clothed in linen, which was upon the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand unto heaven, and sware by him that liveth for ever that it shall be for a time, times, and an half. " - Daniel 12:7

From a folio cataloged as Yahuda MS 7.3g, f. 13v:

"So then the time times & half a time are 42 months or 1260 days or three years & an half, reckoning twelve months to a year & 30 days to a month as was done in the Calendar of the primitive year. And the days of short lived Beasts being put for the years of lived kingdoms, the period of 1260 days, if dated from the complete conquest of the three kings A.C. 800, will end A.C. 2060." - Isaac Newton

This kind of date-setting is garbage, and wastes everybody's time, when we *know* that we were told we won't know the day and the hour. Furthermore, as famous and as smart as Isaac Newton was, he was more a scientist than a theologian. His side interest in prophecy does not make him an expert. If he rejected the Trinity are you going to believe him because he is, well, Sir Isaac Newton?

In fact, he was completely wrong in using a day-year theory with respect to the 1260 days. They are quite literal--the Antichrist will rule, not for 1260 years, but only for 1260 days. That is not, I believe determining when he will die, but only when he will reign supreme, and unopposed.

In the end, Antichrist will have reigned supreme only a very short 3.5 years. Christ has let Antichrists in history come and go, but they always meet their Maker in the end. Antichrist will do the same.

 

[farouk]

Clearly the entity involved in the linkage between the Lord's Supper and the Lord's coming mentioned in 1 Cor, 11:26 is the church.

 

[rockytopva]

This kind of date-setting is garbage, and wastes everybody's time, when we *know* that we were told we won't know the day and the hour. Furthermore, as famous and as smart as Isaac Newton was, he was more a scientist than a theologian. His side interest in prophecy does not make him an expert. If he rejected the Trinity are you going to believe him because he is, well, Sir Isaac Newton?

In fact, he was completely wrong in using a day-year theory with respect to the 1260 days. They are quite literal--the Antichrist will rule, not for 1260 years, but only for 1260 days. That is not, I believe determining when he will die, but only when he will reign supreme, and unopposed.

In the end, Antichrist will have reigned supreme only a very short 3.5 years. Christ has let Antichrists in history come and go, but they always meet their Maker in the end. Antichrist will do the same.

Please read the entire quote.. "It may end later, but I see no reason for its ending sooner. This I mention not to assert when the time of the end shall be, but to put a stop to the rash conjectures of fancifull men who are frequently predicting the time of the end, & by doing so bring the sacred prophesies into discredit as often as their predictions fail. Christ comes as a thief in the night, & it is not for us to know the times & seasons which God hath put into his own breast." - Isaac Newton

So... We are trying to avoid the Harold Camping type stuff. I live as though Christ could come today. Also understanding it could still be decades down the road.

 

[shortangel]

good points here

 

[Rockerduck]

Let's review these verses.

This verse is for the unsaved
1 Thessalonians 5:2 - For you yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so comes as a thief in the night

This verse is for the Elect
1 Thessalonians 5:4 - but you, brethren, are not in darkness, so that this Day should overtake you as a thief

We are in the light, and in Christ. and we should know the signs of His coming better than the unsaved world.

 

[Keraz]

If I had to pick an end time date I would go, word by word, with the scientist, Isaac Newton...

It was impossible for Newton to get to the truth of Bible Prophecy. He was a wise and learned man. Matthew 11:25-26 says: These things are hidden from the wise and learned........

Trying to fit the times into the Middle Ages and getting a date of 2060, is crazy.
Do people really think the world will just go on as it is today for another 38 years?

As for the belief of a 'rapture to heaven', my best suggestion is for people to have a plan B, what to do when things get rough and I'm still here.

 

[Randy Kluth]

Please read the entire quote.. "It may end later, but I see no reason for its ending sooner. This I mention not to assert when the time of the end shall be, but to put a stop to the rash conjectures of fancifull men who are frequently predicting the time of the end, & by doing so bring the sacred prophesies into discredit as often as their predictions fail. Christ comes as a thief in the night, & it is not for us to know the times & seasons which God hath put into his own breast." - Isaac Newton

So... We are trying to avoid the Harold Camping type stuff. I live as though Christ could come today. Also understanding it could still be decades down the road.

I actually looked Newton up to be sure what he believed on this earlier. Yes, he had a caveat, but what good is that if he initially gives an outline of when Christ will Return? That is bound to start another round of planning?

So I don't fault him for doing some speculating. But it's a bit too centered on predicting the exact year and day of Christ's return, even though he seems to backtrack from that. It's really double-minded.

I do think we can know the general season of Christ's return, if that's what his aim was? We should be able to actually identify the Antichrist when he comes, though I knew a Bible teacher who thought Hitler was the Antichrist. Who would blame her?

But the book of Revelation was given us so that we could identify any Antichrist and especially the final one. What we were not given is a time frame for his coming, the beginning of his unholy reign. If God did not supply that, who is Isaac Newton to go on a hunt to find one? I guess a genius-mathematician just can't help himself?

Anyway, his use of "1260 days" is wrong, since it is also stated as 3.5 years and 42 months. That should make it pretty clear--that and the fact other 3.5 year periods figured in history with figures that prefigured Antichrist, such as Antiochus 4.

But thanks for offering some balance to this.

 

[Keraz]

We are in the light, and in Christ. and we should know the signs of His coming better than the unsaved world.

From what I see, this is not the case. Secular people and governments are aware of imminent, tremendous world changes. Christians are ignorant and confused, or just simply refuse to even discuss the end time prophesies.
Belief in a 'rapture to heaven', is their default stance. Why worry, if you're not going to be here?

That the 'rapture' is a false theory, is proved by how the holy people of God are here when they are conquered by the 'beast'. Daniel 7:25 Revelation 13:5-7
Half of the faithful Christian peoples will be kept safe for that 1280 day period, Revelation 12:14, but the other half, who violated the Covenant', Daniel 11:32, must remain; Revelation 12:17 Paralleled by Zechariah 14:1-2

 

[rockytopva]

And to recall a scripture...

Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh. - Matthew 24:44

I can imagine...

Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. - 1 Thessalonians 4:17

I can imagine all of us being gathered together in the clouds and saying amongst ourselves... I never would have thought it would have been today!

 

[Keraz]

Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. - 1 Thessalonians 4:17

This happens, of course: AFTER all the things Prophesied from Revelation 6:12 to Revelation 19:19, have taken place,
those who remain..... will be the people who survive the persecution of the 'beast'.

 

[rockytopva]

This happens, of course: AFTER all the things Prophesied from Revelation 6:12 to Revelation 19:19, have taken place,
those who remain..... will be the people who survive the persecution of the 'beast'.

Then... Christ comes not as a thief as the return date would be rather obvious!

 

[rockytopva]

The key to a wonderful spirituality...

And this know, that if the goodman of the house had known what hour the thief would come, he would have watched, and not have suffered his house to be broken through. Be ye therefore ready also: for the Son of man cometh at an hour when ye think not. - Luke 12:39-40

I find when one anticipates possibilities of the coming of Christ as something that can occur at anytime... A wonderful spirituality follows.