Revelation 13:12 says "everyone on earth, will be forced to worship the beast", does that mean everyone on earth needs to repent? (refuse to repent?)

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Gottservant

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Hi there,

So I took a very little interpretation of Revelation 13:12 and I came to the conclusion, that since I am on Earth and at war with the sin in my members (as Paul says in the letters), I am at the very least going to be tempted to worship the beast. Now, I thought about it and thought about it, and I came to the conclusion that "I can't deny that it is tempting to worship the beast" (I speak out of a love for the world, as God has). From this, the Holy Spirit was able to convict me, that if I truly want to worship the beast, I should repent. So now that is my basic stance, on where the rest of the world sits in relationship to worshipping the beast: they need to repent (just as I did, or more).

What I won't tolerate, is the Devil coming to me again and again, saying "worship the Beast more and more!" No, and this is the stance I think all my Christian brothers and sisters should take: I have dealt with my sin, in my desire to worship the Beast and have claimed the forgiveness of God through the blood of Jesus, in His Name Amen. After that, the Devil has nothing more he can say.

Now what I am not saying is "I can take the mark of the anti-christ and just repent of the sin, while I still have the mark" No! Cut the mark out of your forehead or out of your forearm, if you have it. I am not condemning you, I am saying don't put yourself in a position where you have to condemn yourself. This is about reaching people, who don't think there is any sin, in adding to the desire to worship the anti-christ and identifying with perpetual sin. The Lord knows whom He can save and whom He cannot. Let us not abuse this.

The time is not far from at hand (they have designed the mark, already, it has just not been enforced) and the world is ready to forget the tribulation that has been on the Earth from the beginning. It will be a blessing that the world forgets the danger of the old world, because it will not think to threaten us, but this is precisely the complacency that the Devil will seek to take advantage of, which is why we must be absolutely certain we don't continue to worship the beast or be in a position on earth where we have no foundation against it.

I wholly agree that the Holy Spirit is able to protect us against the temptation to worship the beast, if that's who you want to trust. But that is the same Holy Spirit that said "don't come to the altar, while your brother has something against you; first reconcile yourself to your brother and then come to the altar (gospels, from memory). If you are going to "just" trust the Holy Spirit (which is good), be sure that you praise God, for being able to trust the Holy Spirit. Be sure that you know how to lock the door - as Lot had to, in the days of Sodom and Gamorrah. That's what Jesus said: "remember Lot's wife". Be sure you are penitent about the distance between you and the world. Revelation 13:12 says "if you are on Earth, you will be forced to worship" as believers, your interpretation of that should be that "if you want to leave Earth, and you haven't properly resisted the temptation: you need to repent".

Heaven may dwell in you, but that is precisely what they want to kill.

May God have mercy on our souls.
 

Brakelite

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Hi there,

So I took a very little interpretation of Revelation 13:12 and I came to the conclusion, that since I am on Earth and at war with the sin in my members (as Paul says in the letters), I am at the very least going to be tempted to worship the beast. Now, I thought about it and thought about it, and I came to the conclusion that "I can't deny that it is tempting to worship the beast" (I speak out of a love for the world, as God has). From this, the Holy Spirit was able to convict me, that if I truly want to worship the beast, I should repent. So now that is my basic stance, on where the rest of the world sits in relationship to worshipping the beast: they need to repent (just as I did, or more).

What I won't tolerate, is the Devil coming to me again and again, saying "worship the Beast more and more!" No, and this is the stance I think all my Christian brothers and sisters should take: I have dealt with my sin, in my desire to worship the Beast and have claimed the forgiveness of God through the blood of Jesus, in His Name Amen. After that, the Devil has nothing more he can say.

Now what I am not saying is "I can take the mark of the anti-christ and just repent of the sin, while I still have the mark" No! Cut the mark out of your forehead or out of your forearm, if you have it. I am not condemning you, I am saying don't put yourself in a position where you have to condemn yourself. This is about reaching people, who don't think there is any sin, in adding to the desire to worship the anti-christ and identifying with perpetual sin. The Lord knows whom He can save and whom He cannot. Let us not abuse this.

The time is not far from at hand (they have designed the mark, already, it has just not been enforced) and the world is ready to forget the tribulation that has been on the Earth from the beginning. It will be a blessing that the world forgets the danger of the old world, because it will not think to threaten us, but this is precisely the complacency that the Devil will seek to take advantage of, which is why we must be absolutely certain we don't continue to worship the beast or be in a position on earth where we have no foundation against it.

I wholly agree that the Holy Spirit is able to protect us against the temptation to worship the beast, if that's who you want to trust. But that is the same Holy Spirit that said "don't come to the altar, while your brother has something against you; first reconcile yourself to your brother and then come to the altar (gospels, from memory). If you are going to "just" trust the Holy Spirit (which is good), be sure that you praise God, for being able to trust the Holy Spirit. Be sure that you know how to lock the door - as Lot had to, in the days of Sodom and Gamorrah. That's what Jesus said: "remember Lot's wife". Be sure you are penitent about the distance between you and the world. Revelation 13:12 says "if you are on Earth, you will be forced to worship" as believers, your interpretation of that should be that "if you want to leave Earth, and you haven't properly resisted the temptation: you need to repent".

Heaven may dwell in you, but that is precisely what they want to kill.

May God have mercy on our souls.
I believe you would find it easier once you understand what the beast across is in that particular section of Scripture. (As you would be aware, there are many beasts, rising up at different times and different places. )
So, first understand what this particular beast represents, get that settled in your mind, and take it from there.

“11 And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon. 12 And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him, and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed. 13 And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men, 14 And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live. 15 And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed. 16 And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads: 17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name. ”
Revelation 13:11-17

Note there are two beasts, each having a different work to do, and only one which you are to worship. This one...

“1 And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy. 2 And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority. 3 And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast. 4 And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him? 5 And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months. 6 And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven. 7 And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations. 8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world. ”
Revelation 13:1-8 KJV
 
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ScottA

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Hi there,

So I took a very little interpretation of Revelation 13:12 and I came to the conclusion, that since I am on Earth and at war with the sin in my members (as Paul says in the letters), I am at the very least going to be tempted to worship the beast. Now, I thought about it and thought about it, and I came to the conclusion that "I can't deny that it is tempting to worship the beast" (I speak out of a love for the world, as God has). From this, the Holy Spirit was able to convict me, that if I truly want to worship the beast, I should repent. So now that is my basic stance, on where the rest of the world sits in relationship to worshipping the beast: they need to repent (just as I did, or more).

What I won't tolerate, is the Devil coming to me again and again, saying "worship the Beast more and more!" No, and this is the stance I think all my Christian brothers and sisters should take: I have dealt with my sin, in my desire to worship the Beast and have claimed the forgiveness of God through the blood of Jesus, in His Name Amen. After that, the Devil has nothing more he can say.

Now what I am not saying is "I can take the mark of the anti-christ and just repent of the sin, while I still have the mark" No! Cut the mark out of your forehead or out of your forearm, if you have it. I am not condemning you, I am saying don't put yourself in a position where you have to condemn yourself. This is about reaching people, who don't think there is any sin, in adding to the desire to worship the anti-christ and identifying with perpetual sin. The Lord knows whom He can save and whom He cannot. Let us not abuse this.

The time is not far from at hand (they have designed the mark, already, it has just not been enforced) and the world is ready to forget the tribulation that has been on the Earth from the beginning. It will be a blessing that the world forgets the danger of the old world, because it will not think to threaten us, but this is precisely the complacency that the Devil will seek to take advantage of, which is why we must be absolutely certain we don't continue to worship the beast or be in a position on earth where we have no foundation against it.

I wholly agree that the Holy Spirit is able to protect us against the temptation to worship the beast, if that's who you want to trust. But that is the same Holy Spirit that said "don't come to the altar, while your brother has something against you; first reconcile yourself to your brother and then come to the altar (gospels, from memory). If you are going to "just" trust the Holy Spirit (which is good), be sure that you praise God, for being able to trust the Holy Spirit. Be sure that you know how to lock the door - as Lot had to, in the days of Sodom and Gamorrah. That's what Jesus said: "remember Lot's wife". Be sure you are penitent about the distance between you and the world. Revelation 13:12 says "if you are on Earth, you will be forced to worship" as believers, your interpretation of that should be that "if you want to leave Earth, and you haven't properly resisted the temptation: you need to repent".

Heaven may dwell in you, but that is precisely what they want to kill.

May God have mercy on our souls.
The Beast is us.

Living in this world, we live in the form of flesh and blood, which is the form and mark of the beast--of our father the devil. It's not coming, its here, it's always been here.

Believe therefore in the salvation made available by the sacrifice of Jesus Christ, the only son of man and beast who prevailed to walk in this world not according to the way of our natural father, to become the first born of our spiritual Father in heaven, making a way through Him be sons and daughters of God Almighty.
 
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Davy

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It's hard to believe that any believer serious about our Heavenly Father's Word would just make-up stuff like on this Thread.

The 'beast' concept in Christ's Book of Revelation is EASY... to understand, IF... one sticks with the actual written Bible Scripture.

The first 'beast' mentioned in Revelation 13:1 is to have ten horns, seven heads, and ten crowns, which can ONLY MEAN a 'system', like a kingdom since it involves CROWNS. And back in Daniel 7 and in Revelation 17 we are told those "ten horns" ARE... "ten kings"! That's a kingdom beast! EASY!

Then at Revelation 13:11 forward, "another beast" is described ascending UP OUT OF THE EARTH, that has 2 horns LIKE a lamb (Jesus), but speaks as a "dragon". The title "dragon" is another one of Satan's titles per Rev.12:9. And that "another beast" is to work miracles raining fire down from heaven to the earth to deceive the whole world with. That's a single entity! The coming Antichrist, or false-Messiah that Jesus and Apostle Paul warned us about. EASY!
 
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Gottservant

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Jesus was tempted in all points as we are, and He prayed!

Then He said "pray that you escape and stand before Me"

Then Revelation said "if you are on Earth you will be forced to worship"

Nowhere does it say "you cannot repent for that"

So Jesus is asking us to do something we can do (pray)

Of course, Jesus will understand if we cannot ("the spirit is willing, but the flesh is weak" gospels, from memory), but we will not be rewarded if we do not die to ourselves.

I am saying, it is prudent to repent - but if the Holy Spirit is not saying this to you, by all means ignore it
 

rebuilder 454

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The ac is a trinity.
The beast
The second beast (false prophet)
The dragon.
 

Luther7

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Hi there,

So I took a very little interpretation of Revelation 13:12 and I came to the conclusion, that since I am on Earth and at war with the sin in my members (as Paul says in the letters), I am at the very least going to be tempted to worship the beast. Now, I thought about it and thought about it, and I came to the conclusion that "I can't deny that it is tempting to worship the beast" (I speak out of a love for the world, as God has). From this, the Holy Spirit was able to convict me, that if I truly want to worship the beast, I should repent. So now that is my basic stance, on where the rest of the world sits in relationship to worshipping the beast: they need to repent (just as I did, or more).

What I won't tolerate, is the Devil coming to me again and again, saying "worship the Beast more and more!" No, and this is the stance I think all my Christian brothers and sisters should take: I have dealt with my sin, in my desire to worship the Beast and have claimed the forgiveness of God through the blood of Jesus, in His Name Amen. After that, the Devil has nothing more he can say.

Now what I am not saying is "I can take the mark of the anti-christ and just repent of the sin, while I still have the mark" No! Cut the mark out of your forehead or out of your forearm, if you have it. I am not condemning you, I am saying don't put yourself in a position where you have to condemn yourself. This is about reaching people, who don't think there is any sin, in adding to the desire to worship the anti-christ and identifying with perpetual sin. The Lord knows whom He can save and whom He cannot. Let us not abuse this.

The time is not far from at hand (they have designed the mark, already, it has just not been enforced) and the world is ready to forget the tribulation that has been on the Earth from the beginning. It will be a blessing that the world forgets the danger of the old world, because it will not think to threaten us, but this is precisely the complacency that the Devil will seek to take advantage of, which is why we must be absolutely certain we don't continue to worship the beast or be in a position on earth where we have no foundation against it.

I wholly agree that the Holy Spirit is able to protect us against the temptation to worship the beast, if that's who you want to trust. But that is the same Holy Spirit that said "don't come to the altar, while your brother has something against you; first reconcile yourself to your brother and then come to the altar (gospels, from memory). If you are going to "just" trust the Holy Spirit (which is good), be sure that you praise God, for being able to trust the Holy Spirit. Be sure that you know how to lock the door - as Lot had to, in the days of Sodom and Gamorrah. That's what Jesus said: "remember Lot's wife". Be sure you are penitent about the distance between you and the world. Revelation 13:12 says "if you are on Earth, you will be forced to worship" as believers, your interpretation of that should be that "if you want to leave Earth, and you haven't properly resisted the temptation: you need to repent".

Heaven may dwell in you, but that is precisely what they want to kill.

May God have mercy on our souls.
I do understand what you are presenting. I think it has to do with the beast in this case representing a kingdom, or the kingdom of Satan. This can be seen in Revelation 18 as well as 13. Both chapters are speaking of the world under the spiritual rule of Satan. God calls us to " COME OUT OF HER, MY PEOPLE ", which means that true believers must avoid the perversion and injustice all around us and walk humbly before our God.

The " mark" of the kingdom sadly is the hexagram, which represents those who will be working with Satan to govern the world. Why do I stress this all the time? BECAUSE IT'S ABOUT TO HAPPEN.

They are simply following the teachings of their religion, and the most horrible thing to consider is that many Christians support their cause. That's what the NOAHIDE LAWS are all about.


The image of the beast I'm not 100% sure about.
 

Ronald David Bruno

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Hi there,

So I took a very little interpretation of Revelation 13:12 and I came to the conclusion, that since I am on Earth and at war with the sin in my members (as Paul says in the letters), I am at the very least going to be tempted to worship the beast. Now, I thought about it and thought about it, and I came to the conclusion that "I can't deny that it is tempting to worship the beast" (I speak out of a love for the world, as God has). From this, the Holy Spirit was able to convict me, that if I truly want to worship the beast, I should repent. So now that is my basic stance, on where the rest of the world sits in relationship to worshipping the beast: they need to repent (just as I did, or more).

What I won't tolerate, is the Devil coming to me again and again, saying "worship the Beast more and more!" No, and this is the stance I think all my Christian brothers and sisters should take: I have dealt with my sin, in my desire to worship the Beast and have claimed the forgiveness of God through the blood of Jesus, in His Name Amen. After that, the Devil has nothing more he can say.

Now what I am not saying is "I can take the mark of the anti-christ and just repent of the sin, while I still have the mark" No! Cut the mark out of your forehead or out of your forearm, if you have it. I am not condemning you, I am saying don't put yourself in a position where you have to condemn yourself. This is about reaching people, who don't think there is any sin, in adding to the desire to worship the anti-christ and identifying with perpetual sin. The Lord knows whom He can save and whom He cannot. Let us not abuse this.

The time is not far from at hand (they have designed the mark, already, it has just not been enforced) and the world is ready to forget the tribulation that has been on the Earth from the beginning. It will be a blessing that the world forgets the danger of the old world, because it will not think to threaten us, but this is precisely the complacency that the Devil will seek to take advantage of, which is why we must be absolutely certain we don't continue to worship the beast or be in a position on earth where we have no foundation against it.

I wholly agree that the Holy Spirit is able to protect us against the temptation to worship the beast, if that's who you want to trust. But that is the same Holy Spirit that said "don't come to the altar, while your brother has something against you; first reconcile yourself to your brother and then come to the altar (gospels, from memory). If you are going to "just" trust the Holy Spirit (which is good), be sure that you praise God, for being able to trust the Holy Spirit. Be sure that you know how to lock the door - as Lot had to, in the days of Sodom and Gamorrah. That's what Jesus said: "remember Lot's wife". Be sure you are penitent about the distance between you and the world. Revelation 13:12 says "if you are on Earth, you will be forced to worship" as believers, your interpretation of that should be that "if you want to leave Earth, and you haven't properly resisted the temptation: you need to repent".

Heaven may dwell in you, but that is precisely what they want to kill.

May God have mercy on our souls.
Likely the Church will be raptured before this mark is enforced. Of course many who are on the fence about Christ will be left behind. Realizing they goofed, will repent and refuse the mark.
 
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Trekson

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Hi there,

So I took a very little interpretation of Revelation 13:12 and I came to the conclusion, that since I am on Earth and at war with the sin in my members (as Paul says in the letters), I am at the very least going to be tempted to worship the beast. Now, I thought about it and thought about it, and I came to the conclusion that "I can't deny that it is tempting to worship the beast" (I speak out of a love for the world, as God has). From this, the Holy Spirit was able to convict me, that if I truly want to worship the beast, I should repent. So now that is my basic stance, on where the rest of the world sits in relationship to worshipping the beast: they need to repent (just as I did, or more).

What I won't tolerate, is the Devil coming to me again and again, saying "worship the Beast more and more!" No, and this is the stance I think all my Christian brothers and sisters should take: I have dealt with my sin, in my desire to worship the Beast and have claimed the forgiveness of God through the blood of Jesus, in His Name Amen. After that, the Devil has nothing more he can say.

Now what I am not saying is "I can take the mark of the anti-christ and just repent of the sin, while I still have the mark" No! Cut the mark out of your forehead or out of your forearm, if you have it. I am not condemning you, I am saying don't put yourself in a position where you have to condemn yourself. This is about reaching people, who don't think there is any sin, in adding to the desire to worship the anti-christ and identifying with perpetual sin. The Lord knows whom He can save and whom He cannot. Let us not abuse this.

The time is not far from at hand (they have designed the mark, already, it has just not been enforced) and the world is ready to forget the tribulation that has been on the Earth from the beginning. It will be a blessing that the world forgets the danger of the old world, because it will not think to threaten us, but this is precisely the complacency that the Devil will seek to take advantage of, which is why we must be absolutely certain we don't continue to worship the beast or be in a position on earth where we have no foundation against it.

I wholly agree that the Holy Spirit is able to protect us against the temptation to worship the beast, if that's who you want to trust. But that is the same Holy Spirit that said "don't come to the altar, while your brother has something against you; first reconcile yourself to your brother and then come to the altar (gospels, from memory). If you are going to "just" trust the Holy Spirit (which is good), be sure that you praise God, for being able to trust the Holy Spirit. Be sure that you know how to lock the door - as Lot had to, in the days of Sodom and Gamorrah. That's what Jesus said: "remember Lot's wife". Be sure you are penitent about the distance between you and the world. Revelation 13:12 says "if you are on Earth, you will be forced to worship" as believers, your interpretation of that should be that "if you want to leave Earth, and you haven't properly resisted the temptation: you need to repent".

Heaven may dwell in you, but that is precisely what they want to kill.

May God have mercy on our souls.
It's a little premature for that. The mark isn't here yet.
 
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Trekson

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Jesus was tempted in all points as we are, and He prayed!

Then He said "pray that you escape and stand before Me"

Then Revelation said "if you are on Earth you will be forced to worship"

Nowhere does it say "you cannot repent for that"

So Jesus is asking us to do something we can do (pray)

Of course, Jesus will understand if we cannot ("the spirit is willing, but the flesh is weak" gospels, from memory), but we will not be rewarded if we do not die to ourselves.

I am saying, it is prudent to repent - but if the Holy Spirit is not saying this to you, by all means ignore it
Maybe "forced" could happen and be one of the causes for martyrdom, but that's not what the word 'causeth" means. The a/c can say if you want to buy and sell you must have the mark but that doesn't mean everyone will or be forced to. Just as it is said, 'thou must not kill" doesn't mean that everyone obeys. Imprisonment is a possibility as is living off the grid. There will be other options. Once one receives the mark, that's it. There is no cutting it off, there is no repentence, it will change your mind to be under his total control.
 

rvmb

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Maybe "forced" could happen and be one of the causes for martyrdom, but that's not what the word 'causeth" means. The a/c can say if you want to buy and sell you must have the mark but that doesn't mean everyone will or be forced to. Just as it is said, 'thou must not kill" doesn't mean that everyone obeys. Imprisonment is a possibility as is living off the grid. There will be other options. Once one receives the mark, that's it. There is no cutting it off, there is no repentence, it will change your mind to be under his total control.
""Once one receives the mark, that's it. There is no cutting it off, there is no repentence""
Correct , result - Salvation lost.
According to the teachings of Paul, can a saved believer 'today' lose their Salvation ?
If so, please list the verses FROM PAUL
 

Trekson

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""Once one receives the mark, that's it. There is no cutting it off, there is no repentence""
Correct , result - Salvation lost.
According to the teachings of Paul, can a saved believer 'today' lose their Salvation ?
If so, please list the verses FROM PAUL
It's not a matter of "losing it" as if Christ takes it away. A believer can return it or give it back in a variety of scenarios. 1 Pet. 4:17-20 speaks about judgment beginning w/ the church and many will fail because they do "love their life" and are not willing to die for Christ. This will be the time of the great apostacy also spoken of by Paul in 2 Thess. 2:3.
 

rvmb

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It's not a matter of "losing it" as if Christ takes it away. A believer can return it or give it back in a variety of scenarios. 1 Pet. 4:17-20 speaks about judgment beginning w/ the church and many will fail because they do "love their life" and are not willing to die for Christ. This will be the time of the great apostacy also spoken of by Paul in 2 Thess. 2:3.
""It's not a matter of "losing it" as if Christ takes it away""
Explain Rev 14:9-11 :-
9.. his mark in his forehead, or in his hand,
10.. he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone ..
11..torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: ... receiveth the mark of his name.
**

The request was for FROM PAUL, 1 Pet is not Paul.
**
""great apostacy also spoken of by Paul in 2 Thess. 2:3.""
That does not teach a believer saved by 1 Cor 15:1-4, Eph 1:13 can become UNsaved, UNsealed, UNjustified.
What other verses FROM PAUL do you believe teach that a saved,sealed,justified believer can become UNsaved ?
 
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Trekson

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""It's not a matter of "losing it" as if Christ takes it away""
Explain Rev 14:9-11 :-
9.. his mark in his forehead, or in his hand,
10.. he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone ..
11..torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: ... receiveth the mark of his name.
**

The request was for FROM PAUL, 1 Pet is not Paul.
**
""great apostacy also spoken of by Paul in 2 Thess. 2:3.""
That does not teach a believer saved by 1 Cor 15:1-4, Eph 1:13 can become UNsaved, UNsealed, UNjustified.
What other verses FROM PAUL do you believe teach that a saved,sealed,justified believer can become UNsaved ?
If a former believer loses their faith it is by their choice, not God's, and actions speak louder than words. How about the words of Christ in Matt. 7:22-23?
 

rvmb

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If a former believer loses their faith it is by their choice, not God's, and actions speak louder than words. How about the words of Christ in Matt. 7:22-23?
Matt is not Paul.
I'll make it easier for you.
Yes or no, are there verses >>>FROM PAUL<<< that teach a believer can become UNsaved ?
 

Trekson

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Matt is not Paul.
I'll make it easier for you.
Yes or no, are there verses >>>FROM PAUL<<< that teach a believer can become UNsaved ?
I already gave you 2 Thess. 2:3, that should sufficient.