Ok. Only tell the real martyrs.
You remember Peter telling Jesus He didn't have to go to Jerusalem to die?
Because your beliefs provide an obstacle to martyrdom Jesus would say the sam thing to you that He said to Peter.
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You remember Peter telling Jesus He didn't have to go to Jerusalem to die?
Because your beliefs provide an obstacle to martyrdom Jesus would say the sam thing to you that He said to Peter.
Ferris Bueller
Well-Known Member
How can you say I did not show you what Paul meant by "otherwise you have believed in vain"? I did show you. Here it is, again..
"2and by which you are being saved, if you hold fast to the word I preached to you—unless you believed in vain." 1 Corinthians 15:2
"14And if Christ has not been raised, then our preaching is in vain and your faith is in vain." 1 Corinthians 15:14
"17And if Christ has not been raised, your faith is futile and you are still in your sins." 1 Corinthians 15:17
The potential vanity of what they believed is if Christ has not been raised from the dead. I showed you this and you are choosing to ignore it. Fine. But at least be honest enough to say you're ignoring it, just don't deceitfully and dishonestly change scripture to suit what you want it to say. Don't be a deceitful heretic! Be an honest heretic, lol.
I don't judge a teaching by the faults of it's members.
Jesus didn't accuse Moses of error just because wicked men sat in his chair did He?
What you said is not related to anything ive posted.
Try to be more concise and clear.
EloyCraft, I only contrasted a real martyr, with a false martry, in my posts.
Jesus was a real one.... Hallelujah !!!
10 of the original 12 Apostles, were also real martyrs.
Today, somewhere in this world, some real martyr's for Christ left this world, by being Martyr'd.
Have you ever read these:
Foxe's Book of Martyr's?
The Screwtape Letters
You should. Every Christian should read them both.
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The born again, are to "test the spirits".....and we are to "know them by their fruit".........because .."He that is spiritual, judges all things".
So, its incredibly important for a believer to learn how to HEAR what a deceiver sounds like, when they TEACH.
If you dont learn this, and become skilled, then a heretic has a good chance of breaking your faith.
Some of my Threads and many of my posts are teaching this skill.
Now i have not studied your faith, as you have not actually offered your belief as a theology.
But when and if you do, i'll hear it and know what you are, based on those verses i just showed you, EloyCrafy.
Philip James
Well-Known Member
Jesus taught we must abide in Him.
What about those who had received the Holy Spirit but we're going back to the old covenant? They would need another savior right?
A wife has no obligations to her husband?
Bob Estey
Well-Known Member
It seems to me "heretic" most often is a word used to describe "people who disagree with me."
That is very Tragic.
The story states that some of the shooters were in the Church, and surrounding it also..
So, even if the Catholics got out of the Sanctuary, they still were murdered.
You abide in Christ, by being born again.
The verse says. 'IN".......abide IN............and that means you have to be IN Christ.
The only way to do that is to be born again, as then you become "One with God" IN Christ".
So, Jesus is teaching that becoming one with Him, in spiritual union, is to abide.
He would never tell you that its by your self effort, that you abide, as that isn't possible.
And most believers do not find their way past some type of Legalism, or "self saving"......while they are already saved.
They have not understood that they are "In Christ"....... so, they try to understand it, as "here is what i try to do, to attain and maintain, their Salvation".
So, if these are truly born again, then they could not find or need another savior, as there is only One. John 14:6.
What they need is to be led back to the Light, and out of the deception that is their broken faith which has them trying to be saved or stay saved.
And both the husband and the wife are co-equal, regarding being "one flesh", so, marriage is a duel responsibility that comes with the VOW.
That not what Paul teaches, or what i teach.
But thank you for your opinion.
Heretics are all defined by their belief that salvation is their responsibility to earn, or to Keep., as they have no Faith in Christ as their Salvation.
= ZERO.
Michiah-Imla
Well-Known Member
Interesting because this is what the Bible teaches about heretics:
You shall know them by their fruits:
“Beware of false prophets… Ye shall know them by their fruits. ” (Matthew 7:15-16)
In Once Saved Always Saved you shall NOT know them by their fruits because OSAS’ers believe you will never stop sinning.
Second: Teaching contrary to Christ’s words is heretical:
“If any man teach otherwise, and consent not to wholesome words, even the words of our Lord Jesus Christ, and to the doctrine which is according to godliness; He is proud, knowing nothing” (1 Timothy 6:3-4)
OSAS’ers are proud and teach contrary to Christ’s teaching on enduring to the end to be saved Matthew 10:22
Thirdly: I have learned from the Bible that sinning willfully after receiving the knowledge of the truth will have dire consequences affecting one’s salvation:
“For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.” (Hebrews 10:26-27)
OSAS’ers cause division and offense regarding this scripture and thus they are to be avoided:
“Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them. For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple.” (Romans 16:17-18)
Finally: the doctrine of Once Saved Always Saved turns Grace into a sin-pass:
“For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness” (Jude 1:4)
Now go find the real biblical heretics!
Not the ones you create in your mind.
I thought you knew I'm Catholic. I'm a bible reading Catholic. I don't have a choice. The Church I saw in Scriptures is still in town. A light on a hill so to speak. I'm not sure I know what you mean offering a theology of my faith. I know my faith easily offends many of my separated brothers so I watch my language.
You are obsessed with OSAS, because you do not trust in Christ to keep you saved.
So, there is your self revelation.
Michiah-Imla
Well-Known Member
Im not offended .
thank you for sharing.
I can't talk to Marymog or Breadoflife as they dont talk, they only spit.
Im a evangelist that is a Pauline (teaching) Theologist, so, that ministry is not going to "jive"well with much Catholic Doctrine.
Many members on this forum, feel that i am harsh with them, but im only harsh with their broken faith that wants to try to (preach) and thereby theologically convert everyone else here, so that they end up as a Legalist also.
Broken faith is hard to repair as the person who has it, is deceived, and deception is truth to the deceived.
"speeches" to some.
"revelation" to others.
Why is that ?
Any idea?
Also, I post a lot of verses, but to confuse the heretics i dont post the chapter or the book.
Confusing for you, isnt it, Michiah-Imla??
I can tell.
Also, im a teacher, so, i teach, vs, just posting random verses.
'People that post verses, can't teach, and that is why they post a slew of random verses and then say..>"see there, proved it".
But the reality is, you proved you have good cut and paste skills.
So, congrats on that ability.
As for me, i'll pass.
GEN2REV
Well-Known Member
It's witchcraft.
Always turning of things upside down.
It was the real witches that instituted the witch trials accusing well-meaning Christians of witchcraft resulting in many innocents being put to death.
It's always the heretical witches that call God's True believers heretics.
Bob Estey
Well-Known Member
A heretic would be someone who would tell people what they want to hear, rather than what they need to hear.
That is definitely one way to put it. The other aspect is heretics developing erroneous beliefs (by whatever means), broadcasting them, and then refusing to be corrected. When people double down on their errors, then they turn into heretics.
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