The beast that was and was not and yet is

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burningfire

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Ithink you have it wrong....The first beast will be a one world political system,that's about to happen soon.....That system will fall apart,satan himself,as the antichrist will put it back together again and all will wonder after him thinking he is Christ.........

Here is a good study on it at the link below.......

http://www.biblestud...e.com/beast.htm

Here's an excerpt

There are two beasts spoken of in the thirteenth chapter of the book of Revelation. The first beast [Rev 13:1-10] is the emerging one-world political/religious system that we see gaining strength and power at a breakneck speed in our present generation. This confederacy of all the world's Nations, Educational systems (Media), Monetary systems, and most importantly the Religions will be in effect under the rule of one Governing body. This will make it possible for the antichrist to step in, take the reins, and assume control of most every soul on the planet. This antichrist is the second beast of Revelation chapter thirteen, and he is satan himself, who comes first before Jesus Christ's Second Advent, and he claims to be the True prophesied Messiah.

The second beast [Rev 13:11-18] is satan himself in his role as the antichrist. See the THE ANTICHRIST in-depth Bible study. The word 'antichrist,' in the Greek language that the book of revelation was written in, does not mean what it means in our English language. It does not mean 'the prevention of' as in antifreeze. But rather it means 'instead of' as in an imposter. The word antichrist in the Greek language is antichristos (an-tee'-khris-tos), and it is composed of two words, the second word Christos (khris-tos') you recognize as Christ. But the first word anti (an-tee') has a very revealing definition, it means 'instead of' or 'a substitution' for something. When this prefix is used of a person it means that he is an imposter to whomever the prefix anti is attached to. In this case (anti-Christ); he is an imposter to Christ:

So where is the false prophet in all of this through this interpretation of Revelation?
 

shilohsfoal

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So where is the false prophet in all of this through this interpretation of Revelation?


The second beastr is also called the false prophet in the book of Rev.
It is also the host given to the nation state of Israel in the book of Daniel.

Daniel 8;12
And an host was given [him] against the daily [sacrifice] by reason of transgression, and it cast down the truth to the ground; and it practised, and prospered.

My guess is you dont like the book of Daniel?
Both beasts and events are discibed in that book too.
 

shilohsfoal

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I think peoples biggest problem is the donrt realize the book of Daniel and the book of revelation is speaking of the same end times events.
People are taught by their christian leaders that the king of the north in Daniel chapter 11 sets up a image in a rebuilt temple and they canm find that happening in the book of revelations.And even though none of what thier teachers teach them is biblical they except it as the gosple truth.
At the same time thier teachers teach them something altogether different out of the book of revelation when they are talking about the exact same events.

The purpose of the book of revelation is to help the servants of Jesus Christ understand what takes place at the time of the end.
It is nothing different than what other prophets have written about ,it only is worded differently.

The first beast of revelation describes the occupants of the promised land.That is the beast that is in Jerusalem and the ten muslim countries .
The second beast describes the king of the north and his army that he sends into Israel.
The mark of the beast is the abomination of desolation.

After the beast ,false prophet and the ten muslim countries are destroyed the saints inherit the promised land and the millennial reign begins.

As for the location of the beast.He is right there where the bible says he is.
The city where our Lord was crucified..

Rev 11;7-8
And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them.And their dead bodies [shall lie] in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.



Ya think maybe if there wasnt so many false prophets telling people they shall love the Israeli goverment ,people might realize what it is?

 

burningfire

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I think peoples biggest problem is the donrt realize the book of Daniel and the book of revelation is speaking of the same end times events.
People are taught by their christian leaders that the king of the north in Daniel chapter 11 sets up a image in a rebuilt temple and they canm find that happening in the book of revelations.And even though none of what thier teachers teach them is biblical they except it as the gosple truth.
At the same time thier teachers teach them something altogether different out of the book of revelation when they are talking about the exact same events.

The purpose of the book of revelation is to help the servants of Jesus Christ understand what takes place at the time of the end.
It is nothing different than what other prophets have written about ,it only is worded differently.

The first beast of revelation describes the occupants of the promised land.That is the beast that is in Jerusalem and the ten muslim countries .
The second beast describes the king of the north and his army that he sends into Israel.
The mark of the beast is the abomination of desolation.

After the beast ,false prophet and the ten muslim countries are destroyed the saints inherit the promised land and the millennial reign begins.

As for the location of the beast.He is right there where the bible says he is.
The city where our Lord was crucified..

Rev 11;7-8
And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them.And their dead bodies [shall lie] in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.



Ya think maybe if there wasnt so many false prophets telling people they shall love the Israeli goverment ,people might realize what it is?


No, I like Daniel too. They do go hand in hand, but your reference to Israel being the first beast is not Scriptural. It is just a misinterpretation.

God loves Israel. Israel is in His plans. the coming war is all about Israel. They just found the biggest plot of oil right off their cost in the world. They are going to be a super rich country. God is blessing Israel. Countries that go against Israel will feel God's wrath.

Check out a guy named John McTernan. He specializes in Israel. Very knowledgeable man, loves the Lord. http://johnmcternansinsights.blogspot.com/

He links disasters, natural and un-natural to events that happen in Israel, especially with countries trying to talk them into a peace treaty, or separating the land with Palestine.
 

shilohsfoal

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No, I like Daniel too. They do go hand in hand, but your reference to Israel being the first beast is not Scriptural. It is just a misinterpretation.

God loves Israel. Israel is in His plans. the coming war is all about Israel. They just found the biggest plot of oil right off their cost in the world. They are going to be a super rich country. God is blessing Israel. Countries that go against Israel will feel God's wrath.

Check out a guy named John McTernan. He specializes in Israel. Very knowledgeable man, loves the Lord. http://johnmcternans...s.blogspot.com/

He links disasters, natural and un-natural to events that happen in Israel, especially with countries trying to talk them into a peace treaty, or separating the land with Palestine.


No .Its not a misinterpretation.
The beast calls himself by the name Israel .
All that is written of the beast is coming to pass before your face but you not being able to see cant see it.

Its probably caused by your love for the beast and the fact you have always been taught to love it.

I started three threads on three seperate boards.
The other two boards ,I was able to go through scripture pointing out many prophecies concerning the beast that have come to pass ij the last 65 years or so but not this board.Insted of providing scripture I ended up in a debate with people who support the beast.This thread is really not even worth the effort anymore.I"ll attempt to make another thread in the future concerning these things cause this is not going anywhere.Its like trying to preach the gospel to a orthodox jew.
 

burningfire

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No .Its not a misinterpretation.
The beast calls himself by the name Israel .
All that is written of the beast is coming to pass before your face but you not being able to see cant see it.

Its probably caused by your love for the beast and the fact you have always been taught to love it.

I started three threads on three seperate boards.
The other two boards ,I was able to go through scripture pointing out many prophecies concerning the beast that have come to pass ij the last 65 years or so but not this board.Insted of providing scripture I ended up in a debate with people who support the beast.This thread is really not even worth the effort anymore.I"ll attempt to make another thread in the future concerning these things cause this is not going anywhere.Its like trying to preach the gospel to a orthodox jew.

The reason you are in debate with people on this board is because you have not proven, with Scripture, that Israel is the beast. You have not gone over the prophecies fulfilled. You haven't done any of that, like you claimed you did on other boards. So far, it's all speculation. It's what you think. Post a new thread we all evidence you have accumulated. Until you can do so, with proper interpretation of Scripture, proving Israel to be the beast is true, I will consider this ideology as garbage. The only reason this is going nowhere is because you fail to interpret Scripture correctly.
 

shilohsfoal

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No.It didnt go anywhere because of you love the beast.
Many people love the beast.Its not uncommon.But I will say Veteran was really the one who made the thread go the wrong way .
I knew he loved the beast because Ive seen him before.He supports both thebeast and its ally the king of the north.There have brern many prophecies concerning his kingdom that have been coming to pass in the last 63 years also .
But Im just going to concentrate on the boards that recieved me.I;ll come back and try again some time in the future if I can.Good bye.
 

burningfire

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No.It didnt go anywhere because of you love the beast.
Many people love the beast.Its not uncommon.But I will say Veteran was really the one who made the thread go the wrong way .
I knew he loved the beast because Ive seen him before.He supports both thebeast and its ally the king of the north.There have brern many prophecies concerning his kingdom that have been coming to pass in the last 63 years also .
But Im just going to concentrate on the boards that recieved me.I;ll come back and try again some time in the future if I can.Good bye.

The reason we have not received your posts the way you want is because you keep saying Israel is the beast without any proof. All you need to do is prove it. That's it. You keep beating around the bush, which tells me you really have no significant backing to your theory.
 

Guestman

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Revelation 1:10 provides the period of time that the prophetic events occur that are found in the book of Revelation. The apostle John says that "by inspiration I came to be in the Lord's day." The apostle Paul gave insight into the "Lord's day" by expressing to the Corinthian congregation that Jesus Christ "will make you firm to the end, that you may be open to no accusation in the day of our Lord Jesus Christ."(1 Cor 1:8) He further told them that any man who commits fornication "to hand such a man over....for the destruction of the flesh, in order that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord."(1 Cor 5:5) Thus, the "Lord's day" was, from Paul's time, still far into the future.

The "Lord's day" begins with the opening of the first seal (Rev 6:1), in which a rider on "a white horse" is given "a crown" and he goes "forth conquering and to complete his conquest." Revelation 19 identifies who this rider is, as the "Word of God"(Rev 19:13), and of which the "armies that were in heaven were following him on white horses" ("white horses" pictures righteous warfare, Prov 21:31). Hence, Jesus is the rider on "the white horse" that receives "a crown" or kingship (Dan 7:13, 14), for he is the "Word of God" or God's chief spokesman.(John 1:1)

But when was Jesus given "a crown" so that he began ruling God's kingdom ? Revelation 6:3,4 gives a critical detail, saying that immediately following of his receiving "a crown", the "second seal" was opened, whereby "a fiery-colored horse" came forth, so that "the one seated upon it there was granted to take peace away from the earth so that they should slaughter one another; and a great sword was given him." What does this mean ?

That immediately following Jesus enthronement as king, global war broke out. When was the earth involved in global warfare for the first time in history, whereby ' peace was taken away from the earth, slaughtering one another ' ? With the outbreak of WWI in 1914. Thus, Jesus installment as king of God's kingdom in 1914 marked the beginning of "the Lord's day" and now provides the timeline for rest of the book of Revelation.

Now onto Revelation 17:8, which says that this "wild beast" that John "saw" previously is ridden upon by a "woman", a "harlot" called "Babylon the Great".(Rev 17:5) This "wild beast" is spoken of as a "scarlet-colored wild beast".(Rev 17:3) First, there is a need to identify what is meant by a "wild beast". Daniel 7 unlocks this by showing that the world empires of Babylon, Medo-Persia, Greece and Rome are likened to different "wild beasts". Thus, all human governments are under the umbrella of "a (composite) wild beast", acting like wild beasts, tearing, maiming and killing humans like a vicious wild beast.(Rev 13:2) The harlotrous "woman" of Babylon the Great is seen as riding "a scarlet-colored wild beast", which is a creation of the "wild beast", being given ruling authority (scarlet was a royal color, Matt 27:28) by this "wild beast" that people are awed by, for "those who dwell on the earth will wonder admiringly."("wonder admiringly", Greek thaumazo, Rev 17:8b)

Hence, what is the "scarlet-colored wild beast" that is given ruling authority by the "wild beast" of Revelation 13:1,2 or all the governments of the world as a composite unit ? What is this scarlet-colored "wild beast that....was, but is not and yet is about to ascend out of the abyss, and it is to go off into destruction" ?(Rev 17:8a) As WWI drew to a close in 1918, American president Woodrow Wilson and British prime minister David Lloyd George proposed a League of Nations. Its goal was to “achieve international peace and security” and thus keep the horror of such a war from ever occurring again. It came into existence on January 16, 1920 with a membership of 42 nations.

It is interesting to note who took this initiative. These two leaders were the heads of the two parts of the seventh world power of Bible history, the Anglo-American World Power.(Rev 17:10) This and other facts regarding the international peace and security organization fit, in an amazing way, what the Bible book of Revelation had said about a short-lived “eighth king” that would both rise and fall in our day. What were some of these interesting parallels ?(Rev 17:11)

The prophecy in Revelation revealed that a “beast” having “two horns like a lamb” would tell “those who dwell on the earth to make an image” to the wild beast (Rev 13:11, 14), which has been headed by the seven great world powers of Biblical history.This is exactly what the Anglo-American World Power did. It urged “those who dwell on the earth” to make a League that looked and acted the way great governments do (as an image does).

But really it was only “an image to the wild beast.” It had no power of its own, only what was given it by its member nations. It is not described as coming into power through some great military conquest, as world powers had done. Instead, it springs or comes from the seven world powers. It owes its existence not only to the seventh of them but also to other member nations that include remnants of the preceding six. Would this political image reach the high goals that its founders had hoped for, to "achieve international peace and security" ?(Rev 17:11.) No.

With the outbreak of WWII on September 1, 1939, the League became as "is not", defunct, going out of existence. It remained in a death-like state until it ' ascended out of the abyss' as the United Nations on October 24, 1945 (Rev 17:8a), with 192 members as of 2006. However, those who give admiration to this "scarlet-colored wild beast", their "names have not been written upon the scroll of life from the founding of the world."(Rev 17:8) Those who worship the composite "wild beast" or all the governments of the world as "one"(Rev 13:2), also worship the "image of the wild beast", the United Nations, with these ones names not having been "written upon the scroll of life."
 

Arnie Manitoba

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One good thing about this thread is that it sorts out the people who love Israel (like God does) and those who hate Israel (like the Beast does)

God still has special plans for Israel , the nation in the Middle East , her citizens , and the worldwide Jew who are still being re-gathered,

God will bless those who bless Israel , and curse those who curse Israel. It is a sobering reminder for us to choose sides carefully. Very carefully. Our futures depend on it.

God has punished and scattered disobedient Israel like he said he would. Now is the time of the re-gathering and a time of favor and compassion on Zion. Just like he said he would.

The gentile christian may view the unbelieving Jew as an enemy of the gospel , fine , but they are not the enemy of God. Romans 9 , 10 and 11 spell it out clearly.

Go read and go Israel.
 

shilohsfoal

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One good thing about this thread is that it sorts out the people who love Israel (like God does) and those who hate Israel (like the Beast does)

God still has special plans for Israel , the nation in the Middle East , her citizens , and the worldwide Jew who are still being re-gathered,

God will bless those who bless Israel , and curse those who curse Israel. It is a sobering reminder for us to choose sides carefully. Very carefully. Our futures depend on it.

God has punished and scattered disobedient Israel like he said he would. Now is the time of the re-gathering and a time of favor and compassion on Zion. Just like he said he would.

The gentile christian may view the unbelieving Jew as an enemy of the gospel , fine , but they are not the enemy of God. Romans 9 , 10 and 11 spell it out clearly.

Go read and go Israel.


One thing for sure.You dont know who the seed of Abraham is.
I will bless those who bless you and I will curse those who curse you.

This is written of the seed of Abraham.That seed is Christ.
Gal 3;16
Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.


If you were a true christian and believed in Jesus Christ ,you should have known this.

Mat 16;16-
And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.
And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed [it] unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.
 

Foreigner

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One thing for sure.You dont know who the seed of Abraham is.
I will bless those who bless you and I will curse those who curse you.

This is written of the seed of Abraham.That seed is Christ.
Gal 3;16
Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.


If you were a true christian and believed in Jesus Christ ,you should have known this.


-- "If you were a true christian and believed in Jesus Christ....."

Wow. Very nice. Funny, because God also says that a 'true Christian' does not stand in judgement of others.

You must be truly gifted to be able to see in his heart and KNOW that he doesn't believe in Jesus Christ.


.
 

shilohsfoal

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-- "If you were a true christian and believed in Jesus Christ....."

Wow. Very nice. Funny, because God also says that a 'true Christian' does not stand in judgement of others.

You must be truly gifted to be able to see in his heart and KNOW that he doesn't believe in Jesus Christ.


.


I m not going to kill them for it.
But if they believed in Jesus Christ ,they should have known who God blesses and for what reasons.
Its like they have never heard the gospel.

Mat 25;34-36
“Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world. [sup]35[/sup] For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, [sup]36[/sup] I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.’


It has nothing to do with that beast in the middle east that calls itself by the name of Israel.
No I doi not worship the beast as many people on these forums do.
 

burningfire

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I m not going to kill them for it.
But if they believed in Jesus Christ ,they should have known who God blesses and for what reasons.
Its like they have never heard the gospel.

Mat 25;34-36
“Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world. [sup]35[/sup] For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, [sup]36[/sup] I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.’


It has nothing to do with that beast in the middle east that calls itself by the name of Israel.
No I doi not worship the beast as many people on these forums do.

Not every Christian knows who God blesses and for what reasons right away. It is not automatic that they know this. You are very ignorant. It seems like you think that everyone is scholarly here. There are many broken and hurt people on this board. People that are truly seeking after God and wanting to learn and here you are telling them, "If you were truly a Christian..." and sprouting off judgmental statements. We are called to love one another, not rip on people's level of faith. Be a little bit more cautious with what you write.
 

shilohsfoal

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Not every Christian knows who God blesses and for what reasons right away. It is not automatic that they know this. You are very ignorant. It seems like you think that everyone is scholarly here. There are many broken and hurt people on this board. People that are truly seeking after God and wanting to learn and here you are telling them, "If you were truly a Christian..." and sprouting off judgmental statements. We are called to love one another, not rip on people's level of faith. Be a little bit more cautious with what you write.

Sure didnt sound like they were looking for God.
Reread thier post and show me where they were looking for God.

Quit making things up.State the facts for once.

They dont even know who Israel is.
 

burningfire

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Sure didnt sound like they were looking for God.
Reread thier post and show me where they were looking for God.

Quit making things up.State the facts for once.

They dont even know who Israel is.

I was talking about this entire board as a whole, not just this thread. Like I stated before, people on this board are at all different levels with their faith. You shouldn't be belittling them by a judgmental statement like "If you were truly a Christian...", that is all I am saying about that.

As for israel:

I want you to create a thread with all the "facts" that you have accumulated that points to Israel being the beast. I want to see how you have come up with this theory.
 

tgwprophet

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God has chosen his people.. the Jews - It is Christains that have chosen God, thanks to and through Jesus. If I was to venture to consider a nation as the beast that was and is not and is yet to come... I would have to consider it the Roman Empire. My heart is with Israel... though I inderstand Israel has turned its back to Jesus but also, i know that this is part of God's plan. How many times would you turn toward your enemy (enemy - may be just a slight bit harsh) for salvation, then resist him when all is well again.. then turn back for salvation again..etc...etc, before your strenght, your heart, your soul and your spirit would never want to turn away again? The Jews strenght will be tempered by the blood of the Lamb. Remember the temptation for Israel to accept the Beast will be so very great that the Jews will allow him into the inner-sanctum. And yet, as the entire wolrd will have accepted him... Isreal alone will deny him and choose salvation through Jesus - who they voted to be nailed to a cross.
Imagine the MERCY our God has!
 

BibleScribe

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Hi terry,

I hate to break the news, but the Roman Empire ceased to exist approximate 425 - 625 A.D. Did the newspaper boy miss his delivery that day?

You know, GOD want's us to understand HIS Prophecies. And we can postulate until the cows come home, but there IS an answer. It's provided in Scripture, -- if we only cared enough to search it out.





To All,

I'm not exactly certain how someone could make the assertion as delineated in Post #1, but I think the response should be as provided in Matthew 16:23.



BibleScribe
 

shilohsfoal

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If you look at the beast close enough ,you will see the history of the nation of Israel.
Ofcorse this is for those of Israel who Jesus shall give sight to,but it is for Israel's eyes to see.

Reading about the beast in the book of revelation is like looking at a 5th grade Israeli history book.
Every Israeli should be able to understand it but there are very few Israeli's that would even read it.

Be careful who you call Satan.