The Study and Interpret the Bible

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Behold

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Exactly. The devil hates the uncorrupted Bible, which is the Sword of the Spirit against all evil angels, including Satan. It was the minions of Satan in the garb of Higher and Lower critics who began attacking the Bible in the late 18th and 19th centuries, and have continued to do so.
But Christ used Scripture against the devil when he came to tempt Jesus, and Christians can also use Scripture to demolish the lies of Satan (which appear frequently on this and other forums).

Yes and amen.

God is Holy and "thy word is Truth".

Its a concern when a sophisticated "sounding" person comes to a forum or a church,... suddenly shows up..... and sets themself up as a "bible corrector", as that is the height of spiritual pride.
He has not started into the "original greek" nonsense yet, but, given time, he'll get to it.

Christians have to have a final authority. And when a person tries to disconnect you from that, by casting doubt on the Bible, then that is just the worst sort of deception, being taught.

God calls Pastors......and the Devil calls "scholars"..,, as its always the "scholarship" that tries to sit in authority above the Word of God.
 

Behold

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This is false! Which translation is perfect?

You're "over the top" by saying that AW Bowman has blood on his hands because he knows the facts about the art/science of translation and you clearly don't. You should apologize to him and ask God to forgive you.

You clearly dont know anything about me.
Have you met me? Do you know my credentials?
Then you are talking nonsense.

Has this bible doubter been to Seminary? I too am seminary trained.
Has this bible doubter been trained in "manuscript evidence"? So have i.
Here is at least one difference between this bible doubter and Me....>I would never ever cast doubt on the Word of God.
I would never lead you to believe that you can't trust a bible., as that is the DEVIL's work, and i dont have that Job, Jim B.
How about you?
The bible doubter, the Threads OP.... already did this in his first Post.

And its not about "perfect translations".......its about casting DOUBT into the heart and mind of a person, so that they cant view the bible as their final authority.
He did that, and that is the "blood on his hands" that he mentioned in His post.

I would never ever do that.
 
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Jim B

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Some of the "Hebrew BULK" Christ Rejectors, will be found here.

Hebrews 10:26

For more of the same "bulk" of Christ Rejecting Hebrews, find Paul preaching to them again... in the last 10 verses of Acts 28.

Hebrews 10:26-31, "For if we deliberately keep on sinning after receiving the knowledge of the truth, no further sacrifice for sins is left for us, but only a certain fearful expectation of judgment and a fury of fire that will consume God’s enemies. Someone who rejected the law of Moses was put to death without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses. How much greater punishment do you think that person deserves who has contempt for the Son of God, and profanes the blood of the covenant that made him holy, and insults the Spirit of grace? For we know the one who said, “Vengeance is mine, I will repay,” and again, “The Lord will judge his people.” It is a terrifying thing to fall into the hands of the living God." I fail to see how this applies to the "Hebrew BULK" Christ Rejectors", whatever that means.

The last 10 verses of Acts 28 says...

They replied, “We have received no letters from Judea about you, nor have any of the brothers come from there and reported or said anything bad about you. But we would like to hear from you what you think, for regarding this sect we know that people everywhere speak against it.”

They set a day to meet with him, and they came to him where he was staying in even greater numbers. From morning until evening he explained things to them, testifying about the kingdom of God and trying to convince them about Jesus from both the law of Moses and the prophets. Some were convinced by what he said, but others refused to believe. So they began to leave, unable to agree among themselves, after Paul made one last statement: “The Holy Spirit spoke rightly to your ancestors through the prophet Isaiah when he said,

Go to this people and say,
You will keep on hearing, but will never understand,
and you will keep on looking, but will never perceive.
For the heart of this people has become dull,
and their ears are hard of hearing,
and they have closed their eyes,
so that they would not see with their eyes
and hear with their ears
and understand with their heart
and turn, and I would heal them.”’

“Therefore be advised that this salvation from God has been sent to the Gentiles; they will listen!”

Paul lived there two whole years in his own rented quarters and welcomed all who came to him, proclaiming the kingdom of God and teaching about the Lord Jesus Christ with complete boldness and without restriction."

Some of the "Christ Rejecting Hebrews" (according to you) who heard Paul believed what he said. That's what the Bible clearly says. So your bigotry is false!
 

Behold

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Which Bible translation, in your opinion, is uncorrupted?

"corrupted" ???...... is more the question.
A lot of them.

Perhaps the worst is the "Douay Rheims". The Catholic Bible.

Among popular bibles, the NIV is in the money.... for worst translation.
 
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Behold

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Hebrews 10:26-31, "For if we deliberately keep on sinning after receiving the knowledge of the truth,
Some of the "Christ Rejecting Hebrews" (according to you) who heard Paul believed what he said. That's what the Bible clearly says. So your bigotry is false!

Jews in Acts 28..(Hebrews) rejected Paul's Gospel.

The same did it in Hebrews 10:26.

And Paul was telling them the truth..>If you willfully sin the sin of Christ Rejection", there remains no more Sacrifice for you.
Why?
Because you rejected the SACRIFICE.....who is JESUS, their Messiah.
 

Behold

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Hebrews 10:26-31, "

Some of the "Christ Rejecting Hebrews" (according to you) who heard Paul believed what he said.

Thats true.

Many of Paul's converts were Jews, some were Greeks, etc.

Paul went to the Gentiles in Acts 28.... but he was preaching to Jews since Acts 9-10.
Around Chapter 15, it was more about Gentiles...for Paul, but not just.

That is about 20 yrs of preaching to all, before he "went to the gentiles".
 

Jim B

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You clearly dont know anything about me.
Have you met me? Do you know my credentials?
Then you are talking nonsense.

Has this bible doubter been to Seminary? So have i.
Has this bible doubter been trained in "manuscript evidence"? So have i.
Here is at least one difference between this bible doubter and Me....>I would never ever cast doubt on the Word of God.
I would never lead you to believe that you can't trust a bible., as that is the DEVIL's work, and i dont have that Job, Jim B.
How about you?
The bible doubter, the Threads OP.... already did this in his first Post.

And its not about "perfect translations".......its about casting DOUBT into the heart and mind of a person, so that they cant view the bible as their final authority.
He did that, and that is the "blood on his hands" that he mentioned in His post.

I would never ever do that.

Nonsense! You wrote, "If the Devil was teaching a class on the "bible", his first sentence would be..>"there is no perfect translation". " Those are your exact words! So why are you contradicting what you wrote earlier?

You also wrote this nonsense...

You clearly dont [sic] know anything about me.
Have you met me? Do you know my credentials?
Then you are talking nonsense.

Has this bible doubter been to Seminary? So have i.
Has this bible doubter been trained in "manuscript evidence"? So have i.

... so what? I don't care if you've been to seminary and been trained in manuscript evidence. I don't think it did you much good, as you're clearly confrontational, hostile, and confused.

There is no such thing as a perfect translation for the reasons I posted earlier. If you've been to seminary and been trained in manuscript evidence the you should know...

a) There are no original source documents.
b) The documents that do exist don't agree with each other 100%. There are often differences, so how does the translator decide which one is "correct"?
c) There are significant differences between ancient Hebrew, Aramaic, and Koine Greek and English: vocabulary, verb tenses, idioms, sentence structure, etc.
d) The understanding of the ancient cultures and how they understood the "Bible" is critically important. The best translations are written for our understanding!!!

The more clearly God's words are transmitted to our minds the better off we are. That is why there are excellent modern translations!

Maybe you need to "get off your high horse" go back to school.
 

Jim B

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"corrupted" ???...... is more the question.
A lot of them.

Perhaps the worst is the "Douay Rheims". The Catholic Bible.

Among popular bibles, the NIV is in the money.... for worst translation.

That's your opinion only, which I don't think is worth much.

The NIV is the most popular Bible. It is an excellent translation and is used for private reading, church Bible studies, and in church services. If you think it's the "worst translation" (with no evidence), that is irrelevant.
 

Behold

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Nonsense! You wrote, "If the Devil was teaching a class on the "bible", his first sentence would be..>"there is no perfect translation". .

Yes of course.
And why, ? It because that statement is subversive. Its designed to subvert a person's faith in the word of God.
Surely, as smart as you think you are, this has not escaped your IQ, Jim B?
Or has it.

Look at it like this..

The Devil says....>"hath God SAID"?

And we have a BIBLE, as GOD's Word.

So, then the Devil says..>"you can't trust that, as all the translations are not perfect".
And of course the DEVIL does not try to PROVE THAT statement, as He and his ministers are only after the DAMAGE they can do with it.

See it yet?

Now, what you need to do, when you run into these bible correctors, is.......

Listen for what ive shown you, and then listen for one more thing..
They will CORRECT the "imperfect BIBLE" with the "original GREEK".
And SHAZAM.......there is no ORIGINAL GREEK TEXT. = they lied again.
(Devil's are like that".
See, there are about 30 Koine Greek Texts, and about 3-4 are used to make bibles, unless a new bible society sort of makes a hybrid, out of whatever they want, and they call it a bible.

The bible corrector is just that.......a corrector. He is upon his own Self Righteous Throne, seated above the Word of God, castigating it.
 

Johann

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While that may be true for the Old Testament, the New Testament was written for all mankind, including the Gentiles of the Roman empire. That is precisely why God chose the Greek language for this Testament, even though the writers were Hebrews.
I think you might be in for a big surprise,
J.
 

Johann

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Yes of course.
And why, ? It because that statement is subversive. Its designed to subvert a person's faith in the word of God.
Surely, as smart as you think you are, this has not escaped your IQ, Jim B?
Or has it.

Look at it like this..

The Devil says....>"hath God SAID"?

And we have a BIBLE, as GOD's Word.

So, then the Devil says..>"you can't trust that, as all the translations are not perfect".
And of course the DEVIL does not try to PROVE THAT statement, as He and his ministers are only after the DAMAGE they can do with it.

See it yet?

Now, what you need to do, when you run into these bible correctors, is.......

Listen for what ive shown you, and then listen for one more thing..
They will CORRECT the "imperfect BIBLE" with the "original GREEK".
And SHAZAM.......there is no ORIGINAL GREEK TEXT. = they lied again.
(Devil's are like that".
See, there are about 30 Koine Greek Texts, and about 3-4 are used to make bibles, unless a new bible society sort of makes a hybrid, out of whatever they want, and they call it a bible.

The bible corrector is just that.......a corrector. He is upon his own Self Righteous Throne, seated above the Word of God, castigating it.
 

Behold

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... so what? I don't care if you've been to seminary and been trained in manuscript evidence. I don't think it did you much good, as you're clearly confrontational, hostile, and confused.

Confrontational ? No, just direct.

Hostile? That would be you here, with your personal insults.
Perhaps sone anger management courses would help you dial that back a bit?
Worth a shot, Jim B.

Confused?
Hardly.
i know the Devil's work.
You dont., and therein in lies your confusion.
 

Johann

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Yes of course.
And why, ? It because that statement is subversive. Its designed to subvert a person's faith in the word of God.
Surely, as smart as you think you are, this has not escaped your IQ, Jim B?
Or has it.

Look at it like this..

The Devil says....>"hath God SAID"?

And we have a BIBLE, as GOD's Word.

So, then the Devil says..>"you can't trust that, as all the translations are not perfect".
And of course the DEVIL does not try to PROVE THAT statement, as He and his ministers are only after the DAMAGE they can do with it.

See it yet?

Now, what you need to do, when you run into these bible correctors, is.......

Listen for what ive shown you, and then listen for one more thing..
They will CORRECT the "imperfect BIBLE" with the "original GREEK".
And SHAZAM.......there is no ORIGINAL GREEK TEXT. = they lied again.
(Devil's are like that".
See, there are about 30 Koine Greek Texts, and about 3-4 are used to make bibles, unless a new bible society sort of makes a hybrid, out of whatever they want, and they call it a bible.

The bible corrector is just that.......a corrector. He is upon his own Self Righteous Throne, seated above the Word of God, castigating it.
Test the spirits, visit his timeline.
J.
 

MatthewG

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“God of the Jews”

I thought there were 12 tribes of Israel???

the Jews don’t know their God or they would not have rejected their own salvation and killed their own savior!

There was 12 tribes, you are right. The people of Jerusalem made a choice to kill Jesus when they brought him to Pilate.

People heard his sayings and some did know who he was, so not everyone was faultless, for killing to Son of God the wrath of God was going to fall on that nation upon Jesus Christ to gather his bride (of the 12 tribes) and carry out punishment on those who did what they had done, leaving 1.1 million Jewish people dead on that Passover weekend I believe it was.
 

Behold

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Test the spirits, visit his timeline.
J.

Yes.

All bible correctors sound the same.

"no bible is real", its all man made"

"only the originals can be trusted"

"Original Greek TEXT, is God".

"You must be one of those Bible Believers".

A.) Yes, i am., and So is God.
 

Behold

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There was 12 tribes, you are right. The people of Jerusalem made a choice to kill Jesus when they brought him to Pilate.
People heard his sayings and some did know who he was, so not everyone was faultless, for killing to Son of God the wrath of God was going to fall on that nation upon Jesus Christ to gather his bride (of the 12 tribes) and carry out punishment on those who did what they had done, leaving 1.1 million Jewish people dead on that Passover weekend I believe it was.

And when 2 Thessalonians 1:8-9 hits, the entire world of unbelievers is going to be reeling in blood.
 

Johann

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The next part will cover the biases that we bring to both our reading as well as to our study of scripture, if we are finished with part one. Anyone?
Noticed you use terminologies like Goyim etc, are you Jewish or maybe a Goy who entered in through the gates of Judaism, observing the 7 Noachic Imperatives seeking to proselyte others to do the same?
J.
 

Behold

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That's your opinion only, which I don't think is worth much.

The NIV is the most popular Bible. It is an excellent translation and is used for private reading, church Bible studies, and in church services. If you think it's the "worst translation" (with no evidence), that is irrelevant.

There are books written, study manuals, that outline the missing verses, and changed doctrine that is found in the NIV.

Yes, the most popular, tho the ASV is in the running.
That is the only thing about the NIV that is worth mentioning.

What i noted is that the Devil owns the internet. He has it filled with filth, lust....
Its a WORLDLY trap.... and if you do a Scripture search on the Net, it seems to always offer the NIV, as the 1st option.
I think Satan is still laughing about that...

Its not a good translation.
It tries to remove the Deity of Christ from the scriptures, and hides it, or denies it, and that is why many who use it, HATE the idea of the Trinity
There is your bible.
That's one of the reasons.
 

Johann

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The next part will cover the biases that we bring to both our reading as well as to our study of scripture, if we are finished with part one. Anyone?
QUORE FREELY FROM MAIOMONIDE RABBIS?


Moses Maimonides — known variously as Moses ben Maimon, Rambam, the Great Eagle, and Mūsā b. Maymūn — was a 12th-century philosopher, scientist, physician, religious thinker, rabbinic scholar, jurist, communal leader, and the most famous Jewish figure of the premodern age.

It is a sign of his incomparable genius that modern Spain, Morocco, Egypt, Israel, and Sephardic Jews at large all lay claim to him. By contrast, Maimonides’ rational and humanistic understanding of Judaism has not always found favor among Jews in Ashkenazi lands even though they acknowledge his supreme mastery of Torah.

Maimonides’ published works are pillars of the Jewish canon. But the survival of his formal letters, private correspondence, and documents preserved in the Cairo Genizah, along with references to him in Jewish and Islamic texts, enable us to appreciate the fullness of the man — the doting father and bereaved older brother, the sensitive pastoral counselor and jurist, the highly skilled and sought-after physician, the influential and protective communal leader, the towering public figure, as well as the consummate rabbinic scholar and intellectual visionary.

Maimonides was born in 1138 in Cordoba, al-Andalus, as Islamic Spain was then called. When he was a young lad, the land was overrun and occupied by the Almohads, a Berber dynasty of Islamic revivalists from North Africa who adopted exceedingly harsh policies toward the Christian and Jewish minorities in their realm, including forced conversion to Islam contrary to Islamic law.

Maimonides’ father, a distinguished rabbinic scholar and judge in his own right, seems to have trudged the family around the country in search of safe haven. Somehow, he managed to continue to provide young Moses with a comprehensive rabbinic education, along with advanced instruction in scientific and philosophical subjects. Maimonides sought such wide-ranging education, despite the tumultuous circumstances, out of a belief common to intellectuals in the medieval Islamic world that with proper guidance one could encounter divine wisdom in contemplating the cosmos as well as through revelation and religious practice. Maimonides later famously urged his readers “to hear the truth from whoever utters it.”

Sometime around 1160, the Maimuni family emigrated to Fez, Morocco, then a center of Islamic learning. The evidence suggests that they must have lived for years as crypto-Jews — outwardly feigning adherence to Islam while secretly abiding by Jewish law. In Fez, Maimonides not only continued his study of Torah, science, philosophy and medicine, but also deepened his reading of Islamic law and thought.

Sign up here for “There Was None Like Maimonides,” My Jewish Learning’s email series about the legendary Jewish thinker.

After five years in Fez, the family left for the land of Israel in 1165. Despite the dangers posed by secretly engaging in rabbinic scholarship in Fez, and then the grueling conditions imposed by the journey to Israel, Maimonides continued to labor on his first major work: The Commentary on the Mishnah, seven years in the making and composed in Arabic, his mother tongue, demonstrated Maimonides’ complete mastery of Jewish law and his fusion of it with philosophy.

Palestine was then under Crusader jurisdiction and inhospitable to Jews, so the family did not remain there very long and found refuge in Egypt under the Fatimids, an Islamic polity hospitable to Jews. They settled in Old Cairo, also known as Fustat, where he would remain for the rest of his life.

Maimonides’ early years in Egypt were trying. His father died, making Moses head of the household and responsible for his sisters and brother. He also became embroiled in an internecine Jewish squabble involving a renegade communal leader. But eventually, his fortunes improved. He married a woman from an eminent Egyptian Jewish family and his increasing renown as an authority on Jewish law catapulted him to prominence. Jewish leaders from as far as Provence and Yemen sought his counsel and legal opinions.

Maimonides refused to accept compensation for these communal responsibilities in accordance with rabbinic rulings prohibiting material profit from Torah study. So his younger brother David supported the clan as an international merchant. After David drowned in the Indian Ocean while on a lucrative business trip to India, Maimonides fell into a debilitating year-long depression, describing his loss as “the greatest misfortune that has befallen me during my entire life — worse than anything else …”

Maimonides was appointed head of the Jewish community in 1171 and served in that capacity for several years, representing the Egyptian Jewish community and its interests to the government of a new Islamic dynasty, the Ayyubids, founded by Saladin. He also served as personal physician to the royal court and mixed freely with Muslim political and intellectual elites.

During this period, Maimonides was preoccupied with composing his magnum opus, the Mishneh Torah. This monumental, systematic organization of all of rabbinic law, completed around 1178 and written in his own beautifully rendered register of rabbinic Hebrew, aimed to make Jewish law accessible to all Jews wherever they may live. The Mishneh Torah drew on and fulfilled the plan, first suggested in the Commentary on the Mishnah, to systematize and organize Jewish law. Following that work, The Code also incorporated a set of 13 essential doctrines, later known as Maimonides’ 13 Principles of Faith, that are incumbent on every Jew to uphold. This doctrinal turn, aimed at combating popular forms of idolatry and superstition and calling upon his community to love God with the mind, was so novel, bold, and challenging it became controversial in certain quarters, especially Ashkenazi and adjacent lands such as northern Spain and France.

Despite his medical, communal, and rabbinic responsibilities, and the birth of his son Abraham in 1186, Maimonides nevertheless spent five years working on The Guide of the Perplexed. This magisterial study of the physical and metaphysical secrets inscribed in the Hebrew Bible was addressed to one of his most gifted students and like-minded Jewish intellectual elites confounded by the relationship between Torah, science and philosophy. Even more than the Mishneh Torah, The Guide generated as much controversy as adulation due to suspicions it departed from popular beliefs.

When his Hebrew translator in Provence requested a meeting with him in 1199, Maimonides, 61 at the time, memorably described the draining weekday routine that made any such visit impossible. He relates that he returned home after spending much of the day serving at the sultan’s palace to “find the antechamber filled with people, both Jews and Gentiles, nobles and common people, judges and bailiffs, friends and foes…patients go in and out until nightfall and sometimes even…until two hours and more in the night. I converse and prescribe for them while lying down from sheer fatigue, and when night falls, I am so exhausted that I can scarcely speak.”

Maimonides died in Cairo in 1204. Throughout his life, he steadfastly identified himself as Sephardic/Andalusi and he remained unceasingly loyal to the rabbinic, intellectual, and scientific traditions of his place of origin. His son, Abraham Maimuni, succeeded him as leader of the Egyptian Jewish community, as a physician, learned rabbinic authority, profound religious thinker, and guardian of his father’s incomparable legacy.

I think you have come in sur·rep·ti·tious·ly to spy out the liberty believers have in Y'howshuwa HaMashiach, prove me wrong.

Time for me to pull out my Jewish resources.
J.
 
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