There Are No People In Heaven / The Kingdom.
- Thread starter Phil .
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Here's a question..... What if there are no questions?
In Hell…there are Living souls (of men)…
….waiting (in very unpleasant surroundings)
….for Judgement Day.
In Heaven…there are Living souls (of men) and quickened / ie born again spirits (of men)…
…waiting (in peace, rest and comfort)
…for Judgement Day.
All physically dead body’s return to dust.
All Living souls depart out of dead bodys and are escorted UP or sent DOWN to their waiting “places”.
Glory to God,
Taken
Those are my words, not Scriptural QUOTES.
Study of multiple Scriptures…
REVEAL…
* All souls belong to God.
* The Life IN a soul belongs to God.
* A mans Life is His Blood.
* A Living man with a SOUL IN HIM is a Person.
* A dead man, void of his soul, is no longer called a Person, (rather called…the departed, a cadaver, the passed away, the deceased, etc.)
* A Living SOUL, departs out of a Dead Body.
** IF a LIVING SOUL is returned to the Dead body…the body resumes LIVING..
* ALL Bodies have a set time (according to Gods Order and WAY) to be resurrected.
* ALL Bodies SHALL be risen up.
* ALL Living souls SHALL be returned to their Bodys.
* ALL bodies, SHALL “SEE” the “Son of man”, (sitting on a White Cloud) He in the same BODY (God prepared and 2,000+ years ago Sent to Earth…thus He will APPEAR “AS” a man.
* ALL will “SEE”…thus (as is mans nature to believe what he SEES….and thus ALL WILL Believe HE IS THE Son of God, and ALL SHALL bow down IN Worship unto Him.
(Fulfilling Prophecy…ALL will believe and bow down to Him.)
* Thereafter….Judgments…SEPARATIONS of the DIVIDED …(who were with and without Him in their NATURAL (BLOOD) Lives.)
* Persons during their natural lives (body & soul) who rejected the Lord God…and bodily died having rejected the Lord God…are JUDGED.
* After Judgement (according to the Evidence In Gods Record Books)…
* They Who Rejected the Lord God…the Life in their soul….returns to God…and their Body and Soul destroyed and forgotten.
If you have read / study you should know or be able to find the clues in Scripture of these accounts.
If there is a particular POINT…as highlighted (*)…you can not find…copy, paste, ask me…
Glory to God,
Taken
Much too long of a post that could have been condensed into-- "There is no scripture... I made it up."
Dear Phil,
A person is in the Kingdom of Heaven when they are converted. At that time (their moment of salvation), Christ gathers the new child of God to dwell with Him in heaven (spiritually speaking). This conversion event first happened to the 120 Jewish Elect on the Day of Pentecost. It was at that time that Christ gathered them to dwell in heaven. It is not a one-time future event that happens at the literal end of this age. It is a reoccurring event that happens to all of Christ's Elect.
This verse applies:
Mat 24:31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
Heaven/Kingdom of Heaven is not a location, it is a state of being. Unbelievers dwell in the sea, unconverted believers dwell on the earth and converted believers (children of God) dwell in heaven (where Christ dwells).
Because mankind has a carnal mind, mankind tries to understand "spiritual things" in a physical way; such as making heaven a location. But God is everywhere and does not dwell in a physical location.
Consider what Christ said below:
John 3:8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.
As for when a person dies, they are dead. In that condition, they have no life or consciousness. Without a body, there is no life - that is why the bodily resurrection of the dead is so important. When the resurrection occurs, everyone will then appear before the White Throne of Christ (spiritually speaking) and He will separate them as sheep from goats. The sheep will receive their reward and the goats will go to judgment.
Joe
Rella ~ I am a woman
Well-Known Member
Um...
Scriptures ... I assume you know these well enough to be able to blend their meaning.
Is this pithy enough for you
Luke 16: 19-25
Ecclesiastes 12:7
Mathew 10:28
That there are people in heaven is a belief based on the belief in time. (When they).
Heaven is already the case.
Nor time.
That a person dies is a belief based on the assumption you are a person which is alive. This belief obscures the truth, and therein, heaven.
The belief “without a body” is based on the belief one has a body, as if one is a self separate of a body, as if a body where a possession of a self.
The assumption on behalf of everyone is again the belief there are people.
This is already heaven, and there are no people in heaven.
“When the resurrection occurs” is based on the belief in time. Time is not actually experienced, only thoughts about time are experienced.
That there are “states of being” is a belief on behalf of “not-being”, or, “the knower” / a “separate of being self”, which knows about being, such as that there are, “states of being”. That “self” is actually thoughts, and is not a self.
The belief in states is debunked in direct experience by simply attempting to point to, states.
The belief in time is debunked in direct experience by actually going to a past or future, and returning to the present, and sharing what the past & future are like.
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These thoughts are experienced, yet like the thought ‘unicorn’, what these thoughts are about is never actually experienced.
(Beliefs).
Same.
That belief is based on the belief in physically alive bodies.
Same. The only experience of ‘that’, is of the thoughts, believed.
"Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you."
Not a place in time.
Not you within ‘it’.
Within you.
Dear Phil,
I don't know of any scripture which teaches and supports the comments you made about "time".
Scripture does say that God has "foreknowledge" but His foreknowledge comes from the certainty that He will perform and accomplish all that He has said.
Isa 46:10 Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times the things that are not yet done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure: 11 Calling a ravenous bird from the east, the man that executeth my counsel from a far country: yea, I have spoken it, I will also bring it to pass; I have purposed it, I will also do it.
Nowhere in scripture does it ever say that God is a time traveler, fortuneteller or is not bound by time.
Paul says that we should not "go beyond what is written":
1Cor 4:6 Now, brothers and sisters, I have applied these things to myself and Apollos for your benefit, so that you may learn from us the meaning of the saying, “Do not go beyond what is written.” Then you will not be puffed up in being a follower of one of us over against the other.
Do you have any scripture that supports your comments on time? If not, you are going beyond what is written.
Joe
I find no value in making you feel content by repeating your lie.
If you require a short Biblical version try a toddler Bible.
Go to a past, future, or other time now.
Come back to the present.
Tell us how it was.
Simple.
Time is a belief which like all beliefs can be dispelled by direct experience.
Go to a past, future, or other time now.
Come back to the present.
Tell us how it was.
Simple.
Go to a past and read scripture, go to a future and read scripture.
Come back to the present.
Tell us how it was.
Simple.
Self-evident.
Not according to Scripture….which I will neither read to you or for you.
Gen 35:18
1 Kings Chapter 17 entirety
Luke 16: 19-31
Dear Phil,
Since you don't have scripture to support your statements on time, there is no point in continuing our discussion.
Joe
Thank you.
Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you!
It does not say you are within it (heaven).
It does not say anything about “states of being”.
Is does not say “A person is in heaven when…”
Scripture is being used as the means not to hear, what the scripture says.
The belief in time is easy to dispel:
Go to a past, future, or other time.
Come back to the present.
Tell us how it was.
Simple.
But do not forget this one thing, dear friends: With the Lord a day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years are like a day.
Dear Phil,
Christ's words are "spirit" (John 6:63). Spirit words apply within mankind and their meanings are different than what man's wisdom teaches (1Cor 2:13).
In 2Pet 3:8, when Peter says the a day is like a thousand years, Peter is not teaching about time. Peter is saying that the spirit word "thousand years" is like the Day of the Lord. Peter then goes in the rest of the chapter to teach about the Day of the Lord.
The spirit word "thousand years" represents the judgment of the Elect. That judgment is "like" the Day of the Lord, but it is different in one key aspect from the judgment of the "lost" in the final age. The Elect are saved prior to being judged and the "lost" are judged before they are saved. As a result, the "lost" will suffer wrath during their time of judgment, whereas, the Elect will not.
Rev chapter 19 shows the judgment of the Elect. Since they were "born again" at the Marriage of the Lamb, the Bride (the child of God) will ride with Christ over their own judgment.
Peter is not teaching about time as you believe.
Joe
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