When He Returns!

[bbyrd009]

you know we have a name for those who desire to tell the future Enoch, and wadr "Christian" is not it

 

[Heart2Soul]

This sign of the woman is directly connected to the casting down of Satan and his evil angels from the atmospheric heavens just before the Antichrist takes control of the earth. That is yet future, so you have misapplied the alignment of stars and planets.

this took place last year....and hasn't lined up in such a way in a very long time so I have no idea what you are relating it to....I am relating it to Revelation 12

 

[Enoch111]

this took place last year....and hasn't lined up in such a way in a very long time so I have no idea what you are relating it to....I am relating it to Revelation 12

And Revelation 12 is STILL IN THE FUTURE. So your interpretation is off by many years. Satan is presently "the prince of the power of the air" but when Revelation 12 is fulfilled he will be cast out of the atmospheric heavens (along with his evil angels) and will come down to the earth with great wrath. That is when the Antichrist will take control for 3 1/2 years. Study Rev 12 and 13 as one unit.

 

[Enoch111]

you know we have a name for those who desire to tell the future Enoch, and wadr "Christian" is not it

Well, since God has revealed the future to Christians, you are seriously mistaken. Christians do not have to be prognosticators, but they do have to believe what is revealed in the Word of God.

 

[Naomi25]

Yes, we have a disagreement as to what is literal and what is symbolic. Yet we both use literal and symbolic interpretation. My statement concerning symbols being interpreted in the Bible was to the book of (Revelation) I believe.

And there are symbols used in (Revealtion) but I believed they are understood from other Biblical terminology. I will have to look at those you say you posted to Enoch111.

Stranger

I have been doing a great deal of thought/research on Revelation recently. I still stand behind the symbolic nature of it. And, many of the symbols we actually find used throughout the OT, if we take the time to go back and diligently look for them. However, that said, I do, actually, believe that much of what Revelation teaches will be seen literally. I believe there will be a final Antichrist, and his system will make it woefully hard for Christians living at that time. I believe there will be increasing events like earthquakes, wars, famines.
I know all Amils don't see this, but plenty do. And while this is the interpretation I take, I'm doing my best to understand the others as well, and then keeping my eye on scripture and unfolding world events. I'm not willing to die on the hill of Amillennialism just to prove it's right. I want to follow God's word. I'd be extremely happy to be proved wrong by the Rapture taking place!!

 

[Naomi25]

And that's fine. Nobody says that God does not use metaphors to present spiritual realities. But wholesale spiritualizing is a different matter. Some people want to see parables in everything. Others want to see allegories in everything. Some people want to dismiss the real and tangible altogether.

Whoa! Okay...first off, I have NEVER said that I do, or want to, spiritualize everything. That would be totally wrong and against scripture in every possible way. My point all along has been that we must take the books of scripture as they were written. If they are written as history, then we read them that way. If they are written as Psalms of praise, we take them that way, not history. If they were written as prophecy we read them that way, not as history or praise songs. Apocalyptic literature is slightly different from Prophetic literature in that it often uses symbols and strange visions to illustrate spiritual truths that will then translate into physical realities. That doesn't make it any less true, or valid or important.

Second...well...you seemed to be saying that God never used symbolism in Revelation without specifically telling us (You said, in response to people symbolizing Revelation: "And there is really no need to do that, since the images and symbols are also explained." #165). So...that's fine if you want to re-clarify your statement, but please don't make it seem like I was the one pushing things past the bounds of biblical acceptability. I never did, and I never, at any point, suggested we should.
In fact, if you read back, you will notice that I'm not suggesting that we try and spiritualize things that have what you would call an obvious meaning. I stick to what is clearly symbolic images themselves. So, for example, where John tells us there will be earthquakes...I have no problem with that...an earthquake is an earthquake, right? But when you have stars (which are like our sun, right?) falling to earth, or the sky rolling up like a scroll, only to appear all nice a tight in place next chapter, then you have to agree that it has to be symbolic.

 

[Naomi25]

The woman clothed with the sun is a combination of stars and planets that come together at the right time.....as the scripture says.....I saw a great sign appear in heaven....this did occur last year.

View attachment 3963

woman clothed in the sun revelation - Bing video is a video teaching of it....

Um, yeah. No, it didn't. Sorry. The bible is quite clear on astrology. Trying to use star signs to determine information about human affairs, times, dates, etc, is beyond dodgy, and the bible condemns it. And it was proven, rather spectacularly, last year as the 'sign' came and went and a blessed nothing happened, that said sign was a fake.
We cannot know when Christ is coming. When will people shake the fog from their eyes and take a good, solid grip of the repeated passages that tell us so? When he does, then we'll see signs in the heavens. For us, they will probably be spectacular, for the lost, probably terrifying.


The Coming of the Son of Man
“Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light, and the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. Then will appear in heaven the sign of the Son of Man, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. And he will send out his angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other. - Matthew 24:29–31


This passage tells us that the 'sky' events will happen right at the end of human history, just as Christ returns. If last year was the 'great sign', what was it signalling?

 

[Heart2Soul]

Um, yeah. No, it didn't. Sorry. The bible is quite clear on astrology. Trying to use star signs to determine information about human affairs, times, dates, etc, is beyond dodgy, and the bible condemns it. And it was proven, rather spectacularly, last year as the 'sign' came and went and a blessed nothing happened, that said sign was a fake.
We cannot know when Christ is coming. When will people shake the fog from their eyes and take a good, solid grip of the repeated passages that tell us so? When he does, then we'll see signs in the heavens. For us, they will probably be spectacular, for the lost, probably terrifying.


The Coming of the Son of Man
“Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light, and the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. Then will appear in heaven the sign of the Son of Man, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. And he will send out his angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other. - Matthew 24:29–31


This passage tells us that the 'sky' events will happen right at the end of human history, just as Christ returns. If last year was the 'great sign', what was it signalling?

We aren't even on the same page.....I will just leave it at that.

 

[Stranger]

I have been doing a great deal of thought/research on Revelation recently. I still stand behind the symbolic nature of it. And, many of the symbols we actually find used throughout the OT, if we take the time to go back and diligently look for them. However, that said, I do, actually, believe that much of what Revelation teaches will be seen literally. I believe there will be a final Antichrist, and his system will make it woefully hard for Christians living at that time. I believe there will be increasing events like earthquakes, wars, famines.
I know all Amils don't see this, but plenty do. And while this is the interpretation I take, I'm doing my best to understand the others as well, and then keeping my eye on scripture and unfolding world events. I'm not willing to die on the hill of Amillennialism just to prove it's right. I want to follow God's word. I'd be extremely happy to be proved wrong by the Rapture taking place!!

Without a doubt there are many symbols in the book of Revelation. As was stated at the beginning of the book. (Rev. 1:1) "...and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:" Which means it was made known through the use of signs and symbols.

It is the interpretation of such signs that are important. And I believe they are found in the Scripture themselves.

Or, in other words, it would take the Rapture to occur before you believed it is taught?

Stranger

 

[Naomi25]

We aren't even on the same page.....I will just leave it at that.

Actually...no. I'm sorry I jumped on you so hard, that was not very well done by me. If I'd given it much thought, I would have realized that perhaps you weren't in the same bunch as those calling for that sign as an impending return of Christ then and there.
You obviously think that that alignment held some long-term meaning. Now, I can't promise to agree with you, but I do promise to listen with an open mind this time, if you want to share.

 

[Naomi25]

Without a doubt there are many symbols in the book of Revelation. As was stated at the beginning of the book. (Rev. 1:1) "...and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:" Which means it was made known through the use of signs and symbols.

It is the interpretation of such signs that are important. And I believe they are found in the Scripture themselves.

Or, in other words, it would take the Rapture to occur before you believed it is taught?

Stranger

Maybe, maybe not. Stranger things have happened. Quite often I'll come across some piece of info or evidence from "your side" and it will make me think long and hard. At this point I have eventually answered it in a way that leads me back where I am, but I am far from discounting the possibility that one day I will come across something, or someone will say something that just knocks me off my Amil horse, so to speak. I'm fairly secure where I am, but I don't ever want to be too stubborn to see the truth if it hits me in the face...
Which I know you'll laugh at, because to you, I already have! It's a journey I guess. And we have the blessing in that in this particular topic, thank God, we don't need to be spot on to enjoy the future God has for us.

 

[Stranger]

Maybe, maybe not. Stranger things have happened. Quite often I'll come across some piece of info or evidence from "your side" and it will make me think long and hard. At this point I have eventually answered it in a way that leads me back where I am, but I am far from discounting the possibility that one day I will come across something, or someone will say something that just knocks me off my Amil horse, so to speak. I'm fairly secure where I am, but I don't ever want to be too stubborn to see the truth if it hits me in the face...
Which I know you'll laugh at, because to you, I already have! It's a journey I guess. And we have the blessing in that in this particular topic, thank God, we don't need to be spot on to enjoy the future God has for us.

Not at all sister, I would never laugh at a believer I know was seeking the truth. We differ on the end time events and methods of interpretation but that doesn't mean we are enemies. Though I'm sure I come across that way at times.

Amillennialist's have been great defenders of the faith in the past concerning the Bible and it's inspiration from God, that it is the Word of God. But I do believe in the area of 'last things' or 'eschatology' they have missed it. And of course this pertains to what you and I deem 'literal' or 'symbolical', and if 'symbolical', what does it symbolize?

Stranger

 

[Heart2Soul]

Actually...no. I'm sorry I jumped on you so hard, that was not very well done by me. If I'd given it much thought, I would have realized that perhaps you weren't in the same bunch as those calling for that sign as an impending return of Christ then and there.
You obviously think that that alignment held some long-term meaning. Now, I can't promise to agree with you, but I do promise to listen with an open mind this time, if you want to share.

Thanks....well I have been studying and keeping up the Jewish Calendar of the Feasts, Trumpets and Tabernacles and with the prophesy in the Bible concerning the blood moons and such and so much of Revelation lines up with the Jewish Calendar and in Revelation 12 a sign in the heavens is given to indicate how near we are to His return....What is so fascinating is that we are experiencing events that haven't occurred for a long time....even the Super BLue Blood Moon that occurred this year.....this hasn't happened for 150 years.....any way these signs are confirmation of prophesy in the Bible and what makes them very relevant now as opposed to when they happened in the past is the JEWISH CALENDAR.....so it is a combination of signs in the heavens and the Jewish Traditions.

 

[Heart2Soul]

Here is a very short study on the blood moons and the Jewish feasts

See that when four blood moons happen closely together coinciding with Jewish feasts; Passover and Sukkot, there is an event for Israel and the Jews.

And if there is a total solar eclipse within the four blood moons with the solar eclipse also coinciding with a Jewish feast, there is an event for the world.

The 2014-2015 four blood moons coinciding with Jewish feasts; Passover and Sukkot are the 10th to occur since the first century.

The 2014-2015 blood moons will occur on: –

• Passover, 15th April 2014 – Blood moon
• Sukkot, 8th October 2014 – Blood moon
• (Adar, 20th March 2015 – Total solar eclipse)
• Passover, 4th April 2015 – Blood moon
• Sukkot, 28th September 2015 – Blood moon

2014-2015 blood moons

2014-2015 blood moons
According to NASA, this total blood moon on 28th September 2015 will be at perigee (nearest the earth) meaning it will be a super moon and seen in Jerusalem during the feast of Sukkot while the Jewish people will be dwelling outside in their Sukkahs looking up toward the heavens.

Four blood moons happening coinciding with Jewish feasts will not happen again for 568 years.

The next will happen on;

• 2582-2583 AD
• 2600-2601 AD the last of the four eclipses on Jewish Holidays

It amazes that there is a beginning and end of four blood moons coinciding with Jewish feasts: Passover and Sukkot.

NB: The 2014-2015 blood moons and solar eclipses occur on the same dates as the 70 AD eclipses and during the crucifixion of Jesus Christ in 32-33 AD. It is a clear sign of seasons and times for Israel, the Jews and Christians.

Great events never happened on the world are happening during and after the four blood moons and solar eclipse. See coming events during and after the 2014 – 2015 four blood moons (next).

Sukkot, the feasts of tabernacles (booths) is the day when Jesus dwelt with us. Seen a blood moon at perigee on Sukkot 28th September 2015, which has never been seen before in entire world history, is a clear sign of Jesus coming to dwelt physically again with man.


Here is the link if you want to study further....Significance of Four Blood Moons coinciding with Jewish feasts

 

[Heart2Soul]

I might just pm you on tying in the woman clothed with the sun topic because it is a very deep study.

 

[brakelite]

Um, yeah. No, it didn't. Sorry. The bible is quite clear on astrology. Trying to use star signs to determine information about human affairs, times, dates, etc, is beyond dodgy, and the bible condemns it. And it was proven, rather spectacularly, last year as the 'sign' came and went and a blessed nothing happened, that said sign was a fake.
We cannot know when Christ is coming. When will people shake the fog from their eyes and take a good, solid grip of the repeated passages that tell us so? When he does, then we'll see signs in the heavens. For us, they will probably be spectacular, for the lost, probably terrifying.


The Coming of the Son of Man
“Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light, and the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. Then will appear in heaven the sign of the Son of Man, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. And he will send out his angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other. - Matthew 24:29–31


This passage tells us that the 'sky' events will happen right at the end of human history, just as Christ returns. If last year was the 'great sign', what was it signalling?

Hi sis. How you doing? I would like to recommend a very interesting book for you to read. You may find it online in a free pdf form you can download. The title is The Sting Of The Scorpion. Written by Jonathan Gray. You will understand my recommendation after just the first chapter.

 

[Heart2Soul]

Oh and just to clarify Biblical teaching about the stars are for a sign and seasons is not the astrology that people use for personal interpretation of their personality traits and such that would be a form of witchcraft....but this is what Satan does he counterfeits the things of God in order to create confusion and chaos.

 

[Naomi25]

Hi sis. How you doing? I would like to recommend a very interesting book for you to read. You may find it online in a free pdf form you can download. The title is The Sting Of The Scorpion. Written by Jonathan Gray. You will understand my recommendation after just the first chapter.

Free books! Awesome, thanks, I'll check it out!

 

[Naomi25]

I might just pm you on tying in the woman clothed with the sun topic because it is a very deep study.

Hi! PM me if you wish, I will read it!
So...I read your post, and the page you linked me too. I'm not totally sure I understood it 100%, so bear with me...
I do get that the Feasts are important. That was a new discovery for me, when all this 'sign' business was going on last year, it did actually lead me to figure out how Jesus' first coming fulfilled the first 4...was it? And we can expect his second coming to 'fulfill' the last 3. But I am unsure how he could do that "on schedule", so to speak, and still be "unexpected". If we are expecting Christ to return on one Feast of Trumpets day, then we shall be expecting him, no? Something to ponder on, anyway.
As for all the rest, here's what I understood it saying: that each time in history that four blood moons have coincided with the Passover and Sukkot Feasts, then something 'significant' has happened. The idea also being that the blood moon/eclipse line up that happened in 14/15 that there should be expected something BIG.
My questions about it would be: some of the "events" seem a little wishy washy. Sure, they happened, but stuff is always happening. You could probably point a finger at any point along the timeline and find some similar 'event'...for some of them, anyway. The date of the Crucifixion, Jerusalem's destruction seem super legit, as does Israel's rebirth. You would expect, perhaps, that this 'super confluence' in 14/15 we should have seen something rather spectacular, yes? The site does't mention what (or I missed it).
It also seems to suggest that after the uber moons of 14/15 that's it...Rapture time. Clearly that didn't happen. If that's the case, how can we take any of what they say seriously? Have they not just been proven false prophets, of a sort?
Please see these as legit questions that I'm asking, because I honestly wonder them...I'm not trying to revert to bad behavior!

 

[Naomi25]

Oh and just to clarify Biblical teaching about the stars are for a sign and seasons is not the astrology that people use for personal interpretation of their personality traits and such that would be a form of witchcraft....but this is what Satan does he counterfeits the things of God in order to create confusion and chaos.

So, what do we say about star signs, like virgo, and ...the other ones, that I can't remember.
Are we saying that God made the stars first, and like the gay movement pinching the rainbow, they've pinched the stars and what goes on up there and just put in a lot of hokus pokus?