Why Civilization Should Defend Zionism

[Truthnightmare]

Zion is in the Bible. It is a simple fact.

LANGUAGE USAGE: Zion refers to Canaan or Palestine or Israel, generally, and a mountain therein, specifically. It’s like when people reference Washington. Is it a person, a geographical area or the seat of power?

Yes, Zion is a Jewish place and Zionism is a political movement about that Jewish place.

Isaiah 60:14
14 The children of your oppressors will come bowing before you; all who despise you will bow down at your feet and will call you the City of the LORD, Zion of the Holy One of Israel.

You say Jewish state, the Bible says Israel, so again you lump the house of Judah some being called Jews with the house of Israel.

And in that is the reason you can’t answer who the fake Jews are that Jesus spoke of, nor can you explain the good and bad figs.

Then you claim Zionism started with Joshua, so now you have given yourself some authority to correct Zionist on there own dates… this is absurd.

 

[Wrangler]

You say Jewish state, the Bible says Israel, so again you lump the house of Judah some being called Jews with the house of Israel.

Yup, I do that. That's exactly right. The terms are now synonyms. I've asked repeatedly what is the difference and you cannot provide a straight answer. Salvation comes through the Jews, the Bible tells us - not through Israel. But you have no response to that either (other than claim it is a bad translation - but many translations render).

KJ21
Ye worship ye know not what; we know what we worship, for salvation is of the Jews.
ASV
Ye worship that which ye know not: we worship that which we know; for salvation is from the Jews.
AMP
You [Samaritans] do not know what you worship; we [Jews] do know what we worship, for salvation is from the Jews.
AMPC
You [Samaritans] do not know what you are worshiping [you worship what you do not comprehend]. We do know what we are worshiping [we worship what we have knowledge of and understand], for [after all] salvation comes from [among] the Jews.
BRG
Ye worship ye know not what: we know what we worship: for salvation is of the Jews.
CSB
You Samaritans worship what you do not know. We worship what we do know, because salvation is from the Jews.
CEB
You and your people worship what you don’t know; we worship what we know because salvation is from the Jews.
CJB
You people don’t know what you are worshipping; we worship what we do know, because salvation comes from the Jews.
CEV
You Samaritans don't really know the one you worship. But we Jews do know the God we worship, and by using us, God will save the world.
DARBY
Ye worship ye know not what; we worship what we know, for salvation is of the Jews.
DLNT
You Samaritans worship what you do not know. We Jews worship what we know, because salvation is from the Jews.
DRA
You adore that which you know not: we adore that which we know; for salvation is of the Jews.
ERV
You Samaritans worship something you don’t understand. We Jews understand what we worship, since salvation comes from the Jews.
EASY
You people from Samaria do not know the one that you worship. But we Jews do know him, because God's salvation comes from among the Jewish people.
EHV
You Samaritans worship what you do not know. We worship what we do know, because salvation is from the Jews.
ESV
You worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, for salvation is from the Jews.
ESVUK
You worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, for salvation is from the Jews.
EXB
You Samaritans worship something you don’t understand. We [C Jews] understand what we worship, because salvation comes from the Jews [C because the Messiah who brings salvation comes through the Jews].
GNV
Ye worship that which ye know not: we worship that which we know: for salvation is of the Jews.
GW
You don’t know what you’re worshiping. We ⌞Jews⌟ know what we’re worshiping, because salvation comes from the Jews.
GNT
You Samaritans do not really know whom you worship; but we Jews know whom we worship, because it is from the Jews that salvation comes.
HCSB
You Samaritans worship what you do not know. We worship what we do know, because salvation is from the Jews.
ICB
You Samaritans worship what you don’t understand. We Jews understand what we worship. Salvation comes from the Jews.
ISV
You don’t know what you’re worshiping. We Jews know what we’re worshiping, because salvation comes from the Jews.
PHILLIPS
“Believe me,” returned Jesus, “the time is coming when worshipping the Father will not be a matter of ‘on this hill-side’ or ‘in Jerusalem’. Nowadays you are worshipping with your eyes shut. We Jews are worshipping with our eyes open, for the salvation of mankind is to come from our race. Yet the time is coming, yes, and has already come, when true worshippers will worship in spirit and in reality. Indeed, the Father looks for men who will worship him like that. God is spirit, and those who worship him can only worship in spirit and in reality.”
JUB
Ye worship what ye know not; we worship what we know, for saving health is of the Jews.
KJV
Ye worship ye know not what: we know what we worship: for salvation is of the Jews.
AKJV
Ye worship ye know not what: we know what we worship: for salvation is of the Jews.
LSB
You worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, for salvation is from the Jews.
LEB
You worship what you do not know. We worship what we know, because salvation is from the Jews.
TLB
Jesus replied, “The time is coming, ma’am, when we will no longer be concerned about whether to worship the Father here or in Jerusalem. For it’s not where we worship that counts, but how we worship—is our worship spiritual and real? Do we have the Holy Spirit’s help? For God is Spirit, and we must have his help to worship as we should. The Father wants this kind of worship from us. But you Samaritans know so little about him, worshiping blindly, while we Jews know all about him, for salvation comes to the world through the Jews.”
MSG
“Believe me, woman, the time is coming when you Samaritans will worship the Father neither here at this mountain nor there in Jerusalem. You worship guessing in the dark; we Jews worship in the clear light of day. God’s way of salvation is made available through the Jews. But the time is coming—it has, in fact, come—when what you’re called will not matter and where you go to worship will not matter. “It’s who you are and the way you live that count before God. Your worship must engage your spirit in the pursuit of truth. That’s the kind of people the Father is out looking for: those who are simply and honestly themselves before him in their worship. God is sheer being itself—Spirit. Those who worship him must do it out of their very being, their spirits, their true selves, in adoration.”
MEV
You worship what you do not know; we know what we worship, for salvation is of the Jews.
MOUNCE
You Samaritans worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, because · salvation is from the Jews.
NOG
You don’t know what you’re worshiping. We Jews know what we’re worshiping, because salvation comes from the Jews.
NABRE
You people worship what you do not understand; we worship what we understand, because salvation is from the Jews.
NASB
You Samaritans worship what you do not know; we worship what we do know, because salvation is from the Jews.
NASB1995

 

[Wrangler]

You worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, for salvation is from the Jews.
NCB
You worship what you do not know; we worship what we do know, for salvation is from the Jews.
NCV
You Samaritans worship something you don’t understand. We understand what we worship, because salvation comes from the Jews.
NET
You people worship what you do not know. We worship what we know, because salvation is from the Jews.
NIRV
You Samaritans worship what you do not know. We worship what we do know. Salvation comes from the Jews.
NIV
You Samaritans worship what you do not know; we worship what we do know, for salvation is from the Jews.
NIVUK
You Samaritans worship what you do not know; we worship what we do know, for salvation is from the Jews.
NKJV
You worship what you do not know; we know what we worship, for salvation is of the Jews.
NLV
You people do not know what you worship. We Jews know what we worship. It is through the Jews that men are saved from the punishment of their sins.
NLT
You Samaritans know very little about the one you worship, while we Jews know all about him, for salvation comes through the Jews.
NMB
You Samaritans worship you know not what. We know what we worship, for salvation comes of the Jews.
NRSVA
You worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, for salvation is from the Jews.
NRSVACE
You worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, for salvation is from the Jews.
NRSVCE
You worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, for salvation is from the Jews.
NRSVUE
You worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, for salvation is from the Jews.
NTFE
You worship what you don’t know. We worship what we do know; salvation, you see, is indeed from the Jews.
OJB
You worship that of which you do not have da’as [MELACHIM BAIS 17:28-41]; we worship that of which we have da’as, because Yeshu’at Eloheinu (salvation) is from the Yehudim [Isa 2:3; Ro 9:3].
RGT
“You worship that which you do not know. We worship that which we know. For salvation is from the Jews.
RSV
You worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, for salvation is from the Jews.
RSVCE
You worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, for salvation is from the Jews.
TLV
You worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, for salvation is from the Jews.
VOICE
Jesus: Woman, I tell you that neither is so. Believe this: a new day is coming—in fact, it’s already here—when the importance will not be placed on the time and place of worship but on the truthful hearts of worshipers. You worship what you don’t know while we worship what we do know, for God’s salvation is coming through the Jews. The Father is spirit, and He is seeking followers whose worship is sourced in truth and deeply spiritual as well. Regardless of whether you are in Jerusalem or on this mountain, if you do not seek the Father, then you do not worship.
WEB
You worship that which you don’t know. We worship that which we know; for salvation is from the Jews.
WE
But the time is coming, yes, the time is here already, when those who worship God will worship him in spirit and in a true way. My Father is looking for that kind of people to worship him.
WYC
Ye worship that that ye know not; we worship that that we know; for health is of the Jews.
YLT
ye worship what ye have not known; we worship what we have known, because the salvation is of the Jews;

 

[Wrangler]

That’s when you say it started, you have no evidence to support this, not even the Zionist believe this

What more evidence do you require than God commanding Joshua to conquor Canaan?

 

[Wrangler]

Not sure what conclusion you seek to draw from this set of facts? Every movement had a beginning. So what?

P.S. you’re still wrong… lol

Insightful reply. LOL

 

[Truthnightmare]

Yup, I do that. That's exactly right. The terms are now synonyms. I've asked repeatedly what is the difference and you cannot provide a straight answer. Salvation comes through the Jews, the Bible tells us - not through Israel. But you have no response to that either (other than claim it is a bad translation - but many translations render).

KJ21
Ye worship ye know not what; we know what we worship, for salvation is of the Jews.
ASV
Ye worship that which ye know not: we worship that which we know; for salvation is from the Jews.
AMP
You [Samaritans] do not know what you worship; we [Jews] do know what we worship, for salvation is from the Jews.
AMPC
You [Samaritans] do not know what you are worshiping [you worship what you do not comprehend]. We do know what we are worshiping [we worship what we have knowledge of and understand], for [after all] salvation comes from [among] the Jews.
BRG
Ye worship ye know not what: we know what we worship: for salvation is of the Jews.
CSB
You Samaritans worship what you do not know. We worship what we do know, because salvation is from the Jews.
CEB
You and your people worship what you don’t know; we worship what we know because salvation is from the Jews.
CJB
You people don’t know what you are worshipping; we worship what we do know, because salvation comes from the Jews.
CEV
You Samaritans don't really know the one you worship. But we Jews do know the God we worship, and by using us, God will save the world.
DARBY
Ye worship ye know not what; we worship what we know, for salvation is of the Jews.
DLNT
You Samaritans worship what you do not know. We Jews worship what we know, because salvation is from the Jews.
DRA
You adore that which you know not: we adore that which we know; for salvation is of the Jews.
ERV
You Samaritans worship something you don’t understand. We Jews understand what we worship, since salvation comes from the Jews.
EASY
You people from Samaria do not know the one that you worship. But we Jews do know him, because God's salvation comes from among the Jewish people.
EHV
You Samaritans worship what you do not know. We worship what we do know, because salvation is from the Jews.
ESV
You worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, for salvation is from the Jews.
ESVUK
You worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, for salvation is from the Jews.
EXB
You Samaritans worship something you don’t understand. We [C Jews] understand what we worship, because salvation comes from the Jews [C because the Messiah who brings salvation comes through the Jews].
GNV
Ye worship that which ye know not: we worship that which we know: for salvation is of the Jews.
GW
You don’t know what you’re worshiping. We ⌞Jews⌟ know what we’re worshiping, because salvation comes from the Jews.
GNT
You Samaritans do not really know whom you worship; but we Jews know whom we worship, because it is from the Jews that salvation comes.
HCSB
You Samaritans worship what you do not know. We worship what we do know, because salvation is from the Jews.
ICB
You Samaritans worship what you don’t understand. We Jews understand what we worship. Salvation comes from the Jews.
ISV
You don’t know what you’re worshiping. We Jews know what we’re worshiping, because salvation comes from the Jews.
PHILLIPS
“Believe me,” returned Jesus, “the time is coming when worshipping the Father will not be a matter of ‘on this hill-side’ or ‘in Jerusalem’. Nowadays you are worshipping with your eyes shut. We Jews are worshipping with our eyes open, for the salvation of mankind is to come from our race. Yet the time is coming, yes, and has already come, when true worshippers will worship in spirit and in reality. Indeed, the Father looks for men who will worship him like that. God is spirit, and those who worship him can only worship in spirit and in reality.”
JUB
Ye worship what ye know not; we worship what we know, for saving health is of the Jews.
KJV
Ye worship ye know not what: we know what we worship: for salvation is of the Jews.
AKJV
Ye worship ye know not what: we know what we worship: for salvation is of the Jews.
LSB
You worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, for salvation is from the Jews.
LEB
You worship what you do not know. We worship what we know, because salvation is from the Jews.
TLB
Jesus replied, “The time is coming, ma’am, when we will no longer be concerned about whether to worship the Father here or in Jerusalem. For it’s not where we worship that counts, but how we worship—is our worship spiritual and real? Do we have the Holy Spirit’s help? For God is Spirit, and we must have his help to worship as we should. The Father wants this kind of worship from us. But you Samaritans know so little about him, worshiping blindly, while we Jews know all about him, for salvation comes to the world through the Jews.”
MSG
“Believe me, woman, the time is coming when you Samaritans will worship the Father neither here at this mountain nor there in Jerusalem. You worship guessing in the dark; we Jews worship in the clear light of day. God’s way of salvation is made available through the Jews. But the time is coming—it has, in fact, come—when what you’re called will not matter and where you go to worship will not matter. “It’s who you are and the way you live that count before God. Your worship must engage your spirit in the pursuit of truth. That’s the kind of people the Father is out looking for: those who are simply and honestly themselves before him in their worship. God is sheer being itself—Spirit. Those who worship him must do it out of their very being, their spirits, their true selves, in adoration.”
MEV
You worship what you do not know; we know what we worship, for salvation is of the Jews.
MOUNCE
You Samaritans worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, because · salvation is from the Jews.
NOG
You don’t know what you’re worshiping. We Jews know what we’re worshiping, because salvation comes from the Jews.
NABRE
You people worship what you do not understand; we worship what we understand, because salvation is from the Jews.
NASB
You Samaritans worship what you do not know; we worship what we do know, because salvation is from the Jews.
NASB1995

Again… you simply don’t understand translation and transliteration.
Are Chinese Jews descended from Jacob?

I can’t take your argument seriously until you tell me who are the fake Jews! You don’t seem to know and in the same breath you claim to know who the true tribe of Judah is.

Jesus was a descent of Eber, (Hebrew) the Hebrews went into bondage, the Jews Jesus spoke to in John 8 never went into bondage, how do you explain this? You cant because you have not read and understood.

 

[Truthnightmare]

Insightful reply. LOL

Ok…
Jeremiah 31:31
x
הִנֵּ֛ה יָמִ֥ים בָּאִ֖ים נְאֻם־יְהוָ֑ה וְכָרַתִּ֗י אֶת־בֵּ֧ית יִשְׂרָאֵ֛ל וְאֶת־בֵּ֥ית יְהוּדָ֖ה בְּרִ֥ית חֲדָשָֽׁה

If you will notice in the verse that the House of Judah before translation is יְהוּדָ֖ה

Original Word: יְהוּדָה
Part of Speech: Proper Name Masculine
Transliteration: Yehudah
Phonetic Spelling: (yeh-hoo-daw')
Definition: probably "praised", a son of Jacob, also his desc., the S. kingdom, also four Israelites

In the above verse the two house are mentioned separately from one another, which immediately dismisses you lumping them all together.

Insight? Let’s utilize the manuscripts from here on out, perhaps whe can gain such insight.

 

[Wrangler]

In the above verse the two house are mentioned separately from one another, which immediately dismisses you lumping them all together.

Friend, you are abusing history. Once Virginia was a colony of Britain, then of the US then of the Confederacy. People use language to refer to things as they are now. For instance, Israel was once a united kingdom, then divided, then the kingdom was over-run (for 2,000 years) and now there is again just one kingdom.

People call Israel and Jew synonymously today. Today a Jew is not from what we call Judea but what we call Israel.

Your argument boils down to semantics.

 

[Wrangler]

Are Chinese Jews descended from Jacob?

Yes. They are spiritually descended, the same way Gentiles are descended from Abraham.

Galatians 3:7
English Standard Version
7 Know then that it is those of faith who are the sons of Abraham.

You are invoking racism in your argument, that genetic material is where it is at. No other country is held to that standard.

 

[Truthnightmare]

Friend, you are abusing history. Once Virginia was a colony of Britain, then of the US then of the Confederacy. People use language to refer to things as they are now. For instance, Israel was once a united kingdom, then divided, then the kingdom was over-run (for 2,000 years) and now there is again just one kingdom.

People call Israel and Jew synonymously today. Today a Jew is not from what we call Judea but what we call Israel.

Your argument boils down to semantics.

I don’t care what people call it today. The Bible says God separated Israel into two houses.
1 King 12

God gave them different prophecies, and different prophets.

Israel went into Assyrian captivity.
Judah went into Babylonian captivity.

People call Israel and Jew synonymously today. Today a Jew is not from what we call Judea but what we call Israel.

Now your real colors are showing! You care more about what people call things than what God calls things.

Acts 5:29
Then Peter and the other apostles answered and said, We ought to obey God rather than men

What else did God say????

Ezekiel 37
15 The word of the Lord came again unto me, saying,

16 Moreover, thou son of man, take thee one stick, and write upon it, For Judah, and for the children of Israel his companions: then take another stick, and write upon it, For Joseph, the stick of Ephraim and for all the house of Israel his companions:

Two sticks… and because people want to call it one stick you say I’m arguing semantics.

Nonsense, people say men can babies now, you believe that to?
People say we are going to die because of cow farts, you believe that to?

I find it utterly reprehensible that your rebuttal to scriptural evidence is “well people use it this way”

 

[Truthnightmare]

Yes. They are spiritually descended, the same way Gentiles are descended from Abraham.

Galatians 3:7
English Standard Version
7 Know then that it is those of faith who are the sons of Abraham.

You are invoking racism in your argument, that genetic material is where it is at. No other country is held to that standard.

Again… until you tell me exactly who the fake Jews are your argument is BS.

 

[Wrangler]

I don’t care what people call it today.

Again, we are not speaking the same language. Since you don't care, why are you making post after post about the semantics of supporting God's people in Israel?

 

[Wrangler]

Again… until you tell me exactly who the fake Jews are your argument is BS.

Again, you are claiming there is such a thing as fake Jews. The burden is on you. It is your argument that is BS on many layers.

NOTE: The 6 reasons in the OP why civilization should support Israel has nothing to do with a real-fake dichotomy of Jewry.

 

[Wrangler]

Now your real colors are showing! You care more about what people call things than what God calls things.

I'm OK with that as God understand me and my heart. People get confused when you use words that mean something different. So, I communicate for people's benefit not God's, since he already knows all.

Nice personal attack again though.

 

[Wrangler]

Two sticks… and because people want to call it one stick you say I’m arguing semantics.

Yup. Israel = Jew in the common meaning of the word, even if you seek to invoke Biblical gnosticism.

 

[Truthnightmare]

Again, we are not speaking the same language. Since you don't care, why are you making post after post about the semantics of supporting God's people in Israel?

Who are the fake Jews? Why can’t you answer?
Sorry, can’t take anything you say seriously concerning Jews until you answer who the fake Jews are. At this point you are just as fake as the fake Jews you worship.

 

[Wrangler]

Who are the fake Jews? Why can’t you answer?
Sorry, can’t take anything you say seriously concerning Jews until you answer who the fake Jews are. At this point you are just as fake as the fake Jews you worship.

I deny the validity of your implied premise. There are no fake Jews.

 

[Truthnightmare]

I deny the validity of your implied premise. There are no fake Jews.

And you claim I’m playing semantics, always accuse others of what you do, you must be a democrat.

Anyhow… Who are the Jews be spoken of here?

Revelation 2:9
I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan.

And here…

Revelation 3:9
Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.

Cue the Jeopardy final answer theme.

 

[Wrangler]

Cue the Jeopardy final answer theme.

Distraction. Cannot touch the OP reasons.

 

[Truthnightmare]

Distraction. Cannot touch the OP reasons.

Refusing to answer such a simple question tells me all I need to know.
The OP is a joke, even the Zionist don’t claim what you claim. Shall we look at when the Zionist say Zionism started, compared to when you say it did?
And when the contradiction is pointed out you expect people to believe you and not the Zionist you support. What else are the Zionist wrong about? Lol