Why do so many Christians vehemently disagree?

[marks]

Perhaps if we didn't search out hundreds of negative things to post, declaring them as "FACTS", we wouldn't incite argument? @Willie T

You have a problem and I don’t know why the admin doesn’t put you off dude. I was reading post after post of yours and you’re the negative one. Jesus condemned the hypocrites. Blame another for a sin you commit. Clever. Not

Do you not think that people post negativity to raise a rucus, sometimes?

Much love!

 

[FHII]

Followed this forum and saw him abuse three folks just with time I watched.

Give me the details... Which thread and which posts. I will have a look at them.

I see you agree he’s wrong and nobody said he’s not a brother but if a brother sins he needs rebuke

I think he's wrong about Halloween, an I did say something. He responded. It was an exchange and it's over with.

If you look at posts nobody said nothing to Willie and he gets mean. Somebody who does that is sinning outright So if he’s going to abuse as long as it’s not you he’s abusing you’re ok with it then we read a different bible.

Well, ok. I will have a look. Care to post it?

 

[Not me]

Probably because there's to much 'me' and not enough 'Him'.

I had to chuckle when I read this. You hit the nail on the head. To much self and not enough Christ.

Be well and may God increase Himself in your innermost being.

In Christ, Not me

 

[FHII]

I had to chuckle when I read this. You hit the nail on the head. To much self and not enough Christ.

Be well and may God increase Himself in your innermost being.

In Christ, Not me

Yea... That's what it comes down to. Although everyone claims they are defending and preaching Christ.

 

[Not me]

Yea... That's what it comes down to. Although everyone claims they are defending and preaching Christ.

By their fruits shall you know them.

Be blessed as He becomes more and more real in us, Not me

 

[prism]

I know that not all have the Holy Spirit and that there are false brethren. But why so much disagreement among professing believers?

That there is a large piece of the pie. Many professors but less possessors.

 

[ScottA]

I've been in churches that have broken up and those that have remained stable. Yet one theme I see constantly running through churches and Christian forums are Christians who vehemently disagree - about Scripture, about prophecy, about whether we're to act or be passive, and about the color of the moon.

I know that not all have the Holy Spirit and that there are false brethren. But why so much disagreement among professing believers?

I'm curious to know others' beliefs about this.

Do you have brothers or sisters?
Do you ever disagree with them?
Are you not still family in spite of your differences?

Do you really believe that if a group of toddlers got together and did church according to their level of understanding, that they would be in complete harmony with teens, adults, parents, or seniors; that they would all completely agree "about Scripture, about prophecy, about whether we're to act or be passive, and about the color of the moon?"

How is it that you do not understand something so basic about family?

 

[brakelite]

Personally, I believe that having many different Bible translations has something to do with it.

There is enough of a difference from translation to translation that if one person holds to one and another holds to another, the message on certain doctrines is lost in some translations and in some perhaps even the opposite message is relayed to the reader.

Having recently purchased a New Living Translation, I have noticed how certain things that have ministered to me in the past in the kjv are simply taken away through the rendering given in the NLT.

One example of this is in the following:

First, the kjv:

Tit 2:11, For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,
Tit 2:12, Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;
Tit 2:13, Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;
Tit 2:14, Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

Now, the NLT:

Tit 2:11, For the grace of God has been revealed, bringing salvation to all people.
Tit 2:12, And we are instructed to turn from godless living and sinful pleasures. We should live in this evil world with wisdom, righteousness, and devotion to God,
Tit 2:13, while we look forward with hope to that wonderful day when the glory of our great God and Savior, Jesus Christ, will be revealed.
Tit 2:14, He gave his life to free us from every kind of sin, to cleanse us, and to make us his very own people, totally committed to doing good deeds.

While in the latter rendering, one might still be able to retain the understanding that it is the grace of God that teaches us to deny ungodliness and worldly lusts, it seems to me that the message is not as clear as in the kjv; which clearly shows this truth.

In fact, I would say that in order to glean this truth out of reading the NLT, one would have to know what the kjv says and apply it to the NLT when they read it.

Thus, reading the NLT alone would cheat a person out of a specific Bible truth when it comes to this passage. And that is not the only passage that is like this.

I would also ask you, according to the verses you quoted, what is the blessed hope? The actual appearing of our Lord and Savior, or the appearing of glory?

 

[justbyfaith]

I would also ask you, according to the verses you quoted, what is the blessed hope?

In the kjv, it doesn't say.

In the NLT, one might wrongly conclude that it is speaking of the glorious appearing.

 

[farouk]

In the kjv, it doesn't say.

In the NLT, one might wrongly conclude that it is speaking of the glorious appearing.

I do appreciate the KJV a lot.

 

[justbyfaith]

I do appreciate the KJV a lot.

Yes...I love its poetic value...and I also consider it to be the most accurate of all the translations that we have at our disposal.

 

[farouk]

Yes...I love its poetic value...and I also consider it to be the most accurate of all the translations that we have at our disposal.

I would tend to agree on both counts.

 

[Soverign Grace]

For the simply reason that Satan is actively at work sowing (a)seeds of spiritual confusion, (b) false doctrines, (c) false practices, and (d) the works of the flesh (carnality) (Gal 5:19-21).

Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these;
Adultery,
fornication,
uncleanness,
lasciviousness,
Idolatry,
witchcraft,
hatred,
variance,
emulations,
wrath,
strife,
seditions,
heresies,
Envyings,
murders,
drunkenness,
revellings, and such like:
...of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

Good point. This is right in Scripture for all to see - so why aren't Christians recognizing when the tempter is sowing seeds of discord? Our old pastor told me that a family who had joined a pretty sizable church caused so much division that there are many people today who refuse to step into a church. This was just one example - I've heard of a number. I was reading where pastors are at loggerheads. I spoke with a member of our church who said he's leaving due to the church being cold. Are pastors/ Christians refusing to look at their own sin or the sin in their congregations?

 

[farouk]

By their fruits shall you know them.

Such an important principle, mentioned by the Lord Jesus (Matthew 7.20).

Paul was saying something similar in other words in Ephesians 2.9.

 

[Soverign Grace]

I would add that it seems that so many Christians have not been taught to identify the flesh (sin nature) when it's at work. We are to count the flesh as crucified, but how can we do this if we don't understand it?

Also, Christians need to be taught to walk by the Spirit (i.e. submit to the Holy Spirit's working in our daily lives) so that His fruit can be developed in us. If all Christians were to walk by the Spirit and not the flesh, there would be no dissensions in the body of Christ. This is something we can learn to do as we grow in Him through the process of sanctification.

Galatians 5:15-- So I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the flesh.

I wonder what you should do when dealing with carnal Christians who refuse to walk by the Spirit?

 

[Soverign Grace]

Personally, I believe that having many different Bible translations has something to do with it.

There is enough of a difference from translation to translation that if one person holds to one and another holds to another, the message on certain doctrines is lost in some translations and in some perhaps even the opposite message is relayed to the reader.

Having recently purchased a New Living Translation, I have noticed how certain things that have ministered to me in the past in the kjv are simply taken away through the rendering given in the NLT.

One example of this is in the following:

First, the kjv:

Tit 2:11, For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,
Tit 2:12, Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;
Tit 2:13, Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;
Tit 2:14, Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

Now, the NLT:

Tit 2:11, For the grace of God has been revealed, bringing salvation to all people.
Tit 2:12, And we are instructed to turn from godless living and sinful pleasures. We should live in this evil world with wisdom, righteousness, and devotion to God,
Tit 2:13, while we look forward with hope to that wonderful day when the glory of our great God and Savior, Jesus Christ, will be revealed.
Tit 2:14, He gave his life to free us from every kind of sin, to cleanse us, and to make us his very own people, totally committed to doing good deeds.

While in the latter rendering, one might still be able to retain the understanding that it is the grace of God that teaches us to deny ungodliness and worldly lusts, it seems to me that the message is not as clear as in the kjv; which clearly shows this truth.

In fact, I would say that in order to glean this truth out of reading the NLT, one would have to know what the kjv says and apply it to the NLT when they read it.

Thus, reading the NLT alone would cheat a person out of a specific Bible truth when it comes to this passage. And that is not the only passage that is like this.

That's something that may have something to do with divisions. I stopped using all translations other than the KJV. Then I read something about that. But for right now it's the only version I use. I wanted what I thought would be the purest form of what God inspired men to write.

We had several people leave our bible study because they didn't agree with the pastor's teaching. There seem to be so many Christians going in separate directions. I'm watching all this and wondering why they all can't unite against the real evils in the world instead of fighting each other.

 

[Soverign Grace]

Because Christians are human. Humans enjoy arguing, believing they're right and the others wrong, and respect doesn't come natively.

I think you're right Jane Doe.

 

[Deborah_]

why so much disagreement among professing believers?

Because we don't put Romans 14 into practice:
"Accept the one whose faith is weak, without quarrelling over disputable matters." (verse 1)
"One person considers one day more sacred than another; another considers every day alike. Each of them should be fully convinced in their own mind." (verse 5)
"Therefore let us stop passing judgement on one another." (verse 13)
"Let us therefore make every effort to do what leads to peace and to mutual edification." (verse 19)

Personally, I believe that having many different Bible translations has something to do with it.

I must beg to differ - having been in many churches and home groups where individual people use different translations (I would say that's normal in the UK). We compare one version with another not to set them up against each other but in order to gain a better overall understanding of the passage. So it doesn't have to cause arguments.

 

[Soverign Grace]

It's an interesting question, especially when the Bible clearly says it shouldn't be that way. One thing I am convinced in my studies of Christian history is that it's nothing new. There were far more controversies in the New Testament than people like to admit. Furthermore, after NT times bickering and opposing doctrines persisted, often times leading to deaths of many up through the middle ages. Even before the emergence of Protestantism, there were controversies and dire consequences for coming up on the wrong side.

Exploring why these things happen is easy to brainstorm, but hard to pinpoint. So I will just brainstorm, but ultimately, I think it comes down to Man's ego.

Brainstorming:

The Bible was divided into verses, this leading to focus on one particular verse instead of the overall point. For example, many can quote John 3:16 but few can discuss what the overall discussion was about.

Doctrines arose to try to explain what the Bible doesn't fully explain. For example, the Trinity, Birth of Christ and Easter (the latter two on when exactly they occured).

Pet doctrines. For example, faith, Grace, water baptism, baptism, holiness, love, prophecy. Some folks focus heavily on them and believe they hold prescident over the others. I am probably guilty (even though I am right ) because I focus on Grace and faith heavily.

Ego. Some folks just have the need to be appreciated and look smart or spiritual. There is nothing wrong with jumping into a debate as iron sharpens iron. But some folks want to be a leading guru. That leads to other wanna be gurus challenging them.

(I love debating, but not as much I used to. I think it's healthy as long as your motive is right. Ask yourself, "what am I looking to get out of this exchange"? Then examine your answer.)

Hatred for God's chosen preachers/prophets or servants. They were persecuted all through the BiblIe and even today not many trust the pastor as much as they trust their own family.

Different translations and versions? Maybe up to a point. But I doubt that's as big a problem as other things.

Satan... Well, yea... He's behind it most of it. I just wonder how actively. He probably doesn't push every button that can be pushed; he just probably pushes the right ones and lets us do the rest.

Again, none of this is doctrine... It's just brainstorming, which is throwing ideas out there. And I will say I may be guilty of a few.

That's why I brought it up - the Bible speaks of unity among believers so why is this being ignored? To me - there is so much evil in the world for Christians to unite and fight yet they fight one another over petty things and it makes no sense.

We were in a legalistic church one time and there was one man who was incensed because another church member took his kids to McDonalds on a Sunday and Sunday was supposed to be the day of rest and he was making another work.

At the same church we accidentally sat in an area saved for young children. I turned around and saw the usher look at me with such hatred on his face that it took me aback. He walked over and strongly rebuked us and told us to move - in the midst of the sermon. We left there. The pastor's wife ended up committing suicide. I think it was because of the people there who were putting each other under a microscope. The pastor was one of the best bible teachers I've heard but it was such a shame - it seemed like Satan had a field day there. But why didn't people see it?

How did you come to the conclusion that there were far more controversies in the NT than people like to admit? I've never read Josephus so don't know any church history.

 

[Soverign Grace]

If by "vehemently" you meant zealously, passionately, with strong emotions, etc., it's primarily because of demonic influence. Evil spirits goad Christians to manifest resentment, anger, defensiveness, pride, self-ambition, etc when another presents an argument that counters their stance on a particular issue. They react according to demonic leading instead of the Spirit's. Only those who abide in a Spirit of Peace have the ability to search matters out with one another to a sound conclusion. And we still live in a time when most Christians give themselves to demonic influence rather than the Spirit of God.

Thankfully this will come to end eventually, when the church comes under severe judgment for it. The only ones left standing will be those who trained themselves to obey God's Spirit alone. How long till this judgment comes, only time will tell, but you can tell who will survive the judgment in your own circles by watching who abides by the rule of God and who does not (James 3:13). Granted, it's not an easy lesson to learn, but when you know there is going to be a heavy price tag attached some day, it sort of changes your perspective a little, LoL.

Blessings, sister, and good question.

I think you have a very good point Hidden. I think Satan does enter in - and what more fruitful work he must do than among Christians? He must dance with glee.

I've seen other Christians absolve even the most terrible of actions and I wonder what kind of Christians they really are within themselves. They don't see it or grasp it when it's in their very midst.

We attended a church one time that a family owned and the youth pastor had a huge ego and was all into who he was connected to. I didn't like him - I just sensed undercurrents in him and my instincts turned out to be correct. We were in bible study one time and his father asked us to pray because his son - the youth pastor - was getting dizzy spells and passing out. The youth pastor was then in a car accident and killed a woman. I remember talking to one of the sycophants that worked for the family and I remarked that it was a shame that he killed a woman. It was as if a recorder was switched on in her head and she repeated the company line, saying "poor youth pastor but we're so glad he's alright!" Not a word was said about the woman he killed. It was really freaky. And we all knew he had been getting dizzy spells yet he was exonerated by police. He shouldn't have been driving. Everybody rallied around the poor youth pastor - but what about the poor woman? To my knowledge none of those good Christians rallied around the dead woman's family or did anything for them. No collection and no mention was made of it in church.

That's when I saw that "Christians" would sell out anybody. We left the church and the youth pastor and his family were in the nationwide news for something they had done corrupt. That's when I saw that "Judgment begins with the house of God." Do I wish it had been done sooner? Yes - but it took almost a decade of wrongdoing but they were slammed and lost their business and got embroiled with legal troubles. Their name is mud.

But what struck me was not only the actions of the corrupt family and youth pastor but the exoneration of the people who attended the church. They were willing to go along with wrong.

So I have to agree with you that many Christians give themselves to demonic influence - or they exonerate those who do and think nothing of it. But as you've said this will come to an end. Scripture says "Judgement begins with the House of God." And it does help to know there will be a heavy price tag attached to such evil.

Very salient points!