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Featured Without unconditional Election,no one would be saved.

Discussion in 'Christian Theology Forum' started by Anthony D'Arienzo, Mar 22, 2019.

  1. farouk

    farouk Well-Known Member

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    Reading Ephesians gives a wonderful account of the power and blessing of transforming grace! :)
     
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  2. bbyrd009

    bbyrd009 Groper

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    well imo that is adroit, and I used it myself forever, but obv we have identified a body of believers, right, "the Church at Ephesus" being a fab (and misinterpreted) one, none of which I note are here testifying of you, right. So "Church at Ephesus" fits quite poetically here, not saying that you are not in that "us," but am saying that you are testifying of yourself, obviously, and even suggesting "commending ourselves to each other" I guess, which don't get me wrong ok, I understand, but it just isn't going to fly imo

    Ephesus. Greek city in ancient Asia Minor, center of worship for Artemis, Greek Ephesos , traditionally derived from ephoros "overseer," in reference to its religious significance, but this might be folk etymology.
    Ephesus | Define Ephesus at Dictionary.com
    Dictionary.com › browse › ephesus

    The amazing name Ephesus: meaning and etymology
     
  3. bbyrd009

    bbyrd009 Groper

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    the testimony of Christ, and His Word
     
  4. bbyrd009

    bbyrd009 Groper

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    along with the recalcitrance of the Ephesians I guess, huh
    almost as if the one manifested the other maybe
     
  5. bbyrd009

    bbyrd009 Groper

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    So pls don't misunderstand, I am not meaning to offend you or even suggest that you are not saved or even chosen, ok, I'm just suggesting a diff frame, one that I guess ignores our common def of "conversion" that the Good Samaritan nor the Roman Centurion etc also did not seem to require...etc
     
  6. Jun2u

    Jun2u Well-Known Member

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    It is true God predestines all those whom He elected to salvation, but you will NEVER find language in Scripture that God predestines some to damnation. Unsaved people are damned because they are sinners without a Savior and therefore must answer for their sins on their own.

    Here is a narrative below and it will determine how you will comprehend Unconditional Election.

    Here’s a king who wrote an edict (the contents of the edict is irrelevant for our story), and had the esquires post it at different Town Squares throughout the country. Long story short, the edict declared if anyone disobeyed he surely will be put to death.

    The king’s subjects thought the edict was impossible to obey. So the whole country revolted. Needless to say, the king was so angry that he put everyone in the dungeon. That night, he heard their cry for mercy.

    The king with love and compassion in his heart went down to the dungeon and began to select a person here and a person there. Then he told the guards those whom he chose to set free.

    Did this narrative imply the king chose everyone to be unconditionally elected to be set free? Absolutely not!!

    Did the king loved and had the compassion to those whom he set free whether they were good or evil? Certainly not.

    Hence, is the narrative between God and Israel. He chose Ancient Israel to be the bearer of the Gospel, and NEVER to be unconditionally elected to salvation, that’s a different issue.

    Unconditional Election means God arbitrarily elects only those whom He wants to save (John 6:44; Matthew 1:21). Not as most on this thread and many in Christendom believe He is the Savior of the whole world that redeemed the sins of the world.

    To God Be The Glory
     
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  7. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    Actually, in Jude 1:3-4:

    Jde 1:3, Beloved, when I gave all diligence to write unto you of the common salvation, it was needful for me to write unto you, and exhort you that ye should earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints.
    Jde 1:4, For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.
     
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  8. Jun2u

    Jun2u Well-Known Member

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    ERROR. The term above pertains to the law given by God, “The wages of sin is death.”

    To God Be The Glory
     
  9. bbyrd009

    bbyrd009 Groper

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    :rolleyes:
     
  10. Mjh29

    Mjh29 Well-Known Member

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    So then what is your problem with it even you know that this is stated in the Scriptures? So, you admit you are not battling against the ideas of men but against the very words of Scripture?
     
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  11. Earburner

    Earburner Well-Known Member

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    Pure blasphemous foolishness!
    You neglect to understand the longsuffering love of God!
    2 Peter 3[9] The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
     
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  12. Earburner

    Earburner Well-Known Member

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    No one is "chosen" until they heed and act in faith on the "call".
    Many are "called", but do not address that "call", and therefore are not declared as "chosen".
     
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  13. Mjh29

    Mjh29 Well-Known Member

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    No, they are chosen if God chooses them. Saying they can choose themselves unto salvation is like saying babies birth themselves. Sorry, doesn't happen.
     
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  14. Jun2u

    Jun2u Well-Known Member

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    I beg to differ. It is you a holier-than-thou individual who is a pure blasphemous foolish and aversion person I have ever encountered.

    Most people do not know how to connect the dots (verses) let alone understand how to read Scripture.

    If God is not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance, He will do it. BUT THAT IS NOT HIS SALVATION PROGRAM!! If it were true, then there would no one be put in hell, because all his sins were redeemed by Jesus and there will no sin that he can commit that will threaten him with hell (1 John 3:9). He is the Almighty, Powerful, and that nothing is impossible for God.

    Before uttering the word of God make sure you understand what is being conveyed!!!! What audacity!

    To God Be The Glory
     
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  15. bbyrd009

    bbyrd009 Groper

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    Ta-daa
     
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  16. bbyrd009

    bbyrd009 Groper

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  17. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    How do you deal with people who will not even see that the scripture says what it plainly does say?

    One is inclined to even give up on talking to them...for they do not accept the testimony of scripture as being faithful....there is always some alternate interpretation to the interpretation that is plainly set forth by the meaning of the words.

    However, the scripture declares:

    2Co 3:12, Seeing then that we have such hope, we use great plainness of speech:
     
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  18. Earburner

    Earburner Well-Known Member

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    God's Salvation program incorporates our human will of reasoning with Himself, whereby we can accept His offer of salvation through Jesus, or we can reject it.
    No one is on auto pilot for being saved or destroyed!
    .
    It most definitely is a matter of choice, and the ball is in our court!
    Heb. 10[26] For if we sin wilfully (meaning the unpardonable sin) after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
    [27] But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.
    [28] He that despised Moses' law died without mercy [forgiveness] under two or three witnesses:
    [29] Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the *covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
    [30] For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge **his people.
    [31] It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.
    > *covenant means: a contract, a disposition, an arrangement. Strong's 1242.
    .
    > to be one of **HIS people, one MUST HAVE the Holy Spirit of God within them- Rom. 8:9.
    If you think not, then your argument is with Apostle Paul!
    .
    Listen to His words:
    John 316] For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
    .
    Rev. 22[17] And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.
    The above blasts holes through your foul and false predestination doctrine.
     
  19. Earburner

    Earburner Well-Known Member

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    How does one deal with those who REFUSE to examine the many scriptures, that speak contrary to your fabricated doctrine, that you have taken from a few scriptures in isolation.
     
  20. Earburner

    Earburner Well-Known Member

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    ^ Ooops! Sorry "just by faith". I thought I was replying to " jun2u".
     
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