Difference between Catholic and Protestant.

[Brakelite]

this is the throne of Mary the one who is full of grace Lk 1:28 who found our salvation Lk 1:30 who consented to our salvation Lk 1:38 and is the mother of our salvation Lk 2:30
Jesus is not replaced by Mary on this throne he is at the right hand of the father on the great white throne!

there is only one church Jn 10:16 in subjection to Christ Eph 5:24 then to Peter the head on earth Isa 22/21-22then to the apostles

That you consider the throne spoken of in Hebrews to be that of Mary is your imagination. There is no confirmation any where else, no evidence, no corroboration. From what I see of your posts, which is the only evidence I have, is that may is on the throne of your life. Not heaven.
KJV Acts 4:11-12
11 This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become the head of the corner.
12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

KJV 1 Timothy 2:1-6
1 I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men;
2 For kings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty.
3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
4 Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
6 Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.

 

[Taken]

In a nutshell – the idiocy of your post can be whittled down to the text above in RED.
Now, I’ll explain to you why you’re DEAD WRONG.

.

Your continuance in utter ignorance, simple reveals you understand NOTHING about what was Jesus’ Mission on Earth to Accomplish!

Hev. 10:26-27
“If we sin deliberately AFTER receiving KNOWLEDGE of the truth, there no longer remains sacrifice for sins but a fearful prospect of judgment and a flaming fire that is going to consume the adversaries.”

LOL...NOPE...Hear Knowledge DOES NOT MEAN born again!


Even a 5 yr old can distinguish the difference between ...
Hearing KNOWLEDGE...
Believing the KNOWLEDGE...
Confessing they BELIEVE the KNOWLEDGE...

2 Pet. 2:20-22

For if they, having escaped the defilements of the world through the KNOWLEDGE of our Lord and savior Jesus Christ, again become entangled and overcome by them, their last condition is worse than their first.

YAWN....another Scripture about receiving KNOWLEDGE....

For it would have been better for them not to have KNOWN the way of righteousness than after knowing it to turn back from the holy commandment handed down to them.

YAWN...another Scripture about KNOWING the KNOWLEDGE.

The following is a litany of Protestant scholarship on the Biblical use of the word, “Epignosis” . . .

Oh good grief, why bore me with your list of “Protestants” talking about KNOWLEDGE?

Scripture is quite clear......
Hearing is the beginning of FAITH.

Common sense should notify you...HEARING is a way of Receiving KNOWLEDGE!

And Scripture is quite clear.....for any foolish person to KNOW...

NOTHING IS “BORN AGAIN” unless it first DIES!

Receiving KNOWLEDGE, IS NOT a person DYING!

1 Cor 15:
[36] Thou fool, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die:

YOUR supposed teaching.....another FAILURE on your part.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Don’t even attempt to be disingenuous.... Molestation, Pedophiles, Murders, Rapists, Porn, Immorality, Within Any Church organization IS Unacceptable....and I said so, regardless of the fact you are too Lame to acknowledge and underhandedly imply the opposite.

The Molestation OCCURRING, is a GIVEN.
The Molestation COVER UP, is the LONG TERM ISSUE.
An individual “molested” member of a Protestant Church, has two OPTIONS to initiate a Complaint/ Formal Charge;
1) Privately Against the Church among a council of Church Authorities...
OR
2) Publicly Through the Political Governing System.
An individual “molested” member of a catholic church, has two OPTIONS to initiate a Complaint/ Formal Charge;
1) Privately Against the Church among a council of Church Authorities...
OR
2) Publicly Through the Political Governing System.

In either scenario.......The individual is going to be counseled that the “molestation” Issue will be DEALT WITH internally, via Church Authorities.

AND.......BIG surprise......
When the “molested” individual is not satisfied with how “their molestation” was dealt with.........
1) A Protestant can CHOOSE and often does, to take their Formal Charge to the Political Governing System.
2) A Catholics Political Governing System......IS THE VATICAN!

The molested individual IS SHAMED.

The molested individual IS made to FEEL it was THEIR FAULT.

The molested individual IS assured the ISSUE is resolved.
When IN FACT, the molester, is counseled to be more careful, and either REMAINS Present in their Church, or are whisked away, without punishment, to another Church, to continue their sleazy lifestyle.
Where have you been, that you don’t know the Vatican City is a Theocracy? Where have you been, that Victim catholics and catholic priests have finally come forward with their “secret” horror stories that have plagued them for years?

They were taught like you....AS...The Catholic Church is THE Church, the Beacon, and at all costs can never be shamed. Hiding dirty secrets is something the Catholic Church HAS DONE for centuries, while patting themselves on the back for their “humanitarian” charities, blah, blah.
Starving and Murdering Orphans...Raping little boys...disgusting!
Molestation is not news. Immoral behavior is not news......

The LONG LONG term dirty Catholic Church secrets, while suspect for years, IS NEWS. Own it!

Ummmmm, apparently, you DIDN’T do your homework – AGAIN . . .

How Protestant Churches Hid Sexual Abuse ...

Blogger Who Exposed Protestant Sex Abuse Cover Up Sued By Her Pastor

Denial About Sexual Abuse In Evangelical Churches

Southern Baptists Apologize For Sex Abuse Coverups

Confronting Evangelical Enabling of Sexual Abuse

Bombshell: sex abuse, coverup in America's largest Protestant ...

Southern Baptist leaders covered up sex abuse, kept secret ...

Clergy Abuse Coverup within the Protestant Church

What was that you said about the COVERUP being the problem?
What was that you said about how differently these matters are handled within the Protestant sects??

More LIES – more FRAUD on your part . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

Your continuance in utter ignorance, simple reveals you understand NOTHING about what was Jesus’ Mission on Earth to Accomplish!

LOL...NOPE...Hear Knowledge DOES NOT MEAN born again!

Even a 5 yr old can distinguish the difference between ...
Hearing KNOWLEDGE...
Believing the KNOWLEDGE...
Confessing they BELIEVE the KNOWLEDGE...
YAWN....another Scripture about receiving KNOWLEDGE....
YAWN...another Scripture about KNOWING the KNOWLEDGE.
Oh good grief, why bore me with your list of “Protestants” talking about KNOWLEDGE?
Scripture is quite clear......
Hearing is the beginning of FAITH.
Common sense should notify you...HEARING is a way of Receiving KNOWLEDGE!

And Scripture is quite clear.....for any foolish person to KNOW...
NOTHING IS “BORN AGAIN” unless it first DIES!

Receiving KNOWLEDGE, IS NOT a person DYING!
1 Cor 15:
[36] Thou fool, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die:
YOUR supposed teaching.....another FAILURE on your part.

WRONG.
YOU don’t get to redefine Greek words when they DEBUNK your position.
You’re OUT of your league here.

J.B. Lightfoot, Vine’s Expository and Thayer’s Greek Lexicon are some of eh most eminent and respected scholarly sources on the matter.
YOU, on the other hand are just an angry little uneducated guy on am obscure internet forum.

The use of “Epignosis” in these verses DESTROYS your entire desperate argument . .

 

[Brakelite]

When we’re you saved?

eph 2:8

Who are you asking, and what do you mean by 'saved'?

 

[Brakelite]

OF COURSE there were Churches in other countries by the 4th century.
The Church in Rome had already been established since the FIRST century.

They “had Scriptures”??
There was no UNIFORMITY of Scripture because the Canon had not yet been officially defined.
There were literally DOZENS of Canons floating around based on personal opinion,, likes and dislikes. The Letters of Clement the Epistles of Barnabas, The Gospel of Peter, the Protoevangelium of James, the Gospel of Thomas, the Shepherd of Hermas, etc. – were ALL considered “Scripture” by many in the Early Church and read from pulpits as such.

The NT Canon that was defined and declared by the Catholic Church in 383 AD is the very SAME Canon that YOU and every other Protestant adheres to.

As I said...

They didn't need Rome to "declare" anything. They didn't have a relationship with Rome, they knew Jesus. Do you?

It seems that Catholics in general simply do not in any way trust God to lead them into truth, which explains why they cleave fearfully to the magisterium to confirm and teach them everything.
Those early churches BoL, had Jesus, and He led them into the truths of the gospel. They didn't hide the truth behind a language unknown to the common man in the pews. They didn't suppress the scriptures, on the contrary, they reproduced them and translated them into the languages of the people, making them available to any who could read. And it they couldn't read, they used the scriptures to teach them. Yes, there was a church established in Rome in the first century. However, in later centuries the bishops of that church sought greater power than they were entitled to, began to demand all other bishops submit to the Roman bishop, who then called himself pontifex maximus after the pagan emperors. Not all churches were willing to do that. So Rome began calling them heretics and schismatics. Then called upon the secular powers to persecute them. This was formed a relationship between church and state, which became a marriage. Rather than trusting God and the holy Spirit to convict and convince pagans of the truths of the gospels, Rome used coercion and threats of war. The contentious issues over the introduction of the trinity doctrine invited Constantine to persecute those who were uncomfortable with the formulaic concepts of the creeds, and then of course was the establishment of Sunday sacredness, those who chose to continue in their obedience to the 4th commandment were called heretics and judaizers (nothing new under the sun) , excommunicated and persecuted. This the CC of Rome feel away through a spiritual adulterous relationship with the kings of the earth, which continues to this day. You speak well in stating that some can be found unfaithful when Jesus comes, that all must remain faithful and obedient to the end. Those bishops of Rome in later centuries after the apostles did not, and they attracted, mostly by force and deception (donation of Constantine... Conquests... Crusades) grew to the monstrosity it is today. Now that's history BoL. Written in blood across all lands. And you have some here who still, even despite all the evidence to the contrary, proclaim such practises as noble, godly, and Christian. I say no. It's Antichrist.

 

[Taken]

WRONG.
YOU don’t get to redefine Greek words when they DEBUNK your position.
You’re OUT of your league here.

J.B. Lightfoot, Vine’s Expository and Thayer’s Greek Lexicon are some of eh most eminent and respected scholarly sources on the matter.
YOU, on the other hand are just an angry little uneducated guy on am obscure internet forum.

The use of “Epignosis” in these verses DESTROYS your entire desperate argument . .

Epignosis...is Knowledge.
The stress is on true correct knowledge...yet still knowledge.
And yes the foolish can blab on and on about knowledge...
So what...

Having knowledge is NOT the meaning of Born Again!


1 Cor 15:
[36] Thou fool, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die:

 

[Taken]

As I said...


Those early churches BoL, had Jesus, and He led them into the truths of the gospel. They didn't hide the truth behind a language unknown to the common man in the pews. They didn't suppress the scriptures...

Yes!

AND......Considering the CHURCH was established BY Christ Jesus and the Jews Were the First Church members and
Church meetings welcoming the public (Jews, Gentiles, Women) were held in Synagogues. <—- No Altars!!

 

[Taken]

Difference between Catholic and Protestant.
OP ^

One takes credit for Scripture.
One knows the Truth.

 

[Taken]

Difference between Catholic and Protestant.
OP^

Catholic:

WRONG.
You’re OUT of your league here.
YOU, on the other hand are just an angry little uneducated guy on am obscure internet forum..

Protestant:

Yawn. Same old venom.

 

[theefaith]

Did you not read the post. After I responded to an altar call, a dramatic change came over my life. I had, for the first time heartfelt conviction of sin, it was profound. I'm sure your church has explained to you, according to the foundation upon which the new covenant stands, you must be in a saved state for that to happen

no the true church teaches Matt 24:13
And “Faith alone” is a condemned heresy!

A sacrament is an oath! A sacred promise from God! Ez 36:25-27
Acts 2:38-39 (this promise)


A sacrament is an outward sign for all men including infants And a gift from God to help us see what he does inwardly and invisibly by his grace!

As grace Washes our souls in the merits of Jesus blood from original and personal sin, so the outward action of washing is visible!

without the outward action the inward action cannot take place!

Jn 3:5 Titus 3:5 water and washing
acts 22:16 wash away your sin!

Jn 3:5 Born again BY water and the spirit! Not by “faith alone”!

They did not go to Jerusalem and preach “accept Christ as you’re personal Lord and savior “

They went to the river (water) and they baptized! Jn 3:22

A covenant requires an outward sign of the inward action of grace!

Ez 36:25 I will sprinkle you with clean water and you shall be made white as snow.

Acts 22:16 washing away your sins.

Eph 4:5 one Lord, one faith, one baptism.

1 pet 3:21 baptism saves you.

You cannot enter on you’re own or by faith alone!

2 pet 1: 11 For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

Heb 2:11 For both he that sanctifieth and they who are sanctified are all of one: for which cause he is not ashamed to call them brethren,


Baptism!

God breathed life into Adam, gen 2:7 and we received this life from our fathers!

Christ breathed on the apostles our spiritual fathers, we receive the new covenant life of God’s grace from them thru faith & baptism! Jn 20:21-23 Mk 16:16 acts 8:36-38 eph 2

Born again! Born from above!

'The Father has set his seal' on Christ (John 6:27) and also seals us in him (cf. 2 Corinthians 1:22; Ephesians 1:23, 4:30). Because this seal indicates the indelible effect of the anointing with the Holy Spirit in the sacrament of Baptism,

Baptism indeed is the seal of eternal life." 87 The faithful Christian who I has "kept the seal" until the end, remaining faithful to the demands of his Baptism, will be able to depart this life "marked with the sign of faith," 88 with his baptismal faith, in expectation of the blessed vision of God - the consummation of faith - and in the hope of resurrection.

St. Paul tells the faithful at Ephesus that they have been “sealed with the promised Holy Spirit.” This is in terms of an indelible character imprinted on the soul in the sacraments of baptism and confirmation. It is not as if this invisible mark is simply decorative. Rather, through it, we are enabled to participate in Christ’s mission and in his offices of priest, prophet, and king. Eph 1:13

Sealed by God eph 1:13 sealed by God (ez 36:25-27) in the ark of salvation by baptism just as Noah was sealed by God in the ark of the flood gen 7:16

1 Pet 3:20 Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.

21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us!
(Ark of Noah a type of the church, member of Christ and his church and salvation by baptism!)
(Outside the ark of Noah none were saved, outside the church (the ark of salvation) none are saved!)

Sealed in the ark, sealed in the church the ark of salvation by God thru baptism!



Christ instituted the holy church for the salvation of all men, (repent and believe the gospel, with the institution of the sacraments to convey grace to sanctify souls!


Effects of faith & baptism!

Ez 36:25-27 washed in baptism, with a new heart and the Spirit
Jn 3:5 born again in baptism
Mk 16:16 faith & baptist
Acts 2:38 repentance & baptism
Acts 8:36-38 faith & baptism
Acts 22:16 baptism washes away sin
Rom 6:3 died with Christ
Col 2:12 risen with Christ
1 cor 12:13 baptized into the church
Gal 3:27 by baptism put on Christ
2 Tim 1:10 eph 2:1 and 5 brought to life
2 cor 5:17 new creation
Eph 1:13 sealed by the Holy Spirit
Eph 4:5 one baptism
Eph 5:26 faith and baptism
Titus 3:5 baptismal regeneration
1 pet 1:2 washed in Christ’s blood
1 pet 2:9 the kingdom of light
1 pet 3:20-21 baptism saves us!

“Faith alone” accomplishes nothing!
1 cor 13:2 even all faith (alone) without charity avails NOTHING!!!

Faith and baptism!

Scripture says none of the things about “Faith alone”!

2 Peter 1:11
For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

The Christian sacrament of baptism is the Initiation into the new covenant and must be ministered to you by the apostles!




“Faith alone”

Questions

where does scripture says we have died with Christ by “faith alone”?

Rom 6:3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?

where does scripture say we are members of Christ and his church by “faith alone”?

1 Corinthians 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

where does scripture says we put on Christ by “faith alone”?

Galatians 3:27
For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

Where does scripture say our sins are washed away by “faith alone”?

Acts 22:16
And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

where does scripture say we are saved or justified by “faith alone”?

1 pet 3:21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us!

The only reference in scripture to “faith alone” is James 2:24 NOT BY “FAITH ALONE”?

2 pet 1: 11 For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

How can you enter by your own if it must be ministered to you? Baptism is done unto you, “not do it yourself by faith alone”

Jn 3:5 born again by faith alone?

Where is “Accept Christ as your personal lord & savior” is found in scripture?

They did not go preaching this line but went immediately to the river and baptized Jn 3:22

Acts 22:16
And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

1 Corinthians 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

Galatians 3:27
For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

Eph 4:5 one baptism

Why don’t it say one teeny tiny little act of “faith alone”???

When we first believed we are saved?

Romans 13:11
And that, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep: for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed.

How can salvation be nearer than when we first believed if you’re saved by believing?

1 pet 1:9 Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls.

Matt 24:13 endures to the end Shall be saved.

How can salvation happen when we first believed if it’s the end?

If salvation is by “faith alone” then faith would be the greatest!
1 cor 13:13 charity is the greatest!

Even all faith much less “faith alone” without charity avails nothing!
1 cor 13:2

Faith alone” unbiblical!

WATER AND THE SPIRIT!
Baptismal regeneration is the biblical mandate!!!

 

[theefaith]

BTW
Would you, or bread of life like to answer the following questions? I'm sure neither of you could correctly do so.
In the following what justification is Paul speaking about, for it is a justification that clearly takes time to achieve. Paul is speaking about someone already in Christ. Justification is instantaneous once someone receives salvation. ''Why does Paul ask the question. ''Doesn't that mean that Christ promotes sin?'' what does he mean by his statement ''If I rebuild what I destroyed, then I really would be a lawbreaker.'' :
But if, in seeking to be justified in Christ, we Jews find ourselves also among the sinners, doesn’t that mean that Christ promotes sin? Absolutely not! 18 If I rebuild what I destroyed, then I really would be a lawbreaker. Gal2:17&18

paul does not teach salvation by faith alone! 1 cor 13:2 even all faith without charity avails nothing

scripture does not teach faith alone Mk 16:16 faith and baptism
Jn 3:5 faith and baptism
See Jn 3:22 they did not go and preach “accept Jesus Christ as you’re personal Lord and savior” they went to the river (water) and they baptized!!!!!!!!!!!!’

 

[theefaith]

BTW
Would you, or bread of life like to answer the following questions? I'm sure neither of you could correctly do so.
In the following what justification is Paul speaking about, for it is a justification that clearly takes time to achieve. Paul is speaking about someone already in Christ. Justification is instantaneous once someone receives salvation. ''Why does Paul ask the question. ''Doesn't that mean that Christ promotes sin?'' what does he mean by his statement ''If I rebuild what I destroyed, then I really would be a lawbreaker.'' :
But if, in seeking to be justified in Christ, we Jews find ourselves also among the sinners, doesn’t that mean that Christ promotes sin? Absolutely not! 18 If I rebuild what I destroyed, then I really would be a lawbreaker. Gal2:17&18

not a few scriptures say we are saved until the end of our lives

Matt 24:13 endures to the end.

Mark 13:13
And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

Rev 2:26 And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations:

Heb 3:14 For we are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end;

Heb 6:11 And we desire that every one of you do shew the same diligence to the full assurance of hope unto the end:

1. Romans 11:22 – God’s kindness, if you continue in His kindness

2. Colossians 1:21-23 – holy and blameless, if you continue in the faith"

3. The race of faith: the example of Paul

4. Hebrews 12:22-25: "we shall not escape if we turn away from Him"

5. Hebrews 4:1-3, 9-12: "strive to enter the rest of God"

6.Hebrews 6:4-9 – those who became partakers of the holy spirit and fell away

7. Hebrews 10:23-29, 35-39: "if we sin willfully", "if anyone draws back".

8. Matthew 24:13: He that endures to the end, the same shall be saved

9. Hebrews 3:4-6: Holding fast our confidence firm until the end

10. Matthew 24:13: "But the one who endures to the end will be saved"

11. 1 John 2:24-25 – "if what you heard from the beginning abides in you"

12. 2 John 8-9 : to "everyone who goes on ahead and does not abide in the teaching of Christ

13. 2 Peter 1:5-11 : "Make every effort to supplement your faith"

14. Philippians 2:12-16: "work out your salvation with fear and trembling"

15. 1 Timothy 6:10-16: the love of money

16. Galatians 5:2-4 "Severed from Christ"

17. 2 Timothy 2:11-13: "if we deny him, he will also deny us"

18. James 5:19-20: the wandered brother

19. Some will abandon the faith

20. 1 Timothy 5:8: "he has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever"

22. The real family of Jesus: "Those who hear the Word of God and do it"

23. 1 Corinthians 5:5: "so that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord"

24. Peter 2: "It would have been better for them never to have known the way of righteousness"

25. Jude: "Turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness" - a much relevant warning

26. 1 Cor. 9:27 ....Lest I myself might become a castaway

27. Heb 1:14 shall be heirs of salvation

Romans 1:5
By whom we have received grace and apostleship, for obedience to the faith among all nations, for his name:
(Must remain obedient)

(He who endured to the end) one who dies in a state of grace united to Jesus Christ by faith and baptism!
Mk 16:16 acts 8:36-38 1 pet 3:21
Matt 24:13


Romans 13:11
And that, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep: for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed.

So salvation by “faith alone” is completely false and impossible if baptism is rejected!

1 Peter 1:9
Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls.

Romans 13:11
And that, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep: for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed.

“Salvation by faith alone is a condemned heresy”!!!

 

[theefaith]

You didnt understand what I meant did you, when I said that as I had heartfelt conviction of sin before God I must have been placed in a saved state according to the foundation on which the new covenant stands

baptimal regeneration is the initiation into the new covenant!

You cannot enter on you’re own or by “faith alone”!

Jn 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

2 pet 1: 11 For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

Baptismal regeneration a new creation in Christ!

 

[theefaith]

That you consider the throne spoken of in Hebrews to be that of Mary is your imagination. There is no confirmation any where else, no evidence, no corroboration. From what I see of your posts, which is the only evidence I have, is that may is on the throne of your life. Not heaven.
KJV Acts 4:11-12
11 This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become the head of the corner.
12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

KJV 1 Timothy 2:1-6
1 I exhort therefore, that, first of all, supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks, be made for all men;
2 For kings, and for all that are in authority; that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and honesty.
3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
4 Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
6 Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.

first Christ and his church are one acts 9:4 eph 4:5
while there is famine in the camp (of heretics) but in my fathers house even his servants have plenty to eat!

The doctrine of demons has built in vices!

Jn 8:32 the truth shall make you free! So false doctrine shall hold you in bondage! (Protestantism)

The only way to know the truth is to know church who’s is the truth!
Jn 14:6

This extends to his church the pillar of truth! 1 Tim 3:15

Christ is the light of the world!
This extends to His church!
Matt 5:14

The nature of pride always says no I will not serve, like the father of pride! I decide truth for myself! Pride always protests and lives in a continuous state of rebellion!

The virtues of a Christian are those of Christ, humility, Mt 11:29 obedience, and submission to proper authority, acceptance holy church and all she proposes for belief! Matt 28:19

The Faithful! The obedient of God!

As opposed to the rebellion of spiritual anarchy!

Those who make themselves the only arbiter of truth!

They put themselves in the place of God!

God alone can determine truth and morals!

We must in humility be taught of God and Christ thru His church and apostles!

Jn 14:6 Jesus Christ (not you) is the way, the truth, and the life!

Jn 1:16-17 grace and truth come by Jesus Christ!

We must be taught or instructed:
Lk 1:4
Matt 28:19
Jn 20:21
Acts 8:31

No Christian has the authority to read scripture for yourself and decide your own doctrines or beliefs! Eph 4:5 Jude 1:3

Christ is at the right hand of the father on the great white throne!
The throne of grace is Mary!
The mother of our salvation! Matt 1:21 Lk 2:30
Found our salvation Lk 1:30
Consented to our salvation Lk 1:38
Mother of grace and mercy!

 

[theefaith]

Praise of Mary and the saints redounds to the glory of God and Christ, cos Mary and the saints are what God made them, it is His handiwork (Lk 1:49 Lk 1:28) and the graces they have come from the merits of Christ’s passion and death

Likewise an Attack on Mary and the saints, or the authority of the apostles or the church or rejection of such doctrines is and attack on God and on Christ! And His teaching authority in the church by the successors of the apostles!
Acts 9:4 Eph 5:32

Mary is the temple of God, God consecrated and dwelt in this temple for 9 months and it cannot be used for a ordinary purpose, and it is God who glorified his dwelling!

King david has love of Mary!

Psalm 26:8
Lord, I have loved the habitation of thy house, and the place where thine honour dwelleth.

Sign of salvation Mary

Lk 1:45 all generations shall call me blessed!

Actually this is an exultation of thanksgiving for having obtain thier eternal salvation!

Mary is the air Christians breathe!
As breathing is a sign of life so devotion to Mary help of Christian’s is a sign of supernatural life of grace!

 

[theefaith]

Who are you asking, and what do you mean by 'saved'?

you and whatever you mean by saved according to eph 2:8

 

[BreadOfLife]

As I said...
It seems that Catholics in general simply do not in any way trust God to lead them into truth, which explains why they cleave fearfully to the magisterium to confirm and teach them everything.

Those early churches BoL, had Jesus, and He led them into the truths of the gospel. They didn't hide the truth behind a language unknown to the common man in the pews. They didn't suppress the scriptures, on the contrary, they reproduced them and translated them into the languages of the people, making them available to any who could read. And it they couldn't read, they used the scriptures to teach them. Yes, there was a church established in Rome in the first century. However, in later centuries the bishops of that church sought greater power than they were entitled to, began to demand all other bishops submit to the Roman bishop, who then called himself pontifex maximus after the pagan emperors. Not all churches were willing to do that. So Rome began calling them heretics and schismatics. Then called upon the secular powers to persecute them. This was formed a relationship between church and state, which became a marriage. Rather than trusting God and the holy Spirit to convict and convince pagans of the truths of the gospels, Rome used coercion and threats of war. The contentious issues over the introduction of the trinity doctrine invited Constantine to persecute those who were uncomfortable with the formulaic concepts of the creeds, and then of course was the establishment of Sunday sacredness, those who chose to continue in their obedience to the 4th commandment were called heretics and judaizers (nothing new under the sun) , excommunicated and persecuted. This the CC of Rome feel away through a spiritual adulterous relationship with the kings of the earth, which continues to this day. You speak well in stating that some can be found unfaithful when Jesus comes, that all must remain faithful and obedient to the end. Those bishops of Rome in later centuries after the apostles did not, and they attracted, mostly by force and deception (donation of Constantine... Conquests... Crusades) grew to the monstrosity it is today. Now that's history BoL. Written in blood across all lands. And you have some here who still, even despite all the evidence to the contrary, proclaim such practises as noble, godly, and Christian. I say no. It's Antichrist.

History??
What YOU have posted is your own skewed, revisionist version of history.

First of all – your claims that the Church “suppressed” the Scriptures and wrote them in a language that was unreadable to the masses is astoundingly stupid.
If you actually KEW your history, you would know that the MAJORITY of those masses were ILLITERATE and had virtually NO NEED for the written Scriptures. In fact – it is estimated that as much as 85-90% of the general public was functionally illiterate. Besides - the Bible tells us that faith comes from HEARING the Word (Rom. 10:17). Virtually the ENTIRE Bible is read aloud inn a 3-year Mass cycle.

Prior to the printing press in the 15th century – Bibles were VERY expensive because they took a team of scribes to HARD-COPY them and took YEARS to complete a single copy. For this reason, Bibles were chained to pulpits to prevent them from being stolen.

Some rich, educated people would have unauthorized versions copied by unqualified translators. This led to the Church trying to suppress these unauthorized and spurious copied versions of Scripture that were causing confusion because of their many errors. Because of this – the Church forbade the copying and owning of unauthorized versions.

Additionally, YOUR claim that the Church ONLY copied the Bible in Latin is FALSE. Many of the Books had already been translated into SEVERAL languages prior to the early Protestant versions.

As too the title “Pontifex Maximus” – it simply means great Bridge Builder. The earlies use of this title on record is from De Pudicitia, a letter written by Tertullian in the early 3rd century – and NOT a title that was “demanded” by ANY Pope. Thank you, however, for recognizing that the Papacy existed BEFORE Constantine . . .

Finally, Einstein – Catholics listen to the Church because Jesus Himself stated the following about His Church:
Luke 10:16
“Whoever listens to YOU listens to ME; whoever rejects YOU rejects ME; but whoever rejects ME rejects HIM who sent ME.”

John 16:12-15
“I still have many things to say to you, but you cannot bear them now. When the Spirit of truth comes, HE WILL GUIDE YOU INTO ALL THE TRUTH, for he will not speak on his own authority, but whatever he hears he will speak, and he will declare to YOU the things that are to come. He will glorify me, for he will take what is mine and declare it to YOU. All that the Father has is mine; therefore I said that he will take what is mine and declare it to YOU.

THAT is Authority – and THAT is why we listen to His Church.

 

[Brakelite]

A sacrament is an oath! A sacred promise from God! Ez 36:25-27
Acts 2:38-39 (this promise)

The Ten Commandments are also promises for those that have faith, yet your church changed them.
If the sacraments are promises are promises, then what does your church leaders believe themselves to be to deny them to others?

 

[theefaith]

The Ten Commandments are also promises for those that have faith, yet your church changed them.
If the sacraments are promises are promises, then what does your church leaders believe themselves to be to deny them to others?

I don’t follow you here?

The Bible never says what each commandment is!
The whole content is in ex 20 but it don’t say this is the first
This is the second etc.
the context of the first is ex 20:2-6 all about God and not having graven images
The second refers to Gods name
The third to the holy day
Fourth honor Thy father and mother including Thy spiritual mother Mary Jn 19:26-27 Rev 12:17

Jn 16:13 applies to the apostles in the magisterium, they are to teach us Matt 28:19 Lk 1:4