Another Premillennial absurdity

[Truth7t7]

Can someone born be eternal?

You deny that Jesus Christ was in the beginning being eternal and creator of all things, your views are heretical in my opinion

Your in the wrong forum, your teachings belong in the cult of Jehovah's Witnesses forum not here

Colossians 2:9KJV
9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

John 1:1-3KJV
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2 The same was in the beginning with God.
3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

Genesis 1:26KJV
26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

 

[Truth7t7]

But identification is the key factor. God created a character less than Himself in His transcendence, but that character expresses who He actually is, if even down on a lower level of existence.

I hope I haven't butchered what you were trying to say? Sounds good to me as I've expressed it.

Birds of a feather flock together

Colossians 2:9KJV
9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

John 1:1-3KJV
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2 The same was in the beginning with God.
3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

Genesis 1:26KJV
26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

 

[Randy Kluth]

Birds of a feather flock together

Colossians 2:9KJV
9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

John 1:1-3KJV
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2 The same was in the beginning with God.
3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

Genesis 1:26KJV
26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

Can't you say anything nice? You don't even seem to want to try! If you spend more than 2 seconds thinking about a way to twist what I said you might realize that I was using Cady's illustration of the author and his story!

God created a picture by His Word. In doing so, He created a human expression *of Himself.* If you can't understand that, you just don't want to understand it. You'd rather be stirring up divisions among brothers. And that ain't Christianity on a good day...

Again, so that you don't miss it this time, God *created* an expression through His word. He "created" the expression of *Himself* in Jesus Christ.
In doing so, He did not create a human being that was *strictly created.* Rather, it was an expression of *God's own Self* on a lower level of existence, on the modal level of finite creation.

So the question is, can God create an idea without contradicting the idea that He Himself is uncreated? Of course He can! That's the whole Trinity thing. That's the whole idea of the Son being equal in Deity to the Father. God expresses Himself as a Divine Person within a lower realm of existence, within the realm of creation. But the *idea* is God. The *creation* is of an idea, and not merely the material substance that distinguishes finite things from infinite things.

The idea that God shows who He is, or expresses what He is, within our own human domain does not in any way contradict who He is on an infinite level. The fact it is His Word emerging out of Himself does not mean His Word is other than Himself. It is purely an expression He Himself is able to construct of Himself that *is Himself.*

I don't believe this stuff "flies over your head" because you're obviously a smart guy. You simply have to try to be less critical and more willing to understand what others mean. If you can't do that, you have a moral problem. But I'm hoping otherwise.

 

[Truth7t7]

Can't you say anything nice? You don't even seem to want to try! If you spend more than 2 seconds thinking about a way to twist what I said you might realize that I was using Cady's illustration of the author and his story!

God created a picture by His Word. In doing so, He created a human expression *of Himself.* If you can't understand that, you just don't want to understand it. You'd rather be stirring up divisions among brothers. And that ain't Christianity on a good day...

Again, so that you don't miss it this time, God *created* an expression through His word. He "created" the expression of *Himself* in Jesus Christ.
In doing so, He did not create a human being that was *strictly created.* Rather, it was an expression of *God's own Self* on a lower level of existence, on the modal level of finite creation.

So the question is, can God create an idea without contradicting the idea that He Himself is uncreated? Of course He can! That's the whole Trinity thing. That's the whole idea of the Son being equal in Deity to the Father. God expresses Himself as a Divine Person within a lower realm of existence, within the realm of creation. But the *idea* is God. The *creation* is of an idea, and not merely the material substance that distinguishes finite things from infinite things.

The idea that God shows who He is, or expresses what He is, within our own human domain does not in any way contradict who He is on an infinite level. The fact it is His Word emerging out of Himself does not mean His Word is other than Himself. It is purely an expression He Himself is able to construct of Himself that *is Himself.*

I don't believe this stuff "flies over your head" because you're obviously a smart guy. You simply have to try to be less critical and more willing to understand what others mean. If you can't do that, you have a moral problem. But I'm hoping otherwise.

Birds of a feather flock together

Colossians 2:9KJV
9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

John 1:1-3KJV
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2 The same was in the beginning with God.
3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

Genesis 1:26KJV
26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

 

[Randy Kluth]

Birds of a feather flock together

You either can't understand or won't understand. I'll let God be the judge. But if you don't believe that God "constructed" an image of Himself through His Word, by fashioning a body for Jesus Christ, then you're in heretical territory yourself. If you have a problem with the word "constructed," then you have a moral issue going on, making foolish arguments over words, and wanting to stir up division among brothers.

Heb 10.5 Therefore, when Christ came into the world, he said: “Sacrifice and offering you did not desire, but a body you prepared for me;
1 Tim 6.4 they are conceited and understand nothing. They have an unhealthy interest in controversies and quarrels about words that result in envy, strife, malicious talk, evil suspicions

 

[Truth7t7]

You either can't understand or won't understand. I'll let God be the judge. But if you don't believe that God "constructed" an image of Himself through His Word, by fashioning a body for Jesus Christ, then you're in heretical territory yourself.

Quote Randy Kluth Post #1039

"But identification is the key factor. God created a character less than Himself in His transcendence, but that character expresses who He actually is, if even down on a lower level of existence.

I hope I haven't butchered what you were trying to say? Sounds good to me as I've expressed it."

Birds of a feather flock together

Colossians 2:9KJV
9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

John 1:1-3KJV
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2 The same was in the beginning with God.
3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

Genesis 1:26KJV
26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

 

[Timtofly]

I agree with your modal view except their can only be one outside creation.

All 3 persons as one Lord. However in creation Jesus always existed as the Lamb slain.

If you say only the Lord is outside of creation, you would be correct. God as we know God the Father, no. God as Father is part of creation equal to Jesus/the Word within creation. Jesus claiming to be both God and with God at the same time is correct within creation. I don't claim to comprehend existence outside of creation, especially as in we as humans eventually transcending creation and entering eternity. Many here make that claim.

 

[CadyandZoe]

You deny that Jesus Christ was in the beginning being eternal and creator of all things, your views are heretical in my opinion

Your in the wrong forum, your teachings belong in the cult of Jehovah's Witnesses forum not here

Colossians 2:9KJV
9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

John 1:1-3KJV
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2 The same was in the beginning with God.
3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

Genesis 1:26KJV
26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

I asked you to take this to another forum. You refused. I didn't bring this up again until WPM asked me some questions. This is his thread. I would be happy to drop the subject if everyone agrees.

 

[Randy Kluth]

Quote Randy Kluth Post #1042

"But identification is the key factor. God created a character less than Himself in His transcendence, but that character expresses who He actually is, if even down on a lower level of existence.

I hope I haven't butchered what you were trying to say? Sounds good to me as I've expressed it."

Birds of a feather flock together

Colossians 2:9KJV
9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

John 1:1-3KJV
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2 The same was in the beginning with God.
3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

Genesis 1:26KJV
26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

Okay, either you're thick or you're stubborn--I prefer the 2nd choice. To "construct" something means to "fashion" something.

In the context of Creation itself, it would mean to build something strictly out of created substance. But in the case of God's Word, when God "constructed," "created," or "fashioned," a new idea in the form of a human soul and body, He instituted a new thought about Himself, expressing who He is.

Coming up with a new thought is not creating something physical alone, but along with that physical thing, it is generating an idea. But in the case of God's Word, He is fashioning a new idea that is not essentially different from who He is. He is expressing not only His ideas, but more, a picture of Himself in human form. He is producing something that identifies *who He is* in human form.

Do I really need to belabor this? Perhaps with you, but not with many others, who wish to understand. God did create a body for His Son. But in generating His Son in human form He was also designing the idea of a human being who reflected and was and is this divine Person. The idea was new, but the Being was old.

Cady may have taken issue with the term "divine person." But I do not. So no, "birds of a feather do not flock together." But I've accepted Cady's explanation because it is all about terminology. He has *clearly said* that *Jesus is God.* You cannot put Cady in the category of heresy if that's what he truly believes.

Actually, I think he's just trying to think through some very difficult ideas. Look how long the Church Fathers took in coming up with their creeds! And throughout they had disagreements over the terminology.

Cady is an intelligent and very well-behaved Christian, and you act very unchristian in your insulting ways in addressing these issues. He should be commended for making some very good videos, which have very little that you can argue about in a contemptuous way.

 

[Truth7t7]

Okay, either you're thick or you're stubborn--I prefer the 2nd choice. To "construct" something means to "fashion" something.

In the context of Creation itself, it would mean to build something strictly out of created substance. But in the case of God's Word, when God "constructed," "created," or "fashioned," a new idea in the form of a human soul and body, He instituted a new thought about Himself, expressing who He is.

Coming up with a new thought is not creating something physical alone, but along with that physical thing, it is generating an idea. But in the case of God's Word, He is fashioning a new idea that is not essentially different from who He is. He is expressing not only His ideas, but more, a picture of Himself in human form. He is producing something that identifies *who He is* in human form.

Do I really need to belabor this? Perhaps with you, but not with many others, who wish to understand. God did create a body for His Son. But in generating His Son in human form He was also designing the idea of a human being who reflected and was and is this divine Person. The idea was new, but the Being was old.

Cady may have taken issue with the term "divine person." But I do not. So no, "birds of a feather do not flock together." But I've accepted Cady's explanation because it is all about terminology. He has *clearly said* that *Jesus is God.* You cannot put Cady in the category of heresy if that's what he truly believes.

Actually, I think he's just trying to think through some very difficult ideas. Look how long the Church Fathers took in coming up with their creeds! And throughout they had disagreements over the terminology.

Cady is an intelligent and very well-behaved Christian, and you act very unchristian in your insulting ways in addressing these issues. He should be commended for making some very good videos, which have very little that you can argue about in a contemptuous way.

Quote Randy Kluth Post #1039

"But identification is the key factor. God created a character less than Himself in His transcendence, but that character expresses who He actually is, if even down on a lower level of existence.

I hope I haven't butchered what you were trying to say? Sounds good to me as I've expressed it."

Birds of a feather flock together

Colossians 2:9KJV
9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

John 1:1-3KJV
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2 The same was in the beginning with God.
3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

Genesis 1:26KJV
26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

 

[WPM]

Since C&Z deny that Christ is the great I AM, they shall die in their sins unless they repent. Claiming to be I AM is His claim to deity! And the reason He was crucified, because He agreed when the Pharisee's asked if His was, "I AM".

John 8:24 (KJV) I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am (he), ye shall die in your sins.

Exodus 3:14 (KJV) And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you.

The whole background to the revelation of God’s name is outlined in Exodus 3:13-14, where Moses asked God, “Behold, when I come unto the children of Israel, and shall say unto them, The God [Heb 'elohiym] of your fathers hath sent me unto you; and they shall say to me, What is his name? what shall I say unto them?”

The reading then records God’s response, saying, “And God [Heb. 'elohiym] said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM [Heb hâyâh ăsher hâyâh]: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM [Heb. hâyâh] hath sent me unto you.”

This was the inimitable name by which God wanted to be revealed to the children of Israel. In stating this, God was telling Moses that He is the great I Am, the matchless, eternal, self-existing, and almighty God. He is asserting that there is “none beside me.”

The very next verse uses the name Yahweh: “And God [Heb. 'elohiym] said moreover unto Moses, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, The LORD [Heb Yĕhovah] God [Heb 'elohiym] of your fathers, the God [Heb. 'elohiym] of Abraham, the God [Heb. 'elohiym] of Isaac, and the God [Heb 'elohiym] of Jacob, hath sent me unto you: this is my name for ever, and this is my memorial unto all generations” (Exodus 3:15).

This title was consequently viewed with great awe amongst the Israelites. It belonged alone to Almighty God and could be used by none other. It was treated with the utmost respect in Hebrew culture. When Christ used the name “I am” when speaking to the Pharisees in John 8:58 they wanted to kill Him. They realized He was claiming to be God – a reality they could not accept. That fully explains their hostile reaction. John 8:58-59 records, “Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am [Gr. ego eimi]. Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by.”

Jesus revealed Himself to Israel as “I am.” Christ employed God’s name as His own, using the equivalent Greek words ego eimi which means “I am.” This is seen as proof of His divine nature. The religious Jews (not surprisingly) took His statement to be blasphemous, having no understanding of His divinity. This resulted in them rejecting Him and trying to execute Him.

Adam Clarke comments, “It appears that the Jews understood him as asserting his Godhead; and, supposing him to be a blasphemer, they proceeded to stone him, according to the law.”

In John 8:22-24: “Then said the Jews, Will he kill himself? because he saith, Whither I go, ye cannot come. And he said unto them, Ye are from beneath; I am from above: ye are of this world; I am not of this world. I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am [Gr. ego eimi] he, ye shall die in your sins.”

Many miss the direct and explicit reference to Jesus divinity in this passage. Jesus constantly mesmerized the religious hypocrites with His words. They did not truly understand who He was or what He was saying: Never man spoke like this man.

Jesus said in John 8:28: “When ye have lifted up the Son of man, then shall ye know that I am [Gr. ego eimi] he, and that I do nothing of myself; but as my Father hath taught me, I speak these things.”

Jesus uses the phrase “I am” [Gr. ego eimi] to describe Himself, when speaking about the past, present and future. This demonstrates that He is eternally the “I AM.”

When the fearful disciples of Jesus Christ saw Him walking on the water, thinking He was a spirit, He comforted them the words “be of good cheer; it is I [Gr. ego eimi]” (Matthew 14:27). Here He takes Yahweh’s name to assure them that all was well and that all was under control.

In John 6:35 Jesus identified Himself as: “I am [Gr. ego eimi] the bread of life.” In John 8:12 “I am [Gr. ego eimi] the light of the world.” In John 10:7-9 “I am [Gr. ego eimi] the door.” In John 10:11, “I am [Gr. ego eimi] the good shepherd.” In John 11:25 “I am [Gr. ego eimi] the resurrection and the life.” In John 14:6 “I am [Gr. ego eimi] the way, the truth, and the life.” And in John 15:5: “I am [Gr. ego eimi] the vine.”

Do you notice the repeated “I am”?

All of these revelations are illuminating in their own right. But they are how Jesus chooses to introduce Himself to those He loves. Each of these statements involves a different way in which He relates Himself to mankind. They give us a better understanding of who He is and what He is all about. They paint a vivid picture of a personal God who wants to have intimacy with us.

 

[robert derrick]

No you have not. You are forcing your opinions upon the sacred text. It doesn't add up. It is totally un-corroborative. Every tenet of Amil has multiple support Scriptures. Premil has nothing to support all their main tenets.

Both are true. Spiritual millennial now with the Lord, and earthly millennial then resurrected with the Lord.

 

[WPM]

Both are true. Spiritual millennial now with the Lord, and earthly millennial then resurrected with the Lord.

How could it be when the world ends, time ends, sin ends, sinners end, and Satan ends, when Jesus returns?

 

[robert derrick]

How could it be when the world ends, time ends, sin ends, sinners end, and Satan ends, when Jesus returns?

Because they don't.

This heavena nd earth doesn't end, but the earth is scorched, and then they both flee from the Face of Him on the throne.

Time doesn't end, because there is still a thousand of years to come, and then there is the time of the end, where all are judged by their works.

Neither sin nor sinners end, because they will still follow Satan at the end of the thousand years, when he's loosed on earth one last time.

Satan doesn't end, but is chained in the pit for a thousand years.

Your words show you are only talking about your opinion, not Scripture.

 

[WPM]

Because they don't.

This heavena nd earth doesn't end, but the earth is scorched, and then they both flee from the Face of Him on the throne.

Time doesn't end, because there is still a thousand of years to come, and then there is the time of the end, where all are judged by their works.

Neither sin nor sinners end, because they will still follow Satan at the end of the thousand years, when he's loosed on earth one last time.

Satan doesn't end, but is chained in the pit for a thousand years.

Your words show you are only talking about your opinion, not Scripture.

Wrong! Scripture very clearly differentiates between time and eternity. Time was introduced at beginning when there was a division made between darkness and light. Scripture shows us that time will continue right up until the second coming of Christ when time shall be no more.

Revelation 10:1-3: “And I saw another mighty angel come down from heaven, clothed with a cloud: and a rainbow was upon his head, and his face was as it were the sun, and his feet as pillars of fire: And he had in his hand a little book open: and he set his right foot upon the sea, and his left foot on the earth, And cried with a loud voice, as when a lion roareth: and when he had cried, seven thunders uttered their voices.”

The symbolism and authority surrounding this great heavenly angel proves beyond a doubt that it is none other than the Lord Jesus Christ and a picture of His glorious second coming. We will the symbolism shortly.

Revelation 10:5-7 says of the Second Advent and the concluding last trumpet, “And the angel which I saw stand upon the sea and upon the earth lifted up his hand to heaven, and sware by him that liveth for ever and ever, who created heaven, and the things that therein are, and the earth, and the things that therein are, and the sea, and the things which are therein, that there should be time no longer: but in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets.”

There is clearly a major dilemma here for you those who take Revelation to be a literal chronological unfolding of last day events. They must surely concede, if they are going to be consistent with their view that everything after Revelation 11 (which also refers to the seventh trumpet) is in the realm of eternity and the after-life. After all Revelation 10 plainly records that with this particular event “there should be time no longer.” For those who would lightly dismiss this important narrative as anything other than a magnificent picture of the Lord Jesus Christ and His glorious second coming, they do foolishly ignore the great wealth of explicit and consistent end-time teaching on this subject and divorce the undoubted harmony of this chapter from the rest of New Testament prophetic teaching.

This is the end of the old temporal sin-cursed order and the introduction of the new eternal glorified order. Also, the undoubted finality surrounding the echo of the seventh trumpet proves beyond doubt that it is the last trump – the final trumpet sound for all mankind. “The kingdoms of this world” have finally “become the kingdoms of our lord, and of his Christ” and “he shall reign” not for 1000 years as some would have us believe but “for ever and ever.” Those who reject such evidence do so (in the main) in order to support the Preterist, Pretribulationist or Historist positions.

The King James Version interprets the passage correctly and in context: chronos ouketi estai – literally meaning: Time – no longer – there shall be’!!!

The whole import and wording of the remainder of the passage perfectly supports the King James Version rendering and confirms the all-consummating nature of the Second Advent, which says, “when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be etelesthee (or) finished.” It should be noted that the word etelesthee is a very strong climactic word that is rightly translated ‘finished’ in this reading and is consistently interpreted: completed, concluded, expired and accomplished.

This teaches us that time ceases to exist at the return of Christ.

Genesis 1:14-18 makes it clear that God has furnished mankind with the sun, moon and stars to give light and heat and also to gauge time. But there will also be a time in history where night and day will terminate. The season will no longer be needed. This correlates with the life-span of this current earth. Scripture teaches that these will not last forever. Genesis 8:22 tells us, as long as this corrupt earth (that is now fallen) exists we will have the varying time, seasons and night and day. We learn: “While the earth remaineth, seedtime and harvest, and cold and heat, and summer and winter, and day and night shall not cease.”

The current universe and stars are all going to be changed when He comes. Christ will be the eternal light on the new earth! They will be with us as long as there is time. Job 26:10 tells us: “He hath compassed the waters with bounds, until the day and night come to an end.

Without the sun and moon we do not have natural time. When Jesus comes these are rendered unnecessary and redundant. That is because God is the eternal light that will light eternity. We find support for this in Revelation 21:23 and 22:5.

Revelation 21:23 records: “And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof.”

Revelation 22:5 testifies: “And there shall be no night there; and they need no candle, neither light of the sun; for the Lord God giveth them light: and they shall reign for ever and ever.”

There are no sun or moon in eternity. That means there is no day or night in eternity. That means there is no such thing as time in eternity. There is no divisions of years, months, days, hours and seconds. We have one eternal unbroken day/age.

This reading informs us that this “place,” which Christ spoke of has a name; being described as the New Jerusalem and that it “cometh down out of heaven” at His appearing. This truth should help those who struggle with the meaning and timing of Revelation 20, because Revelation 21:1-2 (which all commentators agree) appears immediately after the happenings of Revelation 20. Therefore, it places its appearing, which we have already established coincides with the second coming of the Lord, at the end of the millennium thus revealing a postmillennial appearing of Christ. Christ connects the appearance of the New Jerusalem at His Coming, declaring, “Behold, I come quickly.” It is at this all-consummating event that the New Jerusalem comes “down out of heaven from my God.”

 

[WPM]

Because they don't.

This heavena nd earth doesn't end, but the earth is scorched, and then they both flee from the Face of Him on the throne.

Time doesn't end, because there is still a thousand of years to come, and then there is the time of the end, where all are judged by their works.

Neither sin nor sinners end, because they will still follow Satan at the end of the thousand years, when he's loosed on earth one last time.

Satan doesn't end, but is chained in the pit for a thousand years.

Your words show you are only talking about your opinion, not Scripture.

The age to come possesses no mortals. The wicked are destroyed at His appearing (2 Samuel 22:9, Job 41:20-21, Psalm 18:7-8, 37:9-11, 50:1-6, 68:1-3, 97:3-5, Isaiah 11:4-5, 13:9, 30:33, 66:15-17, Joel 2:1-3, 2:10-11, Nahum 1:1, 5-6, Malachi 4:1, Luke 17:26-30, 20:34-36, Romans 8:19-23, 1 Corinthians 6:9, 13:8-13, 15:50-55, 1 Thessalonians 4:15-5:3, II Thessalonians 1:4-10, Revelation 16:15-21, 19:11-18, Revelation 21-22).

 

[CadyandZoe]

Quote Randy Kluth Post #1042

"But identification is the key factor. God created a character less than Himself in His transcendence, but that character expresses who He actually is, if even down on a lower level of existence.

I hope I haven't butchered what you were trying to say? Sounds good to me as I've expressed it."

Birds of a feather flock together

Colossians 2:9KJV
9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

John 1:1-3KJV
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2 The same was in the beginning with God.
3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

Genesis 1:26KJV
26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

Brother, we both believe that Jesus is God. Perhaps we can unite on that basis?

 

[Truth7t7]

Brother, we both believe that Jesus is God. Perhaps we can unite on that basis?

One thing I know, my Jesus is different than yours, and there's only one real Jesus In The Holy Bible

Jesus Christ Is The Lord God Almighty, The Creator Of All Things, The Alpha/Omega

Colossians 2:9KJV
9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

John 1:1-3KJV
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2 The same was in the beginning with God.
3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

Genesis 1:26KJV
26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

 

[CadyandZoe]

One thing I know, my Jesus is different than yours, and there's only one real Jesus In The Holy Bible

Jesus Christ Is The Lord God Almighty, The Creator Of All Things, The Alpha/Omega

Colossians 2:9KJV
9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

John 1:1-3KJV
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2 The same was in the beginning with God.
3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

Genesis 1:26KJV
26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

My concern after all this discussion, is whether or not Christians believe that Jesus is a human man. I know what Christians say they believe. But what do they actually believe?

 

[Randy Kluth]

Quote Randy Kluth Post #1042

"But identification is the key factor. God created a character less than Himself in His transcendence, but that character expresses who He actually is, if even down on a lower level of existence.

I hope I haven't butchered what you were trying to say? Sounds good to me as I've expressed it."

Birds of a feather flock together

Colossians 2:9KJV
9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

John 1:1-3KJV
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2 The same was in the beginning with God.
3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

Genesis 1:26KJV
26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

You seem unable or unwilling to intelligently discuss any point I made. Okay, I get it. You don't want to discuss it.