God's Desire is that All Men be Saved!

[logabe]

Everyman is not given life.
Multitudes go into the second death

Was every man given death?

My point is, it is easy to believe that every man was given death, because of Adam's
disobedience, but when Paul says, that Jesus (the Last Adam) will give all men life,
because of the one righteous act, it becomes impossible. Why is that?

God in foreknowledge knew that billions of people wouldn't accept him in their lifetimes,
so He had a plan. He would put them in a place where they couldn't do anything they
wanted to do and allow the overcomers in Revelations chapters 2 & 3 to train them in
the ways of God in the Lake of Fire. That is why John said in Rev. 20:6, the second death
has NO POWER over the overcomers. Rev. 14:10 says,

10 The same shall drink the wine of the wrath of God, which
is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation;
and he shall be tormented with "fire and brimstone in the
presents of the holy angels, and in the presents of the Lamb:

God created the Lake of Fire for the people that didn't accept Jesus in their lifetime. He
did that because of His LOVE for mankind. God is a loving God and He loves His enemies.
He loves them so much, that he will leave the 99 and go get the one.

I don't understand God's love. The Holy Spirit has to reveal to me His Love so I can see
His ways. His ways are righteous, but in my carnal mind it makes no sense at all. Ps. 103:7
says,

7 He made known His ways to Moses, His acts to the sons of Israel.

The Israelites were quite lawless in the wilderness, but they did see the acts of God, but
only Moses knew his ways.

What a God! What a Plan!

Logabe

 

[logabe]

Get real!!! The second death is life in eternal separation from God in the eternal lake of fire!!!

The first death is right here on the earth. Where do you think the second death is?

 

[Anthony D'Arienzo]

logabe,

Thank you for your fine question logabe.

Was every man given death

?
Yes

My point is, it is easy to believe that every man was given death, because of Adam's
disobedience, but when Paul says, that Jesus (the Last Adam) will give all men life,
because of the one righteous act, it becomes impossible. Why is that?

Very Simple answer.
All men ever born were conceived dead in Adam by physical birth.

All who are In Jesus by being born from above, are given a new heart, and made new creatures by the Spirit.
They are born of the Spirit.

Not everyone born in sin { the first adam] gets born again in Jesus....do you see it?

All In Adam die=death ,spiritual death
All In Christ = Spirtual and eternal life

Same word All...different context, in Adam, or In Christ.

God in foreknowledge knew that billions of people wouldn't accept him in their lifetimes,
so He had a plan.

No...you are confusing omniscience with biblical foreknowledge. God knows everything in His omniscience.
God knows thwe elect intimately and savingly, Romans 8:29-30..Whom he did foreknow.

in other words, God knows all mankind are sinners and do not seek Him Psalm 14;1-3. Romans 3...
God seeks and saves those whom He fore loves, that is the Elect.

 

[justbyfaith]

Therefore Romans 3:10-12 is speaking of those who are under the law, apart from God.

Which is everybody.

No. See Romans 3:19; Romans 6:14.

You agree that fallen man has less of a free choice than Adam had before the Fall yet carry on like he is not a slave to his sin and satan and does not need to be set free by the Son.

Those who are in Christ are not slaves to sin.

But when God the Father draws a man to Christ, he is enabled to receive Him. But this does not preclude that he will receive Him. The drawing of the Father of men to Christ and the Father giving men to Christ are two different things.

But let’s not put the KJV on a pedestal, okay?

It is on a very high pedestal with me, and I'll tell you why:...

I started my Christian walk with the kjv and then someone suggested to me that I should try a different translation. I did, and my walk with Christ went downhill; until I picked up the kjv for the second time: at which time my walk with Christ began to look upwards again.

Just a testimony. See Revelation 12:10-11.

 

[reformed1689]

I started my Christian walk with the kjv and then someone suggested to me that I should try a different translation. I did, and my walk with Christ went downhill; until I picked up the kjv for the second time: at which time my walk with Christ began to look upwards again.

First off, that has nothing to do with the KJV and everything to do with you. Second, I doubt it is even true in the sense that it was just because you picked up the KJV. I'm sure there were other circumstances surrounding it. But no, you did not go downhill because you picked up another translation. That's nonsense. I can tell you hundreds of accounts of just the opposite. When people laid down the KJV they finally understood Scripture.

 

[logabe]

Very Simple answer.
All men ever born were conceived dead in Adam by physical birth.

All who are In Jesus by being born from above, are given a new heart, and made new creatures by the Spirit.
They are born of the Spirit.

Not everyone born in sin { the first adam] gets born again in Jesus....do you see it?

All In Adam die=death ,spiritual death
All In Christ = Spirtual and eternal life

Same word All...different context, in Adam, or In Christ.



As I said, it is easy to believe Adam brought death (mortality) to the whole human race. All
in Adam die (100%). So we know that ALL means ALL. Everybody I ask about death they
believe it is a reality.

The question is, why don't the ALL mean ALL in the last Adam (Jesus Christ)? We can agree
that everybody that was in Adam died, and it was done without our so called free will. We
had absolutely nothing to do with our mortality. It was done before we were born.

But let's get back to the question. What about All in Christ? Can God forgive the whole human
race and prepare a way for the enemies of God to be reconciled. Most people and Christians
say NO! But the Bible says YES! Colossians 1:20 says,

And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by
him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether
they be things in earth, or things in heaven.

Paul said, one day all things will be reconciled to God through Jesus Christ. In verse 16, Paul
said, that all things were created by him and everything that was lost in the first Adam will be
reconciled, because of the righteous act of Jesus Christ. Now that is GOOD NEWS! But what
about the ones that don't believe?

At the Great White Throne every knee will bow and every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ
is Lord!

Paul said, If you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God raised
him from the dead you shall be saved. Sounds like the whole human race will be x-unbelievers @
the Great White Throne!

What a God! What a Plan!

Logabe

 

[prism]

But when God the Father draws a man to Christ, he is enabled to receive Him. But this does not preclude that he will receive Him. The drawing of the Father of men to Christ and the Father giving men to Christ are two different things.

Think again, the word is akin to 'drag'...

ἕλκύω
STRONG’S NUMBER: g1670
Dictionary Definition g1670. ἑλκύω helkyō; or helko hel'-ko; probably akin to 138; to drag (literally or figuratively): — draw. Compare 1667.
AV (8) - draw 8;
to draw, drag offmetaph., to draw by inward power, lead, impel

 

[justbyfaith]

First off, that has nothing to do with the KJV and everything to do with you. Second, I doubt it is even true in the sense that it was just because you picked up the KJV. I'm sure there were other circumstances surrounding it. But no, you did not go downhill because you picked up another translation. That's nonsense. I can tell you hundreds of accounts of just the opposite. When people laid down the KJV they finally understood Scripture.

There are certain ways that other translations translate certain verses, that amount to less of a deterrent concerning specific types of sins. The kjv kept me on the straight and narrow. When I moved to a different translation, I became lacksadaisical in my faith and ended up sinning. As long as I kept with the kjv I walked in entire sanctification; when I moved to another translation I lost that blessing.

 

[reformed1689]

There are certain ways that other translations translate certain verses, that amount to less of a deterrent concerning specific types of sins. The kjv kept me on the straight and narrow. When I moved to a different translation, I became lacksadaisical in my faith and ended up sinning. As long as I kept with the kjv I walked in entire sanctification; when I moved to another translation I lost that blessing.

This is a false and overplayed claim of KJVO advocates.

 

[justbyfaith]

This is a false and overplayed claim of KJVO advocates.

It is certainly not false...it is a claim that is based on my experience.

 

[reformed1689]

It is certainly not false...it is a claim that is based on my experience.

Then post the verses that back up that claim.

 

[justbyfaith]

There is only one example that I remember any more...and that is 1 Corinthians 7:9. Other translations add in italics with passion; whereas if you read it in the kjv you find and keep the understanding that it is talking about burning in hell.

 

[justbyfaith]

Think again, the word is akin to 'drag'...

ἕλκύω
STRONG’S NUMBER: g1670
Dictionary Definition g1670. ἑλκύω helkyō; or helko hel'-ko; probably akin to 138; to drag (literally or figuratively): — draw. Compare 1667.
AV (8) - draw 8;
to draw, drag offmetaph., to draw by inward power, lead, impel

Act 7:51, Ye stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always resist the Holy Ghost: as your fathers did, so do ye.

The Holy Spirit, and thus the grace of God, can be resisted.

 

[reformed1689]

There is only one example that I remember any more...and that is 1 Corinthians 7:9. Other translations add in italics with passion; whereas if you read it in the kjv you find and keep the understanding that it is talking about burning in hell.

Unless, of course, it is not talking about Hell in that verse. What makes you think to burn is talking about Hell based on the context of that verse?

 

[justbyfaith]

Unless, of course, it is not talking about Hell in that verse. What makes you think to burn is talking about Hell based on the context of that verse?

See Matthew 5:29-30 (its topical context).

And also, the plain meaning of it when you read it in the kjv.

 

[justbyfaith]

Paul said, one day all things will be reconciled to God through Jesus Christ.

One way or another (Revelation 20:15, Revelation 20:10).

 

[reformed1689]

See Matthew 5:29-30 (its topical context).

And also, the plain meaning of it when you read it in the kjv.

First, it wasn't written in the KJV. It was written in Greek. Second, topical context? Oh boy... Third, the CULTURAL context, the word for burn was regularly used to describe sexual desire, erotic action, etc. So given the whole context is talking about sexual issues, burn with passion or burn with lust is the proper understanding. Not burn in Hell. While that is true, the context of this passage does not support it in that specific verse.

 

[justbyfaith]

First, it wasn't written in the KJV. It was written in Greek.

with passion is obviously not in the Greek. It is in italics in the translations in which it is included.

So given the whole context is talking about sexual issues, burn with passion or burn with lust is the proper understanding. Not burn in Hell.

Go ahead and take a chance on this if you so desire. Your blood is no longer on my head concerning it.

 

[reformed1689]

with passion is obviously not in the Greek. It is in italics in the translations in which it is included.

Likewise, neither is "in hell."

Go ahead and take a chance on this if you so desire. Your blood is no longer on my head concerning it.

What are you talking about? Take a chance on what?

 

[prism]

Act 7:51, Ye stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always resist the Holy Ghost: as your fathers did, so do ye.

The Holy Spirit, and thus the grace of God, can be resisted.

Sure, God's grace can be resisted, that's why God has to 'drag' us to Himself. Left on our own we would head South.