Bobby why are you so nasty towards other members of this forum?
What is to be gained by it other than you upsetting other people without any justification.
Shalom
Beware of Men's Endless Charts & Lists
- Thread starter Davy
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Bobby why are you so nasty towards other members of this forum?
What is to be gained by it other than you upsetting other people without any justification.
Shalom
Your statement is just one seeking advantage, not one actually dealing with truth.
You're obviously confused. I made no charts. I did declare times and seasons for fulfillment of that Dan.9:24 verse, which is when Jesus returns and not before.
What I am hearing, you are claiming from this statement, is that only your understanding is "truth" whether or not your understanding is actually God's truth.
But you have charted your timeline understanding of End time events with words by declaring times and seasons for fulfilments in your posts.
The fact that your understanding, of when Dan. 9:24 was/is to be fulfilled in this single verse prophecy,is flawed. Your understanding of when the second advent of Christ will occur is also flawed.
The Armageddon battle/judgement of the kings of the earth is a near future event which is also linked, timewise, with the judgement of Satan and his Angels in heaven who are then imprisoned in the Bottomless pit for 1,000 years. It is not, as you are claiming, a distant future war/event that will occur towards the very end of the Millennium Age. The battles/judgements that will occur towards the very end of the Millennium Age are the Gog Magog wars when Satan goes on a killing spree of the Saints who will not bow down to him.
Davy you may feel that you are the fountain of all wisdom and understanding, but the reality is that you are not.
Shalom
Bobby Jo
Well-Known Member
I just now saw your previous POST, so FIRST OF ALL, allow me to thank you for your considered reply! Secondly, please allow me to respond accordingly:
QUOTE: @Jay Ross
Congratulations Bobby Jo, you have put up some words for people to consider which contains your wisdom of your understanding of some verses in Daniel. 9.
1. Dan. 9:2 specifies "years".
2. Dan. 9:2 does not use the simple shama to perceive the prophecy of Jeremiah as though reading that book, but rather the Solomon biyn (Ref. 1 Kings 3) to perceive the prophecy in the BOOKS.
3. Per Young, the Dan. 9:25 "going forth of the word" does NOT have the inference of an edict from a man/king, but rather an edict directly from GOD.
4. The Dan. 9:25 "seven" is one duration with an anointed one "coming" after that duration.
5. The Dan. 9:25-26 sixty-two weeks is a second duration with a second anointed one who is cut off after that duration.
6. The "weeks" are the inconcise Masculine gender text, which are specifically NOT 490 years.
7. The second anointed one who is cut off is not killed upon the sixty-two, but simply AFTER.
8. The destroyer does not come at the beginning, middle, or upon the end of the seventieth shabuwa, but "shall come" after the seventieth shabuwa.
9. The seven, the sixty-two, the seventieth, and after the seventieth are chronologically connected, with NO ~2,000 year gap.
10. This prophecy is shut up and sealed until the time of the end, which is approximate to 1948.
... and of course there are other aspects which must be included, but these are basic aspects which any student of Prophecy should be aware of, but seldom are ...
But I DO appreciate you taking the time to consider what is being proposed, and hope that we can continue a meaningful conversation! 
Bobby Jo
QUOTE: @Jay Ross
Congratulations Bobby Jo, you have put up some words for people to consider which contains your wisdom of your understanding of some verses in Daniel. 9.
1. Dan. 9:2 specifies "years".
We are agreed.
2. Dan. 9:2 does not use the simple shama to perceive the prophecy of Jeremiah as though reading that book, but rather the Solomon biyn (Ref. 1 Kings 3) to perceive the prophecy in the BOOKS.
Yes you are right that “haš·šā·nîm” is not the simple form as you have put it of the Hebrew Root from which it is generated, “shanah.” Also the Hebrew word used to describe how Daniel came to understand from the book that the period of time that Israel would be in exile in Babylon would be 70 years. The Hebrew word is “bî·nō·ṯî” in Daniel. 9:2 whereas in 1 Kings. 3:9 the Hebrew word is “lə·hā·ḇîn”, in verse 11 it is “hā·ḇîn”, in verse 12 it is “wə·nā·ḇō·wn”, and in verse 21 it is “wā·’eṯ·bō·w·nên” all of which have embedded in these Hebrew words the Hebrew root, H:0995, “biyn” or “bin”.
It seems to me that you are on thin ice with your 2nd point.
It seems to me that you are on thin ice with your 2nd point.
Let me expound. Jesus says that when a person is invited to dine with a King, to sit at the far end of the table so that you can be honored when the King asks you to sit closer, versus being dishonored by being moved down. As such, in 1 Kings 3, Solomon merely asked for shama, but GOD gave him "what he asked for" which was actually the Solomon Wisdom biyn which is the same as the 9:2 diction. This suggests that Daniel did NOT read from the Book of Jeremiah, but instead found the Seventy Years in some other O.T. Book, -- specifically the Psalms, which has the requisite minimum 70 Chapters.
3. Per Young, the Dan. 9:25 "going forth of the word" does NOT have the inference of an edict from a man/king, but rather an edict directly from GOD.
You may well be right on this point.
Actually YOUNG is correct in his assertion, and the PSALMS validates this premise.
4. The Dan. 9:25 "seven" is one duration with an anointed one "coming" after that duration.
The usual translations of verse 25 is: -
Which suggest that the time duration described in this verse is 69 weeks of years.
"... There shall be seven weeks and sixty-two weeks ... "
There is NO PRECEDENT either in Scripture or in ANY SOCIETY where a pair of shoes cost ~seven and sixty-two dollars~ plus tax.
The CORRECT translation is:
The CORRECT translation is:
RSV: ... from the going forth of the word to restore and build Jerusalem to the coming of an anointed one, a prince, there shall be seven weeks. Then for sixty-two weeks it shall be built again with squares and moat, but in a troubled time. 26 And after the sixty-two weeks, an anointed one shall be cut off, and shall have nothing ...
5. The Dan. 9:25-26 sixty-two weeks is a second duration with a second anointed one who is cut off after that duration.
It seems to me that you are focusing on Daniel 9:26a in this point only and is independent of verse 25.
It's Scriptural and Historical, -- versus the FALSE contortions which are "Jesus Agenda" driven.
6. The "weeks" are the inconcise Masculine gender text, which are specifically NOT 490 years.
Not sure what your point is here.
The commentators interpret the text as though it were the USUAL CONCISE Feminine Gender text, which is found in all the other 14 instances. But these 6 citations in Dan 9, and ONLY DAN 9, are in the UNUSUAL INCONCISE Masculine Gender text. It's like asserting that you drive four cars (CONCISE). But you actually drive a: car, a motorcycle, a truck, and a van. Thus you don't have four CARS, but you DO have FOUR VEHICLES.
In Dan 9:2, one duration is a "year" and a second duration is a "week". And when the commentators assign a CONCISE "seven" for all seventy DURATIONS, they defy the INCONCISE text which Scripture actually presents. So the 490 is a LIE!
In Dan 9:2, one duration is a "year" and a second duration is a "week". And when the commentators assign a CONCISE "seven" for all seventy DURATIONS, they defy the INCONCISE text which Scripture actually presents. So the 490 is a LIE!
7. The second anointed one who is cut off is not killed upon the sixty-two, but simply AFTER.
I would agree with this point.
8. The destroyer does not come at the beginning, middle, or upon the end of the seventieth shabuwa, but "shall come" after the seventieth shabuwa.
There is a need for further information to be able to understand the point you are making.
... and upon the wing of abominations shall come one who makes desolate, until the decreed end is poured out on the desolator.”
You are right, there is no 2,000 years gap inserted between verse 26 and verse 27, the gap is closer to 3,000 years.
You are incorrect on TWO counts. The first is that I used an "~" approximate symbol. Secondly, there are NO GAPs either in Dan 9 or Dan 11. The angel makes it clear that ALL these prophecies are for the time of the end, and you make the angel a liar.
10. This prophecy is shut up and sealed until the time of the end, which is approximate to 1948.
This statement with no scriptures to substantiate it, is a bold claim. Scriptural evidence to support your assertion is required before it would be accepted by others.
It has FULL Scriptural support -- which you are oblivious to, so your position is an unsubstantiated bold claim.
All you have to do is consider if 12:4 "ancients" had 60 to 600mph travel; or whether the "ancients" had INSTANT INFORMATION at their fingertips.
All you have to do is consider if 12:4 "ancients" had 60 to 600mph travel; or whether the "ancients" had INSTANT INFORMATION at their fingertips.
12:4 ... Many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall increase.”
... and of course there are other aspects which must be included, but these are basic aspects which any student of Prophecy should be aware of, but seldom are ...
As usual you have a barb in your post to finish off with. Are you so discerning of the word that only you have the wisdom of Solomon to understand what has been recorded?
Yes and no. I depend heavily on Scripture, HONEST Scholars, and Revelation. But REVELATION NEVER EXCEEDS what the Scripture say and what the Scholars explain what the Scriptures say.
Take for example 1:21 & 10:1. Calvin acknowledges that his expositors are stumped by the word היה, haiah,by to be “broken;” but then throws out the LITERAL TEXT in favor of "historical convenience". But 1:21 & 10:1 are PERFECTLY CORRECT that Daniel DIED in the FIRST YEAR of Cyrus, but was still alive in the THIRD YEAR of Cyrus, King of Persia. (Same Cyrus, same Daniel.)
So to your point, do your have sufficient WISDOM to explain exactly how 1:21 & 10:1 are PERFECTLY CORRECT?
Take for example 1:21 & 10:1. Calvin acknowledges that his expositors are stumped by the word היה, haiah,by to be “broken;” but then throws out the LITERAL TEXT in favor of "historical convenience". But 1:21 & 10:1 are PERFECTLY CORRECT that Daniel DIED in the FIRST YEAR of Cyrus, but was still alive in the THIRD YEAR of Cyrus, King of Persia. (Same Cyrus, same Daniel.)
So to your point, do your have sufficient WISDOM to explain exactly how 1:21 & 10:1 are PERFECTLY CORRECT?
Bobby Jo
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It seems to me that you are ignoring what is recorded in Daniel 9 where it plainly states the following: -
Daniel 9:1-2: - 9:1 In the first year of Darius the son of Ahasuerus, of the lineage of the Medes, who was made king over the realm of the Chaldeans — 2 in the first year of his reign I, Daniel, understood by the books the number of the years specified by the word of the Lord through Jeremiah the prophet, that He would accomplish seventy years in the desolations of Jerusalem.
and are trying to find your answer to where Daniel may have got his answer from another source in the scriptures other than what Jeremiah may have written. Your answer is also cryptic in your provision of the particular chapter of the Book of Psalms. By ignoring what is plainly written in Daniel 9:2 you are doing the very thing that you poke fun at.
But you are make a claim without presenting the scriptural evidence to support your point of view.
Our understanding/interpretation of these verses is flawed to say the least, and it can be read/understood a number of ways. Although I found the RSV a reasonable translation, I know from experience that the translation also has errors in it. To claim that the RSV of all the English translations is the only translation in this case that has interpreted this passage correctly is a bit of a stretch give the other error it contains.
It seems that once again you are expressing an opinion without providing the proof for your assertions.
My understanding is that at the time of Christ’s birth, the beginning of the third generation/age of the Israelite people, that they were required to have repented of their iniquities, to stop the visitation of the fathers iniquities upon their children and their children’s children. God had given Daniel’s people and the city of Jerusalem 490 years of Grace to repent of their idolatrous practices through Daniel 9:24 by the end of their second generation/age of existence. History shows that Daniel people and Jerusalem had 490 years in which to repent after which the iniquities of the fathers were visited on their children and their children’s children as the prophecy in Daniel 9:26b clearly demonstrates and is confirmed by Exodus 20:4-6 during the third and the fourth. The question that I do not know the answer to is who decided that šā·ḇu·‘îm was inconcise and as such have muddied the waters as to the meaning of this Hebrew word.
Your argument is centred around your/someone’s claim that šā·ḇu·‘îm cannot have the meaning of “weeks of years” and that there cannot be 70 weeks of years which represents 490 years. The visitation of the iniquities of the fathers upon their descendants has not as yet run it full course with respect to time, and the end of this present age clearly co-insides with when this visitation will end, the Armageddon event will occur and all of Israel will be saved. There is to enough evidence to confirm this understanding.
This reference to scripture does not answer the question of, “Why it is so?” Or, “When will it happen that the decreed end is poured out on the desolator?”
So your argument against what I had written is that I had not used the "~" approximate symbol in my statement and your claim that there are no “Gaps” in either Daniel 9 or in Daniel 11. Now, when is Satan in your wisdom locked up in the Bottomless pit? Is it in our near future, approximately, 2,000 years after Jesus was crucified on a cross, after he is thrown out of heaven? Then How long is Satan then be locked up for? Is it 1,000 years per Revelation 20? If we add up these time period from when Daniel 9:26b begins, then there is a time period of around 3,000 years between the start of the Prophecy in Daniel 9:26b, and when the Prophecy in Daniel 9:27 begins to play out.
Now I will admit to an error in my post as then is a gap of 1,000 years that should be inserted between verse 26 and verse 27 of Daniel 9.
As with respect to your opinion that I have made the angel a liar, I have certainly placed the Prophecy in verse 27 towards the very end of the Millennium Age which is the last age of the for this earth as we presently know it, in which case I have not made the Angel a liar as I certainly agree with his statement that the prophecies are for the end times of the earth as we know it.
Continued in the next post: -
Continued from the previous post: -
Your rebuttal is your understanding and opinion as to what time period 12:4 is applicable to. In your defence you have assumed that many are presently running to and fro and that knowledge shall increase is applicable to this present time, but I would suggest that that this verse will only be applicable in our distant future, a round 1,000 years into our future.
We should consider Daniel 12:7 which reads in context: -
Daniel 12:5-10: - 5 Then I, Daniel, looked; and there stood two others, one on this riverbank and the other on that riverbank. 6 And one said to the man clothed in linen, who was above the waters of the river, "How long shall the fulfillment of these wonders be?"
7 Then I heard the man clothed in linen, who was above the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand to heaven, and swore by Him who lives forever, that it shall be for a time/an age, times/ages, and half a time/age; and when the power of the holy people has been completely shattered, all these things shall be finished.
8 Although I heard, I did not understand. Then I said, "My lord, what shall be the end of these things?"
9 And he said, "Go your way, Daniel, for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end. 10 Many shall be purified, made white, and refined, but the wicked shall do wickedly; and none of the wicked shall understand, but the wise shall understand.
If we understand the time this verse is pointing to, we would know that it is suggesting that approximately a period of 3,500 years will pass before all that has been prophesised will have been fulfilled. I see no reference or connection here with 1948 as you have suggested.
So far, I have not witnessed that you heavily rely of scripture, honest Scholars and Revelation.
As for your “riddle” as to why 1:21 & 10:1 is correct? I believe that you have attempted to answer this riddle, which is of little consequence with respect to this conversation.
Shalom
Your rebuttal is your understanding and opinion as to what time period 12:4 is applicable to. In your defence you have assumed that many are presently running to and fro and that knowledge shall increase is applicable to this present time, but I would suggest that that this verse will only be applicable in our distant future, a round 1,000 years into our future.
We should consider Daniel 12:7 which reads in context: -
Daniel 12:5-10: - 5 Then I, Daniel, looked; and there stood two others, one on this riverbank and the other on that riverbank. 6 And one said to the man clothed in linen, who was above the waters of the river, "How long shall the fulfillment of these wonders be?"
7 Then I heard the man clothed in linen, who was above the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand to heaven, and swore by Him who lives forever, that it shall be for a time/an age, times/ages, and half a time/age; and when the power of the holy people has been completely shattered, all these things shall be finished.
8 Although I heard, I did not understand. Then I said, "My lord, what shall be the end of these things?"
9 And he said, "Go your way, Daniel, for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end. 10 Many shall be purified, made white, and refined, but the wicked shall do wickedly; and none of the wicked shall understand, but the wise shall understand.
If we understand the time this verse is pointing to, we would know that it is suggesting that approximately a period of 3,500 years will pass before all that has been prophesised will have been fulfilled. I see no reference or connection here with 1948 as you have suggested.
So far, I have not witnessed that you heavily rely of scripture, honest Scholars and Revelation.
As for your “riddle” as to why 1:21 & 10:1 is correct? I believe that you have attempted to answer this riddle, which is of little consequence with respect to this conversation.
Shalom
Bobby Jo
Well-Known Member
Perhaps we should address one point at at time.
As to your question: Are you so discerning of the word that only you have the wisdom of Solomon to understand what has been recorded?
What you request is validation that I have some insight, whether by study or by inspiration, and I gave you an example -- AS REQUESTED:
Take for example 1:21 & 10:1. Calvin acknowledges that his expositors are stumped by the word היה, haiah,by to be “broken;” but then throws out the LITERAL TEXT in favor of "historical convenience". But 1:21 & 10:1 are PERFECTLY CORRECT that Daniel DIED in the FIRST YEAR of Cyrus, but was still alive in the THIRD YEAR of Cyrus, King of Persia. (Same Cyrus, same Daniel.)
So to your point, do you have sufficient WISDOM to explain exactly how 1:21 & 10:1 are PERFECTLY CORRECT?
So to your point, do you have sufficient WISDOM to explain exactly how 1:21 & 10:1 are PERFECTLY CORRECT?
And then because people are often hypocritical, YOU DENY and then REFUSE TO ANSWER WHAT YOU DEMANDED OF ME!
As for your “riddle” as to why 1:21 & 10:1 is correct? I believe that you have attempted to answer this riddle, which is of little consequence with respect to this conversation.
I answered that I can solve what NO OTHER SOURCE that I'm aware of, -- Commentary, Scholar, Pastor, or even @ReChoired -- can solve. But because you don't have the answer, you what?, back out of both MY and YOUR validation of study/inspiration?!?
Don't be dishonest, don't be a coward, -- solve the "riddle".
Bobby Jo
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What I am hearing from your mouth, is how you like to push hot air while not giving one iota of Biblical proof for you conclusions. When you ought to be focusing in God's Holy Writ, you instead like to throw out insults, as if it makes you think of yourself as being somewhat, when it only shows your immature childishness.
Oh, I definitely am... poking fun at those who like to apply Jewish Kabbalistic mysticism to God's Word, a system of Jewish occultism. Lot of my Christian brethren are totally unaware of a group of occult Jews that practice pagan mysticism against God's Word, treating the very letters on the page like they are magic formulas! Would you like for me to go more into that, and how the mystics in early European history used that Kabbalah system to practice ceremonial magic? And that is... what I was alluding to with those who try to apply some secret formula idea to what Daniel said there in Daniel 9:1-2. All Daniel was saying there was that he was studying the Book of Jeremiah about God's promise for Judah's captivity to last only 70 years, which promise is recorded in Jeremiah 25.
Now there's an example of your kind of hot air statement that flies out of nowhere!
Maybe YOUR understanding is flawed, because of who you may be listening to; ever think that might be a problem you're having if you can't come to a conclusion of the times and the seasons of the Daniel endtime prophecies?
Matt 24:15-16
15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand
16 Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:
KJV
Jesus didn't give that above sign for 70 A.D. He gave that for the last generation that will see all those signs He gave there upon the Mount of Olives. The final sign He gave was that of His 2nd coming and gathering of the saints. In simple words, Jesus showed that "abomination of desolation" event spoken of in the Book of Daniel is for the very end... of this present world, just prior to His return!
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But Davy I did reference scripture as a reference and I then went on to provide a summary of my understanding without referencing scripture as you have already quoted these passages before and as such you know where they are. For your information I have quoted part of my previous post and inserted the Biblical References that justified my summary of world event.
As for throwing out insults, it seems from your quoted post above that you are rather skilled in that department and resort to that false form of rebuttal when others present facts that shows your understanding is flawed.
Be honest with yourself and admit that your understanding of the End Times is not based on an honest understanding of scripture but on your twisting of the scriptures to suit your theory.
Shalom
Bobby Jo the references you want to show are "PERFECTLY CORRECT" are these: -
Dan 1:18-21: - 18 Now at the end of the days, when the king had said that they should be brought in, the chief of the eunuchs brought them in before Nebuchadnezzar. 19 Then the king interviewed them, and among them all none was found like Daniel, Hananiah, Mishael, and Azariah; therefore they served before the king. 20 And in all matters of wisdom and understanding about which the king examined them, he found them ten times better than all the magicians and astrologers who were in all his realm. 21 Thus Daniel continued until the first year of King Cyrus.
Dan 10:1: - 10:1 In the third year of Cyrus king of Persia a message was revealed to Daniel, whose name was called Belteshazzar. The message was true, but the appointed time was long; and he understood the message, and had understanding of the vision.
Dan 10:1: - 10:1 In the third year of Cyrus king of Persia a message was revealed to Daniel, whose name was called Belteshazzar. The message was true, but the appointed time was long; and he understood the message, and had understanding of the vision.
I understand that these two scripture references are true and correct, Daniel 1 tells us of the time period Daniel was an official of the respective kings that he served. From the time that Nebuchadnezzar appointed him as an official of his court and he served the various kings who had dominion over Babylon up and until the first year of King Cyrus. Daniel 1:21 only indicates that Daniel stopped serving in his capacity as a chief advisor to the respective king, not that he had died.
Daniel 10:1 tells us when he received the vision that is recorded from the beginning of chapter 10 until the end of the book of Daniel.
Now in Daniel 12:13 we are told that Daniel is still alive and the angel tells him this:-
Dan 12:13: - 13 "But you, go your way till the end; for you shall rest, and will arise to your inheritance at the end of the days/ages."
Daniel is told that he will die soon and have his rest but that he will arise at the end of the days/ages and receive his inheritance.
Now how relevant is this information to our present discussion. Is this you simply posting a red herring to stop the conversation where you are being exposed as an impostor on this forum with respect to your knowledge of the end times.
Shalom
Davy, you are commenting on a post that I made to Bobby Jo because, it seems that you are hurt because I have previously called your posts above flawed in the understanding that you have presented. This rant of yours is your attempt to justify your flawed understandings.
And a quote that you are addressing that I had responded to Bobby Jo with:-
And you posted comment on what I had posted to Bobby Jo was: -
Davy, I would question who you are attempting to attack with your post above as it seems to me to be miss directed. It seems that your rant is that of a little person trying to play in the big boys league.
You were also trying to discredit me by your statement of "because of who you may be listening to; every think that might be a problem you're having," which is as nasty as one can get, with the inference of saying that the person in question is onlly listening to the Devil.
Your false argument does nothing to support your theory and in fact it is you who have destroyed the validity of your posts.
Shalom
Bobby Jo
Well-Known Member
QUOTE: Bobby Jo
QUOTE: Jay Ross
As to your question: Are you so discerning of the word that only you have the wisdom of Solomon to understand what has been recorded?
What you request is validation that I have some insight, whether by study or by inspiration, and I gave you an example -- AS REQUESTED:
Take for example 1:21 & 10:1. Calvin acknowledges that his expositors are stumped by the word היה, haiah,by to be “broken;” but then throws out the LITERAL TEXT in favor of "historical convenience". But 1:21 & 10:1 are PERFECTLY CORRECT that Daniel DIED in the FIRST YEAR of Cyrus, but was still alive in the THIRD YEAR of Cyrus, King of Persia. (Same Cyrus, same Daniel.)
So to your point, do you have sufficient WISDOM to explain exactly how 1:21 & 10:1 are PERFECTLY CORRECT?
And then because people are often hypocritical, YOU DENY and then REFUSE TO ANSWER WHAT YOU DEMANDED OF ME!
As for your “riddle” as to why 1:21 & 10:1 is correct? I believe that you have attempted to answer this riddle, which is of little consequence with respect to this conversation.
I answered that I can solve what NO OTHER SOURCE that I'm aware of, -- Commentary, Scholar, Pastor, or even @ReChoired -- can solve. But because you don't have the answer, you what?, back out of both MY and YOUR validation of study/inspiration?!?
What you request is validation that I have some insight, whether by study or by inspiration, and I gave you an example -- AS REQUESTED:
Take for example 1:21 & 10:1. Calvin acknowledges that his expositors are stumped by the word היה, haiah,by to be “broken;” but then throws out the LITERAL TEXT in favor of "historical convenience". But 1:21 & 10:1 are PERFECTLY CORRECT that Daniel DIED in the FIRST YEAR of Cyrus, but was still alive in the THIRD YEAR of Cyrus, King of Persia. (Same Cyrus, same Daniel.)
So to your point, do you have sufficient WISDOM to explain exactly how 1:21 & 10:1 are PERFECTLY CORRECT?
And then because people are often hypocritical, YOU DENY and then REFUSE TO ANSWER WHAT YOU DEMANDED OF ME!
As for your “riddle” as to why 1:21 & 10:1 is correct? I believe that you have attempted to answer this riddle, which is of little consequence with respect to this conversation.
I answered that I can solve what NO OTHER SOURCE that I'm aware of, -- Commentary, Scholar, Pastor, or even @ReChoired -- can solve. But because you don't have the answer, you what?, back out of both MY and YOUR validation of study/inspiration?!?
QUOTE: Jay Ross
Bobby Jo the references you want to show are "PERFECTLY CORRECT" are these: -
Dan 1:21 Thus Daniel continued until the first year of King Cyrus.
Dan 10:1: - 10:1 In the third year of Cyrus king of Persia
Dan 12:13: - 13 "But you, go your way till the end; for you shall rest, and will arise to your inheritance at the end of the days/ages."
Dan 10:1: - 10:1 In the third year of Cyrus king of Persia
Dan 12:13: - 13 "But you, go your way till the end; for you shall rest, and will arise to your inheritance at the end of the days/ages."
Perhaps you missed that Daniel DIED in the FIRST year of Cyrus:
http://m.ccel.org/ccel/calvin/calcom24.vii.xx.html?bcb=right
Expositors are puzzled with this verse, because, as we shall afterwards see, the Vision occurred to Daniel in the third year of Cyrus’s reign. Some explain the word היה, haiah,by to be “broken;” ...
Expositors are puzzled with this verse, because, as we shall afterwards see, the Vision occurred to Daniel in the third year of Cyrus’s reign. Some explain the word היה, haiah,by to be “broken;” ...
And Daniel DID DIE at the end of Chapter 1, which was an overview of his entire servitude under Nebuchadnezzar and finally under Cyrus. But he was ALIVE in the THIRD year of Cyrus in Chapters 10 & 12 exactly as you depict. -- So once again: How is this possible?
But if you want to distort and disregard Scripture it won't be the first time, and it's really not unexpected given your past performance.
Bobby Jo
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But the word that Calvin acknowledges that his expositors are stumped by, the word היה, haiah, does not appear in Daniel 1:21. The Hebrew word in that verse is וַֽיְהִי֙ way·hî which is based on the Hebrew root word, H:1961, hayah, which means that your arguments is based on the wrong Hebrew word, so that your understanding is flawed.
The New English Translation, i.e. the NET Bible, has this notation for this verse: -
Dan 1:21
sn The Persian king Cyrus' first year in control of Babylon was 539 B.C. Daniel actually lived beyond the first year of Cyrus, as is clear from 10:1. The purpose of the statement in 1:21 is merely to say that Daniel's life spanned the entire period of the neo-Babylonian empire. His life span also included the early years of the Persian control of Babylon. However, by that time his age was quite advanced; he probably died sometime in the 530's B.C.
(from The NET Bible®, Copyright © 1996-2006 by Biblical Studies Press, L.L.C., Dallas, Texas, www.bible.org. All rights reserved. Used by permission.)
sn The Persian king Cyrus' first year in control of Babylon was 539 B.C. Daniel actually lived beyond the first year of Cyrus, as is clear from 10:1. The purpose of the statement in 1:21 is merely to say that Daniel's life spanned the entire period of the neo-Babylonian empire. His life span also included the early years of the Persian control of Babylon. However, by that time his age was quite advanced; he probably died sometime in the 530's B.C.
(from The NET Bible®, Copyright © 1996-2006 by Biblical Studies Press, L.L.C., Dallas, Texas, www.bible.org. All rights reserved. Used by permission.)
Bobby Jo you know that what you have written with respect to my response to your riddle, is not true.
When I clicked on this link, it just told me that there was nothing for me to see. And it also occurred in the link in the next paragraph of your post.
Where in Daniel 1:21 does it say that Daniel had died. This verse along with 1:19 only tells us about the duration of Daniel’s working life, and makes no mention of his death.
Daniel 6:28 tells us the following: -
Dan 6:28: - 28 So this Daniel prospered in the reign of Darius and in the reign of Cyrus the Persian.
Scripture here seems to disagree with what you are claiming. The NET Bible notation suggests that Daniel died around 9 years after Cyrus began to rul over Babylon.
It seems to me Bobby Jo that it is you who is distorting the truth and by doing such you have shown that your knowledge of the end times is very questionable which is reinforced by your constant language of put downs of other forum members.
Shalom
Bobby Jo
Well-Known Member
I accounted what Calvin's record shows. Personally I only find that Daniel "existed" [H1961] until the First Year of Cyrus ( -- given that Chapter 1 covers the span of Daniel's servitude, he would have DIED at the end of that Chapter). And the liars suggest that Daniel "existed" in one empire and ONLY THE FIRST YEAR of the next empire is credited. -- And good LIARS present something that sounds reasonable to stupid people, -- but is in fact from the pit of hell.
You're confused. -- I've CONSISTENTLY asserted that Daniel DIED in the First Year of Cyrus, exactly as 1:21 documents. Secondly, Daniel was also alive in the THIRD year of Cyrus according to 10:1. -- Thus the "riddle".
So answer the "riddle". BOTH Verses are PERFECTLY CORRECT AS WRITTEN, (same Daniel, same Cyrus) and as such I DO HAVE STUDY/INSIGHT. Now do YOU???
Please solve the "riddle",
Bobby Jo
* Please note that 6:28 is for a different argument why the Commentators can't be trusted to explain these END-TIME Prophecies.
Your post #23 didn't provide one iota of Biblical evidence for your position. All you did was mouth at how wrong you think I am, along with personal insults.
I can be a lot more skilled at that than you could ever imagine when someone begins mouthing a bunch of hot air like you've been doing. I've actually been easy on you. You have a bad habit of pushing your 'self-righteousness'. When you make hot air statements like, "You get angry when the facts are presented...", and such the like, when you have NOT... presented the facts, but have just run your mouth making assumptions, that's an example of your real attitude!
With your last statement I rest my case. You have no intention of actually staying with Scripture, but instead desire to just start arguments and run your ignorant mouth pushing hot air, just like you've done in this post. You act just like your Pharisee brethren.
No, I was poking fun at what YOU said in YOUR post:
Jay Ross said:
And I meant what I said.
Your just full of hot air and confusion.
aspen
“"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few
At the same time, it is anti-intellectual to dismiss information - we simply need to research the information.
Helen
Well-Known Member
- Oct 22, 2011
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Hey there my friend....not seen you here for about a month...ood to see you.
Hope all things are good with you ...and if your not back here before Christmas then have a wonderful Christmas to you and yours. ✟
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