Speaking In Tongues, Healing And Laying On Of Hands

QUOTE (WhiteKnuckle @ Apr 6 2009, 09:30 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=71957
I've heard that these gifts of the Holy Spirit are not for us today. I've seen lot's of people saying that things that happened in the early church are not for us today.I've personally seen evidence of these gifts, so I believe they are for today. I know we are all different parts of the same body, so we all wont get the same gifts, (as some churches believe that everyone that's saved speaks in tongues ) Anyway...Why would people believe that they are not for today?If these gifts are evident and true, why aren't people going around public healing?
Many people today have perverted the speaking of tongues. Of course they are for today, but today's speaking of tongue is not biblical speaking of tongue... The today ones ones are unknown babble that no know on Earth can understand... it based on self and not His Words.Like this..."fyttdjudjdut gut uytjvjhgv" It's like scribble.The real speaking of tongues is this...Acts 2:6 - Now when this was noised abroad, the multitude came together, and were confounded, because that every man heard them speak in his own language.Acts 2:8 - And how hear we every man in our own tongue, wherein we were born?Acts 2:9-11 - Parthians, and Medes, and Elamites, and the dwellers in Mesopotamia, and in Judaea, and Cappadocia, in Pontus, and Asia, Phrygia, and Pamphylia, in Egypt, and in the parts of Libya about Cyrene, and strangers of Rome, Jews and proselytes, Cretes and Arabians, we do hear them speak in our tongues the wonderful works of God.In short, the real speaking of tongues is when you speak someone elses home language that is not of your own home language.Lastly, speaking of tongues is the very least of God's gifts of today.

QUOTE (WhiteKnuckle @ Apr 6 2009, 10:00 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=71959
I get that part. What about "If I speak in tongues of men or of angels...." ? Most people believe speaking in tongues is a language of God, so you can "Pray through the Holy Spirit"My Great Grandpa was a Penticostal Preacher. I never did meet him. According to my mom and my aunts and my Grandma, My aunt died in an explosion from a gas stove when she was little, she was burned pretty bad on her chest too, scarred real bad from it. When she died my Great Grandpa layed hands on her and she came back to life.When I was younger I took my wife to some church, it was a penticostal like cult. I didn't realize it was a cult until that night. My wife and I had been baptised a few weeks prior to this visitation. They believed that if you don't speak in tongues you are not saved. What's odd is they didn't believe the Holy Spirit was the Spirit of God. They said that it's more like, "Team Spirit" like, Yay God! Scared me to hear that! Well, we went to that church, and the women latched on to my wife, grabbing her arms, and laying hands on her head. My wife fought to get away, but they wouldn't let her. They told her that she had a demon in her and started trying to drive it out. At this time, I was so afraid I was commiting the unforgiveable sin, so I was to afraid to say anything and I didn't have any idea what to do. I was sorry I brought my wife there, and felt trapped.After a few minutes, my wife started speaking in tongues, I couldn't tell if it was a language of man, or what it was. I talked to her later on. She says, "I don't know what happened. I started speaking in tongues and I couldn't control it. I don't believe those women were from God, but I think it was God helping me out of that situation"I can see that, because I was absolutely useless in defense at that time.Believe me, I've got some stories, they seem far fetched but they're true. My whole life has been a giant huge epic experience like very few I've talked to.This is why I'm wondering. Alot of atheists are looking for signs, and the bible clearly says that those who follow Christ these signs will follow them. I know what the bible says about "A wicked and adulterous generation seeks a sign but none will be given...."
Back in summer 2006, I went to three churches. I hated 2 of them because nobody brought their bible. One of them told me NOT to bring my bible. The final church I went to WAS a Pentecostal church... I was there for three weeks, and I never went back because I felt a devil... clearly not of God. I am fine if I don't have this gift of speaking in tongue... regardless if I don't have it or not, I am saved by grace, not by requirement of speaking in tongues (works). (Ephesians 2:8-9, Romans 11:6)Trust me WhiteKnuckle, you are nowhere near committing an unforgiveable sin. The unforgiveable sin can only be committed by the elects in the future event in the trial of Satan (The Anti-Christ)

QUOTE (WhiteKnuckle @ Apr 6 2009, 10:22 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=71963
I'm getting over that fear, it's a long story that relates to my nervous breakdown when I was 18, and having OCD on top of it. LOL!I'm not afraid to speak out about things now. I want to go back to that church and walk right up to the pulpit and start preaching the word of God so those people will finally hear it. In fact I want to go to every church and start preaching for some reason.Saved by grace is good we don't need anything else. I'm just wondering why people feel we don't need these other gifts. It seems to me that they're denying the power of God in a way. Then again, even if you healed someone infront of some atheists they'd say it was a hoax. Especially in light of certain "faith healers" we see in the media, who obviously are hoax's, like the Green Prayer Cloth guy.
Well, the simple answer is this, It's not really denying the power of God... It's just that God never gave every single gifts to others. Each has their own talent that God gave us... we just have to search for it. God gave some people more talent than others... If He gave every talent to all His children, we would all be able to do everything.BTW, Summer 2006 is when I became Christian.

QUOTE (WhiteKnuckle @ Apr 6 2009, 10:34 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=71968
No kidding, 2006??? Did you believe your whole life in a God? Or believe in nothing? How'd it happen for you?
I assume myself as an Atheist by default. Nobody ever told me anything about God and Christ... Not even anyone in my family... so how can I know if they never talk about God with me? Although my family says that I was baptized as a baby... but being baptized (by water) means nothing if they don't know God existed at all.Until someone on the internet told me about God and Christ in beginning of 2006.

Heres the explanation and truth about Tongues there was no word language back then Tongues means Language but its more than that its the natrual language of men. God has no use for babbel no one can understand. http://www.entrewave.com/view/reformedonli...%20part%205.htm

QUOTE (WhiteKnuckle @ Apr 6 2009, 10:47 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=71971
We are atheist by default. I was blessed to have been taught about God as a baby and a child from my Grandparents and a little from my mom although she thought I was satan incarnate. So my whole life I've believed. Although in my older years I became more of a Deist, still assuming the Deity was the Christian God, but still thought, anyone that believed in a God believed in the same God. I don't think I ever really had faith or what's called "a saving faith" untill about 1 or 2 months ago. I always thought the bible was truth, but it never seemed alive until then.You don't have to tell me (obviously) I just like hearing how people came to the Lord.
You know already that we all came from different directions, I do like hearing how people came to the Lord also, but I'm more comfortable sharing in a one on one. I have trusted humans all the time before I became a Christian... now I have an extremely hard time trusting humans (especially my family) until I see evidence... but don't take it personally... I just need to get to know them before I am comfortable sharing. (one on one)

Oh boy here we go again. This forum is generally split into two categories. One group that believes that the act of speaking in tongues is more than "language" and the other that is against it. The later group scares off the first, I noticed that upon observation.I fall in to the category of that first group. White Knuckle, I want you to read 1 Corinthians chapter 14. Read it carefully and examine the literal Greek translations for yourself. Jag and Kriss as well as I are here to give you advice and a sense of direction. The only person you can truly trust is God. So I beg you to pray to God for answers if you ever need help interpreting text.Since everyone gave their 2 ¢, I might as well.The gift of tongues has four functions:1. Tongues for personal edification (1 Cor. 14.4)This is the supernatural language the Holy Spirit prays through us that we can use to pray hour after hour as we desire.1 Cor. 14:2: "One who speaks in a tongue does not speak to men, but to God; for no one understands, but in his spirit he speaks mysteries."The gift of tongues mentioned here is obviously different from the one manifested on the day of Pentecost - for this gift is not to "speak to men but to God" and no-one can understand what the speaker is saying.1 Cor. 14:4: "One who speaks in a tongue edifies himself"The gift of tongues enables a believer to build himself up spiritually.2. Tongues for interpretation (1 Cor. 14:5)This manifestation of tongues is normally presented in a public assembly, accompanies by interpretation by the same or another person.1 Cor. 14:26, 27: "What is the outcome then, brethren? When you assemble, each one has a psalm, has a teaching, has a revelation, has a tongue, has an interpretation. Let all things be done for edification. If anyone speaks in a tongue, it should be by two or at the most three, and each in turn, and let one interpret;"Not more than two or three should speak in tongues in a meeting of the church, but each "tongue" must be interpreted. "Interpretation" is not the same as "translation". Translation is "word for word". Interpretation is "expressing the thought in one's own words".3. Tongues of deep intercession groaning (Rom. 8:26) This diversification of tongues empowers the believers to stand in the gap for their own lives, their families, their church, their city, their nation, etc. God may also call them to intercede for someone or for some situation that is totally unknown to them.4. Tongues as a sign to the unbeliever (1 Cor. 14:22)This is the phenomenon that took place on the Day of Pentecost (Acts 2:4-11). It occurs when the Holy Spirit transcends the intellect and all language barriers by empowering a believer to preach, teach, or testify about Christ in some language of men of which the believer himself has no knowledge.Acts 2:4,7,11: "They were all filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit was giving them utterance....... And the Jews from every nation marveled saying....`We hear them in our own tongues speaking of the mighty deeds of God.'"The first time that believers were filled with the Holy Spirit, they ALL spoke in tongues. The "tongues" were languages that others understood immediately. So there was no need for the gift of interpretation.Notice also in verse 4 that it was the persons themselves who began to speak in tongues and not the Holy Spirit. The Spirit did not move their tongues. The Spirit only gave them utterance. They spoke themselves.In no gift, does the Holy Spirit take away freedom of choice from us. In fact, the fruit of the Spirit is "self-control" (Gal.5:23). Only demon-possessed people lose control of themselves. One who is filled with the Spirit will have more control over himself than anyone else. "The spirit of the prophets is subject to the control of the prophets"(1 Cor.14:32).Revert back to this massive post of mine if you need anymore insight: [url="http://www.christianityboard.com/index.php?showtopic=6923&view=findpost&p=48327]http://www.christianityboard.com/index.php...ost&p=48327[/url]

QUOTE (Jordan @ Apr 6 2009, 08:43 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=71958
Many people today have perverted the speaking of tongues. Of course they are for today, but today's speaking of tongue is not biblical speaking of tongue... The today ones ones are unknown babble that no know on Earth can understand... it based on self and not His Words.Like this..."fyttdjudjdut gut uytjvjhgv" It's like scribble.The real speaking of tongues is this...Acts 2:6 - Now when this was noised abroad, the multitude came together, and were confounded, because that every man heard them speak in his own language.Acts 2:8 - And how hear we every man in our own tongue, wherein we were born?Acts 2:9-11 - Parthians, and Medes, and Elamites, and the dwellers in Mesopotamia, and in Judaea, and Cappadocia, in Pontus, and Asia, Phrygia, and Pamphylia, in Egypt, and in the parts of Libya about Cyrene, and strangers of Rome, Jews and proselytes, Cretes and Arabians, we do hear them speak in our tongues the wonderful works of God.In short, the real speaking of tongues is when you speak someone elses home language that is not of your own home language.Lastly, speaking of tongues is the very least of God's gifts of today.
I am afraid you are mistaken

QUOTE (Wakka @ Apr 7 2009, 12:21 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=71988
Oh boy here we go again. This forum is generally split into two categories. One group that believes that the act of speaking in tongues is more than "language" and the other that is against it. The later group scares off the first, I noticed that upon observation.I fall in to the category of that first group. White Knuckle, I want you to read 1 Corinthians chapter 14. Read it carefully and examine the literal Greek translations for yourself. Jag and Kriss as well as I are here to give you advice and a sense of direction. The only person you can truly trust is God. So I beg you to pray to God for answers if you ever need help interpreting text.Since everyone gave their 2 ¢, I might as well.The gift of tongues has four functions:1. Tongues for personal edification (1 Cor. 14.4)This is the supernatural language the Holy Spirit prays through us that we can use to pray hour after hour as we desire.1 Cor. 14:2: "One who speaks in a tongue does not speak to men, but to God; for no one understands, but in his spirit he speaks mysteries."The gift of tongues mentioned here is obviously different from the one manifested on the day of Pentecost - for this gift is not to "speak to men but to God" and no-one can understand what the speaker is saying.1 Cor. 14:4: "One who speaks in a tongue edifies himself"The gift of tongues enables a believer to build himself up spiritually.2. Tongues for interpretation (1 Cor. 14:5)This manifestation of tongues is normally presented in a public assembly, accompanies by interpretation by the same or another person.1 Cor. 14:26, 27: "What is the outcome then, brethren? When you assemble, each one has a psalm, has a teaching, has a revelation, has a tongue, has an interpretation. Let all things be done for edification. If anyone speaks in a tongue, it should be by two or at the most three, and each in turn, and let one interpret;"Not more than two or three should speak in tongues in a meeting of the church, but each "tongue" must be interpreted. "Interpretation" is not the same as "translation". Translation is "word for word". Interpretation is "expressing the thought in one's own words".3. Tongues of deep intercession groaning (Rom. 8:26) This diversification of tongues empowers the believers to stand in the gap for their own lives, their families, their church, their city, their nation, etc. God may also call them to intercede for someone or for some situation that is totally unknown to them.4. Tongues as a sign to the unbeliever (1 Cor. 14:22)This is the phenomenon that took place on the Day of Pentecost (Acts 2:4-11). It occurs when the Holy Spirit transcends the intellect and all language barriers by empowering a believer to preach, teach, or testify about Christ in some language of men of which the believer himself has no knowledge.Acts 2:4,7,11: "They were all filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit was giving them utterance....... And the Jews from every nation marveled saying....`We hear them in our own tongues speaking of the mighty deeds of God.'"The first time that believers were filled with the Holy Spirit, they ALL spoke in tongues. The "tongues" were languages that others understood immediately. So there was no need for the gift of interpretation.Notice also in verse 4 that it was the persons themselves who began to speak in tongues and not the Holy Spirit. The Spirit did not move their tongues. The Spirit only gave them utterance. They spoke themselves.In no gift, does the Holy Spirit take away freedom of choice from us. In fact, the fruit of the Spirit is "self-control" (Gal.5:23). Only demon-possessed people lose control of themselves. One who is filled with the Spirit will have more control over himself than anyone else. "The spirit of the prophets is subject to the control of the prophets"(1 Cor.14:32).Revert back to this massive post of mine if you need anymore insight: [url="http://www.christianityboard.com/index.php?showtopic=6923&view=findpost&p=48327]http://www.christianityboard.com/index.php...ost&p=48327[/url]
Nice presentation, Wakka. There is much confusion in the Holy Spirit field. It took a lot for God to get Peter to go to a Gentiles house, but when he did go to Cornelius's house in Acts 10, those who went with Peter were amazed that the Gentiles also received the gift of the Holy Spirit and they knew this because they people there spoke in tongues. Compare this with Acts 8. After Phillip had preached and brought healing and great joy, something was still missing. Peter and John went down and it says then the people of Samaria "received the Holy Ghost." And then, Simon (the sorcerer) saw something - he must have seen the manifestations of the Spirit because he then wanted to buy the power so that he could lay hands on anybody he wanted to so they too could receive. The point is, in the early Church it was common to receive into manifestation speaking in tongues. When a new believer didn't, then someone helped them, like Paul did in acts 19. And in I Corinthians chapter 14, which you so wisely encouraged us to read, Paul said to "forbid not to speak with tongues."One last thing. Jordon, the great apostle Paul said he spoke in tongues more then ye all. If he thought it was that important, then why would you think that it is the least important?

QUOTE (Jordan @ Apr 6 2009, 10:43 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=71958
Many people today have perverted the speaking of tongues. Of course they are for today, but today's speaking of tongue is not biblical speaking of tongue... The today ones ones are unknown babble that no know on Earth can understand... it based on self and not His Words.Like this..."fyttdjudjdut gut uytjvjhgv" It's like scribble.
2nd Peter 2:12 But these, as natural brute beasts, made to be taken and destroyed, speak evil of the things that they understand not; and shall utterly perish in their own corruption;Jude:10 But these speak evil of those things which they know not: but what they know naturally, as brute beasts, in those things they corrupt themselves.There is more than one type of biblical tongues.

QUOTE (watchman @ Apr 17 2009, 01:21 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=72711
2nd Peter 2:12 But these, as natural brute beasts, made to be taken and destroyed, speak evil of the things that they understand not; and shall utterly perish in their own corruption;Jude:10 But these speak evil of those things which they know not: but what they know naturally, as brute beasts, in those things they corrupt themselves.There is more than one type of biblical tongues.
One of the main reason that tongues along with the power gifts are not present in the IC is because the religions demons don't want Gods people getting set free. Only a brief glimpse at the IC dominated by its spectator congregations will show you there is no room for anything unless it is controlled from the pulpit. No wonder 1,000,000 are leaving every year in North America alone.

QUOTE (Wakka @ Apr 7 2009, 01:21 AM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=71988
1. Tongues for personal edification (1 Cor. 14.4) 2. Tongues for interpretation (1 Cor. 14:5) 3. Tongues of deep intercession groaning (Rom. 8:26) [/color] 4. Tongues as a sign to the unbeliever (1 Cor. 14:22)
Good job wakka, I appreciate your post and your understanding on this subject.

QUOTE (evotell @ Apr 16 2009, 06:50 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=72675
QUOTE (Jordan @ Apr 6 2009, 09:43 PM) index.php?act=findpost&pid=71958
Many people today have perverted the speaking of tongues. Of course they are for today, but today's speaking of tongue is not biblical speaking of tongue... The today ones ones are unknown babble that no know on Earth can understand... it based on self and not His Words.Like this..."fyttdjudjdut gut uytjvjhgv" It's like scribble.The real speaking of tongues is this...Acts 2:6 - Now when this was noised abroad, the multitude came together, and were confounded, because that every man heard them speak in his own language.Acts 2:8 - And how hear we every man in our own tongue, wherein we were born?Acts 2:9-11 - Parthians, and Medes, and Elamites, and the dwellers in Mesopotamia, and in Judaea, and Cappadocia, in Pontus, and Asia, Phrygia, and Pamphylia, in Egypt, and in the parts of Libya about Cyrene, and strangers of Rome, Jews and proselytes, Cretes and Arabians, we do hear them speak in our tongues the wonderful works of God.In short, the real speaking of tongues is when you speak someone elses home language that is not of your own home language.Lastly, speaking of tongues is the very least of God's gifts of today.
I am afraid you are mistakenHow am I mistaken? It is clearly written in the scriptures... Speaking in a NON-home language... Speaking in a language that isn't your birth language is the biblical way of speaking in tongues. I don't see how I am very mistaken.

I do not dispute that the Gifts of The Holy Spirit can be applied in modern day. He distributes them according to his purpose. Some are genuine.I will also not dispute that in modern day we can walk into Charismatic and Pentecostal services and all you see are people swinging from the chandeleirs , rolling on the carpet , vibrating on the floor in front of the stage for the whole service ..... What is THAT ???? I ask ???? Come back 10 years later and they are doing the same thing. Nothing more has been acomplished.Some of these groups get exposed and have the lowest moral standards you can imagine. Please do not tell me this is The Holy Spirit at work. At the very best some of those folks have confused emotional feel good showmanship with Gifts of The Spirit. Some times it may be harmless but it sure looks strange .There are genuine manifestations of the Holy Spirit working through the Christian in modern day. People who instantly can communicate in an unknown language , usually to reach the listener with a message from the Lord. Some faith healings are the genuine article. You just have to cut through the showmanship , carnival acts , money and nonsense to find it.Here is hoping we are all filled with The Holy Spirit and accomplish something genuine. It can be done.Martin W.