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Featured Biblical Salvation

Discussion in 'Christian Theology Forum' started by ByGraceThroughFaith, Apr 5, 2021.

  1. Tong2020

    Tong2020 Well-Known Member

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    Check the Greek word. It’s “prographó”. It does not mean foreordained.

    <<<But you are right in that God does not predetermine that certain people will go to hell.

    And that means that God does not predetermine certain people to go to heaven.>>>

    It does not necessarily follow.

    Tong
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  2. Tong2020

    Tong2020 Well-Known Member

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    Why, do you find scriptures saying that God is Satan? If not, then you should not have any problem not believing any one who teaches that.

    Tong
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  3. Hidden In Him

    Hidden In Him Well-Known Member

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    That was a triple negative, which is also something I find hard to understand, LoL.
     
  4. Tong2020

    Tong2020 Well-Known Member

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    Those who were not chosen by God to save will be condemned, not because they were not chosen, nor because God created them for condemnation, but because of their sin.

    Now regarding the passage in Proverbs 16:4. It would be a mistake to interpret that as God creating people for condemnation. For God did not create a wicked man, but God created an innocent and sinless Adam.

    Tong
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  5. Tong2020

    Tong2020 Well-Known Member

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    It would be hard if you isolate that from the context.

    But for your sake, let me say that another way.

    If scriptures does not say that God is Satan, it will be easy for you to not believe any one who says that God is Satan.

    Tong
    R2553
     
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  6. Hidden In Him

    Hidden In Him Well-Known Member

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    A double negative. Tong, God bless you man. It's not a problem if we disagree, and I wish you the very best regardless.

    Have a blessed day in the Lord Jesus Christ, bro. Maybe we'll pick things up the next time around. It's all good.
    - H
     
  7. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    G4270 - prographō - Strong's Greek Lexicon (KJV)

    The KJV translates Strong's G4270 in the following manner: write (1x), write aforetime (1x), write afore (1x), evidently set forth (1x), before ordain (1x).
    Outline of Biblical Usage G4253 and G1125; to write previously; figuratively, to announce, prescribe:—before ordain, evidently set forth, write (afore, aforetime).
    Thayer's Greek Lexicon Romans 15:4a R G L text T Tr WH, 4b Rec.; Ephesians 3:3; οἱ πάλαι προγεγραμμένοι εἰς τοῦτο τό κρίμα, of old set forth or designated beforehand (in the Scriptures of the O. T. and the prophecies of Enoch) unto this condemnation, Jude 1:4.
    2. to depict or portray openly (cf. πρό, d. α: οἷς κατ' ὀφθαλμούς Ἰησοῦς Χριστός προεγράφη ἐν ὑμῖν (but ἐν ὑμῖν is dropped by G L T Tr WH) ἐσταυρωμένος, before whose eyes was portrayed the picture of Jesus Christ crucified (the attentive contemplation of which picture ought to have been a preventive against that bewitchment), i. e. who were taught most definitely and plainly concerning the meritorious efficacy of the death of Christ, Galatians 3:1. Since the simple γράφειν is often used of painters, and προγράφειν certainly signifies also to write before the eyes of all who can read (Plutarch, Demetr. 46 at the end, προγραφει τίς αὐτοῦ πρό τῆς σκηνῆς τήν τοῦ Ὀιδιποδος ἀρχήν), I see no reason why προγράφειν may not mean to depict (paint, portray) before the eyes; (R. V. openly set forth). Cf. Hofmann at the passage (Farrar, St. Paul, chapter xxiv., vol. i, 470 note; others adhere to the meaning to placard, write up publicly, see Lightfoot at the passage; others besides; see Meyer).
     
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2021
  8. Amazed@grace

    [email protected] Active Member

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    One has to ignore an enormous amount of scripture to first believe God's words, only to then rework certain of them that cannot be consolidated unto ones personal belief. And so it is. Denying foreordination, predestination teachings of God I believe is to deny Sovereignty of God. 13 Bible verses about Foreordained Plans
     
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2021
  9. Amazed@grace

    [email protected] Active Member

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    Okie dokie.
     
  10. Amazed@grace

    [email protected] Active Member

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    How so? Responding to that last part.
     
  11. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    In that, if God predetermined sin, then God is the author of sin.

    How is that possible if God is holy?
     
  12. Amazed@grace

    [email protected] Active Member

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    If that was directed toward my post#279, remember that isn't my thoughts. Those are facts from God in his own words. Why do we think there is the term, election? Do we ignore Isaiah's 42 and verse 1? Arminian teachings do conflict with the facet of God's Sovereignty. Is this community dedicated Arminian? I may have missed that in the statement of beliefs. And this could explain the conflict that has arisen. Well, most of it I'd think and save for the dark threatening persona.
     
  13. Amazed@grace

    [email protected] Active Member

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    First, how is sin defined by God in his word? Bye, that last part of your post that I was referencing started at, " But....". It's contradictory.
     
  14. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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  15. Amazed@grace

    [email protected] Active Member

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    Let's go with the most succinct definition in that of 1John 3:4. How did the law come to exist? What is its source?
     
  16. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    The heart and character of the Lord.
     
  17. Amazed@grace

    [email protected] Active Member

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    In other words, God created the law? Editing: Remember Romans 5.
     
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2021
  18. Tong2020

    Tong2020 Well-Known Member

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    What you’ve quoted is how KJV translated the word “prographō”.

    The literal meaning of the word “prographō” is to write before. It comes from “pro” and “grapho”.

    You can check out the Greek word that means foreordained or predetermine, which is “proorizó”.

    Tong
    R2554
     
  19. Tong2020

    Tong2020 Well-Known Member

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    In those 13 Bible verses there is none that speaks about God predestining people for condemnation.

    To be clear, I don’t deny the Sovereignty of God. Scriptures just does not teach God creating man to condemn. That would go to contradict scriptures and God’s nature. Now scriptures teach that God predestine people for salvation. That does not go against scriptures nor God’s nature.

    Tong
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  20. Tong2020

    Tong2020 Well-Known Member

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    Do you believe that what God had by His foreknowledge knew and have seen ahead of time (future), can change what He had seen and known to happen?

    Tong
    R2556
     
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