Christ has already returned ?

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MatthewG

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Calm down there. I'm trying to have a reasonable discussion with you and I'm not judging you, okay? I'm just asking if you've considered the possibility that Jesus could have been talking about His transfiguration in Matthew 16:28 or not. So, have you?
I’m calm, brother. I’m not upset with you at all. I’m just answering from conviction, not emotion. And yes — I have considered the transfiguration view for Matthew 16:28. It’s one of the most common interpretations, and I understand why people hold it.

But here’s why I don’t believe the transfiguration fulfills what Jesus said:

• Jesus said “some standing here will not taste death until…”
In the transfiguration, it was only six days later (Matthew 17:1). No one died in those six days, so the statement loses its meaning if applied there.
• Jesus said they would see “the Son of Man coming in His kingdom” (Matthew 16:28).
At the transfiguration, Jesus was glorified, yes — but He did not come in His kingdom, judge anyone, or reward every man according to his works (Matthew 16:27).
• Peter, who was at the transfiguration, later says the transfiguration was a preview, not the fulfillment:
“We were eyewitnesses of His majesty…” (2 Peter 1:16–18).
He never equates it with the coming Jesus promised.
• Jesus ties the “coming of the Son of Man” to the destruction of Jerusalem in that generation (Matthew 24:27–34).
That’s the same timeframe He referenced in Matthew 16:28.


So yes — I’ve considered the transfiguration view carefully. I just don’t think it fits the details Jesus Himself gives.

I’m not trying to win an argument. I’m simply following the text where it leads me. If we’re going to talk about it, I’m happy to do that respectfully.
 

MatthewG

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Jesus and his transfiguration shares what I believe where Jesus is now…

On the throne with Yahavah.

Glorified after saving the bride and overcoming all things.
 

MatthewG

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You're saying you believe He came and got His bride in 70 AD and then immediately went back to heaven with His bride? Don't you believe that those who are Christians now are part of His bride?
I’m not part of the bride at all. People proclaim that but I don’t see how we could be.

What I do believe is that everyone dies and is immediately judged and resurrected.

That was the first century people under apostolic rulership, which was the Bride of Christ.


I don’t claim to be the bride of Christ or part of it.


I see us more as individuals all choosing to have faith and believe or not and be sons or daughters of God through faith in the resurrected Lord Jesus.
 

MatthewG

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Think about it, people in Jesus time.

Are they important?

Do the introductions of most letter include where the people are ?

That’s the real people being talked to…

You know how people share Thessaloniki right? Those people where there living reading the apostles letter…

Or Ephesus, people lived there but today people need people to come to church so many in church pulpits and stuff disregard these things…

They just regurgitate idk… whatever comes to their minds and however it gets people in the seats doesn’t matter gotta make money.


That’s most pastors mentality and you never get really taught properly… you just kind of nod and and listen to someone tell you how to believe without thinking for yourself….



At the end of the day still love God and people just these quibbles are a reality… but don’t define a life lived for God…

That’s on every individual … either believe on the resurrected Lord Jesus, and raise with him into newness of life and love, as we suffer through.

Or don’t.

That’s my outlook.
 

Spiritual Israelite

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I’m calm, brother. I’m not upset with you at all. I’m just answering from conviction, not emotion. And yes — I have considered the transfiguration view for Matthew 16:28. It’s one of the most common interpretations, and I understand why people hold it.
That's all I was asking was if you have considered it. Thanks for answering the question.

But here’s why I don’t believe the transfiguration fulfills what Jesus said:

• Jesus said “some standing here will not taste death until…”
In the transfiguration, it was only six days later (Matthew 17:1). No one died in those six days, so the statement loses its meaning if applied there.
That isn't necessarily the case. Jesus knew that most likely all of His disciples would die before He came again in glory (many believe they were all martyred, which is very possible), but He wanted to give some of them a glimpse of that before they died.
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• Jesus said they would see “the Son of Man coming in His kingdom” (Matthew 16:28).
In Mark 9, it's worded like this...

Mark 9:1 And He said to them, “Assuredly, I say to you that there are some standing here who will not taste death till they see the kingdom of God present with power.” 2 Now after six days Jesus took Peter, James, and John, and led them up on a high mountain apart by themselves; and He was transfigured before them. 3 His clothes became shining, exceedingly white, like snow, such as no launderer on earth can whiten them.

I would say the way Jesus is described in Mark 9:3 qualifies for the kingdom of God being present with power.

At the transfiguration, Jesus was glorified, yes — but He did not come in His kingdom, judge anyone, or reward every man according to his works (Matthew 16:27).
I don't think it's necessary to assume that Jesus, in verse 28, was talking about what the fulfillment of what He mentioned in verse 27. I think He wanted to give some of His disciples a preview, so to speak, of what it would be like when Matthew 16:27 is fulfilled by showing Himself to them in glory. When He comes in the future He will appear in glory.

• Peter, who was at the transfiguration, later says the transfiguration was a preview, not the fulfillment:
“We were eyewitnesses of His majesty…” (2 Peter 1:16–18).
Right. I don't believe Jesus intended to refer to anything but that in Matthew 16:28. I believe He was intending to say that He was going to give some of them standing there a preview of His coming in glory.

He never equates it with the coming Jesus promised.
• Jesus ties the “coming of the Son of Man” to the destruction of Jerusalem in that generation (Matthew 24:27–34).
That’s the same timeframe He referenced in Matthew 16:28.
That can't be true because Jesus said that the coming of the Son of Man will result in heaven and earth passing away and all unbelievers being killed just as was the case in the flood in Noah's day (Matthew 24:35-39 - compare to 2 Peter 3:6-7,10-12).

So yes — I’ve considered the transfiguration view carefully. I just don’t think it fits the details Jesus Himself gives.
I think there's some details that you maybe haven't considered, which I've shared above, but you have to decide for yourself what to believe, of course.

I’m not trying to win an argument. I’m simply following the text where it leads me. If we’re going to talk about it, I’m happy to do that respectfully.
I can do that and am trying to, but I do have a disdain for full preterism. But, I can see that you do believe you will be with Christ when you die and you are trying to be respectful, so I will honor that.