So, we can only die, and not be buried with Christ?
Do they leave the corpses laying where they died in your part of the country?
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Do they leave the corpses laying where they died in your part of the country?
Peter preached the 1st message of the church.
He concluded by telling the sinners they must be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of their sins.
He taught water baptism from day 1.
The modern, non-water cults are the real cults.
They oppose Acts 2:38.
You better get out of it before it is too late.
I love acts 10, but didn't realize you were there yet.(Peter COMMANDED them to be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ, which you are not)
You skipped Acts 2:38 again?
Magdalene
Member
Magdalene
Member
I didn't skip anything. We were on Acts 10 and you jumped to Acts 2 rather than deal with the fact that the gentiles in Acts 10 were saved before baptism.
Peter doesn't say that they are saved by the water.
Acts 2:38, “And Peter said to them, ‘Repent, and let each of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.’”
Those who hold to the belief that baptism is required for salvation point to this verse and the fact that it says “be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins,” assuming that the word translated “for” in this verse means “in order to get.” However, in both Greek and English, there are many possible usages of the word “for".
There are three possible meanings of the word “for” that might fit the context of Acts 2:38: 1--“in order to be, become, get, have, keep, etc.,” 2—“because of, as the result of,” or 3—“with regard to.”
One example of how this preposition is used in other Scriptures is seen in Matthew 12:41 where the word eis communicates the “result” of an action. In this case it is said that the people of Nineveh “repented at the preaching of Jonah” (the word translated “at” is the same Greek word eis). Clearly, the meaning of this passage is that they repented “because of’” or “as the result of” Jonah’s preaching. In the same way, it would be possible that Acts 2:38 is communicating the fact that they were to be baptized “as the result of” or “because” they already had believed and in doing so had already received forgiveness of their sins.
No they weren't.
They did not get remission of sins until baptism in the name of Jesus Christ.
Now you are accusing PETER of skipping Acts 2:38.
Yikes!
Magdalene
Member
Since Jesus said, "He that keeps my sayings shall never see death" - John 8:51.
I'm asking if you know anyone or group that is illuminated unto Life.
All christian groups I know are dying like flies.
That doesn't even make sense. Peter didn't have the book of Acts...and..
Then Peter said, 47 “Surely no one can stand in the way of their being baptized with water. They have received the Holy Spirit just as we have.”
Not, " they will receive." Already done. They were already saved before being dunked.
All I saw is that you imply remission of sins per water baptism in the name of Jesus Christ via Acts 2:38 is not going to save us.
I beg Peter's pardon.
Wait, the star of the book of Acts is Peter. The co-star was Paul.
Peter WAS the book of Acts.
Remove Peter, you have the book of confusion.
He knew what he said in Acts 2:38....
Still dancing around the fact that the gentiles were already saved I see.
Do you understand that the Bible reveals more Truth as it moves forward in time? The OT gives us glimpses of what God is like and how he works. And the New shows him revealed more and more, to both the diciples and to us, the readers. Peter got some things right at pentecost, but he did not yet have the full revelation.
What does John the Baptist say about baptism?
“I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:” – Matthew 3:11
Paul received farther Revelation on this topic:
13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.
Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?” – Romans 6:3
What kind of baptism is Paul talking about? Not a wet one!
John the Baptist contrasted his baptism in water with Jesus’ baptism with the Holy Spirit. According to John the Baptist, the baptism with the Holy Spirit would be a distinctive part of the ministry of Jesus Christ.
Before His ascension into heaven Jesus said the following to His disciples.
John baptized with water, but in just a few days you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit (Acts 1:5 NLT).
Simon Peter used this phrase when recounting what took place when the gospel was received by the Gentiles. We read of this in the Book of Acts. He said.15 “As I began to speak, the Holy Spirit came on them as he had come on us at the beginning. 16 Then I remembered what the Lord had said: ‘John baptized with water, but you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.’ 17 So if God gave them the same gift he gave us who believed in the Lord Jesus Christ, who was I to think that I could stand in God’s way?”
Ahh, now Peter is understanding that it's not just about the water and not just about repentance.
It's a new form of baptism that comes from believing in Christ's resurrection.
The Apostle Paul used the phrase once. In his first letter to the Corinthians he wrote the following words.
For in one Spirit we were all baptized into one body. Whether we are Jews or Greeks or slaves or free, we were all made to drink of the one Spirit 1 Corinthians 12:13
Are you getting it now?
To the Galatians, Paul proclaimed that believers had been baptized “into” Christ. He explained it in this manner.
for all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ Galatians 3:27
To the church in Ephesus, the Apostle Paul emphasized that there is only one baptism. He put it this way.
[There is] One Lord, one faith, one baptism Ephesians 4:5
What baptism is it that matters? Not the wet one, but the baptism of fire. The Baptism of the Holy Spirit.
Thanks for the discussion because it has really clarified my understanding of this topic to study it more. I believe more than ever that those who rely on their dunking for their salvation are in error.
The Holy Ghost is absolutely promised as the result of being water baptized in the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth for the remission of sins (Acts of the Apostles 2:38-39).
Was John the Baptist wrong to baptize?
Furthermore, Jesus also took up the ministry of baptism in John 4:1-2. Was Jesus wrong?
If I said that water has the power to save, it was only in the context of the fact that going under the water and coming up out of it is the only way to accurately represent death, burial, and resurrection and our identification with that in Christ.
I have said that the water does not have any magical qualities. It is the symbol that saves; in that through the symbol of being buried in the water, the person makes a confession of Jesus Christ before men; so that Christ will confess him before His Father in heaven and before the holy angels (Matthew 10:32, Luke 12:8).
Tell me, is it not salvational to a man for Christ to confess him before the Father and His angels?
I think that it is.
Oh well; I guess that you are one of those spoken of in 2 Timothy 4:3.
If you have moved on from me it is not because I said that the water saves; for that is not my position.
But if you think that that is the reason, know that you have rejected me as a teacher for a faulty reason that is not based in reality. I have stated my true position above; and it is not that water has any kind of magical qualities to be able to save a person.
In Acts chapter 10, the church was in a period of transition. Most believers believed that only Jews could be saved at that time. So, God gave Cornelius and friends the baptism of the Holy Ghost in order to prove to the circumcision group of Peter's day that Gentiles could be saved. If they had not spoken in tongues, the circumcision group would never have allowed Cornelius and friends to be baptized in water (thus identifying them as Christians). The circumcision group was opposed to any non-Jew being included in the kingdom of God. So, God had to prove to them that Gentiles could be saved so that they would allow them into the fold of Christianity.
God was not changing His mind about the promise that He gave in Acts of the Apostles 2:38-39. He created an exception to the rule of Acts of the Apostles 2:38 in order to create a situation where those who were of the circumcision would be willing to allow Gentiles into the fold of Christianity.
That is disputable.
In order to have a case you would have to contend for the idea that water baptism is not baptism.
For I would contend that baptism is three-in-one: 1) water, 2) Spirit, 3) fire;
And therefore you cannot separate water baptism from Holy Spirit baptism because there is one baptism (Ephesians 4:5).
And because there is one baptism, you cannot separate water baptism from Holy Spirit baptism unless you say that water baptism is not baptism.
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