You gotta read 1 Corinth chapter 12 but this a part of it27Now you are the body of Christ, and each one of you is a part of it. 28And in the church God has appointed first of all apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then workers of miracles, also those having gifts of healing, those able to help others, those with gifts of administration, and those speaking in different kinds of tongues. 29Are all apostles? Are all prophets? Are all teachers? Do all work miracles? 30Do all have gifts of healing? Do all speak in tongues[d]? Do all interpret? 31But eagerly desire[e] the greater gifts. And now I will show you the most excellent way.So guys lemme know what you think, I don't believe everyone speaks in tounges.
Do you think speaking in Tounges is the gift of everybody?
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Conclusion: Nobody on Earth is going to have every gift from God. Not everybody is going to have the same gift.Anybody saying that it is required is a liar. It's Yahshua only. NOT Yahshua plus works...Jag
Let's rejoice in the Lord then.
HalleluYah! In the name of Yahshua, to the glory of God (YHWH) the Father.It's men's interpretation trying to fit God's Words. Let God do His own interpretation since He is infinately wiser than men.Jag
(thesuperjag;27170)
. . .It's men's interpretation trying to fit God's Words. Let God do His own interpretation since He is infinately wiser than men.
1 Corinthians 12 - often quoted, rarely understood.People often fish out the verses you quote, which, in isolation, could indeed be taken to mean what you obviously want them to.But if you take that approach, you can make the bible say anything!When you take a text out of context you are left with a con!Is the context of these verses what different people get *at salvation* as you are representing it to be?If so, does it it the rest of the chapter which says only one is given faith, knowledge, wisdom etc?Or is there a distinction between "the gift" of faith and faith spoken of elsewhere, "gift of tongues" and tongues spoken of eslewhere?Does it fit with what God did and what was said in Acts and the beginning of the letter, and other scriptures that detail the receiving of the Spirit (becoming a Christian)?
. . .It's men's interpretation trying to fit God's Words. Let God do His own interpretation since He is infinately wiser than men.
1 Corinthians 12 - often quoted, rarely understood.People often fish out the verses you quote, which, in isolation, could indeed be taken to mean what you obviously want them to.But if you take that approach, you can make the bible say anything!When you take a text out of context you are left with a con!Is the context of these verses what different people get *at salvation* as you are representing it to be?If so, does it it the rest of the chapter which says only one is given faith, knowledge, wisdom etc?Or is there a distinction between "the gift" of faith and faith spoken of elsewhere, "gift of tongues" and tongues spoken of eslewhere?Does it fit with what God did and what was said in Acts and the beginning of the letter, and other scriptures that detail the receiving of the Spirit (becoming a Christian)?
practice what you preach tallman stop reading what you want into scripture salvation has nothing to do with your tongues and babble We are saved by grace unless you can come up with outstanding Prophecy you have to share your babble is just babble
Speaking in tounges without an interpreter Paul says only edifies that personI have not found it anywhere, an i don't do the 1verse reading when i read i read chapters and books...... I hear you tallman but if you can find sound doctrine then I will look more into it.. God Bless you
(SavedByChrist;27228)
Speaking in tounges without an interpreter Paul says only edifies that personI have not found it anywhere, an i don't do the 1verse reading when i read i read chapters and books...... I hear you tallman but if you can find sound doctrine then I will look more into it.. God Bless you
I trust Christ only, and Christ alone. Tallman is just trying to get us into this blasphemy. There will never be scriptures saying that we need works on top of Christ for salvation.Salvation means victory. So how can it be victory if we add works on top of Christ who gives us salvation?It is Yahshua only. NOT Yahshua plus works.I'll stick with the scriptures.Ephesians 2:8-9 - For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast. Romans 11:6 - And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.JagLovest thou in Christ Yahshua, Lord and Saviour of the world.
Speaking in tounges without an interpreter Paul says only edifies that personI have not found it anywhere, an i don't do the 1verse reading when i read i read chapters and books...... I hear you tallman but if you can find sound doctrine then I will look more into it.. God Bless you
I trust Christ only, and Christ alone. Tallman is just trying to get us into this blasphemy. There will never be scriptures saying that we need works on top of Christ for salvation.Salvation means victory. So how can it be victory if we add works on top of Christ who gives us salvation?It is Yahshua only. NOT Yahshua plus works.I'll stick with the scriptures.Ephesians 2:8-9 - For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast. Romans 11:6 - And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.JagLovest thou in Christ Yahshua, Lord and Saviour of the world.
(SavedByChrist;27234)
Praise God....there is nothing but Christ to gain salvation
All honour, glory and praise to the Lord Yahshua/Jesus Christ to the glory of God (YHWH) the Father. HalleluYah !JagLovest thou in Christ Yahshua, Lord and Saviour of the world.
Praise God....there is nothing but Christ to gain salvation
All honour, glory and praise to the Lord Yahshua/Jesus Christ to the glory of God (YHWH) the Father. HalleluYah !JagLovest thou in Christ Yahshua, Lord and Saviour of the world.
It will be noted by any visitors to this thread that the questions I asked were not answered, instead silly accusations were made.This is what is called a kangaroo court, like in the Dark Ages when the Papists killed and persecuted any that opposed them then issued an open invitation: "if any one disagrees with us, come on down to Rome and state your case"(or words to that effect) . . . when no-one came they said: glory to God! we must be right!How sad!There are the ignorant . .. and then there are the willingly ignorant.
(TallMan;27257)
It will be noted by any visitors to this thread that the questions I asked were not answered, instead silly accusations were made.This is what is called a kangaroo court, like in the Dark Ages when the Papists killed and persecuted any that opposed them then issued an open invitation: "if any one disagrees with us, come on down to Rome and state your case"(or words to that effect) . . . when no-one came they said: glory to God! we must be right!How sad!There are the ignorant . .. and then there are the willingly ignorant.
Nay, who should be ignorant that Christ only can save us? Can works save us? Can Satan save us? Verily, verily, I say unto thee, thou art trying to enter Heaven at the back gate instead of the natural proper gate. (John 10:1)Jag
It will be noted by any visitors to this thread that the questions I asked were not answered, instead silly accusations were made.This is what is called a kangaroo court, like in the Dark Ages when the Papists killed and persecuted any that opposed them then issued an open invitation: "if any one disagrees with us, come on down to Rome and state your case"(or words to that effect) . . . when no-one came they said: glory to God! we must be right!How sad!There are the ignorant . .. and then there are the willingly ignorant.
Nay, who should be ignorant that Christ only can save us? Can works save us? Can Satan save us? Verily, verily, I say unto thee, thou art trying to enter Heaven at the back gate instead of the natural proper gate. (John 10:1)Jag
Yes, we do work. When we get saved...we should do the Lord's Work...for we are saved by grace. We should do them in the name of Yahshua (Jesus) to the glory of God (YHWH) the Father. If we add works on top of Christ for salvations...then the Faith is false.JagLovest thou in Christ Yahshua, Lord and Saviour of the world.
(thesuperjag;27274)
Nay, who should be ignorant that Christ only can save us? Can works save us? Can Satan save us? Verily, verily, I say unto thee, thou art trying to enter Heaven at the back gate instead of the natural proper gate. (John 10:1)Jag
You keep saying that, there's no point no one is saying that works save, simply what is being said is that AFTER salvation the next step is to be baptised in the Holy Spirit, you don't just say "Yes I feel I have the Holy Spirit in me". How in the name of the Lord do you know you have it in you? How do you deceive yourself? There is Cornelius, read and STUDY carefully what the power of Jesus' Word that was being preached to him, did!"44 While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.45 And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.----------WHY? HOW?------------------46 For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter,47 Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?48 And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days." Acts 10:44Now how can you not see these steps of salvation??? This is the pure process! The christian way! I know brethren that pray for many years to be baptised in the Holy Spirit, but have not yet received. Why? God knows. Are they not saved? Of course they are! God knows the right time, I'm sure He will bestow the Spirit upon them in time, and if not I'm sure they will come along with us to meet Jesus in the air, no doubt about that!Praise God!
Nay, who should be ignorant that Christ only can save us? Can works save us? Can Satan save us? Verily, verily, I say unto thee, thou art trying to enter Heaven at the back gate instead of the natural proper gate. (John 10:1)Jag
You keep saying that, there's no point no one is saying that works save, simply what is being said is that AFTER salvation the next step is to be baptised in the Holy Spirit, you don't just say "Yes I feel I have the Holy Spirit in me". How in the name of the Lord do you know you have it in you? How do you deceive yourself? There is Cornelius, read and STUDY carefully what the power of Jesus' Word that was being preached to him, did!"44 While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.45 And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.----------WHY? HOW?------------------46 For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter,47 Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?48 And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days." Acts 10:44Now how can you not see these steps of salvation??? This is the pure process! The christian way! I know brethren that pray for many years to be baptised in the Holy Spirit, but have not yet received. Why? God knows. Are they not saved? Of course they are! God knows the right time, I'm sure He will bestow the Spirit upon them in time, and if not I'm sure they will come along with us to meet Jesus in the air, no doubt about that!Praise God!
(Jonous;27569)
You keep saying that, there's no point no one is saying that works save, simply what is being said is that AFTER salvation the next step is to be baptised in the Holy Spirit, you don't just say "Yes I feel I have the Holy Spirit in me". How in the name of the Lord do you know you have it in you? How do you deceive yourself? There is Cornelius, read and STUDY carefully what the power of Jesus' Word that was being preached to him, did!"44 While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.45 And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.----------WHY? HOW?------------------46 For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter,47 Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?48 And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days." Acts 10:44Now how can you not see these steps of salvation??? This is the pure process! The christian way! I know brethren that pray for many years to be baptised in the Holy Spirit, but have not yet received. Why? God knows. Are they not saved? Of course they are! God knows the right time, I'm sure He will bestow the Spirit upon them in time, and if not I'm sure they will come along with us to meet Jesus in the air, no doubt about that!Praise God!
You are reading what you want in scripture you can not be saved without the holy spirit already entering you (think theif on the cross who was neither baptisted by water nor spoke any babble We are saved by grace baptised by spirit your examples you use of tongues is translated languge (foregien) you have presented no evidence or proof of your argument at all
You keep saying that, there's no point no one is saying that works save, simply what is being said is that AFTER salvation the next step is to be baptised in the Holy Spirit, you don't just say "Yes I feel I have the Holy Spirit in me". How in the name of the Lord do you know you have it in you? How do you deceive yourself? There is Cornelius, read and STUDY carefully what the power of Jesus' Word that was being preached to him, did!"44 While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.45 And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.----------WHY? HOW?------------------46 For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter,47 Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?48 And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days." Acts 10:44Now how can you not see these steps of salvation??? This is the pure process! The christian way! I know brethren that pray for many years to be baptised in the Holy Spirit, but have not yet received. Why? God knows. Are they not saved? Of course they are! God knows the right time, I'm sure He will bestow the Spirit upon them in time, and if not I'm sure they will come along with us to meet Jesus in the air, no doubt about that!Praise God!
You are reading what you want in scripture you can not be saved without the holy spirit already entering you (think theif on the cross who was neither baptisted by water nor spoke any babble We are saved by grace baptised by spirit your examples you use of tongues is translated languge (foregien) you have presented no evidence or proof of your argument at all
(TallMan;27178)
1 Corinthians 12 - often quoted, rarely understood.People often fish out the verses you quote, which, in isolation, could indeed be taken to mean what you obviously want them to.But if you take that approach, you can make the bible say anything!When you take a text out of context you are left with a con!Is the context of these verses what different people get *at salvation* as you are representing it to be?If so, does it it the rest of the chapter which says only one is given faith, knowledge, wisdom etc?Or is there a distinction between "the gift" of faith and faith spoken of elsewhere, "gift of tongues" and tongues spoken of eslewhere?Does it fit with what God did and what was said in Acts and the beginning of the letter, and other scriptures that detail the receiving of the Spirit (becoming a Christian)?It will be noted by any visitors to this thread that the questions I asked were not answered, instead silly accusations were made.This is what is called a kangaroo court, like in the Dark Ages when the Papists killed and persecuted any that opposed them then issued an open invitation: "if any one disagrees with us, come on down to Rome and state your case"(or words to that effect) . . . when no-one came they said: glory to God! we must be right!How sad!There are the ignorant . .. and then there are the willingly ignorant
Your question hasnt been answered because we have answered it a thousand times you just wont listen the gift of tongues here was to be able to speak and understand (translate/interpt )forgien languages thats it this was so the prophecys (teachings)given by Jesus and God on Pencost could be taught to those who spoke forgien languages. It had nothing to do with babble.Ti 1:16They claim to know God, but by their actions they deny him. They are detestable, disobedient and unfit for doing anything good.
1 Corinthians 12 - often quoted, rarely understood.People often fish out the verses you quote, which, in isolation, could indeed be taken to mean what you obviously want them to.But if you take that approach, you can make the bible say anything!When you take a text out of context you are left with a con!Is the context of these verses what different people get *at salvation* as you are representing it to be?If so, does it it the rest of the chapter which says only one is given faith, knowledge, wisdom etc?Or is there a distinction between "the gift" of faith and faith spoken of elsewhere, "gift of tongues" and tongues spoken of eslewhere?Does it fit with what God did and what was said in Acts and the beginning of the letter, and other scriptures that detail the receiving of the Spirit (becoming a Christian)?It will be noted by any visitors to this thread that the questions I asked were not answered, instead silly accusations were made.This is what is called a kangaroo court, like in the Dark Ages when the Papists killed and persecuted any that opposed them then issued an open invitation: "if any one disagrees with us, come on down to Rome and state your case"(or words to that effect) . . . when no-one came they said: glory to God! we must be right!How sad!There are the ignorant . .. and then there are the willingly ignorant
Your question hasnt been answered because we have answered it a thousand times you just wont listen the gift of tongues here was to be able to speak and understand (translate/interpt )forgien languages thats it this was so the prophecys (teachings)given by Jesus and God on Pencost could be taught to those who spoke forgien languages. It had nothing to do with babble.Ti 1:16They claim to know God, but by their actions they deny him. They are detestable, disobedient and unfit for doing anything good.
I'm going to throw an off topic phrase...JonousJohn 4:10 - Jesus answered and said unto her, If thou knewest the gift of God, and who it is that saith to thee, Give me to drink; thou wouldest have asked of him, and he would have given thee living water.What kind of water do you think this is Jonous?JagLovest thou in Christ Yahshua, Lord and Saviour of the world.
(kriss;27593)
You are reading what you want in scripture you can not be saved without the holy spirit already entering you (think theif on the cross who was neither baptisted by water nor spoke any babble We are saved by grace baptised by spirit your examples you use of tongues is translated languge (foregien) you have presented no evidence or proof of your argument at all
Yes of course we are saved by Grace, no the Spirit doesn't necessarily enters you in order to be saved. You mean that the thief was saved because the Spirit entered in him? Then you say Jesus was lying when he said that He had to go in order to send the Comforter. I guess He made an exception for the thief then and gave Him to him earlier. Or maybe the Comforter wasn't the Holy Spirit but some other vague idea Jesus promised. You see you are obviously missing something? Kriss I don't expect you to understand unless you also receive the Comforter in you. Untill then there is no point trying to explain to you the facts that are infront of you and yet you openly deny. Untill then you will continue to babble (cause this is indeed babbling) about theories that baptism in water is not baptism in water, tongues are language, prophecy is teachings etc. And as for evidnce and proof, you realy haven't given me the impression tha you are willing to discuss, but more to discard whatever is written and doesn't comply with your beliefs and oppose to anyone that doesn't share your thoughts. I haven't used anything else than verses from the bible and this is the only evidence you will ever read from me. At least accept that there is one possibility that what I write is true, coming from a person that studies His Word in the the language that was written (the N.T.) and happens to be his native tongue (= language) and doesn't need translations that many times miss the true point and meaning and the rendering is not always exact.May God help you see.(thesuperjag;27595)
I'm going to throw an off topic phrase...JonousJohn 4:10 - Jesus answered and said unto her, If thou knewest the gift of God, and who it is that saith to thee, Give me to drink; thou wouldest have asked of him, and he would have given thee living water.What kind of water do you think this is Jonous?JagLovest thou in Christ Yahshua, Lord and Saviour of the world.
Jag it is the Word of God that gives eternal life to those that accept It."the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life." John 6:63May God bless you all.
You are reading what you want in scripture you can not be saved without the holy spirit already entering you (think theif on the cross who was neither baptisted by water nor spoke any babble We are saved by grace baptised by spirit your examples you use of tongues is translated languge (foregien) you have presented no evidence or proof of your argument at all
Yes of course we are saved by Grace, no the Spirit doesn't necessarily enters you in order to be saved. You mean that the thief was saved because the Spirit entered in him? Then you say Jesus was lying when he said that He had to go in order to send the Comforter. I guess He made an exception for the thief then and gave Him to him earlier. Or maybe the Comforter wasn't the Holy Spirit but some other vague idea Jesus promised. You see you are obviously missing something? Kriss I don't expect you to understand unless you also receive the Comforter in you. Untill then there is no point trying to explain to you the facts that are infront of you and yet you openly deny. Untill then you will continue to babble (cause this is indeed babbling) about theories that baptism in water is not baptism in water, tongues are language, prophecy is teachings etc. And as for evidnce and proof, you realy haven't given me the impression tha you are willing to discuss, but more to discard whatever is written and doesn't comply with your beliefs and oppose to anyone that doesn't share your thoughts. I haven't used anything else than verses from the bible and this is the only evidence you will ever read from me. At least accept that there is one possibility that what I write is true, coming from a person that studies His Word in the the language that was written (the N.T.) and happens to be his native tongue (= language) and doesn't need translations that many times miss the true point and meaning and the rendering is not always exact.May God help you see.(thesuperjag;27595)
I'm going to throw an off topic phrase...JonousJohn 4:10 - Jesus answered and said unto her, If thou knewest the gift of God, and who it is that saith to thee, Give me to drink; thou wouldest have asked of him, and he would have given thee living water.What kind of water do you think this is Jonous?JagLovest thou in Christ Yahshua, Lord and Saviour of the world.
Jag it is the Word of God that gives eternal life to those that accept It."the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life." John 6:63May God bless you all.
(Jonous;27694)
Yes of course we are saved by Grace, no the Spirit doesn't necessarily enters you in order to be saved. You mean that the thief was saved because the Spirit entered in him? Then you say Jesus was lying when he said that He had to go in order to send the Comforter. I guess He made an exception for the thief then and gave Him to him earlier. Or maybe the Comforter wasn't the Holy Spirit but some other vague idea Jesus promised. You see you are obviously missing something? Kriss I don't expect you to understand unless you also receive the Comforter in you. Untill then there is no point trying to explain to you the facts that are infront of you and yet you openly deny. Untill then you will continue to babble (cause this is indeed babbling) about theories that baptism in water is not baptism in water, tongues are language, prophecy is teachings etc. And as for evidnce and proof, you realy haven't given me the impression tha you are willing to discuss, but more to discard whatever is written and doesn't comply with your beliefs and oppose to anyone that doesn't share your thoughts. I haven't used anything else than verses from the bible and this is the only evidence you will ever read from me. At least accept that there is one possibility that what I write is true, coming from a person that studies His Word in the the language that was written (the N.T.) and happens to be his native tongue (= language) and doesn't need translations that many times miss the true point and meaning and the rendering is not always exact.May God help you see.
If you read what I said and know scripture as you say you would know Christ promised the thief he would see him in heaven that very day. Why because the thief belived upon Christ and repented all that is required.To claim Gods grace I never said anything about Jesus not dying first to make this possable I have said nothing that is not what scripture says it is you that deny you break Gods word by speaking babble in church There is no where the scripture says anything about babbling incoherently it says no where that speaking some unknown babble is even called a tongues OR that babble is the sign of the Holy spirit. It in fact says the gift of speaking and understaning languages of other nations will cease The greek word for tongues is glossa and means languages from nations thus foriegen now you can do what ever you like but dont claim its because you know scripture. When what your claiming isnt whats said.And as far as Acts that was a miracle from God allowing all to speak and hear the same thing the language (not babble) of God and the Angels no where does it say they were all murming differnt sounds speaking their own form of babbling and not understaning anything that was said in fact it says they all understood this babble may be from some spirit but there is no evidence that it is from God. As this babble was NEVER claimed to be a giftpreverting what the Word says clearly is languages from other nations to babbling was NO gift God ever mentioned.God has a set language he is not the author of confusion which is what babble means.
Yes of course we are saved by Grace, no the Spirit doesn't necessarily enters you in order to be saved. You mean that the thief was saved because the Spirit entered in him? Then you say Jesus was lying when he said that He had to go in order to send the Comforter. I guess He made an exception for the thief then and gave Him to him earlier. Or maybe the Comforter wasn't the Holy Spirit but some other vague idea Jesus promised. You see you are obviously missing something? Kriss I don't expect you to understand unless you also receive the Comforter in you. Untill then there is no point trying to explain to you the facts that are infront of you and yet you openly deny. Untill then you will continue to babble (cause this is indeed babbling) about theories that baptism in water is not baptism in water, tongues are language, prophecy is teachings etc. And as for evidnce and proof, you realy haven't given me the impression tha you are willing to discuss, but more to discard whatever is written and doesn't comply with your beliefs and oppose to anyone that doesn't share your thoughts. I haven't used anything else than verses from the bible and this is the only evidence you will ever read from me. At least accept that there is one possibility that what I write is true, coming from a person that studies His Word in the the language that was written (the N.T.) and happens to be his native tongue (= language) and doesn't need translations that many times miss the true point and meaning and the rendering is not always exact.May God help you see.
If you read what I said and know scripture as you say you would know Christ promised the thief he would see him in heaven that very day. Why because the thief belived upon Christ and repented all that is required.To claim Gods grace I never said anything about Jesus not dying first to make this possable I have said nothing that is not what scripture says it is you that deny you break Gods word by speaking babble in church There is no where the scripture says anything about babbling incoherently it says no where that speaking some unknown babble is even called a tongues OR that babble is the sign of the Holy spirit. It in fact says the gift of speaking and understaning languages of other nations will cease The greek word for tongues is glossa and means languages from nations thus foriegen now you can do what ever you like but dont claim its because you know scripture. When what your claiming isnt whats said.And as far as Acts that was a miracle from God allowing all to speak and hear the same thing the language (not babble) of God and the Angels no where does it say they were all murming differnt sounds speaking their own form of babbling and not understaning anything that was said in fact it says they all understood this babble may be from some spirit but there is no evidence that it is from God. As this babble was NEVER claimed to be a giftpreverting what the Word says clearly is languages from other nations to babbling was NO gift God ever mentioned.God has a set language he is not the author of confusion which is what babble means.
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