Once Saved....always Saved - Results of Questionnaire.

[APAK]

Doesn't matter.
You either know you are saved or you don't.
Plenty of people in Scripture knew they were saved before they died.
If you are saved, the Holy Spirit will never let go of you.

Rollo Tamasi:
That is the major point...the spirit within me tell me so...I'm saved (not fully realized in a glorified state yet, if you get my drift)

Bless you,

APAK

 

[Taken]

Taken: I think you might want to read what I wrote again. I've seen this reply of yours several times before. You are not saying any thing different here.

I believe the point that you are not grasping in that Salvation is NOT FULLY REALIZED until graduation until you own resurrection. Why cannot you understand that? You keep talking of the initial confession of faith etc, and that you seem to think that you realize it a that point in time. You are still living and breathing on this earth and are walking in spirit TO salvation. You don't have it YET....right? How can you realize the full effect of it now? it is impossible...Of course you are not losing it, you will GET it...I'm still growing and tasting SALVATION as I grow in faith....SAVE means the transformation of the body and soul/spirit to a new body and soul/spirit. YOU CANNNOT GET THAT WHILE ON THE EARTH. Your ticket for salvation is secure though until that time.

Bless you,

APAK

I have spoke to this before, perhaps not directly to you;

"Realized"... I would say "manifested", and perhaps you mean the same thing.

If it is TRUTH we seek; we have to decide Who's TRUTH we seek. And once we Discover the TRUTH from whom we seek it...we have to decide if we Truth that Truth.

Plainly:
Jesus IS the Truth of God.
The Lord God Almighty is NOT able to be seen by men.
Men wait to see.
God Speaks and it is Done, whether or not men CAN SEE IT.

Pss 33:9
For he spake, and it was done;
He commanded it; and it stood fast.

What the Lord provides; speaking plainly of Salvation; and is received unto a man; it is done. Speaking plainly of Quickening the spirit; it is done.

Men wait to SEE. God doesn't.
Men can HOPE they will SEE. God doesn't.

And some men will TRUST to believe;
without seeing.

John 20:29
...blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed.

Just saying...I don't wonder, hope, second guess, teach men have keep or maintain Salvation they have received...

And appears to be in opposition of some men; who believe and promote and seem to have a frustration with trying to maintain their Salvation.

People discover their own Standing, I am comfortable with mine.
Others have to speak for themselves.

God Bless,
Taken

 

[Taken]

So if salvation is fully realized at the moment of rebirth, whilst on earth, what does being saved in a new body and spirit in the heavens mean?

APAK

It simply means you are Prepared to be taken to your new home where you will have more new experiences that have been Prepared for you.

God Bless,
Taken

 

[Taken]

aspen: I guess the confusion is over the meaning of when salvation is realized. That is the crux of it.

When I came to the Lord when I was 18-19 yrs old I really experienced a change in mind and attitude towards myself, family and spiritual things and a bias to scripture. I knew at time I was saved or recognized in heart and mind that God had provided me

IMO - should be a Period. SAVED.

will the hope of salvation in the future,

Another Salvation? Of what?
Salvation is the SAVING of the soul, that life shall never depart from it.

The spirit is Quickened.
The body becomes Dead.

IOW - what is this future saving that is called Salvation?

not yet fully realized at that time and today.

What is not fully realized...IS KNOWLEDGE.
We do not have all knowledge. We continuously Learn, aside from what we fill our minds with, speaking spiritually, the Lord shall endlessly fill our spirit with His Knowledge. Some, while still physically on earth, SEEK His never ending Knowledge, Some are not interested, too busy, or don't know How to.

God Bless,
Taken

 

[APAK]

I have spoke to this before, perhaps not directly to you;

"Realized"... I would say "manifested", and perhaps you mean the same thing.

If it is TRUTH we seek; we have to decide Who's TRUTH we seek. And once we Discover the TRUTH from whom we seek it...we have to decide if we Truth that Truth.

Plainly:
Jesus IS the Truth of God.
The Lord God Almighty is NOT able to be seen by men.
Men wait to see.
God Speaks and it is Done, whether or not men CAN SEE IT.

Pss 33:9
For he spake, and it was done;
He commanded it; and it stood fast.

What the Lord provides; speaking plainly of Salvation; and is received unto a man; it is done. Speaking plainly of Quickening the spirit; it is done.

Men wait to SEE. God doesn't.
Men can HOPE they will SEE. God doesn't.

And some men will TRUST to believe;
without seeing.

John 20:29
...blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed.

Just saying...I don't wonder, hope, second guess, teach men have keep or maintain Salvation they have received...

And appears to be in opposition of some men; who believe and promote and seem to have a frustration with trying to maintain their Salvation.

People discover their own Standing, I am comfortable with mine.
Others have to speak for themselves.

God Bless,
Taken

Taken: Let me get a few things straight here.

I think you are speaking of something completely different and I know it's not specifically about salvation. It is more....Maybe you need to further evaluate and meditation on this subject for a while or reread mine or other folks' replies again.

You are trying to project something deeper from within you here, in your writing.

Why the injection of basic Christianity, come to Jesus sermon, as you keep expressing truth in scripture that Jesus = truth, about faith, etc., as if you are trying to convince me or anyone else of becoming a believer all over again?

It just muddies the waters, every time. And then I lose your point(s).

And further, I get the impression you are implying that I'm promoting a false claim and that I'm actually frustrated and 'trying' to maintain my salvation. Quite presumptuous if this is your purpose.

Word do have precise meanings and I try to be precise although I mess it up at times myself.

Believe me, it is frustrating to me in writing this as it is in you reading this ....

I hope I'm completely wrong on my assessment.

Bless you brother,

APAK

 

[Taken]

Nevertheless, I believe I do understand your version ( and I believe it is Taken's version as well) although I would not used it -it is confusing to me. I want to align my definition fully with scripture. One clue as to why I would not use are those verses that speak of the 'hope of salvation' after becoming a believer. Your version cannot account for this meaning.

Having received Salvation. period. Done.

Continue in receiving knowledge, wisdom, understanding that IS Gods, that He gives...
Continues forever.

God Bless,
Taken

 

[APAK]

Having received Salvation. period. Done.

Continue in receiving knowledge, wisdom, understanding that IS Gods, that He gives...
Continues forever.

God Bless,
Taken

Taken:
I guess my last post to you now has lost some meaning since you wrote this...

Bless you,

APAK

 

[Taken]

Taken: Let me get a few things straight here.

I think you are speaking of something completely different and I know it's not specifically about salvation.

Of course I am. There are conditions to receiving Salvation.

It is more....Maybe you need to further evaluate and meditation on this subject for a while or reread mine or other folks' replies again.

No need.

You are trying to project something deeper from within you here, in your writing.

Correct.

Why the injection of basic Christianity, come to Jesus sermon, as you keep expressing truth in scripture that Jesus = truth, about faith, etc., as if you are trying to convince me or anyone else of becoming a believer all over again?

No, not my intent. Nor did I challeng
e or imply yo
ur saving or faith was not genuine.

And further, I get the impression you are implying that I'm promoting a false claim and that I'm actually frustrated and 'trying' to maintain my salvation. Quite presumptuous if this is your purpose.

Broadly, SOME people DO believe they have to maintain their Salvation, by works, service Etc.

(That is something Jews taught, and many Christians adopt the same concept); which is not true.

IOW,
Doing works is not HOW someone becomes Saved.
Doing works is not HOW someone remains Saved.
(That ^ is the hint of what I got from aspen's remarks)

Word do have precise meanings

In English, there are multiple words that appear to have the exact same meaning; but are not quite exact.
In English, we also have expression of ONE word that means the complete opposite.

and I try to be precise although I mess it up at times myself.

I read your words, and read what you declare for yourself, and believe what you say for your own declaration is so.

So, to be more precise, to understand you better...

Addressing your hope...for the "realization" of a new body;

What does that "hope" mean to you?
...that it may or may not happen?

Or something else?

God Bless,
Taken

 

[Taken]

Taken:
I guess my last post to you now has lost some meaning since you wrote this...

Bless you,

APAK

You do realize, I am posting what I believe.

God Bless,
Taken

 

[APAK]

You do realize, I am posting what I believe.

God Bless,
Taken

Taken:

Salvation to me...........

(Rom 5:5) and hope does not put us to shame, because God's love has been poured into our hearts through the Holy Spirit who has been given to us.

(Tit 1:2) in hope of eternal life, which God, who never lies, promised before the ages began

(Tit 2:13) waiting for our blessed hope, the appearing of the glory of our great God and Savior Jesus Christ,

(1Pe 3:15) but in your hearts honor Christ the Lord as holy, always being prepared to make a defense to anyone who asks you for a reason for the hope that is in you; yet do it with gentleness and respect,

(Gal 5:5) For through the Spirit, by faith, we ourselves eagerly wait for the hope of righteousness.

These verses encapsulate the meaning of my hope as a firm and steady faith in our own salvation. It is assured from rebirth to it full realization when Jesus our Lord returns in glory, as we also will be in glory with him.

Anyway, BL here, be ready as in 1 Peter 3:15 in your own words.

I understand and believe you are working from the heart...it is not questioned by me, at least

I guess I have a different style in prose that communicated differently at times to others.​

Love in Christ always,

APAK

 

[bbyrd009]

as we also will be in glory with him.

the premise here is tomorrow, right? 'Cannot have possibly occurred yet' iow

 

[APAK]

the premise here is tomorrow, right? 'Cannot have possibly occurred yet' iow

Yes, the literal FULL transformation is tomorrow, and guaranteed to happen for a true believer in Christ.

APAK

 

[Taken]

Taken:

Salvation to me...........

(Rom 5:5) and hope does not put us to shame, because God's love has been poured into our hearts through the Holy Spirit who has been given to us.

(Tit 1:2) in hope of eternal life, which God, who never lies, promised before the ages began

(Tit 2:13) waiting for our blessed hope, the appearing of the glory of our great God and Savior Jesus Christ,

(1Pe 3:15) but in your hearts honor Christ the Lord as holy, always being prepared to make a defense to anyone who asks you for a reason for the hope that is in you; yet do it with gentleness and respect,

(Gal 5:5) For through the Spirit, by faith, we ourselves eagerly wait for the hope of righteousness.

These verses encapsulate the meaning of my hope as a firm and steady faith in our own salvation. It is assured from rebirth to it full realization when Jesus our Lord returns in glory, as we also will be in glory with him.

Anyway, BL here, be ready as in 1 Peter 3:15 in your own words.

I understand and believe you are working from the heart...it is not questioned by me, at least

I guess I have a different style in prose that communicated differently at times to others.​

Love in Christ always,

APAK

Okay, thank you.

I will answer the question I asked you.
What Hope means to me...spiritually; is something that IS DONE, but that we can not SEE IT.

Rom 8:24
Heb 11:1

I believe everything the Lord has spoken is already Done. We simply WAIT to SEE IT.
I simply believe it before I SEE it.

Scriptures speak of God having DONE, before we experience it.
Scripture speaks of God telling men, (knowing many can not believe UNTIL they see it),
watch, you'll see it happen.

In my own observation with people in general, I think Hope to many people means;
They really want something to happen; wish for it, hope for it, if they are lucky it will happen, but wil not conclude it is done and they shall see it done.

Thanks for the conversation.
No intent meant if you feel like I stepped on your toes.

I know the extent and depth of my own study and am pretty blunt about speaking of what I have learned and believe, and know why I believe what I do.

My intent is more to the point for others, to examine themselves as to Why they believe what "they" do.

In many instances, quite a few do not really know why they believe what they belief.
I'm not talking about the Big picture, but moreso the finer details.
It's rewarding, when one delves.

God Bless,
Taken

 

[APAK]

Okay, thank you.

I will answer the question I asked you.
What Hope means to me...spiritually; is something that IS DONE, but that we can not SEE IT.

Rom 8:24
Heb 11:1

I believe everything the Lord has spoken is already Done. We simply WAIT to SEE IT.
I simply believe it before I SEE it.

Scriptures speak of God having DONE, before we experience it.
Scripture speaks of God telling men, (knowing many can not believe UNTIL they see it),
watch, you'll see it happen.

In my own observation with people in general, I think Hope to many people means;
They really want something to happen; wish for it, hope for it, if they are lucky it will happen, but wil not conclude it is done and they shall see it done.

Thanks for the conversation.
No intent meant if you feel like I stepped on your toes.

I know the extent and depth of my own study and am pretty blunt about speaking of what I have learned and believe, and know why I believe what I do.

My intent is more to the point for others, to examine themselves as to Why they believe what "they" do.

In many instances, quite a few do not really know why they believe what they belief.
I'm not talking about the Big picture, but moreso the finer details.
It's rewarding, when one delves.

God Bless,
Taken

Taken:

See, this is the mystery with God and our salvation. As you said, it is already done or is a done deal with God (not us- we are human). We have not seen the future as God has already. We choose to walk in time and space with faith and belief that our salvation is secured with Jesus our Lord as we believe God and his plan for our future. We have his spirit as comfort and direction as assurance. We do not FULLY realize that God had our backs all along although we trust in him, his words, as if we already know, AS GOD ALREADY KNOWS. Dimensions of time and space are not obstacles for him. If they were not obstacles for us either, we would not need faith, we would actually see our transformation occurring, like an event in a future movie.

I guess you have been making this theme many times...yes, belief in someone or something is because it/he/she is truly unseen and we are without having full knowledge. We have faith in our Creator that what he says is true and trustworthy. Any other type of belief is not genuine if we try to play the 'sit on the fence' and see game. It is truly a commitment to be made.

Religious people seem to not understand this fine point. They gloss over it and take comfort in having faith in idols they can see, and elders that can speak to, in speaking comfortable things to them...as their assurance and hope..

Bless you,

APAK

 

[Helen]

Salvation is something provided for ALL.
Salvation is ONLY received unto a person;
IF the person TAKES it.

Not sure I agree.
If I go and pay your speeding fine for you...it is no longer 'your' fine.
It was "paid in full".

 

[BreadOfLife]

LOL - A match for you; TWO black eyes...
Too bad you are SO lacking in Understanding.
An unsaved man IS NOT WITH the Lord forever.
A saved man IS WITH the Lord Forever.

Inasmuch as you do not comprehend the difference between Created and Authored;
Thanks for sharing you also do no comprehend what Forever means.

Matt 12:30 (Jesus speaking)
He that is not "WITH ME" IS "AGAINST ME"..

John 14:16
...another Comforter (Holy Ghost) ..
WITH YOU FOR EVER...

You have been listening to and following the wrong man, who has taught you to GO AGAINST the Word of God.

If you think you can Receive and then Lose Salvation...you should be concerned for yourself....because you are failing miserably in showing you Trust the Word of God.

Then address each passage in post #861 which ALL say that you can LOSE your salvation, Einstein.
Until you can do that - you LOSE by default . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

What?
This thread hasn't hit a thousand posts yet?
OSAS
No doubt about it.
John 10:28;
No one can prove it wrong.

I already have proven it wrong - several times.
Just because you won't address the verses i post #861 doesn't mean that they're not true . . .

 

[Taken]

Not sure I agree.
If I go and pay your speeding fine for you...it is no longer 'your' fine.
It was "paid in full".

Okay. Tell me what He PAID "with" ? And How?

Because Scripture says He PAID WITH His flesh body and blood. And the HOW was by death.

Did you forget, every body of flesh SHALL die? And every body with Blood, God SHALL take the blood?

So, just seeing how this goes...
You paid my speeding fine for me...and then I pay you what you spent.

What say you?

 

[Taken]

Then address each passage in post #861 which ALL say that you can LOSE your salvation, Einstein.
Until you can do that - you LOSE by default . . .

LOL - I am not in a contest with you. And your bully tactics are laughable.

It is so blatantly obvious you are without understanding.
Why don't you do as Scripture teaches and Ask God for understanding...and while you are having such a Conversation with God, be sure to call Him smart-alec names and tell Him what He didn't create.

 

[Helen]

So, just seeing how this goes...
You paid my speeding fine for me...and then I pay you what you spent.

What say you?

Yes..His blood paid ...the Perfect Blood of the Perfect Lamb...once and for all.

I do not understand what you mean by -"I pay what you spent"
Can you just write that again so I know what you mean.
(If you pay me back for paying your fine..then it was no longer I that paid your fine, you didn't need me, you could have paid it yourself!! No longer a gift.)

Thanks...H