Paul claimed 3 times that Rev 20:4 was a current reality.

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grafted branch

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Ugh. :) Jewish people are Jewish people, GB, whether Hasidic, or Orthodox, or any other type, or if they consider themselves "not religious" or are unaffiliated with any of the different classifications of Judaism. Ethnic Jews, GB. Good Lord. Are you trying to catch me in some kind of inconsistency? Or are you just trying to be difficult and argumentative? Come on, man. :)
I’m just trying to show you that there is no way to quantify how a large number of Jews will believe in Christ if it can’t be known how many Jews even exist.

In my opinion, Satans little season is problematic for the Amill view, if you can’t quantify it then you don’t have to acknowledge it either, it’s always something that will happen in the future because it can’t be quantified prior to it happening.
With the Amill view Satans little season is subjective, and people like Harold Camping can simply declare Satan is loosed or people who don’t want to put their reputation at risk simply say things like were very close but it hasn’t happened yet, and this gets repeated year after year.




LOL! Hoo boy. Again, are you just trying to be difficult and argumentative? Come on, man. :)
If I would’ve told you 10 years ago that people in high office, medical doctors, school teachers, and the like will say they can’t tell the difference between male and female you would’ve given me a big “LOL! Hoo boy” and said that’s ridiculous.

Don’t underestimate the power of deception. If a male today can simply declare themselves female and be believed, supported, and allowed to participate in all things female then why would you think it’s a “LOL! Hoo boy” for Gentiles to become Jews? I think the real problem is that if you admit this could happen then you also have to admit there’s no possible way of knowing when Satan is loosed.
 
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grafted branch

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Once again you are avoiding your own unproven point that Revelation has anything to do with 70AD.
So now we’re back to the church at Philadelphia, unless you can show what event took place after 70AD and within their lifetime that was “coming upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth”, then I’ll have to stick with Revelation being written prior to 70AD.
 

Mr E

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If they claim Christ as their Savior ~ and I know quite a few that have come to do so; we call them Messianic Jesus ~ then I'd say that's pretty accurate. LOL!

It's more common to run into a Christian who decided to become a Messianic Jew, than a Jew who has become a Christian. Christians (evangelicals) consider the 'Messianic Jew' movement, to be a form of Christianity, while Jews who come to accept Jesus as having been the Messiah, simply consider the Messianic Jew movement to be a form of Judaism. Cake and eat it too.
 

rwb

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The remnant is 1/3 which would be of the 15+ million so called Jews in the world. This 1/3 is considered as (all Israel) in Romans 11:26. ( see Zech. 13:8-9)

Though it speaks of the remnant of Old saved, there shall be an innumerable multitude from all nations of the earth that shall be saved. I've often wondered if "the remnant" applies to all nations, and together the whole becomes the innumerable multitude? But this could simply be me having difficulty with a remnant only from Israel of Old? IOW every nation of the earth shall have but a remnant saved, even though the Bible doesn't say this. :contemplate:
 

rwb

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The remnant is 1/3 which would be of the 15+ million so called Jews in the world. This 1/3 is considered as (all Israel) in Romans 11:26. ( see Zech. 13:8-9)

All Israel is completed by Gentiles being grafted in together with them, and together they are "the Israel of God." All Israel is not an ethnic people but all people of faith.
 

Ronald David Bruno

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Though it speaks of the remnant of Old saved, there shall be an innumerable multitude from all nations of the earth that shall be saved. I've often wondered if "the remnant" applies to all nations, and together the whole becomes the innumerable multitude? But this could simply be me having difficulty with a remnant only from Israel of Old? IOW every nation of the earth shall have but a remnant saved, even though the Bible doesn't say this. :contemplate:
I agree.A remnant of Jews from all over will be saved. And since Christianity numbers some 2.65 billion, that's about 1/3 the population as well ... sounds fair. It's still a narrow gate.
 

Ronald David Bruno

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All Israel is completed by Gentiles being grafted in together with them, and together they are "the Israel of God." All Israel is not an ethnic people but all people of faith.
It's the Body of Christ, His name is not Israel. In Romans 11 Paul makes a distinction between the two on earth. Spiritually there is neither Jew, or Gentile, male or female. I'm still a man, in Christ.
 

grafted branch

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All Israel is completed by Gentiles being grafted in together with them, and together they are "the Israel of God." All Israel is not an ethnic people but all people of faith.
Absolutely agree with you on this RWB, all believers are Jews inwardly and being a Jew ethnically is being a Jew outwardly.
 
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PinSeeker

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It seems it's important to you Pinseeker? Paul does not contradict himself…
No, he certainly does not. :)

You can read the words of Paul anyway you like, but that does not change the FACT that Paul does not say after the fullness of Gentiles come in all ethnic Jews will suddenly have a mass conversion to Christ and all of them shall be saved.
I think you have misunderstood what I said, RWB. I don’t see how, really, but so it is.

You have even said "all Israel" is the Israel of God that includes both Jews and Gentiles of faith.
Yes, I’ve said this many times. But still, what you say above is not what I have said.

Grace and peace to you.
 

PinSeeker

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Yes, Jesus is Lord, King, Creator, Messiah, Savior, God.
Great! So…. :)

I am familiar with most Pre-Millennial views, the Amillennial view, but not yours.
Yours seem to be a literal view of the Millennial Kingdom, except for where Christ will rule this Kingdom from, Heaven?
Well, I’m not an advocate of the post-millennial view… yes, we are very much (and literally:)) I’m the millennium, and maybe very close to the end of it.

Is that correct?
If so, I have several Scriptures to share about Jesus literal return and literal earthly reign.
I’m… sure you do. :) Oh yes, His return will certainly be literal, and His eternal reign will be. I’m not sure how anything I have said could be construed otherwise.

Grace and peace to you.
 
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PinSeeker

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I’m just trying to show you that there is no way to quantify how a large number of Jews will believe in Christ if it can’t be known how many Jews even exist.
There are a lot of Jews in this world, GB. We know this. And at the end of the millennium, there will be a mass conversion among Jews to Christianity in a very short time; it might be interesting to know roughly how many, but there is no need for hard numbers. Goodness gracious.

In my opinion, Satans little season is problematic for the Amill view
Okay, fair enough. Not at all, but fair enough.


if you can’t quantify it then you don’t have to acknowledge it either, it’s always something that will happen in the future because it can’t be quantified prior to it happening.
It will be what it will be. And it will be a large “movement” among Jews, easily taken note of; again any real quantification is not necessary.

With the Amill view Satans little season is subjective…
Subjective in relation to what, GB? That’s quite ridiculous. It will happen when it happens, and it will be what it will be.

and people like Harold Camping can simply declare Satan is loosed or people who don’t want to put their reputation at risk simply say things like were very close but it hasn’t happened yet, and this gets repeated year after year.
Do you hear me setting dates, GB? No…. All I’ve said is, be ready, the time could be very close, but we don’t know. That’s all. Wow.

If I would’ve told you 10 years ago that people in high office, medical doctors, school teachers, and the like will say they can’t tell the difference between male and female you would’ve given me a big “LOL! Hoo boy” and said that’s ridiculous.

Don’t underestimate the power of deception. If a male today can simply declare themselves female and be believed, supported, and allowed to participate in all things female then why would you think it’s a “LOL! Hoo boy” for Gentiles to become Jews? I think the real problem is that if you admit this could happen then you also have to admit there’s no possible way of knowing when Satan is loosed.
Can a male really become a female, and vice versa, GB? They can have surgical procedures and have hormone treatments and all those things, but can a person really alter reality? No. And in like manner, can a person through any means really change his or her ethnicity (alter reality)? No. This is all irrelevant anyway.

Dude. Stop.

Yes, there’s no possible way to know when exactly Satan is loosed. But a short time after it’s happened, we Christians at least will know, as it will become apparent… somehow, in some way.

Grace and peace to you.
 
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Zao is life

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Paul explicitly indicates a sequence in Romans 11:25-26, where the fullness of the Gentiles come in to Israel, and then the partial hardening is removed. There are some Jews coming to Christ, and actually probably at an increasing rate. So, if you want to say both happen over roughly (or even not so roughly) over the same period of time (over the millennium), than I'm perfectly fine with that. In that case, it is not a hard one and then the other. But I do think ~ and many theologians and commentators think this, too; I am surely not alone ~ that there will be a mass conversion of Jews to Christ over a very short period of time at the end of the age.

And I would just ask, is this really all that important? I say no... :) Should anybody really have any problem? I think not... :) I mean... come on, bro. :)

Grace and peace to you, RWB.
25 For I would not, brethren, that all of you should be ignorant of this mystery, lest all of you should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fullness of the Gentiles be come in.

26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.

The covenant is the New Covenant in the blood of Christ, the Deliverer, shed to take away the sins of both the natural branches and the unnatural branches of the Olive tree who believe. Of all who believe. All Israel = all who believe.

This is the gospel,
and "As concerning the gospel, they (those natural branches who do not believe) are enemies for your sakes: but as concerning the election, they are beloved for the father's sakes."

Therefore,

23 And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be grafted in: for God is able to graft them in again.
24 For if you were cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and were grafted contrary to nature into a good olive tree: how much more shall these, which be the natural branches, be grafted into their own olive tree?

So,

12 If the fall of them be the riches of the world, and the diminishing of them the riches of the Gentiles until the fullness of the Gentiles be come in, how much more their fullness?

"Until the fullness of the Gentiles be come in = "until the return of Christ" because there is no future time in which the Deliverer will come out of Zion and take away anyone's sins. He died once for all, and once for all time. The "when the Jews are restored" doesn't wait until the return of Christ, because

23 And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be grafted in: for God is able to graft them in again.

29 For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.

And in any case,

28 As concerning the gospel, they (those natural branches who do not believe now) are enemies for your sakes: but as concerning the election, they are beloved for the father's sakes.

If anyone is looking for scripture that supports the idea that there will be masses of Jews returning to Christ before He returns, then Romans 11 is the WRONG place to look.

ALL Israel did not recognize Joseph's place as the chosen of his father and one whose prophetic dream showed they would one day all bow to him. They only recognized him after he revealed to them who he was.

He had all the authority and power of Pharaoh and could have put them to death at that point for what they had done to him.

Then he forgave and blessed ALL Israel.
But the covenant of God unto them, when He took away their sins, will not only begin to exist when Christ is about to return. Romans 11 is the WRONG place to look for a scenario where Jews en masse will possibly turn to faith in Christ, IMO.
 
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Earburner

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What evidence do we have that Paul read those particular revelations of Apostle John of Patmos?
The Holy Spirit of God, aka the spirit of Christ; the mind of Christ.
Rom. 8:8-9; 1 Cor. 2:16; 1 John 5:10;

1 Cor. 2[5] That your faith should not stand in the wisdom of men, but in the power of God.

1 John 2
[27] But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.
 

PinSeeker

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Romans 11 is the WRONG place to look for a scenario where Jews en masse will possibly turn to faith in Christ, IMO.​
Hmm, well, you're certainly entitled to your opinion, for sure. But you seem to be acknowledging that it will happen, and I would submit to you and RGB that, in Romans 11, especially in verse 26, that that's exactly what Paul is doing. And by "en masse," I don't mean "all Jews," and neither does Paul, as he has referred to the "remnant chosen by grace" (Romans 11:5), which is to say not all but only those purposely (by God, obviously) separated from the whole, and also just prior to that, in saying "not all who are descended from Israel belong to Israel" (Romans 9:6).

Grace and peace to you, FOTG.
 

Timtofly

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So now we’re back to the church at Philadelphia, unless you can show what event took place after 70AD and within their lifetime that was “coming upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth”, then I’ll have to stick with Revelation being written prior to 70AD.
Since the lifetime of the Philadelphia church went all the way to 1920, which event of that church should we pick out of all those years? You think an event hundreds of miles away was greater than WW'S?
 

grafted branch

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Since the lifetime of the Philadelphia church went all the way to 1920, which event of that church should we pick out of all those years? You think an event hundreds of miles away was greater than WW'S?
I think the destruction of Jerusalem was the event that came upon the whole world that the church at Philadelphia was told about, not WW1. Let’s look at the next verse.

Revelation 3:11 Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown.

When did Jesus come quickly? Did this happen in WW1? Or do you now suppose that this wasn’t really meant for the church at Philadelphia at all since they are no longer in existence?

If so, then are we to believe that the literal seven churches that existed in the first century received letters addressed to them but not intended for them, about events they would never experience?
 

Davidpt

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Revelation 20:4
4 I saw thrones on which were seated those who had been given authority to judge. And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded because of their testimony about Jesus and because of the word of God. They had not worshiped the beast or its image and had not received its mark on their foreheads or their hands. They came to life and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

This is one of the most controversial verses in the entire bible and a lot of Christians believe that it has to be a future event because they believe that it's at the second coming. But according to Paul he stated three times that it was a current reality back in his day.

Here below are the three texts.

Ephesians 2:4-6
4 But because of his great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy, 5 made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions—it is by grace you have been saved. 6 And God raised us up with Christ and seated us with him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus,

In the verses above Paul states that we were already made alive, raised up and seated with Christ in the heavenly realms.

Colossians 3:1
Since, then, you have been raised with Christ, set your hearts on things above, where Christ is, seated at the right hand of God.

Once again Paul states that we have already been raised up with Christ.

Romans 5:17
17 For if, by the trespass of the one man, death reigned through that one man, how much more will those who receive God’s abundant provision of grace and of the gift of righteousness reign in life through the one man, Jesus Christ!

Finally in the verse above Paul states that we reign in life through Jesus.

All of these verses were a current reality while alive in the physical body almost two thousand years ago. If it was a reality back, then it is still a reality today.

Paul ties three events directly to Revelation 20:4 "that we have been made alive", "seated with Christ in the heavenly realms" and that "we reign (in life) through Jesus".

Why do so many Christians not accept this even though Paul declares it? Because they are focused on it being physical not spiritual. They focus on the physical because it mentions saints that were beheaded by the beast and the thousand years.

But let's let scripture interpret scripture. Paul I believe teaches that its spiritual and what John is saying in Revelation 20:4 is that even though the saints are beheaded they still live and reign spiritually the soul doesn't die with the body. It's a promise even though you may die for Jesus you will still live and reign spiritually. The beast can kill the body but not the soul.

Thus, according to Paul we reign in life now and have been for almost two thousand years we are not limited to a literal thousand years God has a better longer plan.

Obviously, you are the wrong person I should be asking the following, the fact you have this strange 2 millennium theory going on in your head, where the saints are still reigning with Christ a thousand years after the thousand years expire. But since most of the rest of us don't believe saints are still reigning for a thousand years after the thousand years have expired, let's then assume reigning with Him a thousand years is pertaining to all these passages brought up.

Obviously then, once the thousand years expire, and that the passages you brought up are involving reigning with Him a thousand years, those passages would then mean the exact opposite once the thousand years are expired. Something like the following.

Since, then, you have been raised with Christ for a thousand years, set your hearts on things above, where Christ is, seated at the right hand of God, but when the thousand years are expired though, you are no longer raised with Christ

But because of his great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy, 5 made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions—it is by grace you have been saved. 6 And God raised us up with Christ and seated us with him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus for a thousand years, but when the thousand years are expired, we are no longer seated him in the heavenly realms


For if, by the trespass of the one man, death reigned through that one man, how much more will those who receive God’s abundant provision of grace and of the gift of righteousness reign in life for a thousand years through the one man, Jesus Christ, but when the thousand years are expired, we no longer reign in life through the one man, Jesus Christ

As can be seen, it is ludicrous to apply these things to Revelation 20:4 since that is only involving reigning with Him a thousand years and that these passages are not meaning a thousand years only. And besides, no one in this present age lives a thousand years to begin with, and that these passages are applicable to this side of life, not after one has died instead.

Take Colossians 3:1, for example. Imagine trying to apply that to someone that has already passed away. As if it makes sense, that while in death rather than still among the living on earth, one should set their heart on things above, where Christ is, seated at the right hand of God, when they would already be there in disembodied state, assuming soul sleep is not true.


Pretty much the same logic pertaining to the other 2 passages you submitted. None of those passages are pertaining to anyone in a disembodied state, yet, Amil pretty much has everyone mentioned in Revelation 20:4 in a disembodied state, and they trying to apply the 3 passages you submitted to someone in a disembodied state. Obviously then, nothing pertaining to Revelation 20:4 is pertaining to any of the passages you submitted.

Even your two millennium theory can't even make sense out of this since the passages you submitted are being applied to the living this side of life, not the dead in a disembodied state on the other side of this life. Where do you see anyone mentioned in Revelation 20:4 that has not been martyred, but are still alive this side of life, thus someone for you to apply those passages you submitted to?
 

Marty fox

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Obviously, you are the wrong person I should be asking the following, the fact you have this strange 2 millennium theory going on in your head, where the saints are still reigning with Christ a thousand years after the thousand years expire. But since most of the rest of us don't believe saints are still reigning for a thousand years after the thousand years have expired, let's then assume reigning with Him a thousand years is pertaining to all these passages brought up.

Obviously then, once the thousand years expire, and that the passages you brought up are involving reigning with Him a thousand years, those passages would then mean the exact opposite once the thousand years are expired. Something like the following.

Since, then, you have been raised with Christ for a thousand years, set your hearts on things above, where Christ is, seated at the right hand of God, but when the thousand years are expired though, you are no longer raised with Christ

But because of his great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy, 5 made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions—it is by grace you have been saved. 6 And God raised us up with Christ and seated us with him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus for a thousand years, but when the thousand years are expired, we are no longer seated him in the heavenly realms


For if, by the trespass of the one man, death reigned through that one man, how much more will those who receive God’s abundant provision of grace and of the gift of righteousness reign in life for a thousand years through the one man, Jesus Christ, but when the thousand years are expired, we no longer reign in life through the one man, Jesus Christ

As can be seen, it is ludicrous to apply these things to Revelation 20:4 since that is only involving reigning with Him a thousand years and that these passages are not meaning a thousand years only. And besides, no one in this present age lives a thousand years to begin with, and that these passages are applicable to this side of life, not after one has died instead.

Take Colossians 3:1, for example. Imagine trying to apply that to someone that has already passed away. As if it makes sense, that while in death rather than still among the living on earth, one should set their heart on things above, where Christ is, seated at the right hand of God, when they would already be there in disembodied state, assuming soul sleep is not true.


Pretty much the same logic pertaining to the other 2 passages you submitted. None of those passages are pertaining to anyone in a disembodied state, yet, Amil pretty much has everyone mentioned in Revelation 20:4 in a disembodied state, and they trying to apply the 3 passages you submitted to someone in a disembodied state. Obviously then, nothing pertaining to Revelation 20:4 is pertaining to any of the passages you submitted.

Even your two millennium theory can't even make sense out of this since the passages you submitted are being applied to the living this side of life, not the dead in a disembodied state on the other side of this life. Where do you see anyone mentioned in Revelation 20:4 that has not been martyred, but are still alive this side of life, thus someone for you to apply those passages you submitted to?

I have never once said that saints reign for a thousand years after the thousand years expire

I have states more than once in this thread plainly what my view is
 

Timtofly

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I think the destruction of Jerusalem was the event that came upon the whole world that the church at Philadelphia was told about, not WW1. Let’s look at the next verse.

Revelation 3:11 Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown.

When did Jesus come quickly? Did this happen in WW1? Or do you now suppose that this wasn’t really meant for the church at Philadelphia at all since they are no longer in existence?

If so, then are we to believe that the literal seven churches that existed in the first century received letters addressed to them but not intended for them, about events they would never experience?
Obviously Jesus will return sooner after WW1 than an event 1850 years prior to WW1.
 

n2thelight

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Chapter 20 of the Book of Revelation covers the first days of the Millennium, when Jesus Christ comes to earth to establish His kingdom. This chapter runs close to the prophecies of Ezekiel in the last eight (8) chapters of the book of Ezekiel. "Millennium" means "1,000 years". This period is basically a 1,000 years of teaching and learning.

Jesus Christ will be with us here on earth in His kingdom then. There will be teaching and discipline, and many people saved in this Millennium period. Most of the people saved today will not be reigning with Christ in the Millennium, because they will throw their inheritance away very soon, when they choose to go whoring after the Antichrist. Some of these people are the ones who believe in the rapture theory. They will chase after the first messiah that appears on earth and not be part of the wedding between Christ and His bride (the church) at the sounding of the seventh trump.

Those who fall into the trap of the rapture theory doctrine can repent and be saved in the Millennium age, when their sins of following the Antichrist are committed in ignorance. You can even look at the Millennium kingdom as the "time of salvation", for many will accept and follow Christ in the Millennium. However the period of grace is for this age of the flesh only, for in the Millennium age salvation will be by their works only as we will see in this chapter. Due to the great apostasy there will be more saved out of the Millennium, than during any other period of time.

Revelation 20:1 "And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand."

When Satan has completed his five month reign here on earth, the battles of Armageddon and Hamongog have already taken place. Jesus Christ is returning with His army to earth, and this army are those saints that are already with Him. Those saints that died and went to be with Him as recorded in Ecclesiastes 12:7. Though their bodies were laid in the ground, their souls returned instantly to the Father, and not though a rapture.

On that first day of the Millennium age, both the beast and the false prophet are destroyed. The beast is in two parts, the one world political system that gives way to Satan's one world religious system. These two systems of support will not be brought back to support Satan at the end of the millennium. [See Revelation 19:20 where both of these are destroyed.]

I believe this angel to be Michael, for it's Michael and his angels that control Satan. This chain that Michael will have is a locking, sealing and confining device. Satan will be locked away, and his influence will be totally absent during this time of teaching.

This is why every knee, even the Kenites, will bow to Christ. Satan, their father, will be in the pit and will not be able to influence their thinking.

"Revelation 20:2 "And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,"

"The dragon"
was Satan's title in the world that was, just as his title of "the Antichrist", or "instead of Christ" is during the last five months of this earth age of the flesh. Dragon is the title he wears as he rules over the ten kings and seven regions or continents. [see Revelation 12 and 13]

The "serpent" was Satan's roll in the Garden of Eden when he "wholly seduced" Eve. Eve bore his offspring Cain, the father of the Kenites. The "Devil" was his title given in Matthew 13:39 as Jesus identified the enemy as the "Devil". Satan will have no influence in this time of teaching.

In Isaiah 14:12-16, Satan is given another name, "Lucifer", which means "morning star" or "bright star". It tells us that people will walk by the pit and see Satan bound and say, "Is this the man that deceived the world?" They will wonder how they could have been so deceived through this earth age into believing Satan to be the true Messiah.

That deception is rooted in Margaret MacDonald's "rapture theory", which gives false hope and teaches of a flying away. It will be because of the lack of knowledge of God's full plan that will lead them into believing this rapture lie; Satan deceiving the whole world that he is Jesus Christ come to rapture them away.

"Revelation 20:3 "And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season."

When this time of the great deception is on earth, it will be during the five month period of Revelation 9:5,10, and the Antichrist will then deceive all nations and all peoples of the earth except the elect. When the millennium is over, Satan will be released to try to deceive the people all over again, and many will follow him just as they did in this earth age.

Why would God turn Satan loose a short season? Because this will be a time of testing for those claiming to be Christians who were deceived by him in this earth age. After the thousand year testing and teaching, some will still seek after Satan, and they will be gathered by the angels as tares [see Matthew 13] to be burned with him.

Matthew 13:40 "As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world."

Matthew 13:41 "The Son of man shall send forth His angels, and they shall gather out of His kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity:"

Matthew 13:42 "And shall cast them into the furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth."

God is a fair and just God, and when all have been taught and tested after their changing into that spiritual body, there will be no mental handicaps or sickness to distort the outcome. Every soul will have a sound mind, and an adequate thinking capacity for observing Jesus Christ in His reign, and Satan in the pit. Then with full understanding, every soul will choose for himself/herself whom they will follow. This not a matter of second chances, because for many in this earth age they did not stand a chance the first time. They have simply not been taught the truth of God's eternal plan.

Revelation 20:4 "And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the Word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years."

Judgment is coming for the millions of Christian brothers and sisters who have lost their lives for the witness of Jesus Christ over the past two thousand years. Also receiving rewards are those that have not bowed to the Antichrist in the five month period of deception (coming up shortly), nor did they take his mark through the deception, nor accepted his ways (image) in their minds. If you believe in the rapture theory, you will worship Satan in error. Mark 13 and Matthew 24 makes it clear that the Antichrist will come first. The "rapture theory" teaches that you will be lifted out by the first messiah, and that first (false) messiah is the Antichrist.

Ezekiel 3:8, 9 tells us "our forehead" is our mind. The seal that is in our forehead is what we believe to be true in our minds. The "mark of the beast" is the knowledge you will possess in your mind. What you believe as truth will either cause you to be deceive, or prevent you from being deceived by the first (false) Christ into thinking he is the true messiah.