Soul sleep is a false doctrine

[ewq1938]

2 Corinthians 5:1 For we know that if our earthly house of this tabernacle were dissolved, we have a building of God, an house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens.

2Co 5:8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.
2Co 5:9 Wherefore we labour, that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him.



Luk_23:46 And when Jesus had cried with a loud voice, he said, Father, into thy hands I commend my spirit: and having said thus, he gave up the ghost.


Rev 1:7 Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.

Every eye shall see him, even those that had pierced him though they died long ago. If they were asleep they couldn't witness his return!

Rev 6:9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:
Rev 6:10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?

Here the souls of the dead are fully alert and not sleeping!


Another great article on this subject:

https://carm.org/soul-sleep

What is soul sleep?


by Matt Slick
Soul sleep is the teaching that when a person dies, his soul "sleeps" until the time of the future resurrection. In this condition, the person is not aware or conscious. The Jehovah's Witnesses and the Seventh-day Adventists hold to this doctrine. But the Jehovah's Witnesses teach annihilation. This means that after death, a person ceases to exist. At the future resurrection they maintain that the soul is made again. Basically, it is a re-creation of the individual. The Seventh-day Adventists teach that the soul is simply inert and resides in the memory of God.

The primary verses used to support soul sleep are found in Ecclesiastes:

• Eccl. 9:5, For the living know they will die; but the dead do not know anything, nor have they any longer a reward, for their memory is forgotten."
• Eccl. 12:7, "then the dust will return to the earth as it was, and the spirit will return to God who gave it."

Ecclesiastes must be understood in the context of its own commentary, which says at the opening of the book, "The words of the Preacher, the son of David, king in Jerusalem. 2 “Vanity of vanities,” says the Preacher, “Vanity of vanities! All is vanity.” 3 What advantage does man have in all his work which he does under the sun?" (Eccl. 1:1-3). The writer is telling us how things are from the human perspective from "under the sun." He is not telling us doctrinal statements about whether or not the soul continues after death. Besides, it's a mistake to use the Old Testament to interpret the New Testament. It is the New Testament that sheds light on the Old Testament.
In the New Testament we see Paul say in 2 Cor. 5:8, "we are of good courage, I say, and prefer rather to be absent from the body and to be at home with the Lord." Paul is clearly telling us that when he dies, he will go and be with the Lord. Furthermore, at the Transfiguration of Jesus (Matt. 17:1-8), we see Moses and Elijah who were alive. There was no soul sleep with them.
Therefore, the doctrine of soul sleep is incorrect. The soul continues on after death. The wicked face the judgment of God, and the Christians will dwell in His presence.
Both groups are in error about soul sleep.

 

[ATP]

Luke 23:46 - Yes, and Jesus is the only person that resurrected from the dead and is dwelling in the third heaven in bodily form.

Aside from Rev 6, where else in scripture does it say dead people put on white robes?

"Absent from the body" refers to what happens when we die. "Present with the Lord" means present with Jesus in a resurrection body (at the Second Coming). The reason so many claim that we are immediately in heaven or hell the moment we die is because they fail to understand the 3rd aspect of the passage that Paul presents: the intermediate state of "nakedness" which is also depicted as being "without a body". This refers to lying dead in the grave with no body, no thoughts, no memories, no knowledge, no wisdom, no praising God, no nothing as we "wait" in a total state of insensibility for either the one or the other resurrection.

The key to understanding "absent from the body and present with the Lord" is found in verse 4 when Paul says, "For we that are in this tabernacle do groan, being burdened, not that we want to be unclothed, but clothed upon that mortality might be swallowed of life." 2 Corinthians 5:4 KJV

Some say Paul wasn't talking about some intermediate state of nakedness in the grave between being clothed with the mortal body and the immortal, resurrection body, but that he was referring to the "spiritual nakedness" of being a lost soul without the robe of Christ's righteousness.

If that were truly the case, then we would understand Paul to be saying, "For we that are in this tabernacle to groan, being burdened, not that we want to (appear in judgment without the robe of Christ's righteousness), but clothed upon, that mortality might be swallowed up of life."

Does the above statement make any sense? It makes zero sense.

What Paul is saying is, "For we that are in this tabernacle do groan, being burdened, not that we want to be (lying in the grave dead awaiting the resurrection so that we can finally be clothed in immortality and be in the presence of Jesus), but clothed upon, that mortality might be swallowed up of life."

In other words, Paul is saying that his and our solution to the problem of the groaning we experience in our trouble filled lives is not the prospect of the rest and respite from that groaning that the grave would provide, but that our desire is to skip that step and be clothed upon with immortality that we may be in the presence of Jesus, though the grave is the unavoidable destination for us where we will have to wait for Jesus to come. It is in this that Paul said that he is confident and willing "to be absent from the body (skip the naked grave part) and present with the Lord."

 

[ewq1938]

Luke 23:46 - Yes, and Jesus is the only person that resurrected from the dead and is dwelling in the third heaven in bodily form.

Aside from Rev 6, where else in scripture does it say dead people put on white robes?

Just search using the terms "white robe" or "robes"

"Absent from the body" refers to what happens when we die. "Present with the Lord" means present with Jesus in a resurrection body (at the Second Coming).

No, it means exactly what it says. If you are absent from the body you are present with the Lord.

Also found here:

Ecc 12:6 Or ever the silver cord be loosed, or the golden bowl be broken, or the pitcher be broken at the fountain, or the wheel broken at the cistern.
Ecc 12:7 Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.

 

[ATP]

Just search using the terms "white robe" or "robes"



No, it means exactly what it says. If you are absent from the body you are present with the Lord.

Also found here:

Ecc 12:6 Or ever the silver cord be loosed, or the golden bowl be broken, or the pitcher be broken at the fountain, or the wheel broken at the cistern.
Ecc 12:7 Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.

Yeah and Eccl 12:7 spirit is translated "breath". Remember what we learned in Job...Job 34:14-15 NIV If it were his intention and he withdrew his spirit and breath, 15all humanity would perish together and mankind would return to the dust.

You still don't get it.

 

[ewq1938]

Yeah and Eccl 12:7 spirit is translated "breath". Remember what we learned in Job...Job 34:14-15 NIV If it were his intention and he withdrew his spirit and breath, 15all humanity would perish together and mankind would return to the dust.

You still don't get it.

Scripture states we return to God when we die, you disagree. I'm not the one "not getting it".

 

[ATP]

Scripture states we return to God when we die, you disagree. I'm not the one "not getting it".

Job 34 cannot be more clear, christianity 101.

 

[Butch5]

2 Corinthians 5:1 For we know that if our earthly house of this tabernacle were dissolved, we have a building of God, an house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens.

2Co 5:8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.
2Co 5:9 Wherefore we labour, that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him.



Luk_23:46 And when Jesus had cried with a loud voice, he said, Father, into thy hands I commend my spirit: and having said thus, he gave up the ghost.


Rev 1:7 Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.

Every eye shall see him, even those that had pierced him though they died long ago. If they were asleep they couldn't witness his return!

Rev 6:9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:
Rev 6:10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?

Here the souls of the dead are fully alert and not sleeping!


Another great article on this subject:

https://carm.org/soul-sleep

I didn't see anything in any of the passages regarding soul sleep. Firstly we need to define what a soul is. A soul according to Gen 2:7 is the combination of a body and the breath/spirit of life. The Breath/spirit of life is something from God, He puts it into a body and that body lives. Since a soul consists of these two elements if one removes one of the elements there is no longer a soul. Therefore if the body is dead, the soul cannot be alive.

 

[ATP]

Job 34:14-15 NIV If it were his intention and he withdrew his spirit and breath, 15all humanity would perish together and mankind would return to the dust.

Psalm 146:4 NIV When their spirit departs, they return to the ground; on that very day their plans come to nothing.

Eccl 3:19-20 NIV Surely the fate of human beings is like that of the animals; the same fate awaits them both: As one dies, so dies the other. All have the same breath ; humans have no advantage over animals. Everything is meaningless. 20All go to the same place; all come from dust, and to dust all return.

Acts 17:25 NIV And he is not served by human hands, as if he needed anything, because he himself gives all men life and breath and everything else.

James 2:26 NIV As the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without deeds is dead.

Rev 11:11 NIV But after the three and a half days the breath of life from God entered them, and they stood on their feet, and terror struck those who saw them.