The end of the world, as taught by Christ, separates the wicked from the just at the harvest, and it is coming for you.

[Spiritual Israelite]

They got in just as Matthew 23:13 says …

Matthew 23:13 But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither suffer ye them that are entering to go in.

That isn't what it says. The only way that anyone has ever been saved and entered the kingdom of God/heaven is by faith and they did not have faith.

The tares were sown into His field which could only have taken place under the old covenant. Under the new covenant it’s only by water and spirit.

What are you talking about? How do you think someone was saved in old covenant times and how in new covenant times?

John 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do …

Also in Matthew 13:37 the word “sowing” <4687> is a present tense verb, so we know the Son of man was sowing when He spoke those words, during the old covenant age.

What is your point here?

 

[grafted branch]

What are you talking about? How do you think someone was saved in old covenant times and how in new covenant times?

I’m not arguing that the tares were saved, only that they were in the kingdom prior to them being purged out by the angels.

What is your point here?

The point is the same old covenant field was sown by Jesus and Satan.
You have Satan in the bottomless pit during the new covenant so how do you suppose he would personally be able to sow in the field when the field is the world per Matthew 13:38? He can’t be both in the pit and in the world.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

I’m not arguing that the tares were saved, only that they were in the kingdom prior to them being purged out by the angels.

They were not. Look at this...

Matthew 13:38 The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one;

Can you see here how Jesus contrasted the children of the kingdom (good seed/wheat) with the children of the wicked one (tares). That means the tares were not in the kingdom. Very simple.

The point is the same old covenant field was sown by Jesus and Satan.

So?

You have Satan in the bottomless pit during the new covenant so how do you suppose he would personally be able to sow in the field when the field is the world per Matthew 13:38? He can’t be both in the pit and in the world.

Do apparently don't know how Amils understand the binding of Satan, which is very surprising. We do not see his binding in the sense of Him being completely incapacitated in a literal place like Premils do. We see His binding as being related to His inability to keep people in bondage to the fear of death without hope of anything after death like he was able to do in old covenant times because he held the power of death (Hebrews 2:14-15). But, by His death Jesus took the power of death away from Satan and has set many people free from the power of death by giving them the hope of eternal life.

 

[grafted branch]

They were not. Look at this...

Matthew 13:38 The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one;

Can you see here how Jesus contrasted the children of the kingdom (good seed/wheat) with the children of the wicked one (tares). That means the tares were not in the kingdom. Very simple.

Matthew 13:38 but the tares are the children of the wicked one
John 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil
Matthew 23:13 But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men

Hello!

Matthew 13:41 and they shall gather out of His kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity

What more corroboration do you need? The tares were in His kingdom, they got purged out.

Do apparently don't know how Amils understand the binding of Satan, which is very surprising. We do not see his binding in the sense of Him being completely incapacitated in a literal place like Premils do. We see His binding as being related to His inability to keep people in bondage to the fear of death without hope of anything after death like he was able to do in old covenant times because he held the power of death (Hebrews 2:14-15). But, by His death Jesus took the power of death away from Satan and has set many people free from the power of death by giving them the hope of eternal life.

So are you saying that Satan is currently in this world? Or maybe you think the world is the bottomless pit?

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Matthew 13:38 but the tares are the children of the wicked one
John 8:44 Ye are of your father the devil
Matthew 23:13 But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men

Hello!

Matthew 13:41 and they shall gather out of His kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity

What more corroboration do you need? The tares were in His kingdom, they got purged out.

You are making zero effort to see my point. What Matthew 13:41 means is the same thing that Matthew 13:49 says in this similar parable:

Matthew 13:47 “Once again, the kingdom of heaven is like a net that was let down into the lake and caught all kinds of fish. 48 When it was full, the fishermen pulled it up on the shore. Then they sat down and collected the good fish in baskets, but threw the bad away. 49 This is how it will be at the end of the age. The angels will come and separate the wicked from the righteous 50 and throw them into the blazing furnace, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

What Matthew 13:41 is saying is that at the end of the age that angels will come and separate the wicked (children of the wicked one, tares) from the children of the kingdom (the righteous, wheat). The only way that anyone has ever been in the kingdom of God/heaven is by faith and the Pharisees did not have faith.

So are you saying that Satan is currently in this world? Or maybe you think the world is the bottomless pit?

So, you really don't have any idea how Amils understand the binding of Satan, do you? How is that possible? After all the years you have been part of these discussions, you have no understanding of Amil?

Here is something I said in relation to the binding of Satan in a different post (comments relating to Premil have been removed).

Satan being bound has nothing to do with completely incapacitating Satan, it has to do with Jesus destroying his works (1 John 3:8) and taking the power of death away from him (Hebrews 2:14-15) in order to make the way for the gospel of Christ to shine light to the world that was formerly almost completely in spiritual darkness because they had "no hope, and were without God in the world" (Ephesians 2:11-13).

I believe all of the following passages relate to Satan's binding and all of them talk about the impact that Jesus and the preaching of His gospel has had on the world for the past almost 2,000 years.

Matthew 12:28 But if I cast out devils by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God is come unto you. 29 Or else how can one enter into a strong man's house, and spoil his goods, except he first bind the strong man? and then he will spoil his house.

1 John 3:8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.

John 12:31 Now is the judgment of this world: now shall the prince of this world be cast out. 32 And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me. 33 This he said, signifying what death he should die.

Luke 10:17 And the seventy returned again with joy, saying, Lord, even the devils are subject unto us through thy name. 18 And he said unto them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven.

Hebrews 2:14 Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil; 15 And deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage.

Acts 26:14 And when we were all fallen to the earth, I heard a voice speaking unto me, and saying in the Hebrew tongue, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me? it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks. 15 And I said, Who art thou, Lord? And he said, I am Jesus whom thou persecutest. 16 But rise, and stand upon thy feet: for I have appeared unto thee for this purpose, to make thee a minister and a witness both of these things which thou hast seen, and of those things in the which I will appear unto thee; 17 Delivering thee from the people, and from the Gentiles, unto whom now I send thee, 18 To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me.

All of the above passages relate to the binding of Satan which has to do with Jesus coming to "destroy the works of the devil" by way of taking "the power of death" away from him which he formerly used to keep the world (especially the Gentiles) in spiritual darkness and in slavery to the fear of death (due to previously having no hope of eternal life). Before He came very few Gentiles in the world had been saved, but after that a multitude has been saved. That was made possible by way of Jesus binding Satan and restraining the power he once held over the world to make it possible for people to be delivered "from the power of Satan unto God".

The binding of Satan has nothing to do with making Satan completely powerless. It has to do with spoiling his house, destroying his works, taking the power of death away from him and keeping him from deceiving almost the entire world awhile keeping them in spiritual darkness as slaves to the fear of death as he was able to do in OT times.

 

[grafted branch]

So, you really don't have any idea how Amils understand the binding of Satan, do you? How is that possible? After all the years you have been part of these discussions, you have no understanding of Amil?

Ok, let me put it this way, Satan is bound in the bottomless pit during the millennium. Whatever that pit is, and I’m guessing it’s a spiritual place not a physical location, that is where Satan is during the millennium and Satan can’t go beyond the boundaries of the bottomless pit during the millennium.

Satan himself, not his minions, is currently sowing tares in the world, correct? If so then the world is within the boundaries of the bottomless pit, and His field is within the boundaries of the bottomless pit.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Ok, let me put it this way, Satan is bound in the bottomless pit during the millennium. Whatever that pit is, and I’m guessing it’s a spiritual place not a physical location, that is where Satan is during the millennium and Satan can’t go beyond the boundaries of the bottomless pit during the millennium.

You interpret it literally just like Premills do. Amills do not interpret it that way. I showed you how I interpret his binding. Not sure what else I can do.

Satan himself, not his minions, is currently sowing tares in the world, correct?

What do you mean "his minions"? His angels? Of course he has help to do what he does and doesn't just do it all himself.

If so then the world is within the boundaries of the bottomless pit, and His field is within the boundaries of the bottomless pit.

No idea what you're saying. I think it's pointless to continue the discussion because neither of us can understand what the other is saying.

 

[Davidpt]

Ok, let me put it this way, Satan is bound in the bottomless pit during the millennium. Whatever that pit is, and I’m guessing it’s a spiritual place not a physical location, that is where Satan is during the millennium and Satan can’t go beyond the boundaries of the bottomless pit during the millennium.

Satan himself, not his minions, is currently sowing tares in the world, correct? If so then the world is within the boundaries of the bottomless pit, and His field is within the boundaries of the bottomless pit.

A 'place' whether spiritual or literal, would have to be 'location', would it not? If you had said this instead---and I’m guessing it’s a spiritual condition--in this case a location of some kind wouldn't be applicable, since it doesn't imply a location while 'a place' does.

If meaning a condition, location and bounderies shouldn't matter. But they would matter if meaning location.

Something to keep in mind regardless what the pit is or isn't. satan, unlike God, can't be in multiple places at the same time. Therefore, if he is depicted as bound and shut up in a pit, he can not also be roaming around freely outside of the pit, as a roaring lion, seeking whom to devour. It doesn't matter if the pit is literal or not. If satan is depited locked up somewhere, it is then a contradiction for him to be roaming outside of where he depicted locked up in.

Consider these locusts in Revelation 9, for instance. They are in the same pit satan will be in. And while they are in the pit it's as if they don't even exist at the time. Their activities in the earth, thus outside of the pit, are zero when they are in the pit. Surely then, when satan is in the pit the same has to be true of him as well. Except we see plenty of proof of his activities throughout the earth when Amil has him in the pit. Therefore, he can't be in the pit yet.

 

[WPM]

A 'place' whether spiritual or literal, would have to be 'location', would it not? If you had said this instead---and I’m guessing it’s a spiritual condition--in this case a location of some kind wouldn't be applicable, since it doesn't imply a location while 'a place' does.

If meaning a condition, location and bounderies shouldn't matter. But they would matter if meaning location.

Something to keep in mind regardless what the pit is or isn't. satan, unlike God, can't be in multiple places at the same time. Therefore, if he is depicted as bound and shut up in a pit, he can not also be roaming around freely outside of the pit, as a roaring lion, seeking whom to devour. It doesn't matter if the pit is literal or not. If satan is depited locked up somewhere, it is then a contradiction for him to be roaming outside of where he depicted locked up in.

Consider these locusts in Revelation 9, for instance. They are in the same pit satan will be in. And while they are in the pit it's as if they don't even exist at the time. Their activities in the earth, thus outside of the pit, are zero when they are in the pit. Surely then, when satan is in the pit the same has to be true of him as well. Except we see plenty of proof of his activities throughout the earth when Amil has him in the pit. Therefore, he can't be in the pit yet.

• Do you believe Satan and his minions are physical beings?
• Is the dragon in Revelation 20:2 a literal physical dragon?
• Is the serpent in Revelation 20:2 a literal physical serpent?
• Do you believe Satan literally has 7 heads and 7 necks?
• Is the key mentioned in Revelation 20:1 a literal metal door key?
• Is the chain mentioned in Revelation 20:1 a literal metal chain?
• Is the prison mentioned in Revelation 20:7 a literal brick prison?
• Do you believe demons need to be detained in a literal physical prison with literal metal chains in order to be restrained?
• Can a prisoner in a prison have great wrath while in chains?
• Does imprisonment mean immobility?
• Does it mean a prisoner cannot do harm?
• Can a dog on a chain walk or roam about?
• Can a prisoner in a prison walk or roam about?
• Can a prisoner deceive others in prison?
• Does a prisoner have the ability to kill, steal, destroy, rape and embezzle in prison?

 

[WPM]

A 'place' whether spiritual or literal, would have to be 'location', would it not? If you had said this instead---and I’m guessing it’s a spiritual condition--in this case a location of some kind wouldn't be applicable, since it doesn't imply a location while 'a place' does.

If meaning a condition, location and bounderies shouldn't matter. But they would matter if meaning location.

Something to keep in mind regardless what the pit is or isn't. satan, unlike God, can't be in multiple places at the same time. Therefore, if he is depicted as bound and shut up in a pit, he can not also be roaming around freely outside of the pit, as a roaring lion, seeking whom to devour. It doesn't matter if the pit is literal or not. If satan is depited locked up somewhere, it is then a contradiction for him to be roaming outside of where he depicted locked up in.

Consider these locusts in Revelation 9, for instance. They are in the same pit satan will be in. And while they are in the pit it's as if they don't even exist at the time. Their activities in the earth, thus outside of the pit, are zero when they are in the pit. Surely then, when satan is in the pit the same has to be true of him as well. Except we see plenty of proof of his activities throughout the earth when Amil has him in the pit. Therefore, he can't be in the pit yet.

When Satan is released before the second coming for a little season then so is the beast, and Satan's minions. We see the devils in Revelation 9:2-3, the beast in 2 Thessalonians 2:3-12, Revelation 11:7 and Revelation 17:8, and Satan in Revelation 9:10-11 and Revelation 20:3 all being released before the second coming for a little season. Then comes the end! But Christ comes in majestic and eternal glory to overthrow the kingdom of darkness forever. The demonic realm is all killed when Satan is destroyed at the climactic second coming (Isaiah 26:19-27:1, 2 Thessalonians 2:8, Revelation 19:20, 20:9-10).