The trouble with religion

[historyb]

God setup a Religion, read the OT. Of course I am sure that you will still go your own man made route and in so doing saying God has changed. You see God is the same yesterday, today, and forever but you and others like you say God does change by saying God did not create Religion. If your a Christian your in a Religion, if you deny that than your not a Christian but a man made idea.

 

[Nancy]

Sure you can be like the world and have all kind of fun redefining words; However, it does not change the fact the Christianity is the definition of Religion and you can not get away from that. The much better thing to say is that you don't want the tradition (Scripture, history, Church) that religion brings but want to chart your own path.

Mark 7:1-9 pretty much sums up what Jesus thought about man's tradition.

 

[historyb]

Mark 7:1-9 pretty much sums up what Jesus thought about man's tradition.

Religion is not man's traditions. How can something God created be bad? You all are no different than the Pharisees and Sadducees but instead of adding rules you make demands that are only more man-made ideas and than puff up like they did saying look at us we are not religious but those who are are wrong. Evangelicals are no different then the rulers of Jesus day just in a different guise.

 

[mjrhealth]

God setup a Religion, read the OT. Of course I am sure that you will still go your own man made route and in so doing saying God has changed. You see God is the same yesterday, today, and forever but you and others like you say God does change by saying God did not create Religion. If your a Christian your in a Religion, if you deny that than your not a Christian but a man made idea.

What a bit like this one

Act 7:47 But Solomon built him an house.
Act 7:48 Howbeit the most High dwelleth not in temples made with hands; as saith the prophet,
Act 7:49 Heaven is my throne, and earth is my footstool: what house will ye build me? saith the Lord: or what is the place of my rest?
Act 7:50 Hath not my hand made all these things?
Act 7:51 Ye stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always resist the Holy Ghost: as your fathers did, so do ye.
Act 7:52 Which of the prophets have not your fathers persecuted? and they have slain them which shewed before of the coming of the Just One; of whom ye have been now the betrayers and murderers:

and mankind has built his temple to heaven and God is not in them.

 

[historyb]

What a bit like this one

Act 7:47 But Solomon built him an house.
Act 7:48 Howbeit the most High dwelleth not in temples made with hands; as saith the prophet,
Act 7:49 Heaven is my throne, and earth is my footstool: what house will ye build me? saith the Lord: or what is the place of my rest?
Act 7:50 Hath not my hand made all these things?
Act 7:51 Ye stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always resist the Holy Ghost: as your fathers did, so do ye.
Act 7:52 Which of the prophets have not your fathers persecuted? and they have slain them which shewed before of the coming of the Just One; of whom ye have been now the betrayers and murderers:

and mankind has built his temple to heaven and God is not in them.

Acts 7:51 applies to those like you. I am a Christian and I am Religious, I disavow your man made ideas as from the enemy.

 

[mjrhealth]

Acts 7:51 applies to those like you. I am a Christian and I am Religious, I disavow your man made ideas as from the enemy.

What this one

Joh 10:26 But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you.
Joh 10:27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:
Joh 10:28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
Joh 10:29 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.

And that is why He has few sheep, so few will leave their religions to follow after Him, prefer egypt and serving Pharaoh, than worshiping the living God.

Exo_9:13 And the LORD said unto Moses, Rise up early in the morning, and stand before Pharaoh, and say unto him, Thus saith the LORD God of the Hebrews, Let my people go, that they may serve me.

but the pharaohs of this world will not let Gods people go, and neither do the people want to leave egypt.

 

[Phoneman777]

Now you are yelling..

1Ki 19:11 And he said, Go forth, and stand upon the mount before the LORD. And, behold, the LORD passed by, and a great and strong wind rent the mountains, and brake in pieces the rocks before the LORD; but the LORD was not in the wind: and after the wind an earthquake; but the LORD was not in the earthquake:
1Ki 19:12 And after the earthquake a fire; but the LORD was not in the fire: and after the fire a still small voice.

The truth is proclaimed not yelled. And yes we know you love your religion, just let those who choose Christ alone, walk with Him alone without the need for men. You choose your path and now you must walk it.

Ensuring that others have a chance to consider the other side of the coin of popular misconceptions like those which form the entire body of your post content - which in this case is the popular yet false idea that "religion" is a problem when James by implication clearly makes a distinction between "pure, undefiled religion" and "bad religion" - is not yelling, it's light which exposes the darkness...if you'd come out of darkness, the light wouldn't hurt your eyes.

 

[mjrhealth]

Ensuring that others have a chance to consider the other side of the coin of popular misconceptions like those which form the entire body of your post content - which in this case is the popular yet false idea that "religion" is a problem when James by implication clearly makes a distinction between "pure, undefiled religion" and "bad religion" - is not yelling, it's light which exposes the darkness...if you'd come out of darkness, the light wouldn't hurt your eyes.

It is when you make it 10ft high and by teh way you missed out on teh rest,

Jas_1:27 Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world.

Nothing to do with "church" or denomination nor all the other stuff people keep adding to the requirements of salvation.

 

[Helen]

Why would God destroy something He setup, He would not. God setup religion in the OT to Isreal and in the NT to His Church. The biggest problem is the same od one man wants his way so will not follow God's setup Religion even though they think they do.

So, you say "God set up religion"...I say Gods purpose was for relationship.
So, you think that God's intention and purpose was to start "religion"!!!!!

So...show us where God set up "religion" as a pattern for mankind- in the garden , when He created Adam ?


The floor is yours....

....

 

[historyb]

So, you say God set up religion...I say Gods purpose was for relationship.

So...show us where God set up "religion" in the garden when He created Adam ?

The floor is yours....

....View attachment 5432

God told the Israelites how to setup the temple, how to setup statues, how to worship Him, the rules all this is Religions. The problem is you all are saying God changed from setting up the Religion to not wanting that and that makes Scriptures lie when it says God never changed. God never hated Religion what He did hate was the people taking His Religion and turning into something that never was. He hated the pride they had. When you all say there is no religion because you don't like the word that you all are misunderstanding ou all are just like the Religious leaders of Jesus time. Yes God wants a relationship but He never said a relationship divorced from His Religion

 

[Phoneman777]

It is when you make it 10ft high and by teh way you missed out on teh rest,

Jas_1:27 Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world.

Nothing to do with "church" or denomination nor all the other stuff people keep adding to the requirements of salvation.

So, you now see and admit that the blanket condemnation of "religion" that is such a popular idea is actually wrong, but only bad religion is worthy of such condemnation. Now, please stop promoting this false idea, thank you very much

 

[mjrhealth]

So, you now see and admit that the blanket condemnation of "religion" that is such a popular idea is actually wrong, but only bad religion is worthy of such condemnation. Now, please stop promoting this false idea, thank you very much

Not religion as the world sees it, it is an abomination, none of mens "religions" "churches" denominations are from God, not a single one.

 

[Butterfly]

see post 57.
You perhaps fail to understand.

Nope, have not failed to understand X
You did not answer my question - do you prayer to have your eyes and ears open ?
It's a very simple question - but an important one X
Rita

 

[Butterfly]

Not religion as the world sees it, it is an abomination, none of mens "religions" "churches" denominations are from God, not a single one.

Not sure I can agree with the above statement.
It's not unbiblical for believers to come together and have fellowship/ worship ect.
I have heard many good testimonies about people going into communities as groups, and many do wonderful things for those communities. Many are full of true believers, and many are open to Gods leading. It's when man made rules become way more important than hearing from God , when men let the power/ authority go to their heads, when there is little openness to change within the leading from God that divisions come about. Religion, to me, is about all the man made rules and regulations that have been introduced over the years, like with the Pharisees - it brought about a slavery.
I still hold to the truth that ' the Church ' is Gods people , and not a building or denomination ect, but I believe that God can work within the physical building where people come together.

The disciples met together in a physical place, so did the people of Corinth, Philippians, ect but I am not convinced it was a ' church building ' with all its bells and smells ! ( an expression an elderly lady once had to describe the Church of England, if it was a high church )
Rita

 

[mjrhealth]

I still hold to the truth that ' the Church ' is Gods people , and not a building or denomination ect, but I believe that God can work within the physical building where people come together.

Well you got that bit right, and not many get that, the biggest problem is you must ask yourself, what happens when you put a white garment into a muddy river for long enough, and that is the whole problem, as Jesus put it, where 2 or 3 are gathered together, can be at the pub, garden, beach park. doesnt matter, we should be careful what we hear.. a musician when they want to become the best they can be, pursue the best teachers, and usually end up sounding just like them, as it is with Christ, the more time we spend with Him the more like Him we will become, the more time you spend in your church the more like your church you will become, Which is why HE said, "come out of her My people".

Narrow is the way that leads to life, He is our life and the walk we can only do alone with Him.

 

[Butterfly]

Well you got that bit right, and not many get that, the biggest problem is you must ask yourself, what happens when you put a white garment into a muddy river for long enough, and that is the whole problem, as Jesus put it, where 2 or 3 are gathered together, can be at the pub, garden, beach park. doesnt matter, we should be careful what we hear.. a musician when they want to become the best they can be, pursue the best teachers, and usually end up sounding just like them, as it is with Christ, the more time we spend with Him the more like Him we will become, the more time you spend in your church the more like your church you will become, Which is why HE said, "come out of her My people".

Narrow is the way that leads to life, He is our life and the walk we can only do alone with Him.

Very true, or like many of us we become so fed up with feeling like a round peg in a square hole that we simply have to move on. For years I thought there was something wrong with me because I simply didn't agree with everything.
I know I will always be judged as being ' in the wrong ' ' rebellious ' by those who simply do not see it !!
Rita

 

[mjrhealth]

Very true, or like many of us we become so fed up with feeling like a round peg in a square hole that we simply have to move on. For years I thought there was something wrong with me because I simply didn't agree with everything.
I know I will always be judged as being ' in the wrong ' ' rebellious ' by those who simply do not see it !!
Rita

I was trying to find this bit

Joh 6:25 When they found him on the other side of the sea, they said to him, “Rabbi, when did you come here?”
Joh 6:26 Jesus answered them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, you are seeking me, not because you saw signs, but because you ate your fill of the loaves.
Joh 6:27 Do not work for the food that perishes, but for the food that endures to eternal life, which the Son of Man will give to you. For on him God the Father has set his seal.”

Ye you get used to it, so many religious trying to defend there religions so few willing to forsake all to follow after Christ than abuse those that do. We must be in Him not In Church that bit about what you are joined to..

God bless you for seeing and hearing not many do.

 

[Nancy]

Religion is not man's traditions. How can something God created be bad? You all are no different than the Pharisees and Sadducees but instead of adding rules you make demands that are only more man-made ideas and than puff up like they did saying look at us we are not religious but those who are are wrong. Evangelicals are no different then the rulers of Jesus day just in a different guise.

You say "religion is not man's traditions". But in a previous post, you said:
"The much better thing to say is that you don't want the tradition (Scripture, history, Church) that religion brings but want to chart your own path."

Very true, or like many of us we become so fed up with feeling like a round peg in a square hole that we simply have to move on. For years I thought there was something wrong with me because I simply didn't agree with everything.
I know I will always be judged as being ' in the wrong ' ' rebellious ' by those who simply do not see it !!
Rita

Hi Rita,
Boy you got that round peg square hole right! I had all of last summer to decide if I was going to remain in the local body or go to a different one. I decided for several reasons to leave and it was not a light decision. I still get a lump in my throat when I pass by my old place but, I do not think everyone is meant for just any body of believers. The women there were very tough to break the ice with and, they never made much of an attempt to get to know me. Not to mention there were doctrinal issues that I could never agree with so, rather than stay and probably, eventually cause division because it was really tough for those 2.5 yrs. to NOT bring up some of those issues to the folks I was a bit close with. They had no clue they were attending a strict Calvinistic Church. If I were to say something to one of the people around me, they had no idea what I was talking about so, I just kept my mouth shut.
I'm now happily back to an old church that opened a campus near me! I have friends there and we do not just "fellowship" on one day a week but, several ♥

 

[Butterfly]

You say "religion is not man's traditions". But in a previous post, you said:
"The much better thing to say is that you don't want the tradition (Scripture, history, Church) that religion brings but want to chart your own path."


Hi Rita,
Boy you got that round peg square hole right! I had all of last summer to decide if I was going to remain in the local body or go to a different one. I decided for several reasons to leave and it was not a light decision. I still get a lump in my throat when I pass by my old place but, I do not think everyone is meant for just any body of believers. The women there were very tough to break the ice with and, they never made much of an attempt to get to know me. Not to mention there were doctrinal issues that I could never agree with so, rather than stay and probably, eventually cause division because it was really tough for those 2.5 yrs. to NOT bring up some of those issues to the folks I was a bit close with. They had no clue they were attending a strict Calvinistic Church. If I were to say something to one of the people around me, they had no idea what I was talking about so, I just kept my mouth shut.
I'm now happily back to an old church that opened a campus near me! I have friends there and we do not just "fellowship" on one day a week but, several ♥

Yes, it's not a nice feeling is it. Pleased you found a place to go xxx
Rita

 

[Triumph1300]

As epostle stated - this is a relatively NEW teaching that was started by televangelists in the 60's and 70's.

Could be, I don't now.
I don't have TV.

But as far as I am concerned a "personal relationship with Christ" is not a new teaching.
Seems to me it's a 2000 year old teaching.
That's why I don't classify Christianity as a "religion", but a relationship.
There's lots of religion out there. But it's not the stuff that Christianity is based on.