Third Temple?

[JohnDB]

And just as a point of clarification.

It's better termed as the "Abomination that causes desolation"

Desolation is abominable...but to say Abomination of Desolation negates the ascribed power of Holiness.

Holiness is a state of being that rejects error...it is Pure and good. It has a violent reaction to error or corruption as it tries to remain pure and good.

The Temple was a "shadow" or closely related copy of the true Throne in Heaven. As such it was very Holy and subject to the state of being Holy.

It's a state of being that people have a difficult time in understanding. Fire is hot... Holy is pure. Do not touch fire or else you will get burned...right?
Ok
Then do not corrupt Holy because all hell will break loose.

And that is precisely what happened in 66 AD as that Roman Eagle was erected and Caesar's picture plates were put up all over Jerusalem. God/Jesus had visited that Temple...it had been touched by Him...it was Holy. He used it.

 

[Base12]

I would think that God Himself caused the Moslem Dome to be built right where it is.

Galatians 4:25
"For this Agar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children."

Fitting verse for these times.

 

[Dave Watchman]

The abomination that causes desolation was in 66AD...the Temple destruction was in 70 AD.

Right, "when you see Jerusalem surrounded by armies.

Only that wasn't the Olivet of Matthew and Mark.

When Jesus said: "when you see Jerusalem surrounded by armies", He was sitting down inside the temple the day OF the Olivet.

Matthew 24 began with Jesus LEAVING the temple and walking away.

20 minute hike down the temple mount, across the Kiddron valley, and up to the mount called Olivet.

It was likely night by then.

For every day he was teaching in the temple, but at night he went out and lodged on the mount called Olivet.

There were no rich donators to the treasury, no poor widows.

Only four came to Him privately, Peter, James, John and Andrew, and asked “Tell us, when will these things happen? And what will be the sign that they are all about to be fulfilled?”

Anyway, you're not going to get a 1290 Day lock fit on the first century, like the one I have right now.

I already tried it.

Lock fit:

Calculate Duration Between Two Dates – Results​

Peaceful Sabbath.

 

[Davy]

The abomination that causes desolation was in 66AD...the Temple destruction was in 70 AD.

Actually, the historical event that served as a blueprint for the "abomination of desolation" in the Book of Daniel was with Antiochus IV in 170 B.C. He took Jerusalem, went inside the temple and sacrificed swine upon the altar, spread its broth around inside the temple, and then setup an idol in Zeus worship, and demanded the Jews to worship it, attempting to establish Hellenism among the Jews. He fulfilled the Daniel 11 "vile person" prophecy ALMOST TO A TEE. Yet some parameters of the prophecy he did not fulfill, and about 200 years later Jesus forewarned of the "abomination of desolation", moving the real one forward to the endtime Antichrist.

 

[JohnDB]

Actually, the historical event that served as a blueprint for the "abomination of desolation" in the Book of Daniel was with Antiochus IV in 170 B.C. He took Jerusalem, went inside the temple and sacrificed swine upon the altar, spread its broth around inside the temple, and then setup an idol in Zeus worship, and demanded the Jews to worship it, attempting to establish Hellenism among the Jews. He fulfilled the Daniel 11 "vile person" prophecy ALMOST TO A TEE. Yet some parameters of the prophecy he did not fulfill, and about 200 years later Jesus forewarned of the "abomination of desolation", moving the real one forward to the endtime Antichrist.

Until you stop your changing of scriptures I'm not going to discuss anything more with you.

It is the "abomination that causes desolation"
Not that abomination you keep stating.

 

[marks]

From the Phillipines to North Africa and all of the Middle East...
Don't forget Turkey and Eastern Europe and others throughout Europe.

Then there's the Moslem in North America and South America and Canada.

It's a popular religion.

No earthquake is going to fix the whole world.

Focus on the militarized Muslem nations. Now you have a much more limited list, primarily the Middle East and North Africa.

There appear to be prophecies that Israel will take over their adjacent neighbors from their failed attempt to wipe Israel out. For instance, Obadiah. Psalm 83. After that Gog and Magog and the hordes with them attempt it. To be destroyed by God in a worldwide cataclysmic earthquake, as the church is being raptured, and the seals are being opened, and the seventieth week is beginning.

Best as I can understand it anyway. But it all makes a lot of sense to me.

Much love!

 

[Davy]

Until you stop your changing of scriptures I'm not going to discuss anything more with you.

It is the "abomination that causes desolation"
Not that abomination you keep stating.

It's impossible to do what you're asking. Jesus was quoting from the Book of Daniel when He warned of the "abomination of desolation" in His Olivet discourse. Both Scriptures are about the SAME event...

Dan 11:21-35
21 And in his estate shall stand up a vile person, to whom they shall not give the honour of the kingdom: but he shall come in peaceably, and obtain the kingdom by flatteries.
22 And with the arms of a flood shall they be overflown from before him, and shall be broken; yea, also the prince of the covenant.
23 And after the league made with him he shall work deceitfully: for he shall come up, and shall become strong with a small people.
24 He shall enter peaceably even upon the fattest places of the province; and he shall do that which his fathers have not done, nor his fathers' fathers; he shall scatter among them the prey, and spoil, and riches: yea, and he shall forecast his devices against the strong holds, even for a time.
25 And he shall stir up his power and his courage against the king of the south with a great army; and the king of the south shall be stirred up to battle with a very great and mighty army; but he shall not stand: for they shall forecast devices against him.
26 Yea, they that feed of the portion of his meat shall destroy him, and his army shall overflow: and many shall fall down slain.
27 And both these kings' hearts shall be to do mischief, and they shall speak lies at one table; but it shall not prosper: for yet the end shall be at the time appointed.
28 Then shall he return into his land with great riches; and his heart shall be against the holy covenant; and he shall do exploits, and return to his own land.
29 At the time appointed he shall return, and come toward the south; but it shall not be as the former, or as the latter.
30 For the ships of Chittim shall come against him: therefore he shall be grieved, and return, and have indignation against the holy covenant: so shall he do; he shall even return, and have intelligence with them that forsake the holy covenant.
31 And arms shall stand on his part, and they shall pollute the sanctuary of strength, and shall take away the daily sacrifice, and they shall place the abomination that maketh desolate.
32 And such as do wickedly against the covenant shall he corrupt by flatteries: but the people that do know their God shall be strong, and do exploits.
33 And they that understand among the people shall instruct many: yet they shall fall by the sword, and by flame, by captivity, and by spoil, many days.
34 Now when they shall fall, they shall be holpen with a little help: but many shall cleave to them with flatteries.
35 And some of them of understanding shall fall, to try them, and to purge, and to make them white, even to the time of the end: because it is yet for a time appointed.
KJV

Matt 24:15
15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:)
KJV

Matt 24:21
21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.
KJV

That wasn't about 66 A.D., nor 70 A.D.

That event is still yet to happen, and is set for the very end of this world, just prior to Christ's return. This is why the Daniel 12 Scripture also points to this involving the end of this world...

Dan 12:1-2
12:1 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.
2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.
KJV

What you are following is a silly doctrine of men, not God's Word.

 

[JohnDB]

It's impossible to do what you're asking. Jesus was quoting from the Book of Daniel when He warned of the "abomination of desolation" in His Olivet discourse. Both Scriptures are about the SAME event...

Dan 11:21-35
21 And in his estate shall stand up a vile person, to whom they shall not give the honour of the kingdom: but he shall come in peaceably, and obtain the kingdom by flatteries.
22 And with the arms of a flood shall they be overflown from before him, and shall be broken; yea, also the prince of the covenant.
23 And after the league made with him he shall work deceitfully: for he shall come up, and shall become strong with a small people.
24 He shall enter peaceably even upon the fattest places of the province; and he shall do that which his fathers have not done, nor his fathers' fathers; he shall scatter among them the prey, and spoil, and riches: yea, and he shall forecast his devices against the strong holds, even for a time.
25 And he shall stir up his power and his courage against the king of the south with a great army; and the king of the south shall be stirred up to battle with a very great and mighty army; but he shall not stand: for they shall forecast devices against him.
26 Yea, they that feed of the portion of his meat shall destroy him, and his army shall overflow: and many shall fall down slain.
27 And both these kings' hearts shall be to do mischief, and they shall speak lies at one table; but it shall not prosper: for yet the end shall be at the time appointed.
28 Then shall he return into his land with great riches; and his heart shall be against the holy covenant; and he shall do exploits, and return to his own land.
29 At the time appointed he shall return, and come toward the south; but it shall not be as the former, or as the latter.
30 For the ships of Chittim shall come against him: therefore he shall be grieved, and return, and have indignation against the holy covenant: so shall he do; he shall even return, and have intelligence with them that forsake the holy covenant.
31 And arms shall stand on his part, and they shall pollute the sanctuary of strength, and shall take away the daily sacrifice, and they shall place the abomination that maketh desolate.
32 And such as do wickedly against the covenant shall he corrupt by flatteries: but the people that do know their God shall be strong, and do exploits.
33 And they that understand among the people shall instruct many: yet they shall fall by the sword, and by flame, by captivity, and by spoil, many days.
34 Now when they shall fall, they shall be holpen with a little help: but many shall cleave to them with flatteries.
35 And some of them of understanding shall fall, to try them, and to purge, and to make them white, even to the time of the end: because it is yet for a time appointed.
KJV

Matt 24:15
15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:)
KJV

Matt 24:21
21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.
KJV

That wasn't about 66 A.D., nor 70 A.D.

That event is still yet to happen, and is set for the very end of this world, just prior to Christ's return. This is why the Daniel 12 Scripture also points to this involving the end of this world...

Dan 12:1-2
12:1 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.
2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.
KJV

What you are following is a silly doctrine of men, not God's Word.

So you want to deny the power of God which is Holiness?

Good day!

 

[Davy]

So you want to deny the power of God which is Holiness?

Good day!

Boy, you certainly strayed way... off topic!

 

[JohnDB]

All I'm stating (aside from getting interrupted by those who want to twist scriptures to fit their own theologies) is that there's not any way in the rest of my lifetime that a new Temple can be built on the Temple Mount.

Between the political climate, the foundation that will have to be completely redone and the sifting through the fill materials, pouring over the stones and timbers currently there, and the Jews own infighting....it ain't happening.

People can hold to a belief of a third Temple being constructed one day...but it would need to start very very soon for it to be completed before I get too old to remember my own name and wear diapers on a regular basis.

So...
Either the theologies surrounding a third Temple are wrong and the end is near
or
they are correct and the end is not near.

But as a "pan millenialist" (everything will pan out ok for me) I am not really concerned.

YMMV
(Your mileage may vary)

 

[Davy]

All I'm stating (aside from getting interrupted by those who want to twist scriptures to fit their own theologies) is that there's not any way in the rest of my lifetime that a new Temple can be built on the Temple Mount.

Wow! Talk about those who twist Scripture to fit their own theology! That's exactly what you do by denying the Scripture evidence for a new JEWISH temple in Jerusalem built for the end (Daniel 9:27; Daniel 11:30-31; Matthew 24:15-26; Revelation 11:1-2; 2 Thessalonians 2:4).

Preparing for the Third Temple – Israel My Glory

Update on the Building of the Third Temple | Jewish Voice

Zehut’s Feiglin says he wants to build Third Temple right away

Temple Institute encourages Jews to hope for Third Temple in new video

 

[JohnDB]

Monks brawl at Jerusalem's Church of the Holy Sepulchre, site of Jesus's crucifixion
2008 rioting monks.

In case you get blocked by a paywall...
Riot police called as monks clash in the Church of the Holy Sepulchre | The Times

Fighting monks...one chair moved 8 inches.

 

[historyb]

Monks brawl at Jerusalem's Church of the Holy Sepulchre, site of Jesus's crucifixion
2008 rioting monks.

In case you get blocked by a paywall...
Riot police called as monks clash in the Church of the Holy Sepulchre | The Times

Fighting monks...one chair moved 8 inches.

You know this doesn't matter to those who don't think rationality. It seems the most illogical and irrational thinking happens around the Bible. I have known the most rational, logical thinking people but than all that goes out the window when they get to Eschatology.

 

[Trekson]

If anyone has been to Israel and understands the political situation there...

The ability to construct (after demolition of the Dome of the Rock) without upsetting everyone in the world is not going to be easy. The whole foundation of the Temple Mount needs to be redone...that ain't happening quickly because of the treasure trove of archaeology in the dirt.

Let's just say that a new Temple is an impossibility.

It doesn't have to be a temple, a dedicated tabernacle would satisfy the prophecies.

 

[JohnDB]

You know this doesn't matter to those who don't think rationality. It seems the most illogical and irrational thinking happens around the Bible. I have known the most rational, logical thinking people but than all that goes out the window when they get to Eschatology.

Even though I am a very strange duck in that I'm more versed in scriptures than most people (including those here) I know beyond all shadow of doubt that I cannot tell anyone when the final eschatons will begin.

I do understand more than most about the symbols and types that exist in Revelation...
But that doesn't give me license to teach it as if I have all authority over understanding what it says.

It's a highly metaphoric book with several layers of intentions. Meaning that it's very complicated...and written that way for a reason.

The letters to the 7 Churches are the easiest and most people screw them up in crazy ways. After that it gets difficult in a big hurry.

But many people think that a new Temple is going to be built on the Temple Mount...
(For various reasons both good and bad... although I have yet to see the good ones listed here yet)

And I am speaking from a purely physical logistical point of view up to this point on the subject. Haven't even touched scriptural reasons for or against.
I spoke very briefly on Jesus' prophecy concerning it's destruction and absolute precision and I get every kind of garbage out there thrown at me from twisted scriptures to how I have no idea what I am talking about. Thinly veiled demands that I need to read scriptures for the first time in my life.
Really?

Bulldozers need diesel...and if the tank is empty you really need to fill the tank before it's started up. That in essence is all I've stated and have been crucified for it.

Nobody wants to talk about scriptures...no one wants to acknowledge that someone might know more about something than they do. I might know a lot but I know that I don't know all...and I can't seem to find anyone willing to actually discuss scriptures without actually preaching at me...,(clue: I'm saved...one of the Bene Elohim)

Maybe one day someone will want to actually discuss things...but as of this point I have yet to find anyone.

 

[JohnDB]

It doesn't have to be a temple, a dedicated tabernacle would satisfy the prophecies.

The retaining walls aren't holding up now...they are literally falling apart. People have been hurt already.

 

[historyb]

Nobody wants to talk about scriptures...no one wants to acknowledge that someone might know more about something than they do.

I am bad at that

 

[JohnDB]

I am bad at that

Admitting it is the first step towards recovery...
ROFL
It's difficult because we worship a personal God...who has revealed himself to us in a personal way. And that causes extreme emotions in each of us who takes this seriously.
But we have to remember that grace and thinking more highly of others is crucial to the faith we hold. (That helps me often)
And admitting:
I'm not the fountain of all knowledge...

But I do think that collectively we can know more than we can individually.

 

[Trekson]

The retaining walls aren't holding up now...they are literally falling apart. People have been hurt already.

A tabernacle near OT descriptions wouldn't have that problem.

 

[JohnDB]

A tabernacle near OT descriptions wouldn't have that problem.

Wouldn't hold up with the foot traffic.

And then there's the issue of the holy of Holies. The Jews are petrified of it...

Look at the history of past high priests...and length of term of service. I guarantee you that many died on atonement day. Pulled out by the rope on their ankle.