Greetings,I find the Christian teaching of being saved interesting because it goes against the entire idea of being judged. If one is saved at baptism or at any ceremonial or ritualistic procedding then is it possible to be unsaved?and if one was saved then unsaved, was that person saved to begin with? Also further in thought if one was saved then what would that person bypass judgement? Please share your thoughts with me as I find this philosophical teaching very interesting.
to be saved or not to be saved that is the question
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I don't find any philosophical teaching interesting. Salvation is not based on babtism only,you can be sprinkled with water thousand times and you are not saved. I was sprinkled with water as a baby in Lutheran church... while growing up,I was never told about Jesus as my saviour, my family never talked about salvation, Christianity. I was not saved until about 17 years of age when I took Jesus into my heart, I believed He died for my sins and later I was babtized. Before that I lived worldly life separated from God. I got Holy Spirit babtism when I received Jesus as my saviour and I started to follow God instead of my philosophies or anybody else's. Babtism does not save you, only Jesus does and it's not a philosophy it's real and it's truth.
Jon-Marc
New Member
(israelitenation;40504)
Greetings,I find the Christian teaching of being saved interesting because it goes against the entire idea of being judged. If one is saved at baptism or at any ceremonial or ritualistic procedding then is it possible to be unsaved?and if one was saved then unsaved, was that person saved to begin with? Also further in thought if one was saved then what would that person bypass judgement? Please share your thoughts with me as I find this philosophical teaching very interesting.
Baptism doesn't save anyone; it is "by grace through faith" in the sacrifice and shed blood of Jesus Christ. God calls it a "gift" in Gal. 2:8. Do you work for a gift? Isn't a gift given freely and with no charge? Baptism is a work.NO one can be "unsaved" once he's saved. If a person is unsaved, it's because he was never saved in the first place. Jesus said in Matt. 7:23 that He will say to some, "I never knew you." That isn't "I used to know you but no longer do." It is NEVER.There is a judgment for the unsaved at the Great White Throne Judgment. I'm not sure what the purpose of that is since the end result is the same for them--eternal damnation. There is a judgment of the believers' "works" as a Christian but not our sins since they were paid for on the cross. EVERYONE's sins were paid for on the cross, but only the sins of those who have come to Christ in repentance have been forgiven. Not all are going to heaven--only those whose names are written in the Lamb's Book of Life. It has NOTHING to do with how good we are since God says that our righteousnesses are as "filthy rags" in Isa. 64:6.
Greetings,I find the Christian teaching of being saved interesting because it goes against the entire idea of being judged. If one is saved at baptism or at any ceremonial or ritualistic procedding then is it possible to be unsaved?and if one was saved then unsaved, was that person saved to begin with? Also further in thought if one was saved then what would that person bypass judgement? Please share your thoughts with me as I find this philosophical teaching very interesting.
Baptism doesn't save anyone; it is "by grace through faith" in the sacrifice and shed blood of Jesus Christ. God calls it a "gift" in Gal. 2:8. Do you work for a gift? Isn't a gift given freely and with no charge? Baptism is a work.NO one can be "unsaved" once he's saved. If a person is unsaved, it's because he was never saved in the first place. Jesus said in Matt. 7:23 that He will say to some, "I never knew you." That isn't "I used to know you but no longer do." It is NEVER.There is a judgment for the unsaved at the Great White Throne Judgment. I'm not sure what the purpose of that is since the end result is the same for them--eternal damnation. There is a judgment of the believers' "works" as a Christian but not our sins since they were paid for on the cross. EVERYONE's sins were paid for on the cross, but only the sins of those who have come to Christ in repentance have been forgiven. Not all are going to heaven--only those whose names are written in the Lamb's Book of Life. It has NOTHING to do with how good we are since God says that our righteousnesses are as "filthy rags" in Isa. 64:6.
Out of curiosity, and I don't mean to take this conversation into a tangent, what's the point of baptism? If one isn't saved through it, why do it at all?If I remember my Sunday Schooling, it was to wash away the Original Sin, but that doesn't make sense if God/Jesus forgives all your sins if you accept Him/Them into your heart.Just curious on this
Jon-Marc
New Member
(Remagoen;40859)
Out of curiosity, and I don't mean to take this conversation into a tangent, what's the point of baptism? If one isn't saved through it, why do it at all?If I remember my Sunday Schooling, it was to wash away the Original Sin, but that doesn't make sense if God/Jesus forgives all your sins if you accept Him/Them into your heart.Just curious on this
Baptism is a symbol of the death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus Christ. That is why the pastor when baptizing says as he's baptizing someone (in the Baptist church anyway) "Buried in the likeness of His death. Raised in the likeness of His resurrection." It is meant to be our first act of obedience as a new child of God and should be done as soon as possible after salvation. Jesus instituted Baptism and Communion (commonly referred to as the Lord's Supper) for believers. The communion is for the purpose of remembering His sacrifice of His body and blood for us. That is why he said, "This do ye, as oft as ye drink it, in remembrance of me."
Out of curiosity, and I don't mean to take this conversation into a tangent, what's the point of baptism? If one isn't saved through it, why do it at all?If I remember my Sunday Schooling, it was to wash away the Original Sin, but that doesn't make sense if God/Jesus forgives all your sins if you accept Him/Them into your heart.Just curious on this
Baptism is a symbol of the death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus Christ. That is why the pastor when baptizing says as he's baptizing someone (in the Baptist church anyway) "Buried in the likeness of His death. Raised in the likeness of His resurrection." It is meant to be our first act of obedience as a new child of God and should be done as soon as possible after salvation. Jesus instituted Baptism and Communion (commonly referred to as the Lord's Supper) for believers. The communion is for the purpose of remembering His sacrifice of His body and blood for us. That is why he said, "This do ye, as oft as ye drink it, in remembrance of me."
(Jon-Marc;40866)
Baptism is a symbol of the death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus Christ. That is why the pastor when baptizing says as he's baptizing someone (in the Baptist church anyway) "Buried in the likeness of His death. Raised in the likeness of His resurrection." It is meant to be our first act of obedience as a new child of God and should be done as soon as possible after salvation. Jesus instituted Baptism and Communion (commonly referred to as the Lord's Supper) for believers. The communion is for the purpose of remembering His sacrifice of His body and blood for us. That is why he said, "This do ye, as oft as ye drink it, in remembrance of me."
Thank you for the clarification, Jon-Marc. I didn't know this bit, and certainly find it interesting. I wonder if it's different from what I remember because of my Catholic upbringing. I still wonder one more thing though: Is is possible to be saved and not be baptized?
Baptism is a symbol of the death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus Christ. That is why the pastor when baptizing says as he's baptizing someone (in the Baptist church anyway) "Buried in the likeness of His death. Raised in the likeness of His resurrection." It is meant to be our first act of obedience as a new child of God and should be done as soon as possible after salvation. Jesus instituted Baptism and Communion (commonly referred to as the Lord's Supper) for believers. The communion is for the purpose of remembering His sacrifice of His body and blood for us. That is why he said, "This do ye, as oft as ye drink it, in remembrance of me."
Thank you for the clarification, Jon-Marc. I didn't know this bit, and certainly find it interesting. I wonder if it's different from what I remember because of my Catholic upbringing. I still wonder one more thing though: Is is possible to be saved and not be baptized?
forgivenWretch
New Member
Jon-Marc
New Member
Yes, one can be saved and go to heaven without baptism. Baptism is a work (although a work of obedience) and therefore cannot save anyone. Note Eph. 2:8,9: "For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast." Note "NOT of works." How much clearer can that be? How can anyone read that and then say we are saved or kept saved by works? Are they calling God a liar? I think they are. They're saying to God, "I don't think what You did is sufficient for my salvation, and I know I have to do something to earn my way into heaven. You were wrong when You said it is not of works." Even though God says that we are simply to "believe and repent", and it is recorded in in Isa. 64:6 that "all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags." Since the best that we can do is nothing but "filthy rags" in God's sight, how can we expect Him to accept filthy rags as payment for sin? The righteousness of Jesus Christ cleanses me from all sin--not my "righteousnesses" of filthy rags.
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