Two Ways of thinking about OSAS

[StanJ]

That isn't what the rule says, I suggest reading it again.

Well that's the way I read it, so I suggest maybe some clarification, which apparently you're not willing to do?

 

[OzSpen]

Actually the rules are that if someone asks you to not respond to their posts you have to comply. Of course that only means you can't quote their posts or refer to their posts, it doesn't mean you can't deal with the issue.

Stan,

The Christianity Board Rules state, 'If a member requests the cessation of all personal contact, then please respect that member's wish'. It does not state that if someone asks me not to respond to their posts I have to comply. It states that if that person 'requests the cessation of all personal contact' I have to respect that.

The person in question has not asked me to cease from all personal contact.

You seem to have misinterpreted what the rule states.

Oz

 

[StanJ]

Stan,

The Christianity Board Rules state, 'If a member requests the cessation of all personal contact, then please respect that member's wish'. It does not state that if someone asks me not to respond to their posts I have to comply. It states that if that person 'requests the cessation of all personal contact' I have to respect that.
The person in question has not asked me to cease from all personal contact.
You seem to have misinterpreted what the rule states.

So you don't think responding to your post personally, like I'm doing here, is not personal? What exactly do you think ALL personal contact means?

 

[OzSpen]

So you don't think responding to your post personally, like I'm doing here, is not personal? What exactly do you think ALL personal contact means?

Stan,

What does the rule state? ''If a member requests the cessation of all personal contact, then please respect that member's wish'.

'Requests' is the key factor, Stan. I have had no request from that person to cease ALL personal contact.

Now you should understand what Iforrest meant when he said to you, 'That isn't what the rule says, I suggest reading it again.' You still do not want to accept what the rule states.

Oz

 

[StanJ]

What does the rule state? ''If a member requests the cessation of all personal contact, then please respect that member's wish'.
'Requests' is the key factor, Stan. I have had no request from that person to cease ALL personal contact.
Now you should understand what Iforrest meant when he said to you, 'That isn't what the rule says, I suggest reading it again.' You still do not want to accept what the rule states.

You are a very confused Oz, because FHII reiterated in post 136 that he had asked you before as well as then, but as usual you strive about words just for the sake of argument and can't seem to recognize the actual issue.

 

[OzSpen]

You are a very confused Oz, because FHII reiterated in post 136 that he had asked you before as well as then, but as usual you strive about words just for the sake of argument and can't seem to recognize the actual issue.

Stan,

In #136, this person stated, 'But I am happy and approve of you deciding to bother me no more. I asked this of you a while ago and you kept on pressing.... So thanks for not participating anymore'.

That is NOT a REQUEST to cease all personal contact with the person.

Let's get back to the topic: Two Ways of thinking about OSAS

Are there only 2 ways of thinking about OSAS or more than 2 ways?

Oz

 

[lforrest]

I have sought clarification on the no personal contact rule, so lets get back on topic here.

An announcement will be made once the rule is clarified.

Thanks

 

[StanJ]

I have sought clarification on the no personal contact rule, so lets get back on topic here.

An announcement will be made once the rule is clarified.

Thanks

Thanks.

 

[StanJ]

Stan,

In #136, this person stated, 'But I am happy and approve of you deciding to bother me no more. I asked this of you a while ago and you kept on pressing.... So thanks for not participating anymore'.

That is NOT a REQUEST to cease all personal contact with the person.

Let's get back to the topic: Two Ways of thinking about OSAS

Are there only 2 ways of thinking about OSAS or more than 2 ways?

Oz

Then I guess this explains why you didn't do so... lack of comprehension.

 

[Born_Again]

Okay, here's my two cents.. if its even worth that. I DO believe you can fall away. I wont bother landblasting with a bunch of scripture. If someone isn't going to bother looking at the Greek text for proper context and just go off of their favorite translations, then they probably shouldn't argue with those who do.

Next, even though you are saved already forgiven... to continue to sin with an "oh well" attitude cant be healthy anyways. When we all face judgment, I seriously doubt God, after going over your sins, is going to say "But hey, Oh well right?" Repentance after sin, after you're are saved, is humbling and showing you acknowledge your sinful ways. We stumble, it happens. The least you can do is feel remorse for sinning against God. Instead of thinking, "Meh, I'm forgiven" I mean really, how arrogant is that? But this is just my two cents. I'm not going to argue with anyone as I am a grown adult and don't get into childish petty arguments.

 

[mjrhealth]

Meh, I'm forgiven" I mean really, how arrogant is that?

Id be more inclined to think. God has a plan for mans salvation, a plan that has no flaws in it, He even Gave His son's life for us, poured upon Him the perfect one , all of our sins, but as arrogant and proud as we are we would rather save ourselves. God forgave me, nah dont believe it, He died how many time. Once, couldnt possibly be enough. How many times do you want Him to die for you before you accept so great a gift.

 

[FHII]

Okay, here's my two cents.. if its even worth that. I DO believe you can fall away. I wont bother landblasting with a bunch of scripture. If someone isn't going to bother looking at the Greek text for proper context and just go off of their favorite translations, then they probably shouldn't argue with those who do.

Next, even though you are saved already forgiven... to continue to sin with an "oh well" attitude cant be healthy anyways. When we all face judgment, I seriously doubt God, after going over your sins, is going to say "But hey, Oh well right?" Repentance after sin, after you're are saved, is humbling and showing you acknowledge your sinful ways. We stumble, it happens. The least you can do is feel remorse for sinning against God. Instead of thinking, "Meh, I'm forgiven" I mean really, how arrogant is that? But this is just my two cents. I'm not going to argue with anyone as I am a grown adult and don't get into childish petty arguments.

1. I don't mind folks looking at the greek definitions. What i don't like is when people use it to get around what the verse says in english. I don't believe the bible or even one verse in the bible needs to be retranslated as it has already been done. Furthermore, its really not that special... Anyone with strongs can do it.

So to put it another way, more often than not people look to the greek NOT TO gain further understanding of what the verse says, but to try to refute and get around what it says.

2. If you repent for your sins, yes you may have to repent again and again. Each time you sin, you have to re-repent. That's not what I'm talking about; Im saying if you confess you are a sinner and you are forgiven for being a sinner, there is no need to ask forgiveness.

Do you really think it is arrogant to believe God has forgiven us? I don't. I see it as having faith in what God says. I'm not going to continously ask God for something he already gave. On the otherhand, I will not cease to thank him. Humbly thank him. God said he wasn't looking at the fleshly sins any longer.

Spiritual sins is another matter.

 

[StanJ]

1. I don't mind folks looking at the greek definitions. What i don't like is when people use it to get around what the verse says in english. I don't believe the bible or even one verse in the bible needs to be retranslated as it has already been done. Furthermore, its really not that special... Anyone with strongs can do it.
So to put it another way, more often than not people look to the greek NOT TO gain further understanding of what the verse says, but to try to refute and get around what it says.

That normally only happens when people miss assign a connotation to an English word. Then it is incumbent upon us to seek out what the Greek actually says in order to show it. The issue is not so much the English but how the English is being interpolated. This also happens a lot with people who quote King James out of context.

2. If you repent for your sins, yes you may have to repent again and again. Each time you sin, you have to re-repent. That's not what I'm talking about; Im saying if you confess you are a sinner and you are forgiven for being a sinner, there is no need to ask forgiveness.
Do you really think it is arrogant to believe God has forgiven us? I don't. I see it as having faith in what God says. I'm not going to continously ask God for something he already gave. On the otherhand, I will not cease to thank him. Humbly thank him. God said he wasn't looking at the fleshly sins any longer.
Spiritual sins is another matter.

I think we've pretty well established that the scripture doesn't say we have to ask for forgiveness. The scripture says we have to confess or agree with God when our actions are sin. Once we do that then they fall under their forgiveness we received at Salvation. If we don't do that then basically this sin is not agreeing with God. I'm pretty sure he wasn't implying that it's arrogant to believe that God has forgiven us because the Bible tells us he has forgiven us if we confess his son as our savior. Not quite sure why you're differentiating between carnal sin and other types of sin? Sin is Sin and it can all be forgiven except one. Blaspheming the Holy Spirit is Unforgivable.

 

[Phoneman777]

Those that do not believe in OSAS are the ones that believe they save themselves by not sinning in the flesh.

Those that believe in OSAS are the ones that believe they are saved by what Jesus did on the cross and not by their ability to not sin in the flesh.

Phil 3:3
3 For we are the circumcision, who worship God in the Spirit, rejoice in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh,
NKJV

2 Cor 11:3-5
3 But I fear, lest somehow, as the serpent deceived Eve by his craftiness, so your minds may be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ.
4 For if he who comes preaches another Jesus whom we have not preached, or if you receive a different spirit which you have not received, or a different gospel which you have not accepted — you may well put up with it!
Paul and False Apostles 5 For I consider that I am not at all inferior to the most eminent apostles.
NKJV

I don't agree with your idea that "we can't stop sinning".
As Joyce Meyer once asked, "If someone put a gun to your child's head and told you that if you indulge that sin just one more time, BAM!", could you find the strength to resist temptation then?

It's not a question of our "skill", but our "will". Instead of staying hung up on what you think you can't do, try imitating the Savior we all claim to love so much when He said, "Not My will, but THY will be done, Lord."

 

[FHII]

I don't agree with your idea that "we can't stop sinning".
As Joyce Meyer once asked, "If someone put a gun to your child's head and told you that if you indulge that sin just one more time, BAM!", could you find the strength to resist temptation then?

It's not a question of our "skill", but our "will". Instead of staying hung up on what you think you can't do, try imitating the Savior we all claim to love so much when He said, "Not My will, but THY will be done, Lord."

Do you have a battlement on your house? Are you wearing polyester or some other mixed blend of cloth? Do you give 10% of your income before taxes to your Church? Did you send Joyce an offering?

Have you looked at a woman and lusted in the last 24 hours? Ever take a pen home from work? Have you lied about any of these answers?

 

[mjrhealth]

I don't agree with your idea that "we can't stop sinning".

Oh you can, but you will have to die first.

Just show me one place where Jesus said you will stop sinning. just one.


Rom 7:14 For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.
Rom 7:15 For that which I do I allow not: for what I would, that do I not; but what I hate, that do I.
Rom 7:16 If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that it is good.
Rom 7:17 Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
Rom 7:18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not.
Rom 7:19 For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do.
Rom 7:20 Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
Rom 7:21 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.
Rom 7:22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
Rom 7:23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.
Rom 7:24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
Rom 7:25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.


or

2Co 12:7 And lest I should be exalted above measure through the abundance of the revelations, there was given to me a thorn in the flesh, the messenger of Satan to buffet me, lest I should be exalted above measure.
2Co 12:8 For this thing I besought the Lord thrice, that it might depart from me.
2Co 12:9 And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me.
2Co 12:10 Therefore I take pleasure in infirmities, in reproaches, in necessities, in persecutions, in distresses for Christ's sake: for when I am weak, then am I strong.
2Co 12:11 I am become a fool in glorying; ye have compelled me: for I ought to have been commended of you: for in nothing am I behind the very chiefest apostles, though I be nothing.

But it seems to many that grace is not sufficient...

Now I wait for the " oh it an excuse"...

 

[FHII]

It was John Calvin that said,"grace is not a license to sin". I find that hilarious because most folks that insist we are still under the law hate the guy! Shows they don't know much about Church history.

We need a license to sin like the coona$$es in Louisiana need a license to fish. If that offends you then you ain't from Louisiana. Cause they would all be saying, "that's right!".

We are going to sin with or without a license. We don't need a license to sin. We need foriveness. That's what Jesus gives. He forgives us for being sinners. Not just for our sins.

Grace is not an excuse from sins. Its forgiveness. Its overlooking our faults. It's all about one man. We are excused as sinners because of Christ.

God isn't even looking at my life. He's looking at Jesus's. And he sees Jesus saying,"he's with me!"

 

[mjrhealth]

It was John Calvin that said,"grace is not a license to sin". I find that hilarious because most folks that insist we are still under the law hate the guy! Shows they don't know much about Church history.

We need a license to sin like the coona$$es in Louisiana need a license to fish. If that offends you then you ain't from Louisiana. Cause they would all be saying, "that's right!".

We are going to sin with or without a license. We don't need a license to sin. We need foriveness. That's what Jesus gives. He forgives us for being sinners. Not just for our sins.

Grace is not an excuse from sins. Its forgiveness. Its overlooking our faults. It's all about one man. We are excused as sinners because of Christ.

God isn't even looking at my life. He's looking at Jesus's. And he sees Jesus saying,"he's with me!"

Well put Fhii,

Do they think the law changed anything,

Good people still did good, bad people still did bad, all it did was condmen the lot.

 

[Phoneman777]

Do you have a battlement on your house? Are you wearing polyester or some other mixed blend of cloth? Do you give 10% of your income before taxes to your Church? Did you send Joyce an offering?

Have you looked at a woman and lusted in the last 24 hours? Ever take a pen home from work? Have you lied about any of these answers?

FHII, you didn't respond to Joyce Meyer's question in Post #154. Could you find the strength to resist temptation if your child's life was on the line? Could you do it everyday?

The Bible says that Jesus, too, has a proverbial gun to His head. Could you find the strength to resist temptation, seeing that your sin will "crucify the Son of God afresh and put Him to an open shame"? (Hebrews 6:6 KJV)

 

[FHII]

FHII, you didn't respond to Joyce Meyer's question in Post #154. Could you find the strength to resist temptation if your child's life was on the line? Could you do it everyday?

The Bible says that Jesus, too, has a proverbial gun to His head. Could you find the strength to resist temptation, seeing that your sin will "crucify the Son of God afresh and put Him to an open shame"? (Hebrews 6:6 KJV)

Well you didn't respond to anyof my questions either. But that's ok because they were rhetorical. They actually did answer Joyce's question by exposing it as rediculous.

Besides, I don't have children so the question doesn't apply to me.

Hebrews 6:6 is not about "not sinning". Its about turning away from God and the grace he gives. Aside from Hebrews 10:26 it is the one verse most taken out of context in the Bible.