When dealing with this Cult..

[Cassandra]

He wasn't a Calvinist.
He was just a believer, who didn't agree with the Theological concept of the Trinity.
There are some of those on this forum.
If Calvin was here, he'd try to have you murdered for your "heresy".
J.Calvin was quite a guy....

-
Michael Servetus


Michael Servetus
( 29 September 1509 or 1511 – 27 October 1553) was a Spanish theologian, physician, cartographer and Renaissance humanist. He was the first European to correctly describe the function of pulmonary circulation, as discussed in Christianismi Restitutio (1553). He was a polymath versed in many sciences: mathematics, astronomy and meteorology, geography, human anatomy, medicine and pharmacology, as well as jurisprudence, translation, poetry and the scholarly study of the Bible in its original languages.

He is renowned in the history of several of these fields, particularly medicine. He participated in the Protestant Reformation, and later rejected the Trinity doctrine and mainstream Catholic Christology. After being condemned by Catholic authorities in France, he fled to Calvinist Geneva where he was denounced by Calvin and burned at the stake for heresy by order of the city's governing council.

Michael Servetus

Born Unknown, possibly 29 September 1511
Disputed, Villanueva de Sigena or Tudela, Kingdom of Navarre
Died 27 October 1553 (aged 42)
Geneva, Republic of Geneva
Alma mater University of Paris
Occupation Theologian, physician, editor, translator
Theological work
Era Renaissance
Tradition or movement Renaissance humanism
Main interests Theology, medicine
Notable ideas Nontrinitarian Christology, pulmonary circulation

"" In 1552 the Spanish Inquisition took action against Servetus, but he escaped their hands. Later, the French Inquisition declared Servetus worthy of death but had to burn him in effigy, due to his escape. In August 1553, Servetus traveled to Geneva where he was recognized and at Calvin’s request was imprisoned by the city magistrates. The trial of Michael Servetus lasted through October, at which time the Council of Geneva condemned him to death. Servetus was burned at the stake on October 27, 1553. The Calvinists and the Catholics both wanted him dead, but the Calvinists got to him first.""""

Sorry--this is just an aside. You should probably put links in your posts when you post quotes like are in the above. A lot of people are interested in following up when someone quotes something. They need to be able to see your sources.

 

[Scott Downey]

"... every branch IN ME (IN CHRIST) that beareth not fruit He (The Father) taketh away: ... If a man abide not IN ME, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned."
John 15:2
John 15:6

Does not mean they had been saved.
Referring to 'every branch in ME that does not bear fruit is taken away'

What are these fruitless branches? Who is Christ, Did not Christ make all men?
Christ is referring to Himself here as the Creator of all mankind. God Through Christ created ALL things, read Hebrews 1 and also this
John 1:1-4
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made. In Him was life, and the life was the light of men.


What does Acts 17 say with Paul preaching the word to them about this very thing about the Creator Christ?

26 And He has made from one blood every nation of men to dwell on all the face of the earth, and has determined their preappointed times and the boundaries of their dwellings, 27 so that they should seek the Lord, in the hope that they might grope for Him and find Him, though He is not far from each one of us; 28 for in Him we live and move and have our being, as also some of your own poets have said, ‘For we are also His offspring.’

29 Therefore, since we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Divine Nature is like gold or silver or stone, something shaped by art and man’s devising. 30 Truly, these times of ignorance God overlooked, but now commands all men everywhere to repent, 31 because He has appointed a day on which He will judge the world in righteousness by the Man whom He has ordained. He has given assurance of this to all by raising Him from the dead.”

 

[Scott Downey]

Galatians 5:22-23
But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control. Against such there is no law.

Since ALL Christians are born of God, the Holy Spirit indwells all Christians and they will all bear good fruit of the Spirit, This God has ordained.
Here is that same thing in Christ's words about fruit bearing and Matthew 13:23 ABSOLUTELY states this.

1. Matthew 7:15
   “Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves.
   In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
2. Matthew 7:16
   You will know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes from thornbushes or figs from thistles?
   In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
3. Matthew 7:17
   Even so, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit.
   In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
4. Matthew 7:18
   A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a bad tree bear good fruit.
   In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
5. Matthew 7:19
   Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire.
   In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
6. Matthew 7:20
   Therefore by their fruits you will know them.
   In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
7. Matthew 12:33
   A Tree Known by Its Fruit
   “Either make the tree good and its fruit good, or else make the tree bad and its fruit bad; for a tree is known by its fruit.
   In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
8. Matthew 13:23
   But he who received seed on the good ground is he who hears the word and understands it, who indeed bears fruit and produces: some a hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.”

 

[Scott Downey]

1. Matthew 7:17
   Even so, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit.
   In Context | Full Chapter | Other Translations
2. Matthew 7:18
   A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a bad tree bear good fruit.
3. Matthew 12:33
   A Tree Known by Its Fruit
   “Either make the tree good and its fruit good, or else make the tree bad and its fruit bad; for a tree is known by its fruit.

The above Christ is telling us those who are the good trees, cannot bear bad fruit. Hence no loss of salvation.
Those who say people can lose salvation are then saying the good tree turns into a bad tree, and that is impossible as God makes the tree either a good tree or a bad tree.

When your nature God changes into being the good tree, it can not then ever again bear bad fruit.
People who you thought were saved and fell away, were always the bad tree. they just were not of God, not converted, I don't care what they said or testified about. You have to believe in your heart God raised Christ from the dead, and you do not know what lurks in some other person's heart. And maybe those who fell away don't know either.

 

[Davy]

-
When you are dealing with a "predestined elect" heretic....the thing you have to realize is that they are theologically confused as well as deeply deceived.
So, that is the worst case scenario.
For example, a believer can be "fallen from Grace" , as Paul explains in Galatians.......and that means they are deceived. However, They dont really have a theology issue that is confusing them, they have a "bewitched" issue, as Paul explains that becomes their confused theology.
They are "in the flesh", as Paul explains , having no longer correct faith.....And this happens, because they become self righteous, and the term i use for them is......they've become a "self saver".
See that?
They stopped trusting in Christ to KEEP them saved, and are now trying to do it by 'SELF"...."self saving". "self effort". "works and commandment keeping"....all of this, as its all the same deception that that have....its always the same mind blindness that has become their broken faith.

Now the Predestined elect heretic, they are both mind blinded by the devil, and they are theologically confused to the max.

Reader.... here i is how you teach them......to try to help them.... You first have to understand their theological confusion, and its very simple..

They do not understand what the "conformed".. is literally talking about, when they read...>"predestined to be conformed"...
This confusion....is the entire cause of their theological and mental breakdown...... See, they do not understand that the "predestination", has a resolve...a resolution.........Its : "to be conformed".
So, that is where they lost the track and came apart theologically and never went back.

Let me show you how to help them..

You teach them that to be born again, starts a process, that has a final ending, destination, and : "conforming".
This process is pre-determined to happen to every born again person., just as God created it to happen.
See, God created Salvation as a process that has a beginning and a final result.
This process of "born again", and becoming a "new creation", is designed to end a believer up ....here....= "conformed into the image of Christ".
See that?
That is what is "predestined"... Its that all believers, (elect) born again, are predestined to end up...= "conformed into the image of Christ".

See Reader, what is pre-determined is what the process is going to resolve into ....... that is the "pre-destination".

So, what God did, is create a spiritual process, that is Salvation, that has a completed ending that is PRE-DETERMINED to happen to every Born again person.
This process that starts with the new birth, ends with the "conforming into the Image of Jesus"....and that is what is "pre-destined"., and this simple theology is completely twisted and subverted by heretics who belong to the Hyper Calvinist "pre-destined elect" cult.
These deceived people even teach that God created Evil, as if the Devil does not even exist.

Beware of them Believers.... as if they brainwash you, its almost impossible to escape their cult .

That's one of the most round-about ways of promoting the false 'once saved always saved' doctrine of men that I've ever heard!

There are so many New Testament warnings by Christ and His Apostles against the believer falling away to instead walk by their flesh that folks like you would have to omit about 1/3 of their New Testament to keep the above doctrine.

And 'trying'... to associate keeping Christ's commandments as some kind of unbelieving Jewish walk is also inexcusable. No, the CULT isn't about a predestined elect by Christ from the foundation of the world, which was a doctrine Apostles Paul and Peter preached, the CULT is of folks with false doctrines like YOU propose.

 

[GEN2REV]

Does not mean they had been saved.
Referring to 'every branch in ME that does not bear fruit is taken away'

What are these fruitless branches? Who is Christ, Did not Christ make all men?
Christ is referring to Himself here as the Creator of all mankind. God Through Christ created ALL things, read Hebrews 1 and also this
John 1:1-4
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made. In Him was life, and the life was the light of men.


What does Acts 17 say with Paul preaching the word to them about this very thing about the Creator Christ?

26 And He has made from one blood every nation of men to dwell on all the face of the earth, and has determined their preappointed times and the boundaries of their dwellings, 27 so that they should seek the Lord, in the hope that they might grope for Him and find Him, though He is not far from each one of us; 28 for in Him we live and move and have our being, as also some of your own poets have said, ‘For we are also His offspring.’

29 Therefore, since we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Divine Nature is like gold or silver or stone, something shaped by art and man’s devising. 30 Truly, these times of ignorance God overlooked, but now commands all men everywhere to repent, 31 because He has appointed a day on which He will judge the world in righteousness by the Man whom He has ordained. He has given assurance of this to all by raising Him from the dead.”

So you agree that God created evil.

The reason your entire explanation is moot is that the verse prior to John 15:2 states that there are two vines. A True Vine, that of Jesus Christ, and a False Vine, that of the devil. This echoes the Wheat and Tares doctrine of Matthew 13 (as well as the event in Genesis 3:15).

Therefore, Jesus' Vine is NOT all mankind. It is ONLY those who are saved.

 

[Scott Downey]

That's one of the most round-about ways of promoting the false 'once saved always saved' doctrine of men that I've ever heard!

There are so many New Testament warnings by Christ and His Apostles against the believer falling away to instead walk by their flesh that folks like you would have to omit about 1/3 of their New Testament to keep the above doctrine.

Not what it says. Jesus tells us why his disciple leave off following Him.
The ones who leave were not granted by God to come to Christ and believe in Christ, plain and simple.
Read it in John 6

As a Christian, none knows regarding any other Christian person if they are truly elect and ultimately saved. Which is why all the various warnings to continue to believe to be saved, applies only to the elect believers, not the temporary non elect.
No person is going to tell someone else they are not elect to be saved, not any apostles ever did that, so they warned the church to continue in faith to be saved, only the elect will.

Like Hebrews 3 and 4 says, you wont read scripture of the saved being tossed into hellfire.

5 And Moses indeed was faithful in all His house as a servant, for a testimony of those things which would be spoken afterward, 6 but Christ as a Son over His own house, whose house we are if we hold fast the confidence and the rejoicing of the hope firm to the end.

Hebrews 4, those who are not elect wont continue in the faith, they will depart from Christ as they are not of the sheep. Only the sheep of Christ continue with Christ.
Of course the apostles had the continual care and burden of all the churches on them and were greived when people fell away. Paul wished himself cursed for the sake of his fellow Jews if they could only be saved, but it does not work like that does it.
Hebrews 4
New King James Version
The Promise of Rest
1 Therefore, since a promise remains of entering His rest, let us fear lest any of you seem to have come short of it.
2 For indeed the gospel was preached to us as well as to them; but the word which they heard did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in those who heard it. 3 For we who have believed do enter that rest, as He has said:

“So I swore in My wrath,
‘They shall not enter My rest,’ ”

although the works were finished from the foundation of the world. 4 For He has spoken in a certain place of the seventh day in this way: “And God rested on the seventh day from all His works”; 5 and again in this place: “They shall not enter My rest.”

6 Since therefore it remains that some must enter it, and those to whom it was first preached did not enter because of disobedience, 7 again He designates a certain day, saying in David, “Today,” after such a long time, as it has been said:

“Today, if you will hear His voice,
Do not harden your hearts.”

8 For if Joshua had given them rest, then He would not afterward have spoken of another day. 9 There remains therefore a rest for the people of God. 10 For he who has entered His rest has himself also ceased from his works as God did from His.

 

[Taken]

A heretic, as defined by Paul, in Galatians, is an enemy of the Cross.
Jude defines them as "committing the error of Cain".

So, its a specific heresy, that defines them all.

They are all defined by :

1. they believe they can lose their salvation
2. they teach a works based, law keeping, commandment keeping, water baptism,.. "false gospel" = that defies the Gift of God's Grace, and opposes the Cross of Christ and the Blood of Jesus..

A heretic does not believe that Jesus keeps them saved.
They believe that THEY keep themselves saved by : self effort, and they will give your their list of "do's and don't do's" that they TEACH and BELIEVE keeps them saved if they do it, or dont do it.....otherwise they lose their salvation, is what all heretics BELIEVE.

That's a "Heretic", according to Paul.

OK. Number 1. I would clarify...
“ they believe they can lose RECEIVED salvation”.
^ Not possible.

 

[Davy]

Not what it says. Jesus tells us why his disciple leave off following Him.
The ones who leave were not granted by God to come to Christ and believe in Christ, plain and simple.
Read it in John 6
....

You should instead read and heed this...

Luke 8:12-14
12 Those by the way side are they that hear; then cometh the devil, and taketh away the word out of their hearts, lest they should believe and be saved.

13 They on the rock are they, which, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, which for a while believe, and in time of temptation fall away.

14 And that which fell among thorns are they, which, when they have heard, go forth, and are choked with cares and riches and pleasures of this life, and bring no fruit to perfection.
KJV

Three categories of those who at first believe, but then fall away:

1. they allow the devil to take away God's Word out of their hearts. This is one of the purposes for the many doctrines of men, made to appear sound and correct, but full of hidden darkness. For the last days, the worse falling away will be the bowing in ignorance to the coming pseudo-Christ, a spurious Messiah in Jerusalem.

2. temptations become too much for them, so their spiritual weakness causes them to fall away out of fear. These simply don't want to bear the persecutions of this world under Satan's control, which requires one to be of strong Faith to overcome this world thru Christ.

3. the cares and pleasures of this world overcome their faith. These believe, but then deem riches and pleasures as more desirable than being a servant of Christ, so these fall away to those riches and comforts of this world, instead of realizing that the comforts of this world are only temporary.

 

[Behold]

".If a man abide not IN ME, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned."
"... I am The Lord, and there is none else. I form the light and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I The Lord do all these things."
Isaiah 45:6-7

Every person who is a believer, is "In Christ", so, this is to be Spiritually "One with God".
That is how you abide...>its by being Born again.
A believer always "abides in Christ' as they are born again into the Spirit of God by the Holy Spirit.
The unbelievers, do not abide in Christ, as they are not born again, "in Christ", and "One with God".
They will indeed hit the Lake of Fire, head first.

Your 2nd verse, the "evil..... = " you are using a very poor translation.
Its probably why you are using it.
If you look at better translations, you'll find the word translated as woe, calamity, hardship, .....and that has a context.
Its when God is dealing with the Wicked.
The Born again are not the wicked... The born again are the Sons/Daughters of Christ and God is now their FATHER.
So, in your verse, God is not relating what He causes, to his Children.

You can read the Genesis Account of the burning of the homosexuals and the sexually perverse, or the drowning of them in the Flood as what God is referring to, in your verse.
He does not commit such JUDGING against His Redeemed by the Blood of Jesus The Christ.

The Born again, exist in the Grace of God, not in the Judgment of God as your verse is referring to.. as "evil".

Your verse is listing these..... John 3:36

 

[GEN2REV]

Every person who is a believer, is "In Christ", so, this is to be Spiritually "One with God".
That is how you abide...>its by being Born again.
A believer always "abides in Christ' as they are born again into the Spirit of God by the Holy Spirit.
The unbelievers, do not abide in Christ, as they are not born again, "in Christ", and "One with God".
They will indeed hit the Lake of Fire, head first.

Your 2nd verse, the "evil..... = " you are using a very poor translation.
Its probably why you are using it.
If you look at better translations, you'll find the word translated as woe, calamity, hardship, .....and that has a context.
Its when God is dealing with the Wicked.
The Born again are not the wicked... The born again are the Sons/Daughters of Christ and God is now their FATHER.
So, in your verse, God is not relating what He causes, to his Children.

You can read the Genesis Account of the burning of the homosexuals and the sexually perverse, or the drowning of them in the Flood as what God is referring to, in your verse.
He does not commit such JUDGING against His Redeemed by the Blood of Jesus The Christ.

The Born again, exist in the Grace of God, not in the Judgment of God as your verse is referring to.. as "evil".

Your verse is listing these..... John 3:36

I just go by what God's Word says. That's what I presented to you from the KJV.

Regardless of all the hype against the KJV, it is the most accepted translation among those who study scripture.

Your translations are altered and corrupted. That's why you have chosen them.

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

-
When you are dealing with a "predestined elect" heretic....the thing you have to realize is that they are theologically confused as well as deeply deceived.
So, that is the worst case scenario.
For example, a believer can be "fallen from Grace" , as Paul explains in Galatians.......and that means they are deceived. However, They dont really have a theology issue that is confusing them, they have a "bewitched" issue, as Paul explains that becomes their confused theology.
They are "in the flesh", as Paul explains , having no longer correct faith.....And this happens, because they become self righteous, and the term i use for them is......they've become a "self saver".
See that?
They stopped trusting in Christ to KEEP them saved, and are now trying to do it by 'SELF"...."self saving". "self effort". "works and commandment keeping"....all of this, as its all the same deception that that have....its always the same mind blindness that has become their broken faith.

Now the Predestined elect heretic, they are both mind blinded by the devil, and they are theologically confused to the max.

Reader.... here i is how you teach them......to try to help them.... You first have to understand their theological confusion, and its very simple..

They do not understand what the "conformed".. is literally talking about, when they read...>"predestined to be conformed"...
This confusion....is the entire cause of their theological and mental breakdown...... See, they do not understand that the "predestination", has a resolve...a resolution.........Its : "to be conformed".
So, that is where they lost the track and came apart theologically and never went back.

Let me show you how to help them..

You teach them that to be born again, starts a process, that has a final ending, destination, and : "conforming".
This process is pre-determined to happen to every born again person., just as God created it to happen.
See, God created Salvation as a process that has a beginning and a final result.
This process of "born again", and becoming a "new creation", is designed to end a believer up ....here....= "conformed into the image of Christ".
See that?
That is what is "predestined"... Its that all believers, (elect) born again, are predestined to end up...= "conformed into the image of Christ".

See Reader, what is pre-determined is what the process is going to resolve into ....... that is the "pre-destination".

So, what God did, is create a spiritual process, that is Salvation, that has a completed ending that is PRE-DETERMINED to happen to every Born again person.
This process that starts with the new birth, ends with the "conforming into the Image of Jesus"....and that is what is "pre-destined"., and this simple theology is completely twisted and subverted by heretics who belong to the Hyper Calvinist "pre-destined elect" cult.
These deceived people even teach that God created Evil, as if the Devil does not even exist.

Beware of them Believers.... as if they brainwash you, its almost impossible to escape their cult .

DUH

 

[Lifelong_sinner]

You should instead read and heed this...

Luke 8:12-14
12 Those by the way side are they that hear; then cometh the devil, and taketh away the word out of their hearts, lest they should believe and be saved.

13 They on the rock are they, which, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, which for a while believe, and in time of temptation fall away.

14 And that which fell among thorns are they, which, when they have heard, go forth, and are choked with cares and riches and pleasures of this life, and bring no fruit to perfection.
KJV

Three categories of those who at first believe, but then fall away:

1. they allow the devil to take away God's Word out of their hearts. This is one of the purposes for the many doctrines of men, made to appear sound and correct, but full of hidden darkness. For the last days, the worse falling away will be the bowing in ignorance to the coming pseudo-Christ, a spurious Messiah in Jerusalem.

2. temptations become too much for them, so their spiritual weakness causes them to fall away out of fear. These simply don't want to bear the persecutions of this world under Satan's control, which requires one to be of strong Faith to overcome this world thru Christ.

3. the cares and pleasures of this world overcome their faith. These believe, but then deem riches and pleasures as more desirable than being a servant of Christ, so these fall away to those riches and comforts of this world, instead of realizing that the comforts of this world are only temporary.

so i assume you’re one of those who think judas was saved at one point??

 

[Scott Downey]

You should instead read and heed this...

Luke 8:12-14
12 Those by the way side are they that hear; then cometh the devil, and taketh away the word out of their hearts, lest they should believe and be saved.

13 They on the rock are they, which, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, which for a while believe, and in time of temptation fall away.

14 And that which fell among thorns are they, which, when they have heard, go forth, and are choked with cares and riches and pleasures of this life, and bring no fruit to perfection.
KJV

Three categories of those who at first believe, but then fall away:

1. they allow the devil to take away God's Word out of their hearts. This is one of the purposes for the many doctrines of men, made to appear sound and correct, but full of hidden darkness. For the last days, the worse falling away will be the bowing in ignorance to the coming pseudo-Christ, a spurious Messiah in Jerusalem.

2. temptations become too much for them, so their spiritual weakness causes them to fall away out of fear. These simply don't want to bear the persecutions of this world under Satan's control, which requires one to be of strong Faith to overcome this world thru Christ.

3. the cares and pleasures of this world overcome their faith. These believe, but then deem riches and pleasures as more desirable than being a servant of Christ, so these fall away to those riches and comforts of this world, instead of realizing that the comforts of this world are only temporary.

Not a single one of those first 3 were saved, none were born of God, emotions only.
The second group believed for a short time and fell away, never were they saved,
Says they have no ROOT
Christ was not their ROOT, they were not born again, get it! They did not believe with a saving faith, they were like Christ's disciples who departed from Christ in John 6
13 But the ones on the rock are those who, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, who believe for a while and in time of temptation fall away.

the 3rd bore no fruit to maturity, so the fruit was bad fruit. They must still be the bad tree, they might have even loved their life in this world, they seemed to care a great deal about their life in this world, not a good sign.

The only ones saved were of the last group. they were the ones who bore the good fruit.
Which also then proves to all at the judgement they were saved.

Matthew 12
A Tree Known by Its Fruit
33 “Either make the tree good and its fruit good, or else make the tree bad and its fruit bad; for a tree is known by its fruit. 34 Brood of vipers! How can you, being evil, speak good things? For out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks. 35 A good man out of the good treasure of his heart brings forth good things, and an evil man out of the evil treasure brings forth evil things. 36 But I say to you that for every idle word men may speak, they will give account of it in the day of judgment. 37 For by your words you will be justified, and by your words you will be condemned.”

I dont think you believe what Christ says here about making tree to be either a good tree or a bad tree, and it is Christ who makes the tree whatever it will be

 

[Behold]

---

I just go by what God's Word says. That's what I presented to you from the KJV.

.

You posted this, according to your link.

Isaiah 45:6-7
English: American Standard Version

 

[Behold]

so i assume you’re one of those who think judas was saved at one point??

Judas was a little different.

Jesus said...>"and one of you is a Devil", and He should know.

So, That is not the usual suspect.

Judas admitted that he had betrayed "innocent blood" and tried to undo the deed.

We know that Peter denied Jesus before the Cross and Judas betrayed Jesus which led Christ to the Jewish court that sent him up.

Is the Blood of Jesus available to Judas?
Well, He died before Christ shed His blood and died for Judas and you, and me.

WE know that God as Christ came to die for the sin of the world..., and so, the principal players played their role in this end result.

 

[Desire Of All Nations]

Not at all.
My true "intent" is to shine a light on the devil's deception, in all forms.
If this light finds you, then it does.

Listen, if a person is a heretic, ..then that isn't an insult, that is just a fact.
Its a fact that there are heretics.
Paul classified them long before i was born.
Jude talks about them, quite a bit.
So, its not anything new.........as heretics were here, when Paul was here.
They accused Him of preaching "OSAS"< exactly like they do today, but in the last 2000 yrs, they have remodeled the term a few times..
"greasy grace"..."license to sin"...>" cheap grace"...
But its all the same devil trying to get people to not understand that God's Son died FREELY for their sin, and offers them "the gift of righteousness" as a Gift.
Its "the Gift of Salvation".
And even in Paul's day, you had heretics (Legalists) who were trying to add to the Grace of God, their lawkeeping and their commandment keeping and water baptism, as a NECESSARY PART of God's Redemption.. .. and Paul defined them as preaching "another Gospel", and said they are cursed of God for doing it.. Galatians 1:8


Listen, God made Salvation based on Christ on the CROSS, ONLY>....John 14:6.... and the Devil and his people try to get you up there on it, with commandment keeping, works, enduring to the end, law keeping, and lifestyle..

The Cross is the final proof that = ONLY Jesus SAVES and ONLY Jesus keeps you saved.

This is the "blood Atonement' ..

The stunning irony in this entire post is that it shows you are clearly no more in a position to educate anybody about what the Bible teaches than the average atheist. Romans teaches that Jesus is the only human being who has truly been born again so far, and Jesus Himself stated in no uncertain terms that a person had better keep the 10 commandments if they expect to receive eternal life in Matt. 19:17.

On top of all that, Jesus Himself also said in Matt. 5:17 that NO ONE was to even think that He came with the intention to abolish the Law's authority. Isa. 42:21 even says the Messiah would not only uphold the Law's authority, but elevate it. So either Jesus was a liar, or you are a liar. And since Jesus can be seen reinforcing and elevating the authority of the Law throughout His earthly ministry as Moses and Isaiah said He would, the only conclusion to reach is that you are the liar.

You have absolutely no idea what salvation is, how it is supposed to be acquired, what it means to truly be "born again", or even what Jesus accomplished on the cross while you talk so confidently about all of those things. Why should anyone who truly studies the Bible take you seriously when you accuse the true followers of God as being "legalists" or satanic agents because they know grace and law do not oppose each other?

This post of yours' personifies what Paul said when he spoke to Timothy about people who desire to be teachers of the Law while having no idea what they're talking about. Jesus' sacrifice did not replace the obligation to live by the Law, as Paul clearly taught in Rom. 3, 6, and 7. Nowhere in Christ's ministry did He ever state as an absolute fact that such was the case. The fact that John was inspired to clearly define sin as violating God's commandments in 1 Jhn 3:4 ought to tell any rational person that since the Bible defines sin in the NT as violating God's commandments, the inherent implication is that God's people are supposed to keep them.

It's truly stunning how antinomians can look around them and see that this present evil world is what it is because it rejects any notion of keeping God's commandments, and yet it still doesn't stop them from arguing that whoever keeps them is adhering to a false gospel. It's mind-boggling how such people can do this even while they talk about abortion being a violation of God's commandments. The argument that God's commandments are abolished is literally the same as arguing that He stopped being just, holy, or even alive. With reasoning like this, it's no surprise why Rev. 12:9 says this world and its religions are deceived by Satan.

 

[Oceanprayers]

Lord.
Name calling threads, using the bible as a cover .

 

[Behold]

The stunning irony in this entire post is that it shows you are clearly no more in a position to educate anybody about what the Bible teaches

That you value your opinion, as if its actually truth, is the irony found in your next post to me, and the following one also.

You are typical.
You have your commentaries, and you have your denomination, and you have your opinion.
When these are shown to be in error, then you only have what is left for people like you.
You take it to the personal level which is the home base of all who are deceived or worse.

 

[Scott Downey]

Judas was a little different.

Jesus said...>"and one of you is a Devil", and He should know.

So, That is not the usual suspect.

Judas admitted that he had betrayed "innocent blood" and tried to undo the deed.

We know that Peter denied Jesus before the Cross and Judas betrayed Jesus which led Christ to the Jewish court that sent him up.

Is the Blood of Jesus available to Judas?
Well, He died before Christ shed His blood and died for Judas and you, and me.

WE know that God as Christ came to die for the sin of the world..., and so, the principal players played their role in this end result.

Judas was a devil, which means Jesus says he was of the wicked one, Satan, and devils don't get saved.
Judas was foreordained to be the betrayer.
True the Blood of Christ had not yet been shed.
At the last Supper, Judas left during the last supper, and did not drink the cup of the new covenant established in His blood.
Jesus does give Judas a piece of bread. After which Judas leaves them.
Then all the teaching in John from John 13 onwards to John 18, Judas was not there to receive any of that doctrine.
So the prayers Christ spoke in John 17 regarding his disciples, Judas was disqualified from all of that.

Judas, bread shared, no blood shared
John 13
18 “I do not speak concerning all of you. I know whom I have chosen; but that the Scripture may be fulfilled, ‘He who eats bread with Me has lifted up his heel against Me.