Jesus stated that is the work of the Holy Spirit, to make and reveal the scriptures to us, as He inspired them!
Why I read/study God's Word: The Authorized Version
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Precious friend, so the original languages/manuscripts Only, are Inspired Correct?
Does that mean then that those original copies are THE ONLY ONES that can
be trusted, and Obeyed? If so, where do we find them, since they are long gone?
That would then mean This Is not true, Correct?:
"ALL Scripture is given by Inspiration of God, and is Profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works. (2Ti_3:16-17)
IF God did not PRESERVE "HIS Inspired Scriptures" FOR me, in my own
[English] language, (and ALL foreigners, in THEIR OWN languages), then:
we DO NOT have "What Is Profitable," for our salvation and good works,
Correct?
What are we supposed to do now???
GRACE And Peace...
you got heap much explanation to do here!
Christ is a sinner?
A good tree!
Matthew 7:18
A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.
The fruit of the tree of Mary is our salvation! Matt 1:21 Lk 2:30 Jesus is our salvation! This reflects the immaculate conception of Mary and the miraculous conception of Jesus!
Lk 1:30 Mary found our salvation!
Lk 1:38 consented to our salvation!
A good tree (immaculate conception) Lk 1:49 God has done this and it is marvelous in our eyes!
Isa 7:14 Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel.
Matt 1:23 Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.
A sinner would be an evil tree with evil fruit, but the fruit of Mary is salvation!
Mary brings in the good fruits of our redemption and salvation!
Only a queen can bear a king!
there are two ways to save
To forgive sin and to preserve from sin
Pull a man out of a pit and you saved him
Prevent him falling into the pit and you saved him
Mary was preserved from sin!
Ineffabilis Deus
The Immaculate Conception
Pope BI. Pius IX - 1854
“We declare, pronounce, and define that the doctrine which holds that the most Blessed Virgin Mary, in the first instance of her conception, by a singular grace and privilege granted by Almighty God, in view of the merits of Jesus Christ, the Savior of the human race, was preserved free from all stain of original sin, is a doctrine revealed by God and therefore to be believed firmly and constantly by all the faithful.”
Gen 3:15 I will put enmities between thee and the woman, and thy seed and her seed: she shall crush thy head, and thou shalt lie in wait for her heel.
(Enmities total war, none of satan’s works found in Her immaculate purity)
Lk 1:28 And the angel came in unto her, and said, Hail, Mary full of Grace, the Lord is with thee: blessed art thou among women.
(Immaculate purity, full of grace, blessed)
Lk 1:35 And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God.
(Mary must have immaculate purity)
Lk 1:47 And my spirit hath rejoiced in God my Saviour. (Preserved from all sin in virtue of the merits of the blood of the savior who is Her son)
Lk 1:49 For he that is mighty hath done to me great things; and holy is his name.
(Immaculate conception of Mary and the miraculous conception of Jesus)
Song of Solomon 4:1 Behold, thou art fair, my love; behold, thou art fair; thou hast doves' eyes within thy locks: thy hair is as a flock of goats, that appear from mount Gilead.
Rev 12:1 a woman clothed with the sun.
(Immaculate purity)
Two ways of being savior, forgive sins: and to preserve us from sin:
Mary was preserved by God from sin!
b
Mary & Eve!
Eve was of the First creation: carnal
Mary of the New creation: spiritual
Eve the cos of Sin and curse disobeyed God! Gen 3:12
Mary cos of salvation, Lk 1:30 & consented to our salvation Lk 1:38 obeyed God & found our salvation Lk 1:30
Eve mourned:
Mary rejoiced: Lk 1:46
Eve gave birth to the all sinners: mother of all the living. Gen 3:20
Mary to the savior of all men: mother of all living in Christ. Jn 19:26-27 rev 12:17
Mary the mother of God! Lk 1:43
Eve brought punishment: gen 3:16
Mary salvation: Lk 1:30 & 38 Lk 2:30
Eve source of sin: gen 3:16
Mary source of grace: Lk 1:30 & 38
Eve brought death: gen 3:19
Mary life: Jn 1:16-17 & Jn 10:10
Eve only wounds & suffering: gen 3:19
Mary healing:
Eve infidelity: gen 3:6
Mary faithfulness: Lk 1:45
Eve offended the Lord: gen 3:6-7
Mary’s soul (being) doth magnify the Lord: Lk 1:46
Eve cursed: gen 3:17-19
Mary blessed: Lk 1:28
Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with thee, blessed art thou among women!
Lk 1:28
Sirach 24
Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition
24 I am the mother of fair love, and of fear, and of knowledge, and of holy hope.
25 In me is all grace of the way and of the truth, in me is all hope of life and of virtue.
26 Come over to me, all ye that desire me, and be filled with my fruits.
27 For my spirit is sweet above honey, and my inheritance above honey and the honeycomb.
28 My memory is unto everlasting generations.
(I know this scripture is deleted by the tradition of men in the KJV)
The Dove, & rainbow signs of peace are types of Mary mother of our salvation who obtained peace for all men!
Song of Solomon 1:2
Smelling sweet of the best ointments. Thy name is as oil poured out: therefore young maidens have loved thee.
Oil heals and fuels the flame, and is the fruit of the olive (peace) so the name of Mary is our peace, and healing, and fire of divine love!
Proverbs 8:35
He that shall find me, shall find life, and shall have salvation from the Lord:
And hundreds more, you will find in the excellent book by Saint Alphonse Lugosi the glories of Mary!
Lk 1:45 all generations shall call me blessed!
Actually this is an exultation of thanksgiving for having obtain thier eternal salvation!
Mary and all the saints grace, virtues, and merits are from God’s infinite goodness mercy and love and they end in the God glory!
Mary is what God made Her! Lk 1:49
Not according to nature but grace!
Mary and all the saints received grace, virtues, and merits from God’s infinite goodness mercy and love and they end in the God glory!
All praise of Mary is praise of the mighty works of God!
Proving Mary most holy, ever virgin mother of God & mother of our salvation is not a sinner!
Lk 1:28 Hail, Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with thee, blessed art thou among women.
How can God fill a sinner with grace, and remain a sinner?
Hail Mary full of grace!
How can the Lord be with sinner?
The lord is with thee!
How can sinner be blessed!
Blessed art thou, and all generations shall call me blessed!
Lk 1: 43 And whence is this to me, that the mother of my Lord should come to me?
How can a sinner be the mother of God?
Lk 1: 45 And blessed is she that believed: for there shall be a performance of those things which were told her from the Lord.
How could sinner be faithful?
Lk 1: 46 And Mary said, My soul doth magnify the Lord,
How could a sinner magnify the Lord?
Lk 1:48 For he hath regarded the low estate of his handmaiden: for, behold, from henceforth all generations shall call me blessed.
How could sinner be humble?
Lk 1:49 For he that is mighty hath done to me great things; and holy is his name.
How could sinner be the immaculate conception and the have the Holy Spirit accomplish the Miraculous conception of Jesus in Her?
Matt 1:21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name Jesus: for he shall save his people from their sins.
22 Now all this was done, that it might be fulfilled which was spoken of the Lord by the prophet, saying,
23 Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.
How could sinner be a perpetual Virgin bringing forth the savior of the world?
Jn 19:27 Then saith he to the disciple, Behold thy mother! And from that hour that disciple took her unto his own home.
How could sinner be our spiritual mother?
Lk 2:30 I have seen my salvation!
How could a sinner be the mother of our salvation?
Good enough for Angels!
Good enough for the Bible!
Good enough for me!
Hail Mary! Full of grace, the Lord is with thee, blessed art thou among women,
Lk 1:28 blessed is the fruit of thy womb, (Jesus) Lk 1:42 Holy Mary, mother of God, Lk 1:43 pray for us sinners, now,
rev 5:8 and at the hour of our death, Matt 24:13 amen!
It is really God who greeting Mary with the “Hail Mary”!
Lk 1:26 & Lk 1:45
translations are not inspired
translations are not authorized unless it by the church with the authority of Christ
Jesus Christ continues HIS ministry in His new covenant church thru Peter, the apostles, and their successors with the same mission, power, and authority!
Mt 16:18 Mt 28:19 Acts 1:17 acts 8:31 & 35 Lk 10:16 Jn 8:32 Jn 13:20 Jn 15:5 Jn 16:13 Jn 20:21-22 eph 2:20
What authority does Christ have?
What power does Christ have?
What mission / ministry does Christ have?
Peter, the apostles and their successors have the same authority, power, and mission! Jn 20:21 as my father sent me, even so send I you!
John 17:18
As thou hast sent me into the world, even so have I also sent them into the world.
The apostles are Christ’s successors!
They have authority to send others as well, apostle means one who is sent!
Therefore the apostles have authority to send more apostles or successors!
Apostolic succession!
The nations still need to be taught, disciples still need to be baptized and the church the new covenant kingdom of christ still needs to be governed!
Hebrews 3:1
Wherefore, holy brethren, partakers of the heavenly calling, consider the Apostle and High Priest of our profession, Christ Jesus;
Christ is an apostle, and has authority to send other apostles, the apostles also have this authority, so the apostles continue down thru the centuries as Christ promised! Matt 28:19-20
Keys of authority! And power to bind and loose! Matt 16:18 and Matt 18:18 matt 28:19 Isa 22:21-22
Moral authority:
(Teaching)
Necessity of being taught by Christ:
Two edge sword: defining truth and condemning errors, and Interpreting scripture.
Jurisdictional authority:
(Governing / administering)
Necessity of Peter and the apostles and their successors to govern the holy church.
Spiritual authority:
(Life of Grace)
Sanctifying thru the mass and Sacraments
The apostles teaching is Christ’s teaching, Christ and His church are one! Acts 9:4
Christian rule of faith is not the Bible alone! But the doctrine of the apostles! Acts 2:42
Jesus Christ continues HIS ministry in His new covenant church thru Peter, the apostles, and their successors with the same mission, power, and authority!
Mt 16:18 Mt 28:19 Acts 1:17 acts 8:31 & 35 Lk 10:16 Jn 8:32 Jn 13:20 Jn 15:5 Jn 16:13 Jn 20:21-22 eph 2:20
Lk 10:16
He who hears you hears me...
John 13:20
Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that receiveth whomsoever I send receiveth me; and he that receiveth me receiveth him that sent me.
Only the church has authority from Christ to define the truth and teach!
Matt 16:18 matt 18:18 matt 28:19 Jn 20:21-23 Jn 8:32 Jn 16:13
The teaching of Peter and the apostles and successors is the teaching of Christ!
Successors of Jesus Christ!
Jesus already prepares His apostles to continue His mission with His power (binding and loosing) and with His authority (keys) matt 16:18 matt 18:18
Same mission, power, and authority Jn 20:21-23
John 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
John 3:22 After these things came Jesus and his disciples into the land of Judaea; and there he tarried with them, and baptized.
John 4:1 when therefore the Lord knew how the Pharisees had heard that Jesus made and baptized more disciples than John...
Jn 4:2 Though Jesus himself baptized not, but his disciples
Here we see Jesus delegating to His successors, Peter and the apostles!
Jn 15:5 apart from me you can do nothing
There can be no unity of the spirit without obedience to the faith! Rom 1:5 eph 4:3
Matt 28 I am with you (the apostles)
The papacy based on Matt 16:18 and Isa 22:21-22
Matt 16:18-19
18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.
19 And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.
Isa 22:21-22
21 And I will clothe him with thy robe, and strengthen him with thy girdle, and I will commit thy government into his hand: and he shall be a father to the inhabitants of Jerusalem, and to the house of Judah.
22 And the key of the house of David will I lay upon his shoulder; so he shall open, and none shall shut; and he shall shut, and none shall open.
Behold I am with you (the successors or the apostles until the end of the world,so the successors of the apostles must remain until the end of the world) matt 28:19
(None of the so called reformers were apostles) (no man has authority to start a church)
Successors of Moses!
Matt 23 why does Jesus say to obey the successors of Moses?
The successors of Moses sit in the chair of Moses having the authority of the keys and the power to bind and loose Matt 23 and Jesus commanded them to be obeyed! Then the kingdom was taken from them matt 21:43 and given to Peter, Matt 16:18 the apostles, Matt 18:18 and their successors with the authority of the keys and the power to bind and lose!
Jesus said to obey the authority of the successors of Moses mt 23 authority of the keys and power to bind and loose and this power and authority was taken from them matt and given by Christ to Peter, the apostles and their successors, mt 16:18 18:18 this same authority and power must be obeyed!
mt 28:18-20 all authority is given to Peter, the apostles, and their successors requiring obedience, rom 1:5 obedience to the faith!
And Jesus say to Peter, the apostles, and their successors: behold I am with you even until the end of the world!!!
So the apostles have to remain until the end! Revelation 5:10
And hast made us unto our God kings and Priests: and we shall reign on the earth. Reign with kingdom authority (keys) power (bind loose) matt 16:18
The successors of Peter and the apostles have a valid jurisdictional authority (keys) and power (bind and loose) by Jesus Christ!
Lk 10:16
He who hears you hears me...
John 13:20
Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that receiveth whomsoever I send receiveth me; and he that receiveth me receiveth him that sent me.
apostolic succession!
explicit and implicit in scripture
Judas was an apostle
Acts 1:17 For he was numbered with us, and had obtained part of this ministry.
acts 1:20 For it is written in the book of Psalms, Let his habitation be desolate, and let no man dwell therein: and his bishoprick let another take.
Matthias succeeded him as apostle
acts 1: 26 And they gave forth their lots; and the lot fell upon Matthias; and he was numbered with the eleven apostles.
now if it applies to judas how much more to Peter and the other apostles
Matt 28:19-20
Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen.
Jesus is with His church and His apostles until the end! So the apostles must remain until the end governing the church administering the kingdom
Mt 16:18 Peter received the keys of the kingdom: (jurisdictional authority of the universal church) and the power to bind and loose:
Lk 22:32
Jesus prays for Peter:
Jn 21:17
Peter commanded to Feed my sheep:
Isa 22 21-22 prime minister called father!
Holding the keys of the kingdom under the king Lk 1:32-33 in the line of david!
Matt 16:18
—————————-
Grace and law!
The great error of faith alone is that you believe you are saved and under grace and that you ARE NOT subject to the Mosaic law, (and that’s correct) but also you are not subject to the moral law and DO NOT need to pray, fast, give alms, practice virtue, suffer for Christ, or be righteous, or keep the commandments, even the commandments of Jesus, or maintain any standard of morality!
It’s a gross misunderstanding of law and Grace!
Misunderstanding
of grace!
Confuses the mosaic law with the moral law!
—————————-
—————————-
Authority in what they teach and not in a person in an office!
Jesus is not our salvation: only what He taught?
Lk 2:30 Matt 16:16 Jesus in His person is our salvation, not only in what He taught!
Matt 16:13 not what do people say about what I teach, but whom do people say the I am!
The teaching of the successors of Moses not their person?
The successors of Moses sit in the seat of Moses Matt 23:1 a teaching cannot sit in the seat of Moses!
Peters confession not Peters person? Matt 16:18
You give the keys to a person not to a confession!
Acts 1:26 they choose Mathias not the teaching of Mathias!
What authority does Christ have?
What power does Christ have?
What mission / ministry does Christ have?
Peter, the apostles and their successors have the same authority, power, and mission! Jn 20:21 as my father sent me, even so send I you!
John 17:18
As thou hast sent me into the world, even so have I also sent them into the world.
The apostles are Christ’s successors!
They have authority to send others as well, apostle means one who is sent!
Therefore the apostles have authority to send more apostles or successors!
Apostolic succession!
The nations still need to be taught, disciples still need to be baptized and the church the new covenant kingdom of christ still needs to be governed!
Hebrews 3:1
Wherefore, holy brethren, partakers of the heavenly calling, consider the Apostle and High Priest of our profession, Christ Jesus;
Christ is an apostle, and has authority to send other apostles, the apostles also have this authority, so the apostles continue down thru the centuries as Christ promised! Matt 28:19-20
Keys of authority! And power to bind and loose! Matt 16:18 and Matt 18:18 matt 28:19 Isa 22:21-22
Moral authority:
(Teaching)
Necessity of being taught by Christ:
Two edge sword: defining truth and condemning errors, and Interpreting scripture.
Jurisdictional authority:
(Governing / administering)
Necessity of Peter and the apostles and their successors to govern the holy church.
Spiritual authority:
(Life of Grace)
Sanctifying thru the mass and Sacraments
The apostles teaching is Christ’s teaching, Christ and His church are one! Acts 9:4
Christian rule of faith is not the Bible alone! But the doctrine of the apostles! Acts 2:42
Jesus Christ continues HIS ministry in His new covenant church thru Peter, the apostles, and their successors with the same mission, power, and authority!
Mt 16:18 Mt 28:19 Acts 1:17 acts 8:31 & 35 Lk 10:16 Jn 8:32 Jn 13:20 Jn 15:5 Jn 16:13 Jn 20:21-22 eph 2:20
Lk 10:16
He who hears you hears me...
John 13:20
Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that receiveth whomsoever I send receiveth me; and he that receiveth me receiveth him that sent me.
Only the church has authority from Christ to define the truth and teach!
Matt 16:18 matt 18:18 matt 28:19 Jn 20:21-23 Jn 8:32 Jn 16:13
The teaching of Peter and the apostles and successors is the teaching of Christ!
Successors of Jesus Christ!
Jesus already prepares His apostles to continue His mission with His power (binding and loosing) and with His authority (keys) matt 16:18 matt 18:18
Same mission, power, and authority Jn 20:21-23
John 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
John 3:22 After these things came Jesus and his disciples into the land of Judaea; and there he tarried with them, and baptized.
John 4:1 when therefore the Lord knew how the Pharisees had heard that Jesus made and baptized more disciples than John...
Jn 4:2 Though Jesus himself baptized not, but his disciples
Here we see Jesus delegating to His successors, Peter and the apostles!
Jn 15:5 apart from me you can do nothing
There can be no unity of the spirit without obedience to the faith! Rom 1:5 eph 4:3
Matt 28 I am with you (the apostles)
The papacy based on Matt 16:18 and Isa 22:21-22
Matt 16:18-19
18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.
19 And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.
Isa 22:21-22
21 And I will clothe him with thy robe, and strengthen him with thy girdle, and I will commit thy government into his hand: and he shall be a father to the inhabitants of Jerusalem, and to the house of Judah.
22 And the key of the house of David will I lay upon his shoulder; so he shall open, and none shall shut; and he shall shut, and none shall open.
Behold I am with you (the successors or the apostles until the end of the world,so the successors of the apostles must remain until the end of the world) matt 28:19
(None of the so called reformers were apostles) (no man has authority to start a church)
Successors of Moses!
Matt 23 why does Jesus say to obey the successors of Moses?
The successors of Moses sit in the chair of Moses having the authority of the keys and the power to bind and loose Matt 23 and Jesus commanded them to be obeyed! Then the kingdom was taken from them matt 21:43 and given to Peter, Matt 16:18 the apostles, Matt 18:18 and their successors with the authority of the keys and the power to bind and lose!
Jesus said to obey the authority of the successors of Moses mt 23 authority of the keys and power to bind and loose and this power and authority was taken from them matt and given by Christ to Peter, the apostles and their successors, mt 16:18 18:18 this same authority and power must be obeyed!
mt 28:18-20 all authority is given to Peter, the apostles, and their successors requiring obedience, rom 1:5 obedience to the faith!
And Jesus say to Peter, the apostles, and their successors: behold I am with you even until the end of the world!!!
So the apostles have to remain until the end! Revelation 5:10
And hast made us unto our God kings and Priests: and we shall reign on the earth. Reign with kingdom authority (keys) power (bind loose) matt 16:18
The successors of Peter and the apostles have a valid jurisdictional authority (keys) and power (bind and loose) by Jesus Christ!
Lk 10:16
He who hears you hears me...
John 13:20
Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that receiveth whomsoever I send receiveth me; and he that receiveth me receiveth him that sent me.
apostolic succession!
explicit and implicit in scripture
Judas was an apostle
Acts 1:17 For he was numbered with us, and had obtained part of this ministry.
acts 1:20 For it is written in the book of Psalms, Let his habitation be desolate, and let no man dwell therein: and his bishoprick let another take.
Matthias succeeded him as apostle
acts 1: 26 And they gave forth their lots; and the lot fell upon Matthias; and he was numbered with the eleven apostles.
now if it applies to judas how much more to Peter and the other apostles
Matt 28:19-20
Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen.
Jesus is with His church and His apostles until the end! So the apostles must remain until the end governing the church administering the kingdom
Mt 16:18 Peter received the keys of the kingdom: (jurisdictional authority of the universal church) and the power to bind and loose:
Lk 22:32
Jesus prays for Peter:
Jn 21:17
Peter commanded to Feed my sheep:
Isa 22 21-22 prime minister called father!
Holding the keys of the kingdom under the king Lk 1:32-33 in the line of david!
Matt 16:18
—————————-
Grace and law!
The great error of faith alone is that you believe you are saved and under grace and that you ARE NOT subject to the Mosaic law, (and that’s correct) but also you are not subject to the moral law and DO NOT need to pray, fast, give alms, practice virtue, suffer for Christ, or be righteous, or keep the commandments, even the commandments of Jesus, or maintain any standard of morality!
It’s a gross misunderstanding of law and Grace!
Misunderstanding
of grace!
Confuses the mosaic law with the moral law!
—————————-
—————————-
Authority in what they teach and not in a person in an office!
Jesus is not our salvation: only what He taught?
Lk 2:30 Matt 16:16 Jesus in His person is our salvation, not only in what He taught!
Matt 16:13 not what do people say about what I teach, but whom do people say the I am!
The teaching of the successors of Moses not their person?
The successors of Moses sit in the seat of Moses Matt 23:1 a teaching cannot sit in the seat of Moses!
Peters confession not Peters person? Matt 16:18
You give the keys to a person not to a confession!
Acts 1:26 they choose Mathias not the teaching of Mathias!
translations are not forbidden inspired only the original
Nothing is authorized unless Christ and his church authorized it
1 Corinthians 16:22
If any man love not the Lord Jesus Christ, let him be Anathema
Extends to the truth and the church
Cos Christ is the truth and His church teaches the truth without error! Jn 14:6 matt 28:19 matt 18:17 1 Tim 3:15 Jn 29:21-23 Jn 16:13
Christ and His church are one! Acts 9:4 eph 5:32
Truth must be revealed by Christ to his church. Jude 1:3 the holy church teaches all nations. Matt 28:19 without error. Jn 16:13
The evidence of true faith is humble subjection and obedience to Christ & His holy church!
The rule of faith for Christians is Jesus Christ Jn 14:6 and His church! Matt 18:17 acts 2:42 1 Tim 3:15
True Christians cannot listen to the errors of excommunicated heretics, but we listen faithfully to Christ, in the bosom of holy mother church, the only ark of salvation!
1 pet 3:20-21 matt 18:17 matt 16:18-19 matt 28:19-20 Jn 16:13 Jn 20:21-23
Truth must be revealed by God thru Christ to His church (the apostles Jude 1:3) then must be proposed by the church, (Matt 28:19 gal 3:23) without error by the Holy Spirit! (Jn 16:13)
Christ and His church are one! (Acts 9:4 eph 5:31 Jn 15:1-5)
Rejection of the one true church or its teaching is rejection of Christ and God!
Christ and His church are one! Acts 9:4 eph 5:32 Jn 8:12 & Matt 5:14
Dan 2:44 Isa 2:2 Micah 4:1 fulfilled in matt 5:14
matt 16:18-19 shall not prevail
Matt 18:17 hear the truth from the church
1 Tim 3:15 the church is the pillar and ground of truth.
Luke 1:28
King James Version
28 And the angel came in unto her, and said, Hail, thou that art highly favoured, the Lord is with thee: blessed art thou among women.
Luke 1:28
Wycliffe Bible
28 And the angel entered to her, and said, Hail, full of grace; the Lord is with thee; blessed bethou among women.
She declared herself to have been a sinner, and there was NO need for Mary to be sinless, due to the Virgin Birth, which allowed jesus to bypass the Fall!
Jim B
Well-Known Member
Fine. I'm glad that you prefer the KJV. But to claim that all other Bible translations are weak is ridiculous. It's just your opinion that "nothing in our time compares to the King James Bible". If there is a factual basis for saying this, prove it.
atpollard
Well-Known Member
We have the same HOLY SPIRIT - Yesterday, Today and Forever - to protect the GOSPEL and lead God's Children into God's Truth. Even the worst translations still contain enough TRUTH for the Holy Spirit to do his work and lead men to Christ. Among the common translations, there are no bad ones. Just less literal ones.
Jim B
Well-Known Member
Why is it that misinformed people think that early 17th Century Englyshe has anything in common with the three languages of the earliest texts: ancient Hebrew, Aramaic, and Koine Greek? They were all the common languages of the time; there was nothing "lofty" about them, so the KJV is a very poor reflection of those languages.
KJV readers like to think that the "holiness rush" that they feel when they read their favorite translation is Godly, but it ain't.
Here is a parable to examine: Matthew 20:1-16...
"For the kingdom of heaven is like unto a man that is an householder, which went out early in the morning to hire labourers into his vineyard.
And when he had agreed with the labourers for a penny a day, he sent them into his vineyard.
And he went out about the third hour, and saw others standing idle in the marketplace,
And said unto them; Go ye also into the vineyard, and whatsoever is right I will give you. And they went their way.
Again he went out about the sixth and ninth hour, and did likewise.
And about the eleventh hour he went out, and found others standing idle, and saith unto them, Why stand ye here all the day idle?
They say unto him, Because no man hath hired us. He saith unto them, Go ye also into the vineyard; and whatsoever is right, that shall ye receive.
So when even was come, the lord of the vineyard saith unto his steward, Call the labourers, and give them their hire, beginning from the last unto the first.
And when they came that were hired about the eleventh hour, they received every man a penny.
But when the first came, they supposed that they should have received more; and they likewise received every man a penny.
And when they had received it, they murmured against the goodman of the house,
Saying, These last have wrought but one hour, and thou hast made them equal unto us, which have borne the burden and heat of the day.
But he answered one of them, and said, Friend, I do thee no wrong: didst not thou agree with me for a penny?
Take that thine is, and go thy way: I will give unto this last, even as unto thee.
Is it not lawful for me to do what I will with mine own? Is thine eye evil, because I am good?
So the last shall be first, and the first last: for many be called, but few chosen."
Does anybody in their right mind think that this is the way people spoke in NT times? "... they received every man a penny" (there were no pennies) and the reply "These last have wrought but one hour, and thou hast made them equal unto us?" and "I will give unto this last, even as unto thee" and "I will give unto this last, even as unto thee" And so on...
This is far more accurate...
"“For the kingdom of heaven is like a landowner who went out early in the morning to hire workers for his vineyard. He agreed to pay them a denarius for the day and sent them into his vineyard.
“About nine in the morning he went out and saw others standing in the marketplace doing nothing. He told them, ‘You also go and work in my vineyard, and I will pay you whatever is right.’ So they went.
“He went out again about noon and about three in the afternoon and did the same thing. About five in the afternoon he went out and found still others standing around. He asked them, ‘Why have you been standing here all day long doing nothing?’
“‘Because no one has hired us,’ they answered.
“He said to them, ‘You also go and work in my vineyard.’
“When evening came, the owner of the vineyard said to his foreman, ‘Call the workers and pay them their wages, beginning with the last ones hired and going on to the first.’
“The workers who were hired about five in the afternoon came and each received a denarius. So when those came who were hired first, they expected to receive more. But each one of them also received a denarius. When they received it, they began to grumble against the landowner. ‘These who were hired last worked only one hour,’ they said, ‘and you have made them equal to us who have borne the burden of the work and the heat of the day.’
“But he answered one of them, ‘I am not being unfair to you, friend. Didn’t you agree to work for a denarius? Take your pay and go. I want to give the one who was hired last the same as I gave you. Don’t I have the right to do what I want with my own money? Or are you envious because I am generous?’
“So the last will be first, and the first will be last.”
(Verse numbers have been removed in both cases because they aren't part of Scripture, but the KJV fragmentation has been retained).
"each received a denarius" (the coin of the realm) vs "they received every man a penny" (the coin of 17th Century England)
"These last have wrought but one hour, and thou hast made them equal unto us..." vs "These who were hired last worked only one hour,’ they said, ‘and you have made them equal to us..."
"I will give unto this last, even as unto thee" vs "I want to give the one who was hired last the same as I gave you".
"Is thine eye evil, because I am good?" vs "are you envious because I am generous?"
This is just a section taken at random but it clearly illustrates that the KJV is a serious distortion of how people communicated in NT times.
KJV readers like to think that the "holiness rush" that they feel when they read their favorite translation is Godly, but it ain't.
Here is a parable to examine: Matthew 20:1-16...
"For the kingdom of heaven is like unto a man that is an householder, which went out early in the morning to hire labourers into his vineyard.
And when he had agreed with the labourers for a penny a day, he sent them into his vineyard.
And he went out about the third hour, and saw others standing idle in the marketplace,
And said unto them; Go ye also into the vineyard, and whatsoever is right I will give you. And they went their way.
Again he went out about the sixth and ninth hour, and did likewise.
And about the eleventh hour he went out, and found others standing idle, and saith unto them, Why stand ye here all the day idle?
They say unto him, Because no man hath hired us. He saith unto them, Go ye also into the vineyard; and whatsoever is right, that shall ye receive.
So when even was come, the lord of the vineyard saith unto his steward, Call the labourers, and give them their hire, beginning from the last unto the first.
And when they came that were hired about the eleventh hour, they received every man a penny.
But when the first came, they supposed that they should have received more; and they likewise received every man a penny.
And when they had received it, they murmured against the goodman of the house,
Saying, These last have wrought but one hour, and thou hast made them equal unto us, which have borne the burden and heat of the day.
But he answered one of them, and said, Friend, I do thee no wrong: didst not thou agree with me for a penny?
Take that thine is, and go thy way: I will give unto this last, even as unto thee.
Is it not lawful for me to do what I will with mine own? Is thine eye evil, because I am good?
So the last shall be first, and the first last: for many be called, but few chosen."
Does anybody in their right mind think that this is the way people spoke in NT times? "... they received every man a penny" (there were no pennies) and the reply "These last have wrought but one hour, and thou hast made them equal unto us?" and "I will give unto this last, even as unto thee" and "I will give unto this last, even as unto thee" And so on...
This is far more accurate...
"“For the kingdom of heaven is like a landowner who went out early in the morning to hire workers for his vineyard. He agreed to pay them a denarius for the day and sent them into his vineyard.
“About nine in the morning he went out and saw others standing in the marketplace doing nothing. He told them, ‘You also go and work in my vineyard, and I will pay you whatever is right.’ So they went.
“He went out again about noon and about three in the afternoon and did the same thing. About five in the afternoon he went out and found still others standing around. He asked them, ‘Why have you been standing here all day long doing nothing?’
“‘Because no one has hired us,’ they answered.
“He said to them, ‘You also go and work in my vineyard.’
“When evening came, the owner of the vineyard said to his foreman, ‘Call the workers and pay them their wages, beginning with the last ones hired and going on to the first.’
“The workers who were hired about five in the afternoon came and each received a denarius. So when those came who were hired first, they expected to receive more. But each one of them also received a denarius. When they received it, they began to grumble against the landowner. ‘These who were hired last worked only one hour,’ they said, ‘and you have made them equal to us who have borne the burden of the work and the heat of the day.’
“But he answered one of them, ‘I am not being unfair to you, friend. Didn’t you agree to work for a denarius? Take your pay and go. I want to give the one who was hired last the same as I gave you. Don’t I have the right to do what I want with my own money? Or are you envious because I am generous?’
“So the last will be first, and the first will be last.”
(Verse numbers have been removed in both cases because they aren't part of Scripture, but the KJV fragmentation has been retained).
"each received a denarius" (the coin of the realm) vs "they received every man a penny" (the coin of 17th Century England)
"These last have wrought but one hour, and thou hast made them equal unto us..." vs "These who were hired last worked only one hour,’ they said, ‘and you have made them equal to us..."
"I will give unto this last, even as unto thee" vs "I want to give the one who was hired last the same as I gave you".
"Is thine eye evil, because I am good?" vs "are you envious because I am generous?"
This is just a section taken at random but it clearly illustrates that the KJV is a serious distortion of how people communicated in NT times.
atpollard
Well-Known Member
Non sequitur.
Try reading what he wrote and responding to what he actually said.
You have the explaining to do and your "cut and paste" rhetoric is not getting the job done.
- Where has anybody but YOU stated "Christ is a sinner"?
- Where does God state in Scripture that Mary was SINLESS?
- The Parable of the Tree and its Fruit has NOTHING to do with Mary, so try focusing on what the Bible is ACTUALLY SAYING rather than what you wish it was talking about (it is an important lesson, just not a lesson about Mary).
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