Are we the "Elect"?

[shturt678]

Is there a difference between the Gospel's "call," and the Epistle's "call"? Not speaking of the "two callings" issue, however can be entertained.

Old 'called' Jack, ie, I hope anyway? Doctrine of Election....I've even spaced this out?

 

[Madad21]

I dont know bout you mate but I reckon Im in!!

 

[aspen]

if you are a human being you were created predestined to be it relationship with God. His elect are thoe who respond to His call home, after the Fall.

 

[RANDOR]

Got my ticket.....Alllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll Aboard

 

[Mr.Bride]

Elected and predestinated. I am the Bride of Jesus Christ, awaiting my Bridegroom. It's lamp trimming time. Do you have enough oil for the journey? Sure hope so. Blessings

 

[shturt678]

I dont know bout you mate but I reckon Im in!!

It's going to be for a forever long time, I hope you remember how to prepare tongue stew?

Old hungry and thirsting also for the Word, Jack

Got my ticket.....Alllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll Aboard

Hope our Lord Jesus at the controls.....on 2nd thought, He is....hate that running out of fuel before landing....it's that sudden stop that'll get you.

Old Jack making sure we're filled with the Holy Ghost.

if you are a human being you were created predestined to be it relationship with God. His elect are thoe who respond to His call home, after the Fall.

By a living trust in the promise that came, that is, "faith" effected thru "repentance," correct?

Old Jack crossing the "t"s and dotting the "i"s making sure we respond our Lord's way. Agape that responding!

 

[aspen]

repentance means 'finding your happiness in God rather than your own incompleteness' it is a commitment to loving outwardly rather than inwardly. it is accepting the invitation to eat the food you are already seated in front of at the feast you were invited to attend . addicts understand repentance when they accept the freedom of sobriety. Men who sleep with a lot of women understand when they are freed by monogamy or celibacy

 

[Martin W.]

Is there a difference between the Gospel's "call," and the Epistle's "call"? Not speaking of the "two callings" issue, however can be entertained.

Old 'called' Jack, ie, I hope anyway? Doctrine of Election....I've even spaced this out?

Jack ..... You will find that the "elect" are Israel / Jews

note:
~~Not every time the term "elect" is used in the bible does it explicitly say who they are , but the hints indicate it is Israel , and ~~Every time it does say who they are it is clearly Israel

Here are some random examples :

.... Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ, .... To God’s elect, exiles scattered throughout the provinces of Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia and Bithynia, who have been chosen according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through the sanctifying work of the Spirit, to be obedient to Jesus Christ and sprinkled with his blood: (exiles refer to Jews scattered among the nations)

..... Concerning this salvation, the prophets, who spoke of the grace that was to come to you, searched intently and with the greatest care, 11 trying to find out the time and circumstances to which the Spirit of Christ in them was pointing when he predicted the sufferings of the Messiah and the glories that would follow (again , Jews had the prophets , and Jews awaited a Messiah ... ) (the gentiles did not)

..... For you know that it was not with perishable things such as silver or gold that you were redeemed from the empty way of life handed down to you from your ancestors (Israel)

If the Lord had not cut short those days, no one would survive. But for the sake of the elect, whom he has chosen, he has shortened them (Israel = chosen)

The above are from 1 Peter:1 and have hints it is Israel

...........................................


More explicit :

What then? What the people of Israel sought so earnestly they did not obtain. The elect among them did, but the others were hardened, (Romans 11:7)

 

[shturt678]

repentance means 'finding your happiness in God rather than your own incompleteness' it is a commitment to loving outwardly rather than inwardly. it is accepting the invitation to eat the food you are already seated in front of at the feast you were invited to attend . addicts understand repentance when they accept the freedom of sobriety. Men who sleep with a lot of women understand when they are freed by monogamy or celibacy

I know you agape our Lord, however did want to point something out regarding the very important concept of "repentance." I seen long ago too many turn to our Lord's grace and mercy, and not from Rom.3:19, 20 (heartful repentance) to our Lord's grace and mercy, that is, by "faith." Fast back about 3 decades after Church on Sunday, too many of it's members open the Bible and act pious for the whole 1.5 hours on Sunday, then wow, after Church fist fights, drinking too much alcohol, and etc. and etc. from Sunday afternoon, all week including worldly parties on Saturday. I had to learn that not only the CIA has secret agents, but Christianity has them too, that is, moreso today for sure.

My point we're not turning from sin daily to the "faith," ie, I know it's a difficult turn & walk, however works for me. Combine the former with a healty "fear" of our Lord, and we're on our way together.

Old difficult religion, Jack just thinking out loud again.

btw found out much later that the concept of "repentance" is to be viewed in the wide and narrow senses plus there are 4 parables that deal with a genuine repentance. Little more of a difficult issue than one would like to think.

 

[Nomad]

Jack ..... You will find that the "elect" are Israel / Jews

Not every time. The following passages are written to the Church, not just Israel.

Rom 8:31 What then shall we say to these things? If God is for us, who can be against us?
Rom 8:32 He who did not spare his own Son but gave him up for us all, how will he not also with him graciously give us all things?
Rom 8:33 Who shall bring any charge against God's elect? It is God who justifies.

2Ti 2:8 Remember Jesus Christ, risen from the dead, the offspring of David, as preached in my gospel,
2Ti 2:9 for which I am suffering, bound with chains as a criminal. But the word of God is not bound!
2Ti 2:10 Therefore I endure everything for the sake of the elect, that they also may obtain the salvation that is in Christ Jesus with eternal glory.

Tit 1:1 Paul, a servant of God and an apostle of Jesus Christ, for the sake of the faith of God's elect and their knowledge of the truth, which accords with godliness,
Tit 1:2 in hope of eternal life, which God, who never lies, promised before the ages began
Tit 1:3 and at the proper time manifested in his word through the preaching with which I have been entrusted by the command of God our Savior;

 

[shturt678]

Jack ..... You will find that the "elect" are Israel / Jews

note:
~~Not every time the term "elect" is used in the bible does it explicitly say who they are , but the hints indicate it is Israel , and ~~Every time it does say who they are it is clearly Israel

Here are some random examples :

.... Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ, .... To God’s elect, exiles scattered throughout the provinces of Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia and Bithynia, who have been chosen according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through the sanctifying work of the Spirit, to be obedient to Jesus Christ and sprinkled with his blood: (exiles refer to Jews scattered among the nations)

..... Concerning this salvation, the prophets, who spoke of the grace that was to come to you, searched intently and with the greatest care, 11 trying to find out the time and circumstances to which the Spirit of Christ in them was pointing when he predicted the sufferings of the Messiah and the glories that would follow (again , Jews had the prophets , and Jews awaited a Messiah ... ) (the gentiles did not)

..... For you know that it was not with perishable things such as silver or gold that you were redeemed from the empty way of life handed down to you from your ancestors (Israel)

If the Lord had not cut short those days, no one would survive. But for the sake of the elect, whom he has chosen, he has shortened them (Israel = chosen)

The above are from 1 Peter:1 and have hints it is Israel

...........................................


More explicit :

What then? What the people of Israel sought so earnestly they did not obtain. The elect among them did, but the others were hardened, (Romans 11:7)

Thank you for your response!

Only a head's up, Peter wrote to Gentile congregations with a minority of Jews.

Old Jack
Only an insignificant end point: The "called" (Rom.8:28) is grammatically to be viewed as a pregnant term which is used in the Epistles as a designation of those who not only have received the call, but also have been won by it. We comport with the Gospel's "called" where a little different.

Old Jack's opinion

 

[aspen]

Jack, i think you are missing my point if you are not seeing repetance in my post. the person who is pious on sunday and goes back to drinking and whoring during the week is not being repentant because he is failing to love prefectly. He is loving himself rather than God and neighbor - in fact he is exploiting both. True repentance is putting others before yourself and allowing God alone to meet your needs. True repentance is turning 180 degrees from selfishness.

 

[shturt678]

Jack, i think you are missing my point if you are not seeing repetance in my post. the person who is pious on sunday and goes back to drinking and whoring during the week is not being repentant because he is failing to love prefectly. He is loving himself rather than God and neighbor - in fact he is exploiting both. True repentance is putting others before yourself and allowing God alone to meet your needs. True repentance is turning 180 degrees from selfishness.

I not only seen your point in #7, but fully agreed with you then, and now, ie, I'm famous or better yet infamous for throwing a monkey wrench into the gears....sorry 'bout that one.

Old Jack that appreciates you, and your words.

 

[aspen]

thanks jack.

 

[StanJ]

Is there a difference between the Gospel's "call," and the Epistle's "call"? Not speaking of the "two callings" issue, however can be entertained.

Old 'called' Jack, ie, I hope anyway? Doctrine of Election....I've even spaced this out?

As I hate to guess Jack, how about making it clear as to WHAT call you are referring to in the Gospels and Epistles?
Nearest I can figure is Rom 8:28

 

[shturt678]

As I hate to guess Jack, how about making it clear as to WHAT call you are referring to in the Gospels and Epistles?
Nearest I can figure is Rom 8:28

Thank you Aspen and Stan!

Amen! One call at Rom.8:28 (Epistle's "call"), and the other at Matt.20:1-16 (Gospel's "call"). The Churches have been combining the two calls onto "1" call for the past 100 years or so to successfully keep the Church economics going, ie, gets most into heaven just with the faith of demons. If I was you I would go with the combined "1" call so your wallet doesn't look like mine, ie, herd of elephants stepped on it repeatedly going back and forth to their watering hole.

Old, 2 "calls," Jack

 

[StanJ]

Thank you Aspen and Stan!

Amen! One call at Rom.8:28 (Epistle's "call"), and the other at Matt.20:1-16 (Gospel's "call"). The Churches have been combining the two calls onto "1" call for the past 100 years or so to successfully keep the Church economics going, ie, gets most into heaven just with the faith of demons. If I was you I would go with the combined "1" call so your wallet doesn't look like mine, ie, herd of elephants stepped on it repeatedly going back and forth to their watering hole.

Old, 2 "calls," Jack

LOL...that's about as clear as dishwater....seriously Matt 20:1-16 is not a call". It is the fact that whether we are Christians for 100 years or one day, we ALL receive the same reward. It's another parable as a follow up to the end of Matt 19....no call.

 

[Nomad]

Hello Jack,

Both passages mention the same call. The difference is in what each passage teaches about that call. Romans 8:28 tells us that God's calling comes with a promise.

Rom 8:28 And we know that for those who love God all things work together for good, for those who are called according to his purpose.

Matthew 20, on the other hand teaches that God is no respecter of persons with regard to his calling and rewards. I would suggest backing up to Matthew 19:26 to get a sense of what prompted Jesus' lesson.

I like the way 17th century theologian Matthew Poole puts it:

"But many that are first shall be last, & c. As much as if he had said, You have forsaken all and followed me, but you had need look, and consider, from what principle, with what love, and to what end you have done it; you had need keep a watch upon yourselves, and see that you hold on, and that you have no confidence in yourselves. For many that are first in, profession, first in the opinion of others, first in their own opinion and confidence, at the day of judgment will be found to be last in mine and my Father’s esteem and reckoning: and many who make not so great a noise, nor have so great a name and repute in the world, and who have the lowest and meanest opinion of themselves, will be found first, and highest in my favour. The day of judgment will frustrate many expectations."

 

[aspen]

I remember when I used to think 'the last shall be first and the first shall be last' meant that the privileged on Earth would be last and the underprivileged would be first. I no longer believe that Jesus was trying to say this. Instead, Jesus is telling us there will be no hierarchy at all. We will all be his children - only those who believe they should be first will feel like they are last.

 

[shturt678]

LOL...that's about as clear as dishwater....seriously Matt 20:1-16 is not a call". It is the fact that whether we are Christians for 100 years or one day, we ALL receive the same reward. It's another parable as a follow up to the end of Matt 19....no call.

Thank you for your response and caring!

Matt.20:1-16, "hire laborers for the vineyard" is about the "called," visible church on earth in veiled parabolic language, and to undress this one is going to wall this thread thus let's move to an easier to undress Parable in Matt.22:1-14, viz., v.3, "to call" then fast forward to v.14, "For many are called ones,..." Thus let's not throw out the baby with the dishwater, O.K.?

However you do have the right idea...keep the money and land coming in with a combined call. I'm going to have to hit the Hawaiian Lulu Bowl this morning for fuel as my wallet flattened again...going to start disliking elephants pretty soon.

Old Jack changing the water....keeping the baby...agape those called babies.

Hello Jack,

Both passages mention the same call. The difference is in what each passage teaches about that call. Romans 8:28 tells us that God's calling comes with a promise.

Rom 8:28 And we know that for those who love God all things work together for good, for those who are called according to his purpose.

Matthew 20, on the other hand teaches that God is no respecter of persons with regard to his calling and rewards. I would suggest backing up to Matthew 19:26 to get a sense of what prompted Jesus' lesson.

I like the way 17th century theologian Matthew Poole puts it:

"But many that are first shall be last, & c. As much as if he had said, You have forsaken all and followed me, but you had need look, and consider, from what principle, with what love, and to what end you have done it; you had need keep a watch upon yourselves, and see that you hold on, and that you have no confidence in yourselves. For many that are first in, profession, first in the opinion of others, first in their own opinion and confidence, at the day of judgment will be found to be last in mine and my Father’s esteem and reckoning: and many who make not so great a noise, nor have so great a name and repute in the world, and who have the lowest and meanest opinion of themselves, will be found first, and highest in my favour. The day of judgment will frustrate many expectations."

Thank you for your response and caring for sure!

I think if we move forward 4 verses to Matt.19:30 where the proper understanding of this pointed saying is of vital importance for the correct interpretation of the Parable that follows, viz., Matt.20:1-16. btw, no sacrcasm this time, if the "last" are conceived as still being in the Kingdom of God "inwardly," the Parable will not be properly interpreted.

Appreciative, old Jack

btw my brother, I know exactly how the RT interprets this Parable, ie, my best student in Koine is from the RT camp.

I remember when I used to think 'the last shall be first and the first shall be last' meant that the privileged on Earth would be last and the underprivileged would be first. I no longer believe that Jesus was trying to say this. Instead, Jesus is telling us there will be no hierarchy at all. We will all be his children - only those who believe they should be first will feel like they are last.

Thank you also for your response and caring!

Now we're getting warm to hot!

Old Jack with a thermometer