Difference between Catholic and Protestant.

[amigo de christo]

I agree with all the above, but you haven't explained how CC doctrine can crush the SDA. I'm intrigued. Also wondering who the Adventist is on this forum who you believe to be cosying up to the CC. Even more intrigued on that one. I know there are some leaders in our church who are involved in ecumenical affairs, but we are well aware of who they are and they do not represent all the membership. There is a vast majority of members who are totally opposed to such relationships.

No, adventists are not committed to their faith in the same manner as Catholics are to theirs. First, adventists are committed to truth, not m necessarily to the denomination. The first hint that the church begins to teach unbiblical concepts, the is much debate throughout the Adventist world, with lobbying of the leaders and church councils, and such matters are dealt with at the annual council. One recent example was women's ordination. Opinion was split throughout the world, local churches discussed the issue and the were pastors and lay ministers on both sides of the issue. So, unlike Catholics, we don't lie down and simply accept everything the leaders decide. There are many who still have serious reservations over the Godhead doctrine. It may surprise you but it church didn't fully accept the trinity into our fundamental beliefs until 1980. There are many who disagree with the way it is worded and taught. I am one of them. Some have left the church as a result. I am not one of them. But pour current official view of the trinity is very different from that taught by the church even 60 years ago. And none of the Adventist pioneers believed in the trinity as presented in the traditonal creeds. For me, their perspective seemed more biblically sound. I hope one day there will be a global discussion on the issue. Meanwhile, there is no disagreement on who Jesus is, either in His divinity or His humanity. So our differences I believe aren't a salvation issue.

It aint you my friend . And yes indeed you are correct , the ecuminical movement has infected ALL denomiations .
The other person i speak about , cannot see that the ecuminical movment has infected even the SDA as it has all other groups .
There are leaders in every camp that are decieving their groups and now they do the bidding of the We are one unity movement .
ITS all over the watchtower , its all over the southern baptist region , ITS all over the places .
Folks that once stood against the harlot now do her will for the sake of unity and those who sit under them
have no idea its getting done . SEE the devil is highly clever . HE cometh to preach the agenda
to a baptist but does so within the mind of the baptist . He does it to an adventist but in within the mind of that religoin
as well as any other religion . THE GOAL IS , WE ARE ONE LETS HUG AND HAVE US SOME GET ALONG BRIDGE BULDING UNITY .
ITS ALL a lie and that from hades . THE MORMONS LEAD IN IT . THE CATHOLICS LEAD IN IT , THE JEWS LEAD IN IT
as well as the evangelical realm and its nar leaders , its beth moores and its todd whites and its stephen furticks
its rob bells , Its rick warrnen purpose driven life . ITS EVERYWHERE .
I SHUN Its false love , is false unity , its false agenda and its doctrines TO HELL . DONT Wait for an apology either .
ITS THE BIBLE FOR ME MY FRIEND and the GOD and CHRIST OF said bible .
WE BETTER be prepared to be hated . WE BETTER stay GLUED IN BIBLES . Cause many AINT GONNA MAKE IT .

 

[amigo de christo]

No, what you have done is alter the focus of my objection. Ignatius may or may not have some doctrines correct, that's not the point. My principle objection is that he, as a very early leader in the Christian era, is already leading the church down a road to apostasy... Not by a whole raft of false doctrine, but by removing Jesus as the head of the church and replacing Him with a presumed authority of the church over the consciences of men.

So you don't deny that the church has removed Christ as head of the church, and had used it's authority as vicarious filli dei. My protest over this is in the manner and reach that said authority has been historically used. Your church throughout it's history, even to this day, assumes is authority extends to the consciences of men, claiming only through her auspices is salvation to be found, and to not be submitted to papal authority is akin to heresy. Heresy in the mind of the Papacy is not being in error to scripture, but to hold different views to the Catholic hierarchy.
Their assumed authority has of course cost the lives on millions. Crusades against Muslims and Huguenots, the Albigenses, inquisitions against the Christians of Spain, France, Goa, and elsewhere. The kind of authority the church claimed and demanded the state submit to was an authority of judgement, which belongs only to God.

Stay glued in that bible . ALL other teachers and teachings GET TESTED against the bible .

 

[BreadOfLife]

Then hello! I am the first person that you have met.

Tell me WHY you left, then.
Enlighten me.

 

[Naomanos]

Tell me WHY you left, then.
Enlighten me.

Can you not just take me at my word?

I have gone through this ad-nauseam before on Catholic Answers Forums before they shut down. Don't really want to go through it all again.

 

[amigo de christo]

Tell me WHY you left, then.
Enlighten me.

Come ye out from amongst her .

 

[Marymog]

@Marymog,

With all due respect, a little feedback would be helpful. You are not a good witness for the RCC. On another site, there is a RCC who is a good witness. He's grounded, measured, thoughtful and inviting in his posts.

Your posts scream the Differences between Catholic and Protestant can never be resolved as you are like the Muslims and we are like Israel; you deny our right to exist. Or the only purpose to our existence - from your POV - is us one day realizing the error of our ways and returning to your one world church. This will never happen!

You only seem interested in making 'kiddo' type condescending posts. I don't see you welcoming new members or posting in threads where people share their trials and tribulations where you offer love, understanding, prayers and support. It wouldn't hurt to love on your fellow Christ follower, especially given how much lower she/he is than the likes of you. Just sayin.

Make a Blessed Day!

W

Thank you.

I should be more grounded, measured, thoughtful and inviting in my posts. When I use the word kiddo it should not be taken condescendingly. I see that some take it that way. I should refrain from using it.

Respectfully, Mary

 

[BreadOfLife]

No, what you have done is alter the focus of my objection. Ignatius may or may not have some doctrines correct, that's not the point. My principle objection is that he, as a very early leader in the Christian era, is already leading the church down a road to apostasy... Not by a whole raft of false doctrine, but by removing Jesus as the head of the church and replacing Him with a presumed authority of the church over the consciences of men.

So you don't deny that the church has removed Christ as head of the church, and had used it's authority as vicarious filli dei. My protest over this is in the manner and reach that said authority has been historically used. Your church throughout it's history, even to this day, assumes is authority extends to the consciences of men, claiming only through her auspices is salvation to be found, and to not be submitted to papal authority is akin to heresy. Heresy in the mind of the Papacy is not being in error to scripture, but to hold different views to the Catholic hierarchy.

Their assumed authority has of course cost the lives on millions. Crusades against Muslims and Huguenots, the Albigenses, inquisitions against the Christians of Spain, France, Goa, and elsewhere. The kind of authority the church claimed and demanded the state submit to was an authority of judgement, which belongs only to God.

“Presumed/Assumed” Authority?”
There you go again with your Anti-Biblical, Anti-Christ nonsense.

As I showed you before – it was CHRIST Himself who gave His Church supreme earthly Authority – that WHATEVER the Church loosed or held bound on earth would be loosed and held bound in Heaven (Matt. 16:18-19, Matt. 18:15-18).
That WHOEVER listens to or rejects His Church listens to or rejects HIM - and the ONE who sent Him (Luke 10:16).
He gave the Leaders of His Church the power to forgive sins or to hold them bound – and sealed that power with the Holy Spirit (John 20:21-23).
This is BIBLICAL Truth – not Catholic opinion.

The fact that YOU claim that Catholics “replaced” Jesus’s Authority with Church Authority shows me how little you understand about the Word of God and how little you know of Christ.
He equates His very SELF with His Church (Acts 8:4-5).
Paul refers to the Church as the FULLNESS of Christ (Eph. 1:22-23).
Yet, YOU’RE still under the false belief that Christ’s Church has “replaced” Him.

The Church isn’t some weird little club invented by a false prophetess in the 19th century.
It’s the Body of Christ Himself.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Come ye out from amongst her .

The Bible commands us to uses REASON (apologia) for our arguments (1 Pet. 3:15).
Yours post is just another idiotic statement because you haven’t supplied any CONTEXT.

How about an intelligent argument for a change?

 

[BreadOfLife]

Can you not just take me at my word?

I have gone through this ad-nauseam before on Catholic Answers Forums before they shut down. Don't really want to go through it all again.

Then, WHY would you even bother posting that you left the Catholic Church because you disagree with its doctrines?

This just lends credence to MY claim that ALL ex-Catholic are “Ex” Catholics out of sheer ignorance and nothing else.
Thanks for making my point . . .

 

[Naomanos]

Then, WHY would you even bother posting that you left the Catholic Church because you disagree with its doctrines?

This just lends credence to MY claim that ALL ex-Catholic are “Ex” Catholics out of sheer ignorance and nothing else.
Thanks for making my point . . .

I hardly made your point as I haven't said anything as to why I left other than disagreement with its doctrines. That's quite the leap. I didn't give any indication as to what those doctrines are or what I know about them. Nor will I. I have done so as I said ad-nauseam on a different forum, a Catholic forum. I am not going to do it again.

If you cannot believe that someone would leave because of doctrine, then I suggest that maybe you consider that it can happen at the very least. If not, then it is really no skin off my back what you believe about me. I know the truth as to why I left, if you cannot accept that truth, that is not my problem.

 

[BreadOfLife]

I hardly made your point as I haven't said anything as to why I left other than disagreement with its doctrines. That's quite the leap. I didn't give any indication as to what those doctrines are or what I know about them. Nor will I. I have done so as I said ad-nauseam on a different forum, a Catholic forum. I am not going to do it again.

If you cannot believe that someone would leave because of doctrine, then I suggest that maybe you consider that it can happen at the very least. If not, then it is really no skin off my back what you believe about me. I know the truth as to why I left, if you cannot accept that truth, that is not my problem.

Nobody here knows anything about your supposed battles on another forum.

The point is that you came HERE to air your grievance against the Catholic Church. And, as is ALWAYS the case with ex-Catholics – you can’t come up with a SINGLE reason why you left.
You “won’t” list any reasons because you know you’ll get exposed on EVERY one.

Thanks again for making my point . . .

 

[Naomanos]

Nobody here knows anything about your supposed battles on another forum.

The point is that you came HERE to air your grievance against the Catholic Church. And, as is ALWAYS the case with ex-Catholics – you can’t come up with a SINGLE reason why you left.
You “won’t” list any reasons because you know you’ll get exposed on EVERY one.

Thanks again for making my point . . .

I realize that no one knows my "battles" on other forums. However, they happened and I am not going to do it again. I didn't air a grievance. I simply and most certainly did list one single reason why I left. That wasn't a grievance so much as this is why. I also stated that I hold no ill will towards the Catholic church and it has its place in the world. I am not arguing that people should not join the Catholic church if they so choose to do so. I am not going to stay in a church when I disagree with it. As I said, that makes me a hypocrite. So, I left.

Maybe in your haste to "battle" other people, you are losing sight that not all who left the Catholic church hold no ill will against it.

 

[theefaith]

I will respectfully disagree with your post.

I am not returning to the Catholic church, not when I disagree with many of its doctrines. That would make me a hypocrite. Nor am I rejecting Christ.

then there’s only one question:

did Christ found a church?

 

[Naomanos]

then there’s only one question:

did Christ found a church?

As I stated to BreadOfLife I am not here to as he put it "battle" with people about why I left. I did. I left for the reason I stated. If you or anyone else cannot handle that, it is your issue, not mine.

I will not return to the Catholic church. No amount of trying to prove with scripture anything about the Catholic church will work with me. The Catholic church has its place in the world, just like other churches do.

I found my church. That should be good enough for you or anyone else.

 

[Brakelite]

baptism is required not immersion

Valid Christian baptism requires the flowing water over the forehead three times.

With the words:

I baptize you in the name of the father and of the son and of the Holy Spirit! Matt 28:19

The grace of God washing away all sin! Acts 22:16




Immersion, pouring, sprinkling 3 times in the name of the father and of the son and of the Holy Spirit are valid forms of baptism.

Ez 36:25 I will sprinkle you with clean water and you shall be made white as snow.

1 pet 1:2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied. (Baptism)

Heb 10:22
Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water.

You don't understand the meaning of baptism. It is indicative of burial. Sprinkling doesn't accomplish that. Read Romans 6.

 

[theefaith]

[QUOTE="Brakelite, post: 1433658, member:

SDA crushed with truth of the Christian doctrine of the necessity of correct faith in the divinity of Christ and the holy trinity and baptismal regeneration in the name of the father, and of the son, and of the Holy Spirit as Christ commanded His one true church founded 2000 yrs ago on Peter and the apostles!

 

[theefaith]

As I stated to BreadOfLife I am not here to as he put it "battle" with people about why I left. I did. I left for the reason I stated. If you or anyone else cannot handle that, it is your issue, not mine.

I will not return to the Catholic church. No amount of trying to prove with scripture anything about the Catholic church will work with me. The Catholic church has its place in the world, just like other churches do.

I found my church. That should be good enough for you or anyone else.

there can only be one true church Matt 6:33 Matt 16:18-19 Jn 10:16
With the sacraments being the means of grace ez 36:25-27 acts 2:38-39
Only Christ has authority to found a church on Peter and the apostles all others are heretical sects of damnation and the tradition of men!

 

[theefaith]

A sacrament is an oath! A sacred promise from God! Ez 36:25-27
Acts 2:38-39 (this promise)


A sacrament is an outward sign for all men including infants And a gift from God to help us see what he does inwardly and invisibly by his grace!

As grace Washes our souls in the merits of Jesus blood from original and personal sin, so the outward action of washing is visible!

without the outward action the inward action cannot take place!

Jn 3:5 Titus 3:5 water and washing
acts 22:16 wash away your sin!

Jn 3:5 Born again BY water and the spirit! Not by “faith alone”!

They did not go to Jerusalem and preach “accept Christ as you’re personal Lord and savior “

They went to the river (water) and they baptized! Jn 3:22

A covenant requires an outward sign of the inward action of grace!

Ez 36:25 I will sprinkle you with clean water and you shall be made white as snow.

Acts 22:16 washing away your sins.

Eph 4:5 one Lord, one faith, one baptism.

1 pet 3:21 baptism saves you.

You cannot enter on you’re own or by faith alone!

2 pet 1: 11 For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

Heb 2:11 For both he that sanctifieth and they who are sanctified are all of one: for which cause he is not ashamed to call them brethren,


Baptism!

God breathed life into Adam, gen 2:7 and we received this life from our fathers!

Christ breathed on the apostles our spiritual fathers, we receive the new covenant life of God’s grace from them thru faith & baptism! Jn 20:21-23 Mk 16:16 acts 8:36-38 eph 2

Born again! Born from above!

'The Father has set his seal' on Christ (John 6:27) and also seals us in him (cf. 2 Corinthians 1:22; Ephesians 1:23, 4:30). Because this seal indicates the indelible effect of the anointing with the Holy Spirit in the sacrament of Baptism,

Baptism indeed is the seal of eternal life." 87 The faithful Christian who I has "kept the seal" until the end, remaining faithful to the demands of his Baptism, will be able to depart this life "marked with the sign of faith," 88 with his baptismal faith, in expectation of the blessed vision of God - the consummation of faith - and in the hope of resurrection.

St. Paul tells the faithful at Ephesus that they have been “sealed with the promised Holy Spirit.” This is in terms of an indelible character imprinted on the soul in the sacraments of baptism and confirmation. It is not as if this invisible mark is simply decorative. Rather, through it, we are enabled to participate in Christ’s mission and in his offices of priest, prophet, and king. Eph 1:13

Sealed by God eph 1:13 sealed by God (ez 36:25-27) in the ark of salvation by baptism just as Noah was sealed by God in the ark of the flood gen 7:16

1 Pet 3:20 Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.

21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us!
(Ark of Noah a type of the church, member of Christ and his church and salvation by baptism!)
(Outside the ark of Noah none were saved, outside the church (the ark of salvation) none are saved!)

Sealed in the ark, sealed in the church the ark of salvation by God thru baptism!



Christ instituted the holy church for the salvation of all men, (repent and believe the gospel, with the institution of the sacraments to convey grace to sanctify souls!


Effects of faith & baptism!

Ez 36:25-27 washed in baptism, with a new heart and the Spirit
Jn 3:5 born again in baptism
Mk 16:16 faith & baptist
Acts 2:38 repentance & baptism
Acts 8:36-38 faith & baptism
Acts 22:16 baptism washes away sin
Rom 6:3 died with Christ
Col 2:12 risen with Christ
1 cor 12:13 baptized into the church
Gal 3:27 by baptism put on Christ
2 Tim 1:10 brought to life
2 cor 5:17 new creation
Eph 1:13 sealed by the Holy Spirit
Eph 2:1&5 brought to life in baptism
Eph 4:5 one baptism
Eph 5:26 faith and baptism
Titus 3:5 baptismal regeneration
1 pet 1:2 washed in Christ’s blood
1 pet 2:9 the kingdom of light
1 pet 3:20-21 baptism saves us!

“Faith alone” accomplishes nothing!
1 cor 13:2 even all faith (alone) without charity avails NOTHING!!!

Faith and baptism!

Scripture says none of the things about “Faith alone”!

2 Peter 1:11
For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

The Christian sacrament of baptism is the Initiation into the new covenant and must be ministered to you by the apostles!

 

[Naomanos]

there can only be one true church Matt 6:33 Matt 16:18-19 Jn 10:16
With the sacraments being the means of grace ez 36:25-27 acts 2:38-39
Only Christ has authority to found a church on Peter and the apostles all others are heretical sects of damnation and the tradition of men!

You keep saying that. My position stays the same.

The Catholic church is no longer and will never again be my church. Not sure how many more times I can say it to you.

We can discuss this in Heaven when we get there. Deal?

 

[theefaith]

You don't understand the meaning of baptism. It is indicative of burial. Sprinkling doesn't accomplish that. Read Romans 6.

Valid Christian baptism requires the flowing water over the forehead three times.

With the words:

I baptize you in the name of the father and of the son and of the Holy Spirit! Matt 28:19

The grace of God washing away all sin! Acts 22:16




Immersion, pouring, sprinkling 3 times in the name of the father and of the son and of the Holy Spirit are valid forms of baptism.

Ez 36:25 I will sprinkle you with clean water and you shall be made white as snow.

1 pet 1:2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied. (Baptism)

Heb 10:22
Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water.