Faith is to do good, not just believe we are saved

[Ghada]

The whole argument about being saved or not, or even confessing salvation, is fruitless because it's framed unbiblically in the first place. The argument about whether we believe we are saved or not is meaningless. The argument is about whether we believe we are doing the will of God or not.

Believing we are saved is meaningless to God and man. Believing we are doing His will is what matters to God and man.

The Bible never speaks of saying, "I believe I am saved". Nor of believing to be saved, nor believing unto being saved. Plenty of people believe they are 'headed to heaven' and to a 'better place', but that doesn't make it so.

Since the Bible never quotes anyone saying, "I am saved!" nor exhorts confessing it, then what does it matter to say so? Preaching to confess we are saved to one another, is a foolish artifice of preachers and Christians that like to think they have accomplished something in ministry.

Saying or confessing to one another we are saved is not wrong in itself. If it makes us feel good and happy, then by all means go for it. However, trusting in such words of personal faith to be saved and to ensure we are saved at the end, is the lie of the devil not found anywhere in the Bible.

What is in the Bible is confessing the Lord Jesus from a pure heart is unto salvation. In fact, those pure words spoken are the heart and soul of God in all testimony and ministry of His dear Son. That is the only confession of the mouth that knees bow down to.

 

[MatthewG]

Hello,

Salvation is deliverance. There are some passages in scripture that are a bit ambiguous. People become delivered from their once spiritual dead state into being made spiritually alive.

Paul wrote to those in Ephesus in that day, saying Eph 2:1 Once you were dead because of your disobedience and your many sins. 2 You used to live in sin, just like the rest of the world, obeying the devil—the commander of the powers in the unseen world.[a] He is the spirit at work in the hearts of those who refuse to obey God. 3 All of us used to live that way, following the passionate desires and inclinations of our sinful nature. By our very nature we were subject to God’s anger, just like everyone else.

4 But God is so rich in mercy, and he loved us so much, 5 that even though we were dead because of our sins, he gave us life when he raised Christ from the dead. (It is only by God’s grace that you have been saved!) 6 For he raised us from the dead along with Christ and seated us with him in the heavenly realms because we are united with Christ Jesus. 7 So God can point to us in all future ages as examples of the incredible wealth of his grace and kindness toward us, as shown in all he has done for us who are united with Christ Jesus.

8 God saved you by his grace when you believed. And you can’t take credit for this; it is a gift from God. 9 Salvation is not a reward for the good things we have done, so none of us can boast about it. 10 For we are God’s masterpiece. He has created us anew in Christ Jesus, so we can do the good things he planned for us long ago.

Praise Yahava for being saved by his grace, when one believes, which is a deliverance from a once prior standing, and from that prior moving, will lead one to desire to do God's will, patiently, and waiting to be spirit led, or they could be those who hear the word of God, but not desire to do Gods will, it is up to the individual of course.

• Psalm 143:10: "Let Your good Spirit lead me on level ground."
• Romans 8:14: "For all who are being led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God."
• Galatians 5:18: "But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the Law."

 

[Behold]

Since the Bible never quotes anyone saying, "I am saved!"

The "BIBLE" teaches that you can "know you have eternal life."

1 John 5

"I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may know that you have eternal life. NIV I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God so that you may know that you HAVE = eternal life."""

See..... Eternal Life, is Salvation, as having Salvation, is to posses Eternal life.

This is Jesus saying....>"All that believe in Me... I give unto you = ETERNAL Life, and you shall never go to Hell, (perish)...


How do you know if you are saved?
Its because you have Eternal life.
And what is that?
That is JESUS< who Himself is Salvation, and Eternal life......... And that is why He just told us that HE GIVES ETERNAL LIFE to all who BELIEVE".

Every born again believer, has Jesus in them.....>"Christ in you, the hope of Glory" (Glory is Heaven).

To be "IN Christ" is to have Jesus in you, and Jesus is Eternal life.
That's how you know you have it.
Its because the born again is to be Spiritually = JOINED to Jesus and God, = you have eternal life.

 

[Ghada]

Since it's not even in God's word to say we are saved, then such confessions have nothing to do with believing and doing His word. And so, it has nothing to do with being saved by Him or not.

Once again, the Bible never quotes any man saying "I am saved".

The Bible never says to confess in being saved, and we shall be saved. Rather the Bible says we shall be saved by confessing the Lord Jesus from a new heart of His faith unto righteousness.

For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

Nowhere does the Bible say we must believe unto salvation, but rather we must believe from the heart unto God's righteousness.

And so, debating within ourselves to be saved or not, much less arguing about it with one another, is a fruitless waste of time, as well as many times counterproductive. Whether we can argue ourselves and others into being saved or not by faith and doctrine, is a childish waste of time, because there's no Bible saying it makes anyone saved or unsaved.

Someone saying "I am saved!" or "I am great!" or "I am happy!" is just fine. Who's to argue with someone's own faith in themselves? Or even in going to a better life than this?

But declaring "I am doing the will of God!" is another matter entirely, and is judged proven or unproven by the word of God. And the Father will judge that matter in the end, by every man's works without respect of persons.

We can all say what we want, and what's the point of judging a person's words? Because in the end, only those obeying Jesus Christ and doing the will of God shall be saved in the resurrection of the dead, and inherit the reward of His everlasting kingdom.

Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered; And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;

And the world passeth away, and the lust thereof: but he that doeth the will of God abideth for ever.

Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall: For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

I don't read anything here nor in the rest of the Bible, where saying or confessing 'we are saved', does anything to ensure we are saved and shall be saved unto the end. Doing the will of God unto the end, is the only way by faith to ensure we shall inherit everlasting life with God and the Lamb.

This is why having faith alone is so dead. Because Biblically it's so useless unto being saved and justified with God. Having faith alone, and even saying we have faith to be saved, is not the gospel of Jesus Christ unto everlasting life.

 

[Ghada]

The "BIBLE" teaches that you can "know you have eternal life."

1 John 5

"I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may know that you have eternal life. NIV I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God so that you may know that you HAVE = eternal life."""

See..... Eternal Life, is Salvation, as having Salvation, is to posses Eternal life.

This is Jesus saying....>"All that believe in Me... I give unto you = ETERNAL Life, and you shall never go to Hell, (perish)...


How do you know if you are saved?
Its because you have Eternal life.
And what is that?
That is JESUS< who Himself is Salvation, and Eternal life......... And that is why He just told us that HE GIVES ETERNAL LIFE to all who BELIEVE".

Every born again believer, has Jesus in them.....>"Christ in you, the hope of Glory" (Glory is Heaven).

To be "IN Christ" is to have Jesus in you, and Jesus is Eternal life.
That's how you know you have it.
Its because the born again is to be Spiritually = JOINED to Jesus and God, = you have eternal life.

This is all nice and sweet I'm sure. But on a debate thread, I no longer bother engaging 'responders' that do not bother engaging the argument made.

Like saying "I'm saved by my faith!", it's pointless to argue with someone saying "I don't care about your argument!"

I may have learned this lesson hard, but I've certainly learned it good. So if you want to post independently like MattG often does, about something else than the argument, it may be meaningless and a bit intrusive, but I don't see any rule forbidding it nor does it move me anymore to argue about something else entirely.

 

[MatthewG]

The "BIBLE" teaches that you can "know you have eternal life."

1 John 5

"I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may know that you have eternal life. NIV I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God so that you may know that you HAVE = eternal life."""

That is a great thing for someone to have faith, hope, assurance of everlasting life, and desire to love God and love others. It's amazing that while one does becomes delivered from a spiritually deaden state, to a spiritually made alive state it is by God's grace they saved, the moment that they had believed on the Son of God whom was sent. When a person comes to know these things, and they desire for Yahava more in their life, they will have a desire to do good works, which is allowing Yahava to work with the individual, and also work through the individual which is done by the spirit of Yahava, and the Spirit of Christ.

Philippians 2:13 For God is working in you, giving you the desire and the power to do what pleases him.

 

[Ghada]

Heal me, O LORD, and I shall be healed; save me, and I shall be saved: for thou art my praise.

This is the only verse int he Bible that seems to come close to anyone saying they are saved affirmatively, in the context of truly being saved.

However, it only appears so at a glance. What the writing is saying, is that if God heals and saves us, then we really shall be healed and saved.

Because the God of the Bible does things really good, unlike the healings and savings of other gods.

It doesn't saying anything about "I shall say and confess I shall be saved".

Once again, saying so can be profitable to the sensibilities and feelings of others, but it has nothing to do with ensuring anything of the sort.

In fact, there's a whole gospel among some Christians, that just saying it ensures it, and diverts from how we are actually living, even to the extent of searing the conscience from conviction of the Holy Ghost.

If we want to minister Christ from the Bible, then it's good to exhort one another to confess plainly and as loudly as we wish Lord Jesus!

The Bible goes so far as to say that is not possible to confess with the mouth from a still unrepented heart of lust. Not to act like a spy or anything, but I have noticed often, that the ones talking about being saved the most, are never heard to say Lord Jesus. Those two simple words never seem to come out of their mouths at the same time.

I've heard whole preachings and gospels, where Lord Jesus is not spoken. Not even the name Jesus. I usually give a minister one or two chances to do so, before moving on elsewhere to hear the preaching the gospel the Lord Jesus Christ, that actually does save the soul.

 

[Ghada]

That is a great thing for someone to have faith, hope, assurance of everlasting life, and desire to love God and love others. It's amazing that while one does becomes delivered from a spiritually deaden state, to a spiritually made alive state it is by God's grace they saved, the moment that they had believed on the Son of God whom was sent. When a person comes to know these things, and they desire for Yahava more in their life, they will have a desire to do good works, which is allowing Yahava to work with the individual, and also work through the individual which is done by the spirit of Yahava, and the Spirit of Christ.

Philippians 2:13 For God is working in you, giving you the desire and the power to do what pleases him.

Very nice Matt. Read post 5 to Behold. So, if you want to post something independent of the debate, then feel free as you did before. But from now on, do me the courtesy please of not ringing my alert bell in the process.

This is what I have learned that prevents endless and meaningless arguments, that have nothing to do with the one at hand.

Like I said, you can come out a post all the sweet nothings you like, that makes your heart feel good. Just do it honestly as an independent post. Or better yet, go to a thread that has something to do with it. Or even start your own. Thanks.

 

[MatthewG]

You are always welcome to put me on ignore if you would like to Ghada. It's understandable my presence annoys you, I will go ahead and walk away. Just wanted to encourage behold, in that he is right about us learning about knowing we have eternal life by coming to the Lord Yeshua.

 

[Behold]

This is all nice and sweet I'm sure. But on a debate thread, I no longer bother engaging 'responders' that do not bother engaging the argument made.

Like saying "I'm saved by my faith!", it's pointless to argue with someone saying "I don't care about your argument!"

I may have learned this lesson hard, but I've certainly learned it good. So if you want to post independently like MattG often does, about something else than the argument, it may be meaningless and a bit intrusive, but I don't see any rule forbidding it nor does it move me anymore to argue about something else entirely.

Your post made no sense.
Nothing new.

Your Thread is... "Faith is to do Good".

And that is not related to the Faith that God accepts, that is given to Him, by a unbeliever.

Unbelievers are not doing good.
They are sinning asap.
And God saves this "ungodly sinner", not because they are doing good, but because their "FAITH is counted by God, as (Christ's) righteousness".

 

[Behold]

and they desire for Yahava more in their life, they will have a desire to do good works,

Yes, those are connected.

However, doing works is always just a work.........but for the believer, the "present your body as a living sacrifice to God, as your reasonable service"... is the good work that we do.

Its not about the deed, its about the willingness to be used by God.
That's the "work".

The greatest work you can ever offer God is..

1.) Availability
2.) Dependability

 

[MatthewG]

Yes, those are connected.
However, doing works is always just a work.........but for the believer, the "present your body as a living sacrifice to God, as your reasonable service"... is the good work that we do. Its not about the deed, its about the willingness to be used by God. That's the "work". The greatest work you can ever offer God is..
1.) Availability 2.) Dependability

Praise Yahava.

26Jesus replied, “Truly, truly, I tell you, it is not because you saw these signs that you are looking for Me, but because you ate the loaves and had your fill. 27Do not work for food that perishes, but for food that endures to eternal life, which the Son of Man will give you. For on Him God the Father has placed His seal of approval.” 28Then they inquired, “What must we do to perform the works of God?” 29Jesus replied, “The work of God is this: to believe in the One He has sent.” 30So they asked Him, “What sign then will You perform, so that we may see it and believe You? What will You do? 31Our fathers ate the manna in the wilderness, as it is written: ‘He gave them bread from heaven to eat.’d” 32Jesus said to them, “Truly, truly, I tell you, it was not Moses who gave you the bread from heaven, but it is My Father who gives you the true bread from heaven. 33For the bread of God is He who comes down from heaven and gives life to the world.”

 

[Behold]

33For the bread of God is He who comes down from heaven and gives life to the world.”

Yes, Christ came down to earth.

And notice the verse says "to give life to the WORLD">.

See that?

Not just to the "Predestined Elect", as the Demonic John Calvinism, teaches.

"The WORLD", as in : John 3:16 = "to as many as BELIEVE".

And this LIFE< is ETERNAL LIFE.

 

[Ghada]

Your post made no sense.
Nothing new.

To some people. Nothing that they do not already agree with, makes any sense to them.

Your Thread is... "Faith is to do Good".

Though half a context may be better than none, in this case it's not.

I'm thinking red flagging someone to no purpose is a form of trolling.